Bleach Abilities Addition (Hollows/Espada)

[Deceived3596]

thought so

K.

not a wall. you do realise its a knockback explosion effect right? notice in the scan the same art when ichigo feet is dragging in the air or the effect around grimmjow

The hell is "Knockback explosion effect"? and how does both these points counter what i said?.

i see the wing blocking it aswell as blank pointed out.

Doesn't matter regarding my main contention. so actually argue against my main point instead of some supplementary evidence.

again not a barrier... characters can use energy to push people back and it won't count as a barrier

But it is, It's inherently a barrier since it an obstacle to forward attacks against Grimmjow. Can you bring up any examples that are remotely comparable to what Grimmjow did because if you can't then that point is null. And even if you did bring up profile i would just argue that profile needs Barrier Creation.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

The hell is "Knockback explosion effect"? and how does both these points counter what i said?.

Not sure why you are focusing on what he labelled the SFX and not his counterargument. That shockwave doesn't mean anything besides Grimm flexing his energy to push Ichigo away.

Doesn't matter regarding my main contention. so actually argue against my main point instead of some supplementary evidence.

You were using Ulq blocking GT with his reiatsu as support. Why would he not attack an argument of yours that is false?

But it is, It's inherently a barrier since it an obstacle to forward attacks against Grimmjow. Can you bring up any examples that are remotely comparable to what Grimmjow did because if you can't then that point is null. And even if you did bring up profile i would just argue that profile needs Barrier Creation.

..... so Ceros are barriers? Cuz that's basically what you said. Every single attack that has a physical presence is now a barrier by your definition since they would all be "obstacles" for whatever they are blocking/intercepting.

 

[Deceived3596]

Aarionero: No to body control, that's just using a limb. Rest looks good

Aaroneiro would have Body Control but just not for the reason i provided since he can control the tone and cadence of his voice as shown with him copying Kaien's voice. Good.

Szayelaporro: I think he actually needs a separate key for everything he can do with his base since several of these abilities are specific to it. Such as the sealing, which as he himself has said is based on prior information gathered upon his opponent. That's why Uryu was able to pull off an attack he hadn't previously known about even though his other powers were sealed. So I'd list it as limited. Though a scan from Ch.276 does support him having damage reduction on those he is able to gather info on with a bit of prep time. Everything else looks cool. Summoning, and sealing should fall under this room key I brought up.

Yeah he needs a separate key for all the hax's he has whilst inside his Castle. Agree on Limited Sealing. Sure let me get the scans for the Damage Reduction but it would be also limited since it's entirely based around him having prior knowledge of his opponents Reiatsu. Agree.

Zommari: We really need that Weapon manipulation power but for now, that'll work.

Alright.

Grimmjow: I wouldn't classify that as a forcefield since its shown blasting Ichigo back and previous pages from Chapter 209 don't indicate that Ichigo had attacked before he was blasted away. Sound Manipulation should instead be Shockwave Generation since that's what it is described as. No Danmaku, just not enough attacks where I think it qualifies. Rest looks good

There seems to be a massive misunderstanding regarding Forcefield Creation for some reason. my point with the Scan is Gimmjow can project is Reiatsu to create "Walls" or "Barriers" of Reiatsu to push away attackers or being able to block attacks since it's made of from Reiatsu. Shouldn't it be both since Grimmjow screams indirectly create Shockwaves. Danmaku doesn't posses a needed amount you only have to produce a "great" number of projectiles and be able to fire them at once which Gimmjow does both times. Alright.

"The ability to produce a great amount of projectiles at once"

Nnoirta: Looks good

Alright.

Uqilorra: No to limited causality negation, it looks more like a flaw on Orihime's part. Moving your tail isn't body control, its just one of your limbs. No to resistance to pain manipulation, that's more just having a high pain tolerance.

How exactly is it a flaw on her part? also i kinda addressed this argument in my response to Cyber. I'll concede on the Body Control point. Aren't both of those the same thing? like what's the difference between them that makes them not the same ability.

Barragan: Neutral to the Self Sustenance stuff, I also feel like type two might be something all hollow have. Immortality Type 2 also seems like it might be something all hollow have as well, since I think it's shown normally fatal wounds seem to not be really a problem for them. But that's something I feel others should verify. No to willpower manipulation, no feats of such and it reads more as the talks of arrogance than of the actual ability to me. No resistance to pain manipulation, that's just pain tolerance.

Alright on Self-Sus and Immortality. Arguing because theirs a Lack of feats despite direct statements to the contrary is an argument from Ignorance and the same question in my Ulquiorra point.

Stark: Just duplication will do I think, otherwise all good.

Why? and Alright.

Yammy: That scan doesn't support resistance to flame manipulation.

Sokatsui is accepted as Fire Manipulation on this wiki so if Yammy is able to resist that heat he should have resistance to either Fire Manipulation or Temperature Manipulation.

 

[Loyd]

The hell is "Knockback explosion effect"? and how does both these points counter what i said?.

the sfx and Art is him knocking ichigo back with force. the "wall" is an explosion

Doesn't matter regarding my main contention. so actually argue against my main point instead of some supplementary evidence.

you bought it up.

But it is, It's inherently a barrier since it an obstacle to forward attacks against Grimmjow. Can you bring up any examples that are remotely comparable to what Grimmjow did because if you can't then that point is null. And even if you did bring up profile i would just argue that profile needs Barrier Creation.

barrier creation isn't broaden to that extent. look at yama persistent flame wall or aizen el escudo as solid barrier creation feats, deflecting with energy or such isn't.

 

[Deceived3596]

Not sure why you are focusing on what he labelled the SFX and not his counterargument. That shockwave doesn't mean anything besides Grimm flexing his energy to push Ichigo away

I'm not focusing on that point i just didn't know what he men't by it that's all. I already addressed his counterargument what he hasn't done was addressed by actual main point as stated in my previous posts. My argument was never contingent of "Shockwaves" nor did i ever bring that as an argument so that's a complete dodge of my actual argument.

You were using Ulq blocking GT with his reiatsu as support. Why would he not attack an argument of yours that is false?

You either didn't read my post or your internally being disingenuous. My point was why isn't he attacking my main point but rather Supplementary Evidence that if removed wouldn't effect my point. It's just avoiding the main topic.

..... so Ceros are barriers? Cuz that's basically what you said. Every single attack that has a physical presence is now a barrier by your definition since they would all be "obstacles" for whatever they are blocking/intercepting.

What a strawman in a half no Cero's nor any forward-facing attacks are not "barriers" in the same way as the "barrier" in Gimmjow's Feat. actually read the context behind by statement before using such a disingenuous argument against me.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Do we treat Almighty push as a barrier? Not that the techniques are 1 to 1, but if we don't treat Almighty push as a barrier, this definitely isn't a barrier.

 

[Deceived3596]

Do we treat Almighty push as a barrier? Not that the techniques are 1 to 1, but if we don't treat Almighty push as a barrier, this definitely isn't a barrier.

Almighty Push is treated as Gravity Manipulation since it's derived from the Tendo path that manipulates Gravitational Forces but i don't see the similarity between these abilities so i don't believe they can be compared. Also Why wouldn't this be Forcefield Creation? it falls directly under what's needed to be Forcefield Creation as i already explained multiple times within previous post.

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

Agree with forcefield creation or barrier. We literally see Ichigo fail to breach a wall of spirit energy projected by Grimmjow in the scan.

Disagree with Danmaku. 4-8 projectiles isn’t enough for danmaku. Yeah the ability doesn’t say how many but clearly 4-8 isn’t enough.

 

[Loyd]

We literally see Ichigo fail to breach a wall of spirit energy projected by Grimmjow in the scan.

the scan on its own would make u assume as such, but the prior scan is him blocking ichigo swing with his hierro arm then knocking him back with his energy force. the scan isn't showing a barrier to block attacks its just a blast/explosion knocking ichigo back.

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

Nvm then

 

[AppleLord]

So can you explain why didn't Ichigo broke out of askin death dealing.

He did. Yoruichi told him to wait for Orihime to heal him before continuing, but Ichigo got up on his own and continue running toward the castle while Orihime stood behind to heal Chad. At this point Orihime was still healing herself first which Yoruichi told her to do.

Also can you explain why didn't Ichibē couldn't finish off Yhwach.

Yhwach negated Ichibei’s Hax.

By your logic Ichigo should have won against Askin. Also Ichibē should had more Reatsu he literally removed all powers of Yhwach and he should have removed almighty too. Why didn't he couldn't do that.

Almighty has power null resistance.

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

Almighty has power null resistance.

That's not my point. I was referring casualty manipulation and fate manipulation works differently. Reastu doesn't counter those. And Using Reastu negate all existing hax is NLF.

 

[AppleLord]

That's not my point. I was referring casualty manipulation and fate manipulation works differently. Reastu doesn't counter those. And Using Reastu negate all existing hax is NLF.

Is not NLF. Is saying Aizen the second intelligent person in the verse is lying and the Captains of the Gotei 13 didn’t say “wait a minute he is lying, this is some BS KS illusion” on the fight. They understood his words were true.

 

[Deceived3596]

If anyone hasn't please make sure when you comment on a specific thing or things on the list to comment on the rest. It makes it alot easier for me to index what you actually agree/disagree with and makes the thread in general faster to finish. Thanks.

 

[Deceived3596]

Bump

 

[Deceived3596]

Bump

 

[KingTempest]

Could've sworn I typed here a while ago

Everything Duedate8898 said aligns with my opinions

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Rare KT sighting

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

Except for Ulqioura all seems fair. I think Ichigo should get causality resistance Instead of Ulqioura.

Couldnt this just be like power null via higher levels of energy, like Aizen did

We don't have any proof whose Reatsu it was. It seems to me it can be white Reatsu

 

[Deceived3596]

We don't have any proof whose Reatsu it was. It seems to me it can be white Reatsu

It's heavily implied that it was Ulquiorra's Reiatsu rather then Ichigo's or Zangetsu's.

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

It's heavily implied that it was Ulquiorra's Reiatsu rather then Ichigo's or Zangetsu's.

Its not implied his reatsu. Its more of him leaving his mark. Also if that's the case so ichigo should also get causality resistance by negating Ulquiorra Reatsu

 

[Duedate8898]

There seems to be a massive misunderstanding regarding Forcefield Creation for some reason. my point with the Scan is Gimmjow can project is Reiatsu to create "Walls" or "Barriers" of Reiatsu to push away attackers or being able to block attacks since it's made of from Reiatsu. Shouldn't be both since Grimmjow screams indirectly create Shockwaves. Danmaku doesn't posses a needed amount you only have to produce a "great" number of projectioles and be able to fire them at once with Gimmjow does both times. Alright.

"The ability to produce a great amount of projectiles at once"

It isn't a barrier though, that's more just an attack that pushed Ichigo away. So no on Forcefield creation. Just Shockwave Generation is fine, no need to add sound manipulation. And no to Danmaku, he produced like six at once, that's like giving danmaku to someone that can throw a handful of projectiles. It's not happening here.

How exactly it's a flaw on here part? also i kinda addressed this argument in my response to Cyber. I'll concede on the Body Control point. Aren't both of those the same thing? like what's the difference between them that makes them not the same ability.

The reason why I'm saying its a flaw on Orihime's part is because one of the guidebooks MASKED does state that due to the large amount of foreign spiritual pressure Orihime can't reject the wound. Not to mention that Orihime has no problem healing the wounds that Ulqiorra gives to Grimmjow shortly before the rematch between Ichigo and herself, so it seems more likely that the large amounts of spiritual energy leftover was the problem not whose it was specifically. Pain manipulation is an ability that means a character can inflict pain upon someone as their power. To resist it means to have an ability try and fail to inflict pain upon the opponent. Just because someone is unbothered by being wounded, that doesn't mean they don't feel the pain. That just means they can move past it. And we'd list stuff like that in stamina normally.

Alright on Self-Sus and Immortality. Arguing because theirs a Lack of feats despite direct statements to the contrary is an argument from Ignorance and the same question in my Ulquiorra point.

I'm arguing both lack of feats and the statements not being foolproof, not ignorance. He never directly states that he can age will with his power, he just calls will and freedom insignificant. In that same statement, he calls the sun and the stars and the moon insignificant too, but you're not trying to argue he's either on those levels or has the range to destroy them. Not to mention that Hachi doesn't corroborate anything about him being able to destroy will, all he really points out is that Barragan can't stand up to his own power. More evidence is needed for me to support the addition of that power simple as that. Get me more, and I'll shut up and let it go by. Until then, no to willpower manipulation or even a possibly.

Why? and Alright.

Since they're duplicating a part of their soul and not really creating something new, I feel it makes more sense to just call it duplication. Though, if you wish, you could list it as both duplication and transformation, since they're just taking these soul parts and transforming them into wolves. Creation is a bit different from my own understandings.

Sokatsui is accepted as Fire Manipulation on this wiki so if Yammy is able to resist that heat he should have resistance to either Fire Manipulation or Temperature Manipulation.

The reason why I said that scan doesn't support resistance is because Yammy acts if he's hurt by it and we don't really see his face afterward. It would've been better to post scans of the next page alongside that, to show that Yammy was actually unhurt. However, besides that, I'd actually argue that Yammy being fine can be more attributed due to the immense power difference between him and Rukia. Since at the end of the day, everything is based in soul energy, you don't really need resistance to ap based attacks such as hitting someone with fire if you're just tougher.

 

[Deceived3596]

It isn't a barrier though, that's more just an attack that pushed Ichigo away. So no on Forcefield creation. Just Shockwave Generation is fine, no need to add sound manipulation. And no to Danmaku, he produced like six at once, that's like giving danmaku to someone that can throw a handful of projectiles. It's not happening here.

The reason why I'm saying its a flaw on Orihime's part is because one of the guidebooks MASKED does state that due to the large amount of foreign spiritual pressure Orihime can't reject the wound. Not to mention that Orihime has no problem healing the wounds that Ulqiorra gives to Grimmjow shortly before the rematch between Ichigo and herself, so it seems more likely that the large amounts of spiritual energy leftover was the problem not whose it was specifically. Pain manipulation is an ability that means a character can inflict pain upon someone as their power. To resist it means to have an ability try and fail to inflict pain upon the opponent. Just because someone is unbothered by being wounded, that doesn't mean they don't feel the pain. That just means they can move past it. And we'd list stuff like that in stamina normally.


I'm arguing both lack of feats and the statements not being foolproof, not ignorance. He never directly states that he can age will with his power, he just calls will and freedom insignificant. In that same statement, he calls the sun and the stars and the moon insignificant too, but you're not trying to argue he's either on those levels or has the range to destroy them. Not to mention that Hachi doesn't corroborate anything about him being able to destroy will, all he really points out is that Barragan can't stand up to his own power. More evidence is needed for me to support the addition of that power simple as that. Get me more, and I'll shut up and let it go by. Until then, no to willpower manipulation or even a possibly.

Since they're duplicating a part of their soul and not really creating something new, I feel it makes more sense to just call it duplication. Though, if you wish, you could list it as both duplication and transformation, since they're just taking these soul parts and transforming them into wolves. Creation is a bit different from my own understandings.

The reason why I said that scan doesn't support resistance is because Yammy acts if he's hurt by it and we don't really see his face afterward. It would've been better to post scans of the next page alongside that, to show that Yammy was actually unhurt. However, besides that, I'd actually argue that Yammy being fine can be more attributed due to the immense power difference between him and Rukia. Since at the end of the day, everything is based in soul energy, you don't really need resistance to ap based attacks such as hitting someone with fire if you're just tougher.

Thanks for commenting and i'll respond to this tomorrow as i'm about to go to bed.

 

[Deceived3596]

It isn't a barrier though, that's more just an attack that pushed Ichigo away. So no on Forcefield creation. Just Shockwave Generation is fine, no need to add sound manipulation. And no to Danmaku, he produced like six at once, that's like giving danmaku to someone that can throw a handful of projectiles. It's not happening here.

I'll just dropped this point since the vast majority disagrees with it and i don't have the time/will to continue debating that topic. Ok. It seems you're letting you opinion regarding what Danmaku should be cloud your mind on what Danmaku is stated to be, Grimmjow falls completely under what it is needed for Danmaku so he should have the ability.

"The ability to produce a great amount of projectiles at once, in order to overwhelm the target by the sheer number of shots. Some users also add complex patterns to make dodging additionally difficult"

You can either create a thread that makes it so Danmaku needs a bare-minimum amount of projectiles or just drop this point since your blatantly wrong on what Danmaku is considered to be on this Wiki.

The reason why I'm saying its a flaw on Orihime's part is because one of the guidebooks MASKED does state that due to the large amount of foreign spiritual pressure Orihime can't reject the wound. Not to mention that Orihime has no problem healing the wounds that Ulqiorra gives to Grimmjow shortly before the rematch between Ichigo and herself, so it seems more likely that the large amounts of spiritual energy leftover was the problem not whose it was specifically. Pain manipulation is an ability that means a character can inflict pain upon someone as their power. To resist it means to have an ability try and fail to inflict pain upon the opponent. Just because someone is unbothered by being wounded, that doesn't mean they don't feel the pain. That just means they can move past it. And we'd list stuff like that in stamina normally.

I'm fine with dropping the Causality Negation point since the more i look at the feat the more i believe it to be just the byproduct of the Power Nullification aspect of Reiatsu which is backed up in the Databooks so i'll dropped it and change it to Power Nullification. Would Supernatural Willpower work? since I've seen profiles on this wiki like Zoro's have Supernatural Willpower via resisting large amounts of pain which is what Ulquiorra did within both scans.

I'm arguing both lack of feats and the statements not being foolproof, not ignorance. He never directly states that he can age will with his power, he just calls will and freedom insignificant. In that same statement, he calls the sun and the stars and the moon insignificant too, but you're not trying to argue he's either on those levels or has the range to destroy them. Not to mention that Hachi doesn't corroborate anything about him being able to destroy will, all he really points out is that Barragan can't stand up to his own power. More evidence is needed for me to support the addition of that power simple as that. Get me more, and I'll shut up and let it go by. Until then, no to willpower manipulation or even a possibly

No statement is "Full-Proof" as you put it and like i stated before arguing that this ability lacks the feats "needed" despite the fact that it possesses statements that aren't contradicted is an argument from Ignorance, you saying you aren't arguing from ignorance doesn't change the fact that you're arguing from ignorance. He literally states "Will and Freedom" are "Insignificantly Small" compared to his power that is "Absolute within the World", I have a question what is Barragan's power exactly? I'll give you a hint it has to do with a thing called "Senescencia". The Sun and Moon are insignificant towards his power because his power is AGEING that isn't a counter and the Range point isn't either since we don't know what his Maximum Range with Respira is, this is just more Incredulity on your part. It corroborates the "Absolute Power within the World" part not the "Will and Freedom" part. I don't believe i need more evidence when you haven't actually debunk anything i said.

Since they're duplicating a part of their soul and not really creating something new, I feel it makes more sense to just call it duplication. Though, if you wish, you could list it as both duplication and transformation, since they're just taking these soul parts and transforming them into wolves. Creation is a bit different from my own understandings.

Uh... I'm not arguing Creation? the only new abilities i was adding with Starkk are Limited Fusion and Duplication?

The reason why I said that scan doesn't support resistance is because Yammy acts if he's hurt by it and we don't really see his face afterward. It would've been better to post scans of the next page alongside that, to show that Yammy was actually unhurt. However, besides that, I'd actually argue that Yammy being fine can be more attributed due to the immense power difference between him and Rukia. Since at the end of the day, everything is based in soul energy, you don't really need resistance to ap based attacks such as hitting someone with fire if you're just tougher.

I didn't think i would need it since i believed it to be pretty blatant but allows me to get the rest of the page and also more supporting evidence from Byakuya.

Rukia strikes Yammy with Sokatsui and Yammy is completely unaffected by it as shown with the fact that his face has no damage against it, He's also again struck by a stronger version of Sokatsui by Byakuya and has barely any damage done against his body expect for his leg getting cut off by Kenpachi.

We don't even have to go down that point given the Byakuya example, where someone as strong if not stronger then that version of Yammy wasn't able to damage him with the same attack which points to Yammy just having a resistance towards Fire-Based attacks.

 

[Duedate8898]

I'll just dropped this point since the vast majority disagrees with it and i don't have the time/will to continue debating that topic. Ok. It seems you're letting you opinion regarding what Danmaku should be cloud your mind on what Danmaku is stated to be, Grimmjow falls completely under what it is needed for Danmaku so he should have the ability.

"The ability to produce a great amount of projectiles at once, in order to overwhelm the target by the sheer number of shots. Some users also add complex patterns to make dodging additionally difficult"

You can either create a thread that makes it so Danmaku needs a bare-minimum amount of projectiles or just drop this point since your blatantly wrong on what Danmaku is considered to be on this Wiki.

I'm not blatantly wrong. When it comes to Danmaku, yes we don't have strict terms for it. It's more up to us to those of us adding and approving the power to understand what makes sense and what doesn't. It doesn't make sense to give Danmaku for what would be considered a handful of attacks. Because what's overwhelming about Grimmjow's attack isn't the number of hits, its the size of them. That's how I see it. But if you so wish, please do get other Mods to check this. See if they agree with you. And if they do, I'll agree that my judgement on the matter is wrong. Until then or if you bring other instances, Danmaku for Grimmjow is a no. End of discussion.

I'm fine with dropping the Causality Negation point since the more i look at the feat the more i believe it to be just the byproduct of the Power Nullification aspect of Reiatsu which is backed up in the Databooks so i'll dropped it and change it to Power Nullification. Would Supernatural Willpower work? since I've seen profiles on this wiki like Zoro's have Supernatural Willpower via resisting large amounts of pain which is what Ulquiorra did within both scans.

No to supernatural willpower. Supernatural Willpower is more pushing past one's limits or great obstacles through their mental endurance. Zoro has numerous instances of doing exactly that. Ulquiorra doesn't. He's just unbothered by plucking out an eye and not really emoting to having his insides wrecked. That's more based in his personality than any power we would list

No statement is "Full-Proof" as you put it and like i stated before arguing that this ability lacks the feats "needed" despite the fact that it possesses statements that aren't contradicted is an argument from Ignorance, you saying you aren't arguing from ignorance doesn't change the fact that you're arguing from ignorance. He literally states "Will and Freedom" are "Insignificantly Small" compared to his power that is "Absolute within the World", I have a question what is Barragan's power exactly? I'll give you a hint it has to do with a thing called "Senescencia". The Sun and Moon are insignificant towards his power because his power is AGEING that isn't a counter and the Range point isn't either since we don't know what his Maximum Range with Respira is, this is just more Incredulity on your part. It corroborates the "Absolute Power within the World" part not the "Will and Freedom" part. I don't believe i need more evidence when you haven't actually debunk anything i said.

Statements aren't feats. And statements by themselves aren't enough for people to just get abilities. This statement, neither directly states he can age willpower or freedom, nor does it really say he can do anything to them. He's just saying that they don't matter in the face of his power. Why they don't matter could be a variety of reasons. One could be because he can age the very ideas themselves, however, it could also be that because everything ages and die, those that possess such ideas can't do much with them. In his actual use of his power, never does anyone who gets afflicted with it ever make any statements or reactions that indicate he's aging their willpower. And its not like he can choose what he's aging, that's why he dies in the end, his power shows no sign of biasing. For me, the statement isn't clear-cut enough and isn't corroborated by any feats, so I don't approve of giving the power. Call me arguing from ignorance as much as you want, but you're not going to get anywhere with it. I require more evidence to approve giving that power. Either bring more evidence to support it, or see if other mods will approve it. Currently, myself and King (from his own post) don't agree. Those are my last thoughts on the topic, till you bring something new.

Uh... I'm not arguing Creation? the only new abilities i was adding with Starkk are Limited Fusion and Duplication?

Check your own OP, please

1th Espada Starkk:

Limited Fusion (Starkk fuses back with Lilinette when entering Los Lobos)

Duplication and Creation (Starkk can create multiple wolves made from fragments of his Soul)

The creation part was all I didn't approve.

Rukia strikes Yammy with Sokatsui and Yammy is completely unaffected by it as shown with the fact that his face has no damage against it, He's also again struck by a stronger version of Sokatsui by Byakuya and has barely any damage done against his body expect for his leg getting cut off by Kenpachi.

We don't even have to go down that point given the Byakuya example, where someone as strong if not stronger then that version of Yammy wasn't able to damage him with the same attack which points to Yammy just having a resistance towards Fire-Based attacks.

Now, while I think Rukia was dubious because she was much weaker Byakuya does go on to defeat Yammy so I can concede and give him resistance to fire manipulation.

 

[Deceived3596]

I'm not blatantly wrong. When it comes to Danmaku, yes we don't have strict terms for it. It's more up to us to those of us adding and approving the power to understand what makes sense and what doesn't. It doesn't make sense to give Danmaku for what would be considered a handful of attacks. Because what's overwhelming about Grimmjow's attack isn't the number of hits, its the size of them. That's how I see it. But if you so wish, please do get other Mods to check this. See if they agree with you. And if they do, I'll agree that my judgement on the matter is wrong. Until then or if you bring other instances, Danmaku for Grimmjow is a no. End of discussion.


No to supernatural willpower. Supernatural Willpower is more pushing past one's limits or great obstacles through their mental endurance. Zoro has numerous instances of doing exactly that. Ulquiorra doesn't. He's just unbothered by plucking out an eye and not really emoting to having his insides wrecked. That's more based in his personality than any power we would list


Statements aren't feats. And statements by themselves aren't enough for people to just get abilities. This statement, neither directly states he can age willpower or freedom, nor does it really say he can do anything to them. He's just saying that they don't matter in the face of his power. Why they don't matter could be a variety of reasons. One could be because he can age the very ideas themselves, however, it could also be that because everything ages and die, those that possess such ideas can't do much with them. In his actual use of his power, never does anyone who gets afflicted with it ever make any statements or reactions that indicate he's aging their willpower. And its not like he can choose what he's aging, that's why he dies in the end, his power shows no sign of biasing. For me, the statement isn't clear-cut enough and isn't corroborated by any feats, so I don't approve of giving the power. Call me arguing from ignorance as much as you want, but you're not going to get anywhere with it. I require more evidence to approve giving that power. Either bring more evidence to support it, or see if other mods will approve it. Currently, myself and King (from his own post) don't agree. Those are my last thoughts on the topic, till you bring something new.

Check your own OP, please


The creation part was all I didn't approve.

Now, while I think Rukia was dubious because she was much weaker Byakuya does go on to defeat Yammy so I can concede and give him resistance to fire manipulation.

I'll addressed either today or tomorrow depending if i have the time.

But i have something that both of us agree with and that's Szayel, i created a blog for the rework to his profile and i'd liked to have your opinion on it.

 

[Deceived3596]

Bump

 

[Duedate8898]

I'll addressed either today or tomorrow depending if i have the time.

But i have something that both of us agree with and that's Szayel, i created a blog for the rework to his profile and i'd liked to have your opinion on it.

Looks good

 

[Deceived3596]

Bump.

 

[Elizhaa]

I also think Duedate8898's points seem fine.

 

[Deceived3596]

Sorry for taking so long to respond, i had to deal with IRL things that needed my immediate attention.

I'm not blatantly wrong. When it comes to Danmaku, yes we don't have strict terms for it. It's more up to us to those of us adding and approving the power to understand what makes sense and what doesn't. It doesn't make sense to give Danmaku for what would be considered a handful of attacks. Because what's overwhelming about Grimmjow's attack isn't the number of hits, its the size of them. That's how I see it. But if you so wish, please do get other Mods to check this. See if they agree with you. And if they do, I'll agree that my judgement on the matter is wrong. Until then or if you bring other instances, Danmaku for Grimmjow is a no. End of discussion.

The Danmaku page doesn't demand a set number of attacks for it to be considered Danmaku so the "handful of attacks" argument doesn't work here. Attacking someone with multiple attacks at the same time inherently means the number of said attacks are a component of said attack, also Garra De La Pantera aren't large by any means so that point doesn’t even work against it.

Honestly the best course of action IMO is to accepted the ability for right now since it does fall under the requirements for Danmaku, then create a thread that requires Danmaku to have a bare-minimum amount of projectiles and if Grimmjow doesn’t fall under said requirements removed the ability from his profile.

No to supernatural willpower. Supernatural Willpower is more pushing past one's limits or great obstacles through their mental endurance. Zoro has numerous instances of doing exactly that. Ulquiorra doesn't. He's just unbothered by plucking out an eye and not really emoting to having his insides wrecked. That's more based in his personality than any power we would list

But we do? It’s not named “Supernatural Willpower” in the profiles but rather “Immense Pain Tolerance” as shown with profiles like Kenpachi, Naruto, Sasuke, and a bunch of other profiles. Ulquiorra does the same thing on even a higher level then characters like Naruto or Sasuke so he should have it.

Also the "Supernatural Willpower" page literally states.

"Characters with this ability may be able to resist enormous amounts of pain, act even when unconscious or well beyond what they should be able to endure, resist possession and mind control, affect their environment, or even go against natural phenomena, such as death or the limits imposed by reality"

And the note at the bottom of the page states.

"Note: This ability should only be given to characters that have explicitly displayed far beyond human levels of mental endurance. This may have been demonstrated in the form of a highly reliable statement or a significant event. An example of the latter would be Roronoa Zoro taking in all of Monkey D. Luffy's pain at once"

Statements aren't feats. And statements by themselves aren't enough for people to just get abilities. This statement, neither directly states he can age willpower or freedom, nor does it really say he can do anything to them. He's just saying that they don't matter in the face of his power. Why they don't matter could be a variety of reasons. One could be because he can age the very ideas themselves, however, it could also be that because everything ages and die, those that possess such ideas can't do much with them. In his actual use of his power, never does anyone who gets afflicted with it ever make any statements or reactions that indicate he's aging their willpower. And its not like he can choose what he's aging, that's why he dies in the end, his power shows no sign of biasing. For me, the statement isn't clear-cut enough and isn't corroborated by any feats, so I don't approve of giving the power. Call me arguing from ignorance as much as you want, but you're not going to get anywhere with it. I require more evidence to approve giving that power. Either bring more evidence to support it, or see if other mods will approve it. Currently, myself and King (from his own post) don't agree. Those are my last thoughts on the topic, till you bring something new.

I’ll just drop this point for right now since i won’t convincing either you or King any time soon, i might create a thread later down the line just for this ability but as for right now i’ll concede.

Check your own OP, please

The creation part was all I didn't approve.

My bad i must’ve forgot that i put that there but i agree i’ll remove it.

Now, while I think Rukia was dubious because she was much weaker Byakuya does go on to defeat Yammy so I can concede and give him resistance to fire manipulation.

Great.

 

[Deceived3596]

Bump

 

[Deceived3596]

Bump

 

[Duedate8898]

Sorry for taking so long to respond, i had to deal with IRL things that needed my immediate attention.

The Danmaku page doesn't demand a set number of attacks for it to be considered Danmaku so the "handful of attacks" argument doesn't work here. Attacking someone with multiple attacks at the same time inherently means the number of said attacks are a component of said attack, also Garra De La Pantera aren't large by any means so that point doesn’t even work against it.

Honestly the best course of action IMO is to accepted the ability for right now since it does fall under the requirements for Danmaku, then create a thread that requires Danmaku to have a bare-minimum amount of projectiles and if Grimmjow doesn’t fall under said requirements removed the ability from his profile.

No. Just because the page doesn't demand a set number of projectiles doesn't mean just anyone capable of shooting more than three projectiles in quick succession would qualify for the power. The power itself requires a great amount of projectiles, and while that isn't a solid number, I would not call what Grimmjow does anywhere close to that.

He doesn't qualify for Danmaku, and there is nothing else to be said on it.

But we do? It’s not named “Supernatural Willpower” in the profiles but rather “Immense Pain Tolerance” as shown with profiles like Kenpachi, Naruto, Sasuke, and a bunch of other profiles. Ulquiorra does the same thing on even a higher level then characters like Naruto or Sasuke so he should have it.

Also the "Supernatural Willpower" page literally states.

"Characters with this ability may be able to resist enormous amounts of pain, act even when unconscious or well beyond what they should be able to endure, resist possession and mind control, affect their environment, or even go against natural phenomena, such as death or the limits imposed by reality"

And the note at the bottom of the page states.

"Note: This ability should only be given to characters that have explicitly displayed far beyond human levels of mental endurance. This may have been demonstrated in the form of a highly reliable statement or a significant event. An example of the latter would be Roronoa Zoro taking in all of Monkey D. Luffy's pain at once"

I would actually argue that in the case of Naruto, Sasuke and Kenpachi, none of them should qualify for the power with their current justifcations. But even beyond that, my main problem with giving it to Uliqiorra is that nothing about it really communicates he's actively having to push himself to keep going.

The full power page states this:
Supernatural Willpower is the ability to exceed one's own limits through sheer willpower to a degree extremely far beyond real human standards.

Although some characters can be considered to have a great will to achieve their goals or give their all in a fight, characters that have a willpower on this level can go vastly beyond what should logically be possible for them, with more extreme cases being able to oppose natural phenomena such as death.

Uliqorra isn't going above his own mental limits or what's possible for him. He's just unbothered visibly unbothered like always, no sign of emoting. This would better fit a stamina feat than it would him getting Supernatural Willpower.

 

[Deceived3596]

No. Just because the page doesn't demand a set number of projectiles doesn't mean just anyone capable of shooting more than three projectiles in quick succession would qualify for the power. The power itself requires a great amount of projectiles, and while that isn't a solid number, I would not call what Grimmjow does anywhere close to that.

He doesn't qualify for Danmaku, and there is nothing else to be said on it.

I would actually argue that in the case of Naruto, Sasuke and Kenpachi, none of them should qualify for the power with their current justifcations. But even beyond that, my main problem with giving it to Uliqiorra is that nothing about it really communicates he's actively having to push himself to keep going.

The full power page states this:
Supernatural Willpower is the ability to exceed one's own limits through sheer willpower to a degree extremely far beyond real human standards.

Although some characters can be considered to have a great will to achieve their goals or give their all in a fight, characters that have a willpower on this level can go vastly beyond what should logically be possible for them, with more extreme cases being able to oppose natural phenomena such as death.

Uliqorra isn't going above his own mental limits or what's possible for him. He's just unbothered visibly unbothered like always, no sign of emoting. This would better fit a stamina feat than it would him getting Supernatural Willpower.

I'll dropped both of these points for different reasons. (I also don't really have the time to argue right now given the Christmas and New Years stuff.)

With Danmaku i believe a thread needs to be created to give a bare-minimum amount of projectiles needed to qualify so we don't have these long needless arguments that only makes the thread longer to get accepted.

With Immense Pain Tolerance i'm in the works of creating a blog that will address this ability, along side many other hax's Bleach Characters inherently have so i'll just wait until that blog is completed to argue this point there.

So since i have your's and 2 other mod's agreement i'll apply the accepted hax's on their profiles later and then this thread can be closed.