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Beyond-Dimensional Existence

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Qawsedf234 said:
The thing here is that BDE Type 2 Aspect 1 and Aspect 2 both do work off that same principal. Both are being beyond the subject of space-time with the nature of the beyondness being measurable or unmeasurable. Or in other words, Aspect 1 is on a quantitative scale while Aspect 2 is on a qualitative scale.
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Aspect 1 is being outside of space-time in the sense that you are an immaterial being, not even being beyond it in a quantitative way. It isn't really the same principal whatsoever. It only grants you the attribute of being non-physical, rather than having any inherent or physiological superiority to physicality.

Aspect 2 is where you get quantitative transcendence of space-time, starting at Low 1-A. They are beyond-dimensional in the sense that no single quantity of dimensions can describe their complexity.

But, the issue this OP brings up is that Aspect 2 currently also contains qualitative transcendence of space-time, which starts at 1-A. That is, being not only above the quantity of dimensions but the quality (concept/essence/form) of them.

Now, while I'm not staff, I do think these two things are very notably different attributes. And I can see where confusion would arise. So a Type 3 sounds alright to me.

Hopefully that clarifies things.
 
Phoenks said:
Aspect 1 is being outside of space-time in the sense that you are an immaterial being, not even being beyond it in a quantitative way. It isn't really the same principal whatsoever. It only grants you the attribute of being non-physical, rather than having any inherent or physiological superiority to physicality.
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That's BDE Type 1. I've been talking about BDE Type 2 and was referring to the two ends (Low 1-A and >1-A) as Aspects 1 or 2
For that reason I say just split it into "BDE Type 2 - Aspect 1" and "BDE Type 2 - Aspect 2" rather than make a Type 3.
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Qawsedf234 said:
That's BDE Type 1. I've been talking about BDE Type 2 and was referring to the two ends (Low 1-A and >1-A) as Aspects 1 or 2
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Ah, my bad, I misunderstood you.

In that case I see what you mean. I think the type 3 option is probably still better though. For consistency, because Type 1 doesn't have any aspects. In Nonexistent Physiology, an ability with aspects, both type 1 and 2 have the same aspects so it fits a bit better that way. Here there's no such thing.
 
Thank you for dedicating your time and providing your input. it was much needed especially from an admin.
Qawsedf234 said:
The thing here is that BDE Type 2 Aspect 1 and Aspect 2 both do work off that same principal. Both are being beyond the subject of space-time with the nature of the beyondness being measurable or unmeasurable. Or in other words, Aspect 1 is on a quantitative scale while Aspect 2 is on a qualitative scale.
Click to expand...
While I do think that measurable or unmeasurable is a correct distinction here. but in my opinion the reason is that BDE T2 Aspect 1 is just a fat boi compared to a possible dimensional space. It can get fatter and fatter endlessly, but it would still remain within Low 1-A. The increase is quantitative, just as you said measurable.
But for 1-A, the concept of size as understood in the lower tiers becomes irrelevant, because 1-A represents a transcendental state of nature. In that sense, you could call it unmeasurable.
This was one of the reasons behind my thought process in considering them as fundamentally different.
Qawsedf234 said:
For that reason I say just split it into "BDE Type 2 - Aspect 1" and "BDE Type 2 - Aspect 2" rather than make a Type 3.

But if we do have to separate it, I won't be against it, I just think that clarifying them better is the way to go.
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So can I consider your vote as agree? (Leaning mostly towards aspects.)
 
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Qawsedf234 said:
Reading through it, I'm not sure if it should be separated as much as aspects should be given.

The thing here is that BDE Type 2 Aspect 1 and Aspect 2 both do work off that same principal. Both are being beyond the subject of space-time with the nature of the beyondness being measurable or unmeasurable. Or in other words, Aspect 1 is on a quantitative scale while Aspect 2 is on a qualitative scale.

The OP mentioned Nonduality as an example, the change with ND and TD was that you can qualify for three aspects between two types. You're either lacking duality or exceeding duality and there's three different scopes of that nature that the character can qualify for. For that reason I say just split it into "BDE Type 2 - Aspect 1" and "BDE Type 2 - Aspect 2" rather than make a Type 3.

But if we do have to separate it, I won't be against it, I just think that clarifying them better is the way to go.
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I also think that better clarifications seem like a more reasonable and easily applied idea. 🙏
 
So far, we have four staff members in agreement. is this number of votes sufficient? (tho I would still like to know which option ant overall supports)
Also I made a blog for the changes I would apply if we go with Type 3.
 
Elyartaker said:
So far, we have four staff members in agreement. is this number of votes sufficient? (tho I would still like to know which option ant overall supports)
Also I made a blog for the changes I would apply if we go with Type 3.
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Anyone of moderator status or above on any of the three wikis is permitted to post on staff threads without asking for permission, but only VS Battles administrators and bureaucrats can vote on them. As of now, only Ant and Qawsedf have approved this with evaluation rights.
 
IdiosyncraticLawyer said:
Anyone of moderator status or above on any of the three wikis is permitted to post on staff threads without asking for permission, but only VS Battles administrators and bureaucrats can vote on them. As of now, only Ant and Qawsedf have approved this with evaluation rights.
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I see. thanks.
 
I added a blog to the thread we can use if option 2 gets accepted, which mostly separates the aspects of Type 2 into Type 2 and Type 3. I also added a Notes section, which includes the two pre-existing notes and two new ones I made for clarification.
 
What are the summaries for options 1 and 2?
 
DarkDragonMedeus said:
What are the summaries for options 1 and 2?
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Summaries as in what both options are? Option 1 is adding aspects to Type 2 to separate quantitative and qualitative BDE. Option two is addition of Type 3 exclusive for Qualitative Superiority. I would recommend reading the blog.
As for voting, 3 staff agrees for option 2, 1 is neutral but leans towards option 1.
 
Thank you for the vote!
Now we have 3 admin votes, 2 thread mod votes and a huge support from the community. Can I apply option 2 now? i have my blog ready to be applied.
 
IdiosyncraticLawyer said:
Anyone of moderator status or above on any of the three wikis is permitted to post on staff threads without asking for permission, but only VS Battles administrators and bureaucrats can vote on them.
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This is wrong.

The text describing our Staff Discussion forum says:
Board activity is allowed for VS Battles wiki staff and highly trusted members only, unless stated otherwise. Derailing is heavily discouraged.
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And our Discussion Rules say:
Only staff members and regular members staff have deemed highly trustworthy may participate in Staff Discussion threads unless an explicit exception is noted.
  • Only staff members with evaluation rights can authorize regular members to participate in Staff Discussion threads. Thread Moderators are able to grant permission for a single post at a time, whereas administrators can give permission for up to three. Bureaucrats are the only staff members that are allowed to give indefinite posting rights for a particular staff thread. If a staff member with evaluation rights determines that a regular member has misused their granted privileges, these can be removed.
  • It is important to note that only voluntarily retired staff members and members who've been accepted for a staff position in the past but dismissed the offer by choice, fall into the category of highly trustworthy. The majority of regular members who do not fall into the groups mentioned above are still in need of permission from staff members with evaluation rights.
Click to expand...
We do not vet the staff members of FCOC and JBW, and we cannot demote them. They could be completely unreasonable and derail our staff threads; we have no controls over that. I would strongly oppose any suggestion to have them able to comment on staff-only threads without permission.
 
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