Ben 10 Upgrade | Part 2

[Firestorm808]

Sir George:

• Immortality (Greater Type 1, 3 [Low-Mid] & 5;
  • His life is linked to Ascalon, he can't die
    • Type 1 is fine.
  • so if a wielder suffers significant damage such as cut off part of his head split, Ascalon will immediately regenerate him. His eternal immortality is enhanced.
    • Type 3 Disagree. This isn't regeneration from wounds. This is some form of empowerment and Age Manipulation.
    • "Too weak to revert to my normal form, I eventually washed up on shore."
    • "Instead, I will find Psyphon, regain my lost powers, then return home to rule my empire."
• Resistanceto
  • Corruption (Type 1)
    • Fine
  • Madness Manipulation (Type 2 & 3)
    • Unaffected by Ascalon's Madness Corruption even when it was with him for years) Ben also would get resist to this since it accepted before.
      • Type 2 is fine
      • Type 3 disagree.

Ascalon:

• Passive Corruption & Madness Manipulation(
  • Type 1for Corruption
    • Fine
  • Type 2 & 3 for Madness Manipulation; Ascalon can corrupt anyone who hold it, and make him becomes crazy and destroy anything around him even himself)
    • Type 2 is fine
    • Type 3 disagree.
• Conceptual Manipulation (Type 2; Can wipe out evil, causing all beings go to kill and rebuild the universe)
  • Disagree. Too vague and figurative to discern what that line would mean.

Dagon

• Immortality (Type 5; He can't be kill.)
  • 5: Deathless Immortality: Characters who exist unbound by conventional life or death, or do not exist at all, and thus cannot be traditionally killed.
  • I don't see how this is demonstrated in the link given.
• All powers and abilities of Lucubra Vilgax (It stated that Lucubra Vilgax was use the power of Dagon)
  • Fine, but that list includes what exactly?
• Unholy Manipulation (Upscale to Lucubra and Esoterica, who can use demonic powers to cross between dimensions)
  • Ask other staff if it meets our definition of demons, evil spirits, and anti-gods
• Absorption, Empathic Manipulation & Non-Physical Interaction (Upscale to Lucubra, a demon beings possess the ability to feed on the thoughts of humans. Gwen states that it feeds on the part of the mind used to pray or meditate until there is nothing left of the victim's mind.) (Add to Lucubra)
  • The abilities are fine

Clockwork & Maltruant:

• Low 1-C via Temporal Energy Absorption (Can absorb Chronosapien Time Bomb's explosion)
  • Fine, but only for Range and non-combat absorption.

Lucubra Vilgax:

• Mana Manipulation (Basic Mana, possibly Dark Mana; He has power of Dagon, a Mana powers)
  • Has it shown any actual mana use in the show?

Alien X:

• Immortality (Type 2 [High-Mid]; Comparable to Galactic Gladiator who can survive from explosion and lost his limbs, and can still alive when his body started to be cut to pieces)
  • Type 2 is fine.

Professor Paradox:

• Non-Physical Interaction & Memory Manipulation (Made past Ben think that all the events he experienced was just a dream)
  • I suppose?

Ultimate Humungousaur:

• Danmaku (Can launch hundreds of rockets at once, as shown here and here)
  • Fine.

Alien Physiology:

• Non-Physical Interaction (Intangibility, Non-Corporeal, Energy, Life-Energy, Soul and Essence; Transformations can interact with Mana, shown here, here and here)
  • Disagree. Mana isn't inherently non-physical.

Save Time Powers for a separate thread.

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

Immortality (Greater Type 1, 3 [Low-Mid] & 5;

• His life is linked to Ascalon, he can't die
  • Type 1 is fine.
• so if a wielder suffers significant damage such as cut off part of his head split, Ascalon will immediately regenerate him. His eternal immortality is enhanced.
  • Type 3 Disagree. This isn't regeneration from wounds. This is some form of empowerment and Age Manipulation.
  • "Too weak to revert to my normal form, I eventually washed up on shore."
  • "Instead, I will find Psyphon, regain my lost powers, then return home to rule my empire."

"Too weak to revert to my normal form, I eventually washed up on shore" means he was literally injured as harmful as the damage to his head, this is why he should be has Immortality Type 3

• Conceptual Manipulation (Type 2; Can wipe out evil, causing all beings go to kill and rebuild the universe)
  • Disagree. Too vague and figurative to discern what that line would mean.

It's not, Vilgax explains that Ben is able to destroy all evil using Ascalon causing the destruction of an existing universe and the creation of a new one.

Dagon

• Immortality (Type 5; He can't be kill.)
  • 5: Deathless Immortality: Characters who exist unbound by conventional life or death, or do not exist at all, and thus cannot be traditionally killed.
  • I don't see how this is demonstrated in the link given.

It can still alive even after lose their life-force & heart

• All powers and abilities of Lucubra Vilgax (It stated that Lucubra Vilgax was use the power of Dagon)
  • Fine, but that list includes what exactly?

Here all abilities of Lucubra Vilgax.

Lucubra Vilgax:

• Mana Manipulation (Basic Mana, possibly Dark Mana; He has power of Dagon, a Mana powers)
  • Has it shown any actual mana use in the show?

Dagon's powers are Mana, and it's shown when Gwen say this is Dark Magic, and later it stated that Dagon's corruption is spells.

Non-Physical Interaction (Intangibility, Non-Corporeal, Energy, Life-Energy, Soul and Essence; Transformations can interact with Mana, shown here, here and here)

• Disagree. Mana isn't inherently non-physical.

It is, Mana can phase through the ground and it's "Soul" & "Essence" which is non-corporeal in nature.

Save Time Powers for a separate thread.

Ok

 

[Firestorm808]

"Too weak to revert to my normal form, I eventually washed up on shore" means he was literally injured as harmful as the damage to his head, this is why he should be has Immortality Type 3

Injury and energy/feeling weak are two different things.

Imagine Deadpool regenerating from being blown up but is too tired/weak to get out of bed afterward.

 

[Quang230]

This out of the thread but I have two scaling want to ask. In this kid Ben hurt kid Gwen with a punch does it enough to scale him to her

And in this said that Null Void is create by Galvan, and since Galvan tech and Highbreed tech scale with each other so can it put anything scale with Highbreed tech upgrade or i miss something about it

 

[Adr10K]

And in this said that Null Void is create by Galvan, and since Galvan tech and Highbreed tech scale with each other so can it put anything scale with Highbreed tech upgrade or i miss something about it

I don't think this can be used since it is not a weapon.

 

[Lort15]

This out of the thread but I have two scaling want to ask. In this kid Ben hurt kid Gwen with a punch does it enough to scale him to her

And in this said that Null Void is create by Galvan, and since Galvan tech and Highbreed tech scale with each other so can it put anything scale with Highbreed tech upgrade or i miss something about it

Firestorm accepted that in my crt that kid ben will be high 6-A, and mftl+ at most 4-B soon o just forgot to add

 

[ABSOLUTE-ABSTRACT-KING]

Firestorm accepted that in my crt that kid ben will be high 6-A, and mftl+ at most 4-B soon o just forgot to add

Where?

 

[Lort15]

Where?

Addition for some aliens #ben10

Whampire - Whampire correction: Body puppetry (Corruptunas controls victim's body not their mind as we can see they are free to think and they don't want it but their bodies are forced to fight.) - Mind manipulation via hypnosis (Upscaling from Vladat King, he is able to hypnotize minds, he...

vsbattles.com

 

[ABSOLUTE-ABSTRACT-KING]

Bump

 

[Firestorm808]

Injury and energy/feeling weak are two different things.

Imagine Deadpool regenerating from being blown up but is too tired/weak to get out of bed afterward.

Waiting on reply.

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

Waiting on reply.

We can keep in additions and make CRT for immortality type 3 later since I'm still reviewing what Vilgax was mentioning.

 

[Firestorm808]

It's not, Vilgax explains that Ben is able to destroy all evil using Ascalon causing the destruction of an existing universe and the creation of a new one.

Elaborate on how this meets our CM Type 2 requirements.

 

[Hellformer]

Elaborate on how this meets our CM Type 2 requirements.

I think he means that destroying the concept of evil wipes out all the evil in the universe. I kinda see why it's vague but that's his interpretation.

 

[Adr10K]

Disagree. Mana isn't inherently non-physic

Eh, it is? Gwen's mana needs to be shaped into a barrier or a platform to be "solid", that's what she learnt by the times of OV flashbacks and AF.
By DAA and before, she couldn't do that. And it has been shown that it phases through solids.

 

[Firestorm808]

Eh, it is? Gwen's mana needs to be shaped into a barrier or a platform to be "solid", that's what she learnt by the times of OV flashbacks and AF.
By DAA and before, she couldn't do that. And it has been shown that it phases through solids.

The examples provided just show Mana attacks hitting/making contact with a target.

Non-physical interaction would only apply if a normal human can't interact with something, but this special individual can.

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

The examples provided just show Mana attacks hitting/making contact with a target.

Mana attacks are in intangible in nature, shown here, Gwen can make Mana become solid only to use shield or tentacles.

Non-physical interaction would only apply if a normal human can't interact with something, but this special individual can.

And this shown when solid objects can't interact with Mana blasts.

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

Bump

 

[Firestorm808]

Mana attacks are in intangible in nature, shown here, Gwen can make Mana become solid only to use shield or tentacles.

And this shown when solid objects can't interact with Mana blasts.

How do you differentiate between mana attacks that are intended to be intangible vs tangible when it makes contact with the target?

You showed clips of Ben's Aliens getting hit by mana attacks, but how we're those attacks intentionally intangible from the start?

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

How do you differentiate between mana attacks that are intended to be intangible vs tangible when it makes contact with the target?

You showed clips of Ben's Aliens getting hit by mana attacks, but how we're those attacks intentionally intangible from the start?

Can you show me any scan prove Mana/Soul are not intangible????????? Lol, it's Mana is soul and essence of being, and it's intangible in nature, to more proof for this it shown to be phase through objects, and even it stated that Gwen changed it to solid shapes for make shield or tentacles.

I don't shown it, I show that Ben's Aliens can interact with Mana, like Fourarms who reflected mana blast or Jetray who can interact Mana blast. It's because Mana are soul and essence who it's intangible in nature.

There many character has Non-Physical Interaction via interact with energy
Wonder Woman

• Non-Physical Interaction (Caught a Yellow Lantern's energy sword with her bare hands<a href="https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Wonder_Woman_(Post-Flashpoint)#cite_note-Sinestro_2011_#17-11"><span>[</span>11<span>]</span></a>)

Elemental Masters:

• Non-Physical Interaction (Ghosts, Souls, Shadows, Darkness, Curses, Data & Energy; Elemental Masters can interact with ghosts as shown here, here and here. They also can interact with shadows here and here. Can interact with Howlers who were stated to be curses. Can interact with Unagami's existence here and here. Even other elemental masters like Krux, Acronix and Wu was able to enter the Digiverse, a Digital Universe, without leaving their physical body which is needed for normal people. Can interact with energy blasts and kick them away as if they were physical as shown here and here)

 

[Firestorm808]

Can you show me any scan prove Mana/Soul are not intangible????????? Lol, it's Mana is soul and essence of being, and it's intangible in nature, to more proof for this it shown to be phase through objects, and even it stated that Gwen changed it to solid shapes for make shield or tentacles.

I don't shown it, I show that Ben's Aliens can interact with Mana, like Fourarms who reflected mana blast or Jetray who can interact Mana blast. It's because Mana are soul and essence who it's intangible in nature.

Do you have examples of Mana Attacks being intangible and going through regular humans?

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

Do you have examples of Mana Attacks being intangible and going through regular humans?

Here shown that Mana attacks can phase through the ground.

 

[Firestorm808]

Here shown that Mana attacks can phase through the ground.

That's not what I asked.

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

That's not what I asked.

You ask to shown Mana are intangible, and Mana literally phase through the ground, who is enough tp prove Non-Physical Interaction for Aliens

Incorporeal (or Non-Corporeal) beings are those who have no true physical form. Though they may have physical avatars or bodies, but their true essence exists non-physically, whether as a soul, as energy, or as an abstract concept. Being incorporeal is very different than Intangibility, as an intangible being's body is their true body, it just can't be affected by conventional physical forces. A incorporeal being does not usually have any kind of concrete, defined form, and can appear in many different forms if they wish, though the destruction of these bodies is of little relevance to the entity behind them.

The power to interact with intangible or non-corporeal beings or objects. Users can both see and interact with intangible, or non-corporeal, abstract, and nonexistent objects or life-forms and entities, allowing them to make physical contact and possibly cause harm.

 

[Firestorm808]

You ask to shown Mana are intangible, and Mana literally phase through the ground, who is enough tp prove Non-Physical Interaction for Aliens

I asked:

Do you have examples of Mana Attacks being intangible and going through regular humans?

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

I asked:

They no scan in show that shown that regular humans can't interact with it (also there even no scan that shown that Mana can interact with regular humans), anyway why even need this?

 

[Firestorm808]

no scan that shown that Mana can interact with regular humans

Really? There's no clip of any humans or inanimate objects getting hit by a mana attack at all throughout the series?

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

Really? There's no clip of any humans or inanimate objects getting hit by a mana attack at all throughout the series?

Ehhhh just one time against forever night (but when they use their armors), and she uses her mana shield or tentacles more than Mana attacks.

 

[jgms2008]

 

[ABSOLUTE-ABSTRACT-KING]

Bump

 

[Firestorm808]

Ehhhh just one time against forever night (but when they use their armors), and she uses her mana shield or tentacles more than Mana attacks.

Seeing the clips from @jgms2008, my stance remains unchanged.

To justify non-physical interaction, you need to provide an example of mana being intentionally intangible/non-physical and a person is still able to intentionally make contact with it.

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

Seeing the clips from @jgms2008, my stance remains unchanged.

What @jgms2008 sand, is just Telekinesis not Mana attacks, you can see the mana around them.

To justify non-physical interaction, you need to provide an example of mana being intentionally intangible/non-physical and a person is still able to intentionally make contact with it.

If it hits targets, it doesn't make it immediately physical, that's what Mana is working on, and it hits the target, like ectoplasmic and ki.

 

[Firestorm808]

The whole point of Non-Physical Interaction is that one can interact with something that is intangible or non-corporeal to a normal person.

I won't be changing my stance on this based on what's been presented so far.

 

[Firestorm808]

It's not, Vilgax explains that Ben is able to destroy all evil using Ascalon causing the destruction of an existing universe and the creation of a new one.

I disagree with this interpretation. Wanting to destroy evil doesn't have any relation to the actual abstract concept of evil.

Something as simple as lying, cheating, or stealing a candy bar fall under the broad umbrella of evil, but that doesn't mean Ben is going to destroy those people as well in this hypothetical.

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

The whole point of Non-Physical Interaction is that one can interact with something that is intangible or non-corporeal to a normal person.

Here even you get this?

The power to interact with intangible or non-corporeal beings or objects. Users can both see and interact with intangible, or non-corporeal, abstract, and nonexistent objects or life-forms and entities, allowing them to make physical contact and possibly cause harm.

I won't be changing my stance on this based on what's been presented so far.

You just get words out of nowhere

 

[Adr10K]

Something as simple as lying, cheating, or stealing a candy bar fall under the broad umbrella of evil, but that doesn't mean Ben is going to destroy those people as well in this hypothetical.

I mean, I see where you're going, but just to add something to the other point.

It was implicit that Ben was going to end all free wills in the entire Universe, which means Ben wasn't targeting just "villains, but all kinds of evilness.

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

I disagree with this interpretation. Wanting to destroy evil doesn't have any relation to the actual abstract concept of evil.

Don't need to be stated as concept, it literally shown to be concept Type 2 and that's not an explanation, that's what Vilgax literally says.

Something as simple as lying, cheating, or stealing a candy bar fall under the broad umbrella of evil, but that doesn't mean Ben is going to destroy those people as well in this hypothetical.

Where even stated to be lying? It means it, since he hold Ascalon which has Madness Effect

 

[Adr10K]

Where even stated to be lying? It means it, since he hold Ascalon which has Madness Effect

Dude, stand down. That's not what he tried to say.

 

[jgms2008]

Seeing the clips from @jgms2008, my stance remains unchanged.

To justify non-physical interaction, you need to provide an example of mana being intentionally intangible/non-physical and a person is still able to intentionally make contact with it.

Look, I don't know if this helps, but I found this scene here of Charmcaster's attacks attacking Kevin and the ones that didn't hit seemed to be going through the concrete wall.

 

[Antvasima]

Firestorm808's evaluations seem to make sense here. What he has accepted can probably be applied now.

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

Firestorm808's evaluations seem to make sense here. What he has accepted can probably be applied now.

Currently this CRT has not been completed