Then you should have translated the last part because it adds context and destroys your claim but maybe you didn't because it doesn't fit your agenda but i digress.... i am not going to go back and forth with you on this.
I never said you said that either maybe you should have read further to understand what point i was actually trying to convey here, CIEN DOESN'T HOLD ULQUIORRA IN COMPARISON TO THE OTHER NAMES, this is backed by the fact that he doesn't call any of the former heuco mondo residents outside the top 3 espadas and he only calls ulquiorra because he acknowledged their battle while saying FH ichigo in particular outside the two could have been trouble to handle, he delibrately omits ulquiorra's name AGAIN after omitting his name earlier in the top three esapada statement. The only reason ulquiorra name is mentioned is because he fought FH ichigo not because he holds ulquiorra in higher esteem, for the basis of your argument to work, you need to prove that cien calls ulquiorra for another reason outside acknowledging their battle because his name isn't mentioned in any other context aside him mocking her for that idea that either of them could kill him (this is where he regards ulquiorra but it is a mockery) and even goes to single him out by acknowledging ONLY fh ichigo, and because ichigo ragdolled ulquiorra my interpretation is all made the more obvious because the text doesn't scale him to ichigo nor does it scale to top three former residents of heuco mondo despite ulquiorra being a former resident as well.
The people he's naming are his guesses to who Roka could be copying in Las Noches/HM, so it's not limited to formal HM residents and that's a weird assumption to make in the first place. So this would include beings like FH Ichigo, HM Zaraki and guess what he doesn't mention either of those 2 when he says "Only me and Lord Aizen surpass these 3 powers", so this statement isn't even all that reliable in the first place and no were giving the reason why Cien mentions SE Ulq which u just keep ignoring (But I'm the one with the agenda right???). It's not that he only gets a mention bc he fought FH Ichigo, no Cien straight up thinks that Roka would copy SE Ulq over those other 3 Espada. So Cien himself debunks his own statement from prior and as i alr explained he wasn't being fully truthful it's not a 100% reliable statement. No one's trying to argue SE Ulq scales to FH Ichigo and SE Ulq being a threat or not doesn't matter, those 3 Espada aren't a threat to him either supposedly and I'm trynna argue SE Ulq > those 3 (not FH Ichigo).
He doesn't mention FH ichigo for the same very reasons he doesn't mention yamamoto or Unohana outisde heuco mondo BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT RESIDENTS IN HEUCO MONDO, The premise of that statement dwells on those that have were once residents of heuco mondo, that was the reason why ichigo isn't mentioned in the first statement, and he only gets mentioned because the ichigo who dogwalked ulquiorra is more powerful than they are as cien's words suggests but it doesn't extend to ulquiorra because he delibrately singles him out by not making an emphasis on him at all other than him ridiculing her for the idea in the first place, you could make a CRT on this and i guarantee it wouldn't get accepted.
Once again, no ur assuming it's limited to HM residents. It would be in reference to who has had fights in HM/Las Noches (Cien and Roka fight in Las Noches, but ik she copies the sand hollow that Rukia defeats. So she was copying beings outside of Las Noches too) or more specifically who has displayed their power in HM/Las Noches at the very least.
"If there was any power beyond that in Hueco Mundo" -any power Roka can copy in HM, context matters. So once again this statement isn't all that reliable FH Ichigo's power would be available and is a equal to a previous version of Cien who's draining the Picaro's SP and isn't slowly dying like this one.
This is also wrong because why would he exclude them because of that when he and roca have information on every hollow in heuco mondo and he is aware of this?, especially when this version of ulquiorra's "secret" has already been revealed in full display mind you to everyone as he vaporizes a huge portion of las noches in his fight with ichigo and the several wide kilometers of lanza del relampago is enough to bring out his secret to everyone, especially if some one with ass spirtual sensing abilities like yammy was even able to sense his power. There is no reason for that to be the case.
Yammy can't really sense for shit. Couldn't sense Orihime and Chad were trash and couldn't tell Ichigo's SP was higher then his (couldn't tell Ichigos SP was fluctuating to points where he's stronger then Ulq), plus they need open their Pesquisa's physically for long range sensing.
-
Also it just is implied Cien wasn't counting SE Ulq and FH Ichigo "
Did you think I didn't know about their transformations and powers" -asking Roka if she thought that he didn't know about their powers implies they weren't being counted before, bc Cien thought Roka perhaps didn't know that he knew about them and that she was sneakily trying to copy one of their powers.
-
Idk if it's confirmed whether or not she knew about SE Ulq and FH Ichigo, but
her threads gather information independent of her will and does shit like reviving pre Soul split Szayelaporro without her knowledge. So it makes sense that Cien wouldn't want to mention SE Ulq or FH Ichigo in the 3 Espada statement (these 3 being common knowledge) and would want to avoid giving her extra knowledge that she possibly doesn't know about (being FH Ichigo adn SE Ulq who aren't common knowledge).
He says that not because of your logic but because he was literally created by roca after the events of the arrancar saga, so he wasn't around at the time of these events. This is why he accumulates information about his past life and power so yeah you are wrong here as well
Yeah he seems to have directly checked all of the information the threads gathered when he revived (he's a smart guy), but Roka was wandering around in KKT after she revived and was depressed cuz she had no purpose (she's just aimlessly doing nothing while her threads do things behind her back).
And he only mentions ulquiorra because of their fight not because of him as individual, the only thing his statement proves is that he doesn't scale to ichigo nor does he scale to the three espadas because he isn't compared to anyone there when cien has knowledge to and ulquiorra fits both criteria to be listed since like them ulq is a former resident of HM.
"Copied one of those powers" (zoomed it in for you, since you seemed to have missed it) -meaning he's including SE Ulq not bc he fought FH Ichigo, but bc it's possible she would've gone to copy either of them. U keep saying I have a agenda when ur the one blatantly ignoring parts of the text, like IG bro and I have alr addressed the next 2 things you mention here above in this reply.
No it doesn't, you would have an argument if he is held in the same regard as FH ichigo, he isn't and we know this based of their fight and based on the interpretaion of cien own words, Cien would still call harribel if she was the one who forced ichigo to Full hollow instead regardless whether he stomps her or not not because of her outstanding power but because of the existence of the fight itself which was meant to allude to ichigo only. It doesn't matter who fought ichigo, that person would have still been called by this knowledge of that fight happened and the outstanding participator was only ichigo.
"Cien would still call Harribel if she was the one who forced..." -you have 0 proof SE Ulq was mentioned bc of his fight with FH Ichigo, and I have alr proved otherwise. Not to mention this example and the last part is just ur assumption again...
It is only dumb if ulquiorra was mentioned as a stand alone person instead of just mentioning him because full hollow ichigo managed to fight and ragdoll him, and their fight highlights ichigo's power. The fact of the matter is, he wasn't mentioned with the other residents of heuco mondo and he wasn't portrayed as being troublesome as ichigo, he was mentioned because the nature of his fight with ichigo revealed full ichigo who is the only one he made an emphasis on. Sure while your logic can be seen there is just too many things around his statement that makes it not being able hold up.
Alr proved he's mention for his own power as well and alr addressed the other 3 Espada statement
Except Cien thinks the one being worthy of being stronger than the espadas is full hollow ichigo since he is the only one who he makes an emphasis on and again the relevance of ulquiorra in that statement is the fight that revealed full hollow ichigo.
Disproved this alr way above
The text simply doesn't imply ulq is on higher level and that hurts your argument.
When u look at everything i've said and read it in this way, it does directly imply Cien thinks Roka would rather copy SE Ulq OR FH Ichigo (meaning both seperately) then those 3 Espada (seperately) which would grant SE Ulq > any of those 3 Espada.
It wasn't semantics when you were trying to say i didn't read novels and were trying to correct me for saying it was cien GRC but it is semantics when i refute that.... i see you.
fair enough
You realize that even if this is true it hurts your point right? He thinks it is possible for roca to believe the top 3 ults can rival his GRC which above his physicals but he doesn't think ulquiorra would be difficult to handle. Being possible rivals to his GRC >>>>>>>>>>>>> Not being troublesome to subdue
Ngl Cien saying he currently surpasses those 3 Espada's ULT is mega cap then. If those 3 Espada's ULTS are stronger then his GRC being doubled, then how is he still stronger then 3's powers? And Cien is a Cero merchant, he has no special ult like Starks wolves iirc. So a GRC is his strongest move.
-
So he's being hyperbolic asl when he's saying "Yh vro trust my current power is higher then those 3's attacks even though they surpass my doubled GRC" (He is stronger then them at his peak, but he's like slowly dying against Roka and losing his SP quickly. So he's hella nerfed and thus his previous statements of being above the Espada don't apply, cuz he wasn't nerfed at the time of those statements like he is here). T
hat doubled GRC fully outscales his durability
-
So atp is him thinking SE Ulq's attack not being difficult to handle even true?
And same for him being able to still defeat Roka if she copied a attack from FH Ichigo, how is he going survive a attack from FH Ichigo who equals his full power? Mind you he's so weakened that his GRC is weaker then Starks Wolves, when before in base at 33% he was stronger then Maxed Out Yammy which is implied stronger then the wolves. So I don't think that line of logic works when he's blatantly capping and overhyping himself, so the line of logic Roka would prioritize SE Ulqs power over those 3 Espada's moves is more reliable and doesn't have issues.
-
Also idk how you would cap SE Ulq
from this line. He doesn't say anything where u can draw the conlcusion SE Ulq is less troublesome then those 3 Espada's ULT's or isn't difficult to handle. You just made that part up. You can infer FH Ichigo > SE Ulq from this ofc, but he just stops talking about SE Ulq presumably bc FH Ichigo is stronger.
Now that i think about it i don't even know why i am arguing this when, an omniscient narrator in safwy directly calls yammy the strongest espada before cien surpasses him, the yammy that still followed the rankings even after ulquiorra revealed his secret form and died. I won't be arguing this anymore, this wiki already follows the logic i described.... Goodluck on the CRT you make
This? "once hailed" and this is like after Cien alr surpassed him, and if ur arguing a omniscient narrator it wouldn't matter whether it's before or after Cien surpasses him. The narrator would know of Pre soul split Szayelaporro, it'd alr be wrong.
-
So what if the wiki follows this logic? Doesn't mean the profiles are perfect
