Asmodeus (Dungeons and Dragons) profile rewrite

[Qawsedf234]

Here's a profile rewrite I made for Asmodeus. The changes are as follows

• Added more keys to represent his various forms. The current profile only uses his strongest incarnation that no longer exists in the current canon

• Added his typical magic spells and exapanded on his weaknesses

If the rewrite is agreeable can the changes be applied to his profile? Ask any questions if you have them.

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

anti chaos spells isn`t chaos manipulation it is specialized power null

 

[Qawsedf234]

Yeah I didn't really mess around with the original power and ability section that much. I'll remove the Anti-Chaos thing.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Bump

 

[ShadowWarrior1999]

This looks good.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Honestly gods should get Chaos Manip since Kord managed to make a permanent storm in the Elemental Chaos (a place of chaos and impermanence). But yeah, looks good, should be applied.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Now to wait for mod approval I guess.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

no mods here

 

[Qawsedf234]

I meant mods with locked page powers

 

[Dark649]

The profile is fine.

 

[Qawsedf234]

So the changes can be applied? Or do you mran that the current profile is fine the way it is?

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Profile seems mostly fine.

Is Solar Asmodeus really that weak, though? The 5e MM suggests they're on par with demon princes (which is surprisingly balanced, as there are only a few dozen solars and not a whole race of them), and this is the same exact edition where noteworthy demon lords are given several obvious Tier 2 feats.

The issue is I don't know if this is technically only 5e solars, or not.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

If we go by Challenge Rating, Solars are a bit stonger than Balors in 3e.

EDIT: Of course, CR is dubious at best at that point, keep in mind.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

20+ CR scaling actually results in basically Low 2-C to 2-C everything, at that level.

Which is pretty consistent for some things but not for others.

Like there are definitely some Tier 2 liches, but I'd find it extremely doubtful that ever lich is Tier 2.

I mention Solars though because this is part of their lore, not stat block.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Does their lore specify if they compare to Demon Lords in their true forms or their avatars?

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

There is zero distinction in 5e unless avatars are specifically mentioned by name, to which there is nowhere I can actually remember. Maybe somewhere in Out of the Abyss? But they don't have rules for aspects or anything anymore, so it's usually just them.The solars' lore directly compares their power to the demon princes themselves, though.

To my knowledge, solars in 5e only have about two paragraphs of lore, right now. What the two paragraphs state are that their "celestial might" is so great that "even demon princes shrink at its resonant commands", and that those of the twenty-four who don't act directly as stewards for specific deities wait in a state of contemplation until they're needed to "stave off some cosmic threat to the cause of good".

So they're supposed to be obscenely strong.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

In all fairness At least 6-B, likely High 6-B is obscenely strong, but point taken.

 

[Qawsedf234]

5e is post 4e retcon tbf. Solars likely got a power boost. But in 1e-4e Solars, while strong, aren't that strong. Mostly since Solars in those editions number in the hundreds or thousands rather than the dozens.

But if you want I could add a "Possibly Low 2-C" rating to the Solar section.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Yeah, that's part of why I was wondering if it was only a "5e solar" thing. There went from being an entire army of solars to only a handful who serve a very important cosmic purpose, so the change is understandable. They're no longer just "balor but an angel".

Though tacking on "Possibly Low 2-C" just to account for the fact solars are now that strong is fine, imo.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Where's the Tier 2 Abyss Lord/Archdevil statement at? I already got the 5e Solar statement

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Where's the Tier 2 Abyss Lord/Archdevil statement at? I already got the 5e Solar statement

Like which one

We've got a few

 

[Qawsedf234]

The ine from 5e where they are stated to be able to control their planes. That's the one Azathoth is refering to iirc

 

[Mr. Bambu]

"The Abyss is a vast wound in the cosmic order, a bottomless pit teeming with creatures that exist only to rend, tear, and destroy. The demon princes, individual demons of great power and determination, bend and shape the Abyss and its inhabitants to meet their every whim. These mighty beings imagine themselves at the center of the cosmos. Each demon prince believes that the universe will one day be theirs to command, its laws and structure twisted and warped to match the demons' ideal of perfection" "The Abyss is a chaotic tangle of miniature worlds, each one shaped by the demon lord that claims primacy over it. Within the layers it controls, a demon lord manipulates conditions to match its view of how that world best serves the lord's desires." Believe those are from Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

There's also these. Probably more (don't feel like looking right now), but here's a few that are also from Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes.

• Demon princes want to twist the universe's law and structure to suit their whim. Confirmed that this is very likely a possibility if they didn't have to deal with the Blood War.

"The demon princes, individual demons of great power and determination, bend and shape the Abyss and its inhabitants to meet their every whim. These mighty beings imagine themselves at the center of the cosmos. Each demon prince believes that the universe will one day be theirs to command, its laws and structure twisted to match the demons' ideal of perfection.

The demon princes' arrogance is exceeded only by their ambition. While any rational being would dismiss their goals as empty ambitions sparked by madness, the truth remains that the demon princes and their thralls are among the mightiest forces in the planes. It is conceivable that, if the Blood War turns dramatically in their favor, the demon princes could put the rest of their apocalyptic plans into motion."

• A demon lord's continued presence in a plane is enough to turn it into another layer of the abyss if left for long enough.

"At this point, a beseiged world's only hope for survival is the expulsion of the demon lord. The lord's defeat leaves the other demons again leaderless, and they react by warring against each other, which makes them susceptible to attacks from the world's defenders. The longer a demon lord remains in control of all the other fiends, the more the world around it becomes irrevocably changed. When a demonic incursion runs its course, no vestige remains of the world that existed before--in effect, the realm has become another layer of the Abyss."

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Azzy your quotes overlap mine a little bit

 

[Qawsedf234]

Okay I updated the profile to include the Low 2-C key. Does everything seem fine to update?

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Gonna remove that ugly white outline on the image first, one second. Quick render, should be done in a minute.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Azzy your quotes overlap mine a little bit

Shh. I wanted to provide full context.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Finished.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Updated the picture

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Alright I think that's it. Perhaps a note stating the Avatar key shares abilities on a lower scale with various god keys but that can probably be explained on threads if you like.

 

[Qawsedf234]

I'll add that and include the quote of him moving the Abyss

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Good idea. Tbh we should have a general thread for issues with D&D pages.

 

[Qawsedf234]

I think the big issue is that like, when the pages were made we all agreed with the stats but we didn't include the links in the pages themselves. So a few profiles are a bit unjustified.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Probably a good idea, as issues always tend to arise when dealing with a franchise that's 45 years old and spans 5(.5) editions.

@Qawsedf

Yeah, some of the pages need things updated.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Okay so I added the Avatar note and the feat of Asmodeus moving the Abyss. So if everything looks good to you I think the changes can be applied (either by you or just unlocking the profile).

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

I can unlock the profile, now.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Applied the changes

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Locked, again.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Oh right, before this thread is closed how do you feel about adding that Ancient Brethren key to Asmodeus? I brought it up before but it didn't get much discussion.