Anna Sprengel Revision (To Aru)

[DontTalkDT]

The Anna Sprengel page was basically created before we really have seen much of anything of the character. Heck, I bet most people (like me) didn't even know it existed for a long time considering that it wasn't put on the verse page. In any case it is not further surprising that it needs a lot of revisions now that we actually experienced the character fight.

As a basis for those revisions, I have created a respect thread with all feats to this point.

Speed​

Let's start with this. Anna has sadly not demonstrated any really impressive speed feats to this point. As we know from early Aleister even god-tier magicians of the verse can be rather lacking in physical speed. Or at least until they decide to use some magic to change that.
As for the current rating of "Nigh-Omnipresent"... well, does the reasoning given even sound like nigh-omnipresence? For me, it doesn't. It doesn't help that the same description is given for Aleister Crowley who we factually know wasn't Nigh-Omnipresent either. As I explain in the corresponding section of the respect blog the entire explanation is rather unreliable, to begin with.
Up to this point she faced Touma, Misaka and Misaki in battle and blitzed none of them. Given, she was hardly even trying. Still, her speed rating should for now be "Human level, possibly higher" or something along that line.

Durability​

The current page gives no reasoning for the durability and in my blog you will find no feats on this scale either. The best you could argue is that you could scale it from her striking strength, buuuuut... as you can see in the Breaker Powers section of the blog she can magically empower her hits with all kinds of effects and strength. So I'm somewhat sceptical that her striking strength scales to her durability given the weird supernatural empowerment.
Her best feats are tanking basically everything Misaka can dish out. Assuming we don't scale from lightning due to it being lightning, I would say we scale her to Multi-City Block level for that. Maybe with a "possibly Planet level" due to the Planet level physical attacks.

Range​

I didn't even pay much attention to that when gathering feats... Still, her structure breaker destroyed some large buildings "in the corner of the scenery", so that should be at least several hundred meters.
I think we can relatively safely ignore the statements that "distance doesn't matter" for now.

Stamina​

The justification of her stamina makes no sense. Those things simply wouldn't even slightly harm her given her durability. This should for the time being get downgraded to average. For the same reason her pain tolerance should go.

Standard Equipment​

She used the black pills once, but I think they are more optional equipment. I'm not sure if she still has any. They also need a bit more explanation. The Pneuma-less Shell should be added on the other hand, as should the normal knife she carries.

Shapeshifting​

Should, in my opinion, be replaced with limited Age Manipulation, given that she only changes her own age and nothing else.

Precognition​

I don't think she should have that. It could just be a case of her being a genius planner, which seems more likely. I talked with LazyHunter about it and he pointed out how Anna was "surprised by unexpected things such as Misaki tripping mid-fight and that she seemed actually curious as to what Touma would do in GT2 and she was genuinely disappointed by Touma when they met again until he revealed he had turn St. Germain into an ally."

Immunity to Mind Manipulation & Possession​

Why "Immunity" is a no go should be clear. This should be resistance, however not for the reason of eating St. Germain but for resisting Misaki. Eating a St. Germain pill should instead grant her resistance to possession as that is what St. Germain does.

Immortality​

I think there is nothing that ever really suggested she is absolutely immortal. So this should be Longevity instead.

Additions​

To keep this short I will just do a quick list of what should be added and which section in the blog the quotes for that are:

1. Resistance to Electricity: Tanked Misaka's lightning
2. Social Influencing: Social Influencing
3. Summoning: Summoning of Originals - The Pneuma-less Shell
4. Thread Manipulation: Bondage
5. BFR: Orbital Launch
6. Mind & Soul Attacks via Grimoire Creation: Writing Tool
7. Explosion Manipulation: Landmines
8. Limited Heat Manipulation: Scorching Beams
9. Air Manipulation: Air Manipulation / Acid Breaker, Wind Breaker and Light Breaker
10. Power Nullification: Blocking Power Circulation
11. Spatial Manipulation: Space Breaker
12. Fire Manipulation: Absence of Fire Breaker?
13. Electricity Manipulation: Item Breaker / Electricity Breaker
14. Gravity Manipulation: Gravity Breaker
15. limited Telekinesis: Scissor Breaker / Structure Breaker / Maw Breaker
16. Ice Manipulation: Ice Breaker
17. Acid manipulation: Acid Breaker, Wind Breaker and Light Breaker
18. Light Manipulation: Acid Breaker, Wind Breaker and Light Breaker
19. Explosion Manipulation: Explosion Breaker
20. Carbon Manipulation: Carbon Breaker
21. Enhanced Senses: Enhanced Senses / Extrasensory Perception
22. Stealth Mastery: Stealth Mastery
23. Invisibility: Invisibility
24. Clairvoyance: Clairvoyance

Of course the details of each ability will be explained the Notable A/T section in accordance to the quotes.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Looks good.

 

[ElixirBlue]

I agree.

Also adding this link to another related CRT that was started yesterday.

https://vsbattles.com/threads/a-little-ability-for-kuroko-shirai.109542/#post-3419793

 

[Malox1696]

i agree but do put the "likely much higher" in the speed, durability and range parts

 

[XDragnoir]

Wasn't she going to have Limited Analytical Prediction instead of Precognition?

 

[DontTalkDT]

Wasn't she going to have Limited Analytical Prediction instead of Precognition?

I kinda forgot that was still a thing as an actual ability. Yeah, I guess Analytic Prediction might be ok.

 

[Zensum]

Looks good, durability and speed are kinda tricky because she hasn't really been trying.

Some things I think should be added:
Range:
This going to vary a lot based on what ability she's using, from her Breakers to her drawing out the essence of objects like the whip which was stated to be capable of binding asteroids.

Stamina:
I believe the stamina of her adult form is greater than her child form since the latter seems to be used grudgingly to conserve energy. But I assume her stamina is greater than average due to empowerment and the fact that she is generally outsourcing.
"She drew in external power, rearranged it how she liked inside her body, and then fired it back out."

Immortality:
From what I can tell, it seems like type 1 over longevity to me.
"She demonstrated the ultimate form of wastefulness where even achieving immortality became an eternal prison of boredom."

Standard Equipment:
Wasn't this just a random knife?

Resistance:
I'd imagine intaking St. Germain without being affected would also get you biological resistance or something of the like.
I think she should also have mind/soul manipulation resistance for the same Grimoire related reason.

 

[XDragnoir]

I think we should re-do the Grimoire resistance thread before adding it to Anna, it was never concluded iirc.

 

[Antvasima]

DontTalkDT and Zensum seem to make sense to me.

 

[LazyHunter]

I agree with the changes suggested by DontTalkDT. Zensum's points about her range and Immortality type 1 are also good.

Side-note, her age should be changed too, given that in GT2 she mentions being at least two thousand years old.

“But after turning you into a mass of pain and robbing you of your ego to the point you can’t chain your memories together coherently, all that remains is a machine that goes around saving people? I already saw that performance around two thousand years ago.”

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you. What has been accepted can probably be applied then.

 

[DontTalkDT]

I can agree with most of Zensum's points, except two.

While I can agree that the range varies a lot based on technique, the asteroid thing shouldn't be understood as a range feat.

The old rope looked worn out and ready to snap if it tried to support someone’s body weight, but the Rose leader was able to endlessly draw out its essence. With that, she could bind even an asteroid falling from the heavens to hold it in place in the middle of the air.

The asteroid example is about how durable the rope is and how strong the binding. It even specifies that the asteroid would already be falling to the ground.

The other thing is the biological resistance. I'm not quite sure where the idea comes from. I don't think St. Germain manipulates the biology of its host. If the idea is that she probably could fight off the infection itself, I think a minor resistance to Disease Manipulation makes more sense.

 

[DontTalkDT]

Btw. not very important but still: What should I name Anna's unnamed techniques?
Should I name the Acid-producing Breaker technique "Acid Breaker" for example? Or something else? (Technically the name should signify what it destroys, but that doesn't really work for acid...)

 

[Malox1696]

The other thing is the biological resistance. I'm not quite sure where the idea comes from. I don't think St. Germain manipulates the biology of its host. If the idea is that she probably could fight off the infection itself, I think a minor resistance to Disease Manipulation makes more sense.

i think since st germain is a bacteria , it should count as resistance from viruses/bacteria and the likes, and it's not minor, the AC hospital could not cure touma even with their advance science

 

[DontTalkDT]

i think since st germain is a bacteria , it should count as resistance from viruses/bacteria and the likes, and it's not minor, the AC hospital could not cure touma even with their advance science

I mean, Anna already resists every single symptom the bacteria causes, which probably makes it easier to fight off than it would be for someone that doesn't. At least from the perspective of a normal immune system.
But I guess normal resistance against disease is ok as well.

 

[Zensum]

The asteroid example is about how durable the rope is and how strong the binding. It even specifies that the asteroid would already be falling to the ground.

The other thing is the biological resistance. I'm not quite sure where the idea comes from. I don't think St. Germain manipulates the biology of its host. If the idea is that she probably could fight off the infection itself, I think a minor resistance to Disease Manipulation makes more sense.

True it is a binding feat, but if it's falling from space and she suspends it in the air it still implies a considerable distance no?
Resistance to Disease Manipulation is cool.

I'm not sure, unnamed Acid-producing Breaker is a mouth full but it's probably the most accurate description.

 

[XDragnoir]

Absence of Fire Breaker isn't a good name, tho, just call it Fire Breaker, iirc it was compared to a napalm, Napalm Breaker maybe?

 

[Accelerate420]

I can agree with most of Zensum's points, except two.

While I can agree that the range varies a lot based on technique, the asteroid thing shouldn't be understood as a range feat.

The asteroid example is about how durable the rope is and how strong the binding. It even specifies that the asteroid would already be falling to the ground.

The other thing is the biological resistance. I'm not quite sure where the idea comes from. I don't think St. Germain manipulates the biology of its host. If the idea is that she probably could fight off the infection itself, I think a minor resistance to Disease Manipulation makes more sense.

If it's not about range, where is the Asteroid then? If it's falling to the ground, it's already in the 'heavens' = far far above ground. I'd consider it to be within the atmosphere. Unless you want to suggest the Asteroid is right beside her and she just ropes it from there. You said it yourself, it's falling.

Falling = distance = range = not near her. Yes, it's a durability Feat too, but it's clearly also based on range saying that even distant accelerating objects can't escape it.

This is nonsensical to see it one way and not both.

 

[DontTalkDT]

If it's not about range, where is the Asteroid then? If it's falling to the ground, it's already in the 'heavens' = far far above ground. I'd consider it to be within the atmosphere. Unless you want to suggest the Asteroid is right beside her and she just ropes it from there. You said it yourself, it's falling.

Falling = distance = range = not near her. Yes, it's a durability Feat too, but it's clearly also based on range saying that even distant accelerating objects can't escape it.

This is nonsensical to see it one way and not both.

It's a theoretical statement. The asteroid isn't anywhere. And it clearly isn't about range. It's about binding and holding it in the air.

And the statement says it is "falling from the heavens". Even if we took it that literally an object that falls from heaven can be literally any distance from the ground. Like, if it fell down to the point that it is 3 meter away from Anna the description would still work exactly as it is given. You can't take any range from that statement.

 

[Accelerate420]

It's a theoretical statement. The asteroid isn't anywhere. And it clearly isn't about range. It's about binding and holding it in the air.

And the statement says it is "falling from the heavens". Even if we took it that literally an object that falls from heaven can be literally any distance from the ground. Like, if it fell down to the point that it is 3 meter away from Anna the description would still work exactly as it is given. You can't take any range from that statement.

You can embellish the range to be the atmosphere if you want to hard cap it. There's also no evidence against the range not being this far either, as we do have that statement to begin with, which gives us range is indeed a factor in this too.

 

[DontTalkDT]

You can embellish the range to be the atmosphere if you want to hard cap it. There's also no evidence against the range not being this far either, as we do have that statement to begin with, which gives us range is indeed a factor in this too.

No evidence against the range being large is never a reason to list it as high. Stats aren't any higher as you can proof them to be.
The statement says nothing about how far the asteroid is away from the ground, so you can't assume it is in the upper atmosphere.

 

[Accelerate420]

No evidence against the range being large is never a reason to list it as high. Stats aren't any higher as you can proof them to be.
The statement says nothing about how far the asteroid is away from the ground, so you can't assume it is in the upper atmosphere.

The distance between them did not matter.

The old rope looked worn out and ready to snap if it tried to support someone’s body weight, but the Rose leader was able to endlessly draw out its essence. With that, she could bind even an asteroid falling from the heavens to hold it in place in the middle of the air.

Notice a quote you skimmed over? Distance? Distance = range. Yes, it's not helpful for an accurate calculation, but it's clearly also a range feat.

 

[ZERO7772]

Accelerate420 seems to make the most sense here.
I agree with him for reason above.

 

[Antvasima]

So what should we do here exactly?

 

[DontTalkDT]

Notice a quote you skimmed over? Distance? Distance = range. Yes, it's not helpful for an accurate calculation, but it's clearly also a range feat.

So, what range ranking do you propose that "feat" results in?

 

[Zensum]

I think just possibly much higher is fine tbh.

 

[Accelerate420]

Since we can't determine the range aside from that distance is not a factor, and to avoid NLF I think Zensum's addition works.

 

[Antvasima]

What do you think DontTalkDT?

 

[DontTalkDT]

Possibly higher is fine. I will apply the changes later.

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you. Should we close this thread?