Alien & Predator CRT

[Xenomorph2099]

Hello all, long time lurker, first time poster, and what a big post it is.
(Also if this post is in someway breaching any stated rules I apologize, like I said, first time poster.)

I come here today to propose the notion that AvP is in fact canon to both the Alien and Predator Franchises. Of course, my full proposal and reasoning is detailed in this Doc:
Alien & Predator CRT Response

Note that the Google Doc is a very lengthy read, (97 pages in total) as I needed to detail the full extend as to my reasoning why AvP should be considered canon to both the Alien and Predator verses. Most of my entries in this Google Doc are supported by statements, scans, and videos. I hope you, the reader look through this with a open mind and have a great day.
​

But in case I am not clear in the Doc, my objective is this:

• Reverse the decision to remove AvP and related scaling from the canon profiles of the Alien and Predator franchises.
• Make Comics, Movies, Video Games, Novels, and Figures considered Canon to both Alien and Predator with substantial reasoning.
• Establish the groundwork for a series of upgrades for Alien and Predator that would be open with the acceptance of this Doc.
• Support my favorite verse.

Summary of Arguments in Doc (However, it is recommended that you read through the entire doc to understand the full reasoning and evidence behind my arguments for Canonicity.):
- Predator Verse Map contains Alien and AvP based planets.

• Numerous other instances where Predator Media intends or straight up crosses over with Alien and vice versa. (no, I am not using Pred 2 Skull as actual evidence here.)
• The 2020 video game Predator: Hunting Grounds establishes Dark Horse Comics, NECA figures and will establish AvP as Canon, along with their own instances of combining two apparently separate universes.
• Xenomorphs existed before Prometheus and Alien: Covenant, therefore Xenomorph presence in earlier times is still plausible.
• Titan Book Novels having their own crossing over of apparently separated books into one world with Xenomorphs and Yautjas.
• A possible rationalization (theory at worst) that would make Predator: Concrete Jungle line up with Prometheus and vice verasa.

There's probably more I missed but that's what the doc's for.

 

[Xenomorph2099]

Bump.

 

[Xenomorph2099]

Bump.

 

[Xenomorph2099]

Bump Dump.

 

[Xenomorph2099]

Bump. (I dunno if there's like a max bump limit or something.)

 

[DaReaperMan]

97 page doc? Look while I have the time I would die from boredom, can you make a summary?

 

[Xenomorph2099]

97 page doc? Look while I have the time I would die from boredom, can you make a summary?

I probably should, should I post a new comment with summary or just edit the thread post?

 

[DaReaperMan]

I probably should, should I post a new comment with summary or just edit the thread post?

Edit the thread post, keep the link to the doc in the thread post but put a summary at the bottom

 

[Armorchompy]

>Alien & Predator CRT Response
>97 pages in total​

@Roachman40 have fun friend : )

 

[Xenomorph2099]

Edit the thread post, keep the link to the doc in the thread post but put a summary at the bottom

Edited with short summary of some some points.

 

[DaReaperMan]

This looks good so far, though please don't use colored text for the points, really ******* hard to see

 

[DragonLord]

Not to be rude, I commend the effort into this, but it feels to me this would only prove that Predator treats AVP as canon while not much says Alien does, i remember people like Ridley Scott saying he Hates AVP

 

[Armorchompy]

I honestly have to praise the effort, I can't check it right now (or ever probably since it is a bit too long) but I have to admit I've never seen this much brought to a CRT

 

[Xenomorph2099]

Not to be rude, I commend the effort into this, but it feels to me this would only prove that Predator treats AVP as canon while not much says Alien does, i remember people like Ridley Scott saying he Hates AVP

I understand the hesitance on that idea. It's kinda why I had to compile it like this to even sound like there's merit behind it. There's also been reports that he liked it, so I couldn't find any definite statements.

 

[Xenomorph2099]

This looks good so far, though please don't use colored text for the points, really ******* hard to see

I use Dark Mode on the fourms so it's easier to see for me I suppose. I kinda did go overboard with the colors but I was admittedly excited.

 

[Ogbunabali]

I don't really care nor know much about this verse, besides my dabbling in some Alien films as a horror fan. However, seeing this is the first time I've seen anyone dedicate so much time and effort into a CRT as to create a 100 page google doc, I decided to go through it out of sheer respect. And reading it, yeah, I agree with the proposal.

Keep in mind though, I'm not knowledgeable in the verse, so if anyone has some counterarguments, or just outright statements of the show's creators, that AvP is not canon it might change my opinion.

 

[Roachman40]

I do need to say though that the map contains non-canon stuff to AVP like var and then, I dont think it can be used to support AVP being canon to either alien or predator as we spoke about before iirc.

It being referenced by the AVPTHB doesn't mean much either imo as it also references ACM and sometimes contradicts things from the alien franchise, iirc.

Even if we consider Hunters Planet canon it would cause a bunch plotholes to pop up in the main story

Not to mention, the deleted scenes and other unused concepts for this movie would also support this argument as these were always meant to be intended scenes within the film, and would explain Lex’s Xenomorph Tail tipped Spear and the Shuriken appearing in The Predator.

I dont think this can be used either as these are just deleted scenes and unused concepts, the xenomorph tail and shuriken could just be nods to AVP, similar to the xenomorph skull in predator 2 just being added as a joke according to the winston effect book thingy.

I will comment on the other stuff later, otherwise you did a pretty good job on this mi amigo, nice

 

[Xenomorph2099]

I do need to say though that the map contains non-canon stuff to AVP like var and then, I dont think it can be used to support AVP being canon to either alien or predator as we spoke about before iirc.


I dont think this can be used either as these are just deleted scenes and unused concepts, the xenomorph tail and shuriken could just be nods to AVP, similar to the xenomorph skull in predator 2 just being added as a joke according to the winston effect book thingy.

I will comment on the other stuff later, otherwise you did a pretty good job on this mi amigo, nice

As for The Predator and Pred 2, the main reason I separated the two is that this (The Predator) is a 2018 film post Prometheus/Covenant that is chock full of Alien references. Xeno Tail and Shuriken (a AvP based Weapon) is pretty damning when compared to the planned Alien ending with Ms.Yutani and related props.

It's kinda like a Xenomorph Skull wrapped over a Plasma Caster, Shurikens and ouright killing Yutani company man, Xenomorphs, and the first (a possible precursor) Mother system in Concrete Jungle. But that's way more obvious than The Predator.

Also I address Then and Var in Counter Arguments.

As far as I remember, The Hunt Begins only makes reference to USCM Tech and Xenomorph types. The Weyland Yutani Report also does the same with Colonial Marine Tech.

Plot Holes?

 

[Roachman40]

Plot Holes?

Used plotholes for lack of the better word lol

Shorty appearing in hunters planet, although supposedly dying In the war comic is what I meant by plothole, and some more stuff like Hunter’s Planet being apparently ignored later into Three World War as stated in your doc.

As for The Predator and Pred 2, the main reason I separated the two is that this (The Predator) is a 2018 film post Prometheus/Covenant that is chock full of Alien references. Xeno Tail and Shuriken (a AvP based Weapon) is pretty damning when compared to the planned Alien ending with Ms.Yutani and related props.

The Xeno tail and Shuriken can still be considered 'easter eggs' imo, more-so this movie happens waaay before prometheus, and we have already debated on if xenos existed before the movie or not.

It's kinda like a Xenomorph Skull wrapped over a Plasma Caster, Shurikens and ouright killing Yutani company man, Xenomorphs, and the first (a possible precursor) Mother system in Concrete Jungle. But that's way more obvious than The Predator.

Concrete Jungle is a doozie, We have discussed concrete jungle before no? not sure if it can be considered canon or not either to alien or otherwise. Concrete Jungle takes place in 2030 while prometheus takes place in 2093 so im not sure if these two really connect.

As far as I remember, The Hunt Begins only makes reference to USCM Tech and Xenomorph types. The Weyland Yutani Report also does the same with Colonial Marine Tech.

THB still isn't really the best source imo, we dont even know if it connects into the main AVP storyline or just its own boardgame thingy. I do see your point here, its just making something like that canon causes complications in the main story if you know what I mean.

 

[Roachman40]

I can see AVP being more tied in with predator, but it being tied with alien is something that could cause complications imo

 

[DragonLord]

From what I’m seeing it seems to me the Predator Franchise has no issue with having AVP stuff, it just seems the Alien side has more complications, I would like to see if Ridley Scott did actually say he liked AVP

 

[Xenomorph2099]

I can see AVP being more tied in with predator, but it being tied with alien is something that could cause complications imo

Gimme a moment to reply to previous comment, doing something rq.

 

[Xenomorph2099]

Used plotholes for lack of the better word lol

Shorty appearing in hunters planet, although supposedly dying In the war comic is what I meant by plothole, and some more stuff like Hunter’s Planet being apparently ignored later into Three World War as stated in your doc.

Yea, that's fair. The only thing that is ignored to the most of my knowledge is Shorty's appearance. However THB mentions both the Bunda event from War (comic), so we obviously can't have Shorty appear and die in both. Seeing as elements from Hunter's Planet appear in the THB bio for Machiko, I did rationalize what exactly happened, which is that Shorty and Top Knot's hunting party didn't survive the Bunda event, seeing as the Ryushi Clan in Three World War didn't seem to know that Machiko was responsible for said events while Livermore Evanston from the Hunter's Planet is mentioned without the mention of their ploy within Hunter's Planet, so I assumed that events now happened differently since this is her first appearance since her story's culmination in Three World War.

The Xeno tail and Shuriken can still be considered 'easter eggs' imo, more-so this movie happens waaay before prometheus, and we have already debated on if xenos existed before the movie or not.

Again, the implications that the Alien Crossover Ending was the Intended Ending before 3rd Act reshoots is incredibly too big to write off as easter eggs in the same regard as Predator 2's Xenomorph Skull as it would have brought a Ripley from a undetermined point in time to 2018 with Weyland-Yutani tech. (likely Ellen) If you read Counter Arguments, you'll see that I have shown that Xenomorphs did exist before the events of Prometheus and Covenant with evidence from Ridley's interview with Empire, Prometheus DVD Special Features, and Ridley's references to the script that detailed the acknowledgment of Alien's Derelict and Xenomorphs.

Concrete Jungle is a doozie, We have discussed concrete jungle before no? not sure if it can be considered canon or not either to alien or otherwise. Concrete Jungle takes place in 2030 while prometheus takes place in 2093 so im not sure if these two really connect.

Not too deeply, no. The fact that Sir Peter Weyland can be easily placed into the events of Concrete Jungle with evidence from Sir Peter Weyland himself, David in Covenant, and further debunking of the Unidentified Weyland being Charles Bishop Weyland (implying he survived AvP 2004 at all lmao) with evidence from both AvP 2010 combined with Prometheus.

THB still isn't really the best source imo, we dont even know if it connects into the main AVP storyline or just its own boardgame thingy. I do see your point here, its just making something like that canon causes complications in the main story if you know what I mean.

I don't happen to see any complications that THB brings into the main story's cohesion. THB does bring in some other characters from other media like Major Schafer from Capcom or Warrior Specimen 6, but these characters and plot elements related from THB don't conflict with any previous story at all. Even an addition like the Alien Monstrosity is heavily based around the Alien King Marquette from Sideshow Collectibles which in of itself is a bit of a small recton which makes the Rouge Alien King, just Rouge now. The Alien king Marquette was released in 2016. TBH Expansion "Unleashed" which brought this Xenomorph into the game was dropped in 2017.


(Ik this is a Dev art post and a actual entry of the Alien King from Prodos games would be better butI don't have the images hosted anywhere rn so I'll have to settle with this. It is the same creature though.)
https://www.deviantart.com/tokalanawak/art/Alien-King-with-Aliens-warriors-752757225

 

[Roachman40]

Again, the implications that the Alien Crossover Ending was the Intended Ending before 3rd Act reshoots is incredibly too big to write off as easter eggs in the same regard as Predator 2's Xenomorph Skull as it would have brought a Ripley from a undetermined point in time to 2018 with Weyland-Yutani tech. (likely Ellen) If you read Counter Arguments, you'll see that I have shown that Xenomorphs did exist before the events of Prometheus and Covenant with evidence from Ridley's interview with Empire, Prometheus DVD Special Features, and Ridley's references to the script that detailed the acknowledgment of Alien's Derelict and Xenomorphs.

But it was still unused, I dont think it could be used in the long run because of that, hell that probably solidifies the predator being more in-universe with AVP rather than alien lol.

The xenomorphs in AVP 2004 and requiem are stated to be xenomorphs, no separate variations like a deacon or neomorph but straight up xenomorphs, nor are they implied to be a different variation. Deacons or Neomorphs aren't something that could signify that there where xenos before David even made them either, just because they have some relation dosen't mean xenos where out and about.

I dont think it's even implied that they're where actual xenomorphs before covenant/prometheus either, saying that they're where xenos before those movies is kind of speculation no? since its not confirmed if thats the case iirc.

Not too deeply, no. The fact that Sir Peter Weyland can be easily placed into the events of Concrete Jungle with evidence from Sir Peter Weyland himself, David in Covenant, and further debunking of the Unidentified Weyland being Charles Bishop Weyland (implying he survived AvP 2004 at all lmao) with evidence from both AvP 2010 combined with Prometheus.

Concrete Jungle seems to fit in far more with AvP with this evidence. I don't think it could be combined with prometheus though, this game was made way before the movie so I doubt they where referencing it, more so the greek legend unless your referring to something else.

I don't happen to see any complications that THB brings into the main story's cohesion. THB does bring in some other characters from other media like Major Schafer from Capcom or Warrior Specimen 6, but these characters and plot elements related from THB don't conflict with any previous story at all. Even an addition like the Alien Monstrosity is heavily based around the Alien King Marquette from Sideshow Collectibles which in of itself is a bit of a small recton which makes the Rouge Alien King, just Rouge now. The Alien king Marquette was released in 2016. TBH Expansion "Unleashed" which brought this Xenomorph into the game was dropped in 2017.

That was bad english on my part my bad lol, I meant Hunters Planet dosent fit well into the main story, for reasons stated above.

 

[Xenomorph2099]

But it was still unused, I dont think it could be used in the long run because of that, hell that probably solidifies the predator being more in-universe with AVP rather than alien lol.

I'm going to have to continue disagreeing that particular part because it's frankly obvious that the symbol on The Predator Ripley's Mask is of Weyland-Yutani, not Weyland Industries, not Weyland Corp, not even Yutani. It's Weyland-Yutani.

The xenomorphs in AVP 2004 and requiem are stated to be xenomorphs, no separate variations like a deacon or neomorph but straight up xenomorphs, nor are they implied to be a different variation. Deacons or Neomorphs aren't something that could signify that there where xenos before David even made them either, just because they have some relation dosen't mean xenos where out and about.

I did not say that because Neomorphs and Deacons are related to Xenomorphs, that pure Xenomorphs were also right next to them at the same time if that is what you mean to say. (unless you read the dogshit that is Marvel's Alien that has Hammerpedes being next to Xenos.) I only mentioned Deacons and Neomorphs for their inherent relation via Black Goo, not a direct relation like what was once planned for Fire and Stone/Life and Death.

I dont think it's even implied that they're where actual xenomorphs before covenant/prometheus either, saying that they're where xenos before those movies is kind of speculation no? since its not confirmed if thats the case iirc.

It is, in the Damon Lindelof Draft Script that includes info that Ridley Scott directly used as the de facto revelation of why the Engineers wanted to erase humanity.

As shown in the Doc with screen caps from the script, the Engineers from the Juggernaut's recording systems speak of the Derelict on LV-426 and how that ship's pilot was attacked a "planet seeder", and with how that ship's cargo were Xenomorph Eggs, that means that the Xenomorph Eggs were there in the first place.

This is further corroborated by the Prometheus DVD Special Features revealing that Sir Peter Weyland knew of the Derelict's Distress Signal before even the events of Prometheus. Alien: Isolation also directly confirms that the Distress Signal came from the Derelict with showing Prometheus style Engineer tech (white biomechanic blubs) in the Alien Derelict.

Concrete Jungle seems to fit in far more with AvP with this evidence. I don't think it could be combined with prometheus either, this game was made way before the movie so I doubt they where referencing it, more so the greek legend unless your referring to something else.

While this is true and that there are already elements in Concrete Jungle's story that reference the Greek legend of Prometheus, the dates, level of technological advances present, and the age of Sir Peter Weyland combined with the mention of the disappearance of AvP's Charles Bishop Weyland and the appearance of this additional Weyland is too convenient to ignore. Remember that Sir Peter Weyland gave that Ted Talk. As mentioned in the doc, he had mentioned that Nanotech was devloped within the first decade of the 21st Century. AvP's Charles Bishop Weyland was that pioneer of Nanotech in that first decade.

That was bad english on my part my bad lol, I meant Hunters Planet dosent fit well into the main story, for reasons stated above.

Oh, oof. I did already mention my rationalization when it came to Hunter's Planet earlier.

 

[Xenomorph2099]

From what I’m seeing it seems to me the Predator Franchise has no issue with having AVP stuff, it just seems the Alien side has more complications, I would like to see if Ridley Scott did actually say he liked AVP

Don't mean to pry, but why it would it matter if Ridley Scott liked AvP or not? I doubt that alone would have any affect on these arguments.

 

[Roachman40]

I'm going to have to continue disagreeing that particular part because it's frankly obvious that the symbol on The Predator Ripley's Mask is of Weyland-Yutani, not Weyland Industries, not Weyland Corp, not even Yutani. It's Weyland-Yutani.

I understand that, but its still from a deleted scene, I dont think we can use it because of that.

I did not say that because Neomorphs and Deacons are related to Xenomorphs, that pure Xenomorphs were also right next to them at the same time if that is what you mean to say. (unless you read the dogshit that is Marvel's Alien that has Hammerpedes being next to Xenos.) I only mentioned Deacons and Neomorphs for their inherent relation via Black Goo, not a direct relation like what was once planned for Fire and Stone/Life and Death.

I probably misinterpreted my bad, I dont see how there relation to the black goo could mean that there where xenomorphs before covenant, I can see how the mural signifies xeno but to me it only shows the deacon and like trilobite creatures to the side of it. There needs to be more info on the mural itself imo as they kinda didn't explain it at all in the movie or otherwise iirc so its kind of up in the air.

It is, in the Damon Lindelof Draft Script that includes info that Ridley Scott directly used as the de facto revelation of why the Engineers wanted to erase humanity.

As shown in the Doc with screen caps from the script, the Engineers from the Juggernaut's recording systems speak of the Derelict on LV-426 and how that ship's pilot was attacked a "planet seeder", and with how that ship's cargo were Xenomorph Eggs, that means that the Xenomorph Eggs were there in the first place.

This is further corroborated by the Prometheus DVD Special Features revealing that Sir Peter Weyland knew of the Derelict's Distress Signal before even the events of Prometheus. Alien: Isolation also directly confirms that the Distress Signal came from the Derelict with showing Prometheus style Engineer tech (white biomechanic blubs) in the Alien Derelict.

Even if this script was used as the 'de facto revelation' of why the Engineers wanted to erase humanity it still wasn't in the actual movie, it being a draft would also probably mean the dialogue is exactly the same either.

Is there a video showing the distress signal in isolation? I'm currently having trouble finding it lol.

Oh, oof. I did already mention my rationalization when it came to Hunter's Planet earlier.

Its your way of interpreting it, not sure if its the best evidence considering it seems your rationalization is moreso speculation since we dont really know if this is what really happened in the book.

 

[Xenomorph2099]

I understand that, but its still from a deleted scene, I dont think we can use it because of that.

My argument for it comes from another reason. The Tail and Shuriken being in the Predator should be indictive of what i'm arguing for alone since most Predator Media that has these of nods and "easter eggs" end up leading to a Crossover of some kind. I realize this does sound like a association fallacy, but these instances of Alien material being in Predator media becoming more than nods is extremely common and fairly consistent as I have mentioned in the doc.

I probably misinterpreted my bad, I dont see how there relation to the black goo could mean that there where xenomorphs before covenant, I can see how the mural signifies xeno but to me it only shows the deacon and like trilobite creatures to the side of it. There needs to be more info on the mural itself imo as they kinda didn't explain it at all in the movie or otherwise iirc so its kind of up in the air.

While it is not crystal clear as to what exact information the mural depicts for sure, we know that these creatures had a presence in Engineer culture before Prometheus. Also I refer the creature in the doc as a Deacon, not a Xenomorph, despite the resemblance or what I said from before.

Even if this script was used as the 'de facto revelation' of why the Engineers wanted to erase humanity it still wasn't in the actual movie, it being a draft would also probably mean the dialogue is exactly the same either.

There is no other interpretation as to what the Engineers said, plus as mentioned in the Doc, the scene plays out mostly the same with their destination being Earth, a Engineer in Cryosleep, etc. Ridley Scott still mentions this script either way in that interview.

Is there a video showing the distress signal in isolation? I'm currently having trouble finding it lol.

Was in the Doc but here:

Its your way of interpreting it, not sure if its the best evidence considering we don't know if your rationalization/assumption actually happened or not, WoG or otherwise no?

Fair enough.

 

[Hellbeast]

This is all very impressive and I commend you for the presentation here

That said..

Most of your evidence seems to be arguing that AVP is canon to the predator franchise, not the Alien saga and there’s evidence going against the Predator universe = Alien universe

The writer for the Aliens RPG has mentioned that to Fox, Alien and predator are separate universes and we see similar stuff on Ridley Scott’s side of the matter, outright disowning the AVP films and seemingly retconning out Bishop Waylend with Peter Weyland, a similar CEO type who built the company from the ground up

 

[Xenomorph2099]

This is all very impressive and I commend you for the presentation here

That said..

Most of your evidence seems to be arguing that AVP is canon to the predator franchise, not the Alien saga and there’s evidence going against the Predator universe = Alien universe

The writer for the Aliens RPG has mentioned that to Fox, Alien and predator are separate universes and we see similar stuff on Ridley Scott’s side of the matter, outright disowning the AVP films and seemingly retconning out Bishop Waylend with Peter Weyland, a similar CEO type who built the company from the ground up

I mention the writer's article within the Doc's Counterarguments and the problems with the article's statements, notably issues with the Fire and Stone & Life and Death comics.

I do go over how it is possible that Charles Bishop Weyland and Sir Peter Weyland can co-exist within the Counterargument section.

I will admit that this Doc was initially made with the objective of reversing only Predator's changes, but as more and more information that could potentially help Alien's case came up, I ended up including Alien during the final days of editing.

 

[Hellbeast]

I mention the writer's article within the Doc's Counterarguments and the problems with the article's statements, notably issues with the Fire and Stone & Life and Death comics.

Then you would know the writer specifically mentioning only the Alien segments are canon to Alien

I do go over how it is possible that Charles Bishop Weyland and Sir Peter Weyland can co-exist within the Counterargument section.

The thing is that’s headcanon; there’s no relationship ever mentioned between the two and Bishop Weyland straight up isn’t mentioned in any capacity.

Not by Prometheus, not by Covenant and not by the supplementary materials

I will admit that this Doc was initially made with the objective of reversing only Predator's changes, but as more and more information that could potentially help Alien's case came up, I ended up including Alien during the final days of editing.

I get that fam, that’s kinda my thing with my Snyder Cut Doc (starting with continuity and then getting more into BtS stuff)

 

[Xenomorph2099]

Then you would know the writer specifically mentioning only the Alien segments are canon to Alien

So Predators appearing in those issues is in "Alien Canon" despite a different rule that straight up contradict it?

This is the footnote you refer to.

Only the Aliens issues of “Fire and Stone” and “Life and Death” are part of the Alien Universe. The Predator and AVP portions are not.

However, these footnotes right after contradict it.

Anything with Predator in it is part of the separate Predator universe instead, or…

If an Alien and a Predator appear, that means its part of the separate AVP Universe. Even if it says its an ALIEN labeled product and not an AVP one—if a Predator shows up it’s AVP).

So this would actually mean that Fire and Stone & Life and Death take place in AvP all things considered.

The thing is that’s headcanon; there’s no relationship ever mentioned between the two and Bishop Weyland straight up isn’t mentioned in any capacity.

Not by Prometheus, not by Covenant and not by the supplementary materials

I wouldn't say it is headcanon due to it being a rationalization given how the collected materials line up, but maybe that's just me misunderstanding.

I get that fam, that’s kinda my thing with my Snyder Cut Doc (starting with continuity and then getting more into BtS stuff)

Nice. I am kinda confused over Synder Cut vs DCEU on that. I realize that fighting for Alien's segment in this doc was going to be the harder part when compared to Predator.

 

[Hellbeast]

So Predators appearing in those issues is in "Alien Canon" despite a different rule that straight up contradict it?

This is the footnote you refer to.

Only the Aliens issues of “Fire and Stone” and “Life and Death” are part of the Alien Universe. The Predator and AVP portions are not.

However, these footnotes right after contradict it.

Anything with Predator in it is part of the separate Predator universe instead, or…

If an Alien and a Predator appear, that means its part of the separate AVP Universe. Even if it says its an ALIEN labeled product and not an AVP one—if a Predator shows up it’s AVP).

So this would actually mean that Fire and Stone & Life and Death take place in AvP all things considered.

No it doesnt

The Alien chapters of Fire and Blood are canon because there’s no Predators

The footnote is specifically that interaction between them makes the sections where that happens is AVP

I wouldn't say it is headcanon due to it being a rationalization given how the collected materials line up, but maybe that's just me misunderstanding.

It’s a good rationalisation but the thing is it’s not listed in any official materials so it would be head canon

IF the material said “oh Peter is his nephew” then it wouldn’t be headcanon

Nice. I am kinda confused over Synder Cut vs DCEU on that. I realize that fighting for Alien's segment in this doc was going to be the harder part when compared to Predator.

Yeah it’s confusing but it seems like the first two Snyder films are canon but the 2017 Cut is canon over the 2021 Snyder Cut

So it’s kinda a treated as a “what if”

 

[Xenomorph2099]

No it doesnt

The Alien chapters of Fire and Blood are canon because there’s no Predators

The footnote is specifically that interaction between them makes the sections where that happens is AVP

Even if that's the case, then why does it say Life and Death is canon to Alien then? It's still a blatant contradiction. Older Dark Horse Comic locations are also locations within the RPG anyway, which conflicts with the Article stating them to be not mainline canon.

This would also invalidate The Rage War from Alien Canon since Alien: Invasion has Predator material in it.

It’s a good rationalisation but the thing is it’s not listed in any official materials so it would be head canon

IF the material said “oh Peter is his nephew” then it wouldn’t be headcanon

Fair.

So it’s kinda a treated as a “what if”

Oof.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Concrete Jungle takes place in 2030 while prometheus takes place in 2093 so im not sure if these two really connect.

Concrete Jungle also has multiple statements and nods to the original AvP movie. Considering that Prometheus utterly ignores that it makes Concrete Jungle questionable.

Honestly though overall I wanna say Predator treats Aliens as canon, but the reverse really isn't true and has a lot of big wigs hating the idea.

 

[Armorchompy]

I would agree, we can totally add AvP to the Predator canon side of things.

 

[Xenomorph2099]

Honestly though overall I wanna say Predator treats Aliens as canon, but the reverse really isn't true and has a lot of big wigs hating the idea.

Pain for Alien, you hate to see it.

I would agree, we can totally add AvP to the Predator canon side of things.

Nice to hear from you. Does this mean Alien can still have a AVP Profile Page separate from the Canon Page or is that not how that works?

 

[Armorchompy]

Oh absolutely, you can totally make Xenomorph pages and all for AvP- in fact you could already do that, we just don't have any.

 

[Xenomorph2099]

Oh absolutely, you can totally make Xenomorph pages and all for AvP- in fact you could already do that, we just don't have any.

Alrighty then, great to know. Should I wait for more approval (for Predator) since there are still present disputes with fellow members before even starting to design additions or am I good? (still new to how this all works lmao.)

 

[Armorchompy]

Waiting a bit is probably a good idea