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THIS IS NOT AN ATTACK TOWARDS DINO, or to annoy anyone either, hopefully people would realize that, also please take debating as not too serious, yet just don't make random feats up, and want it to be concluded, just have fun, also please read the whole debate before making any skeptical judgements, also, i do not 100% agree with everything arceusbowser says now lets move on from this longass heading shall we
To be honest, i didn't think dino really resolved *all* of the points made in the last revision of mario. For instance, he doesn't really clarify about the fact that with all the characters stated after super mario galaxy could be power scaled based off the feats from super mario galaxy, rather only clarifying for the mario galaxy feats, why the feats aren't multi universal, which i can agree. Also, are there truly any outliers in the regular mario(Aside from Dreamy Bowser), considering that there is no true canon within the mario verse, therefore no true consistency. Although the verse was never intended to show who is the most powerful, why should it matter what the core of the series is about when powerscaling, ofc most video games aren't like that. Also, He is discluding more evidence of how mario and the gang can be universal +, or atleast higher than just 4-A, like for instance,
Mario and Rabbids, containing a universal + feat, even statied by dino it is
Mario galaxy series, containing alot, multiple of times, referenced, not even mentioning how even though bowser survived the whole reset of the universe, the gang isn't still based off power scaling, heck, even the galaxy bosses contain an item, named the grand star, which is scaled 3-C to low 2-C, yet they aren't scaled close to that. Heck, there are enimies which overwhelmed lumas, yet mario is not scaled towards those enemies, and stated to be a wank.
Luigi's mansion, also containing a universal + feat, although that wasn't based on luigi's raw power, he still fought king boo in the RPG games.
Mario Bros 2, stated within Arceus's Discussion, with evidence
Making it enough feats for it to not be an outlier
Heck, even in the wario series, only 2 games resemble planet level feats, for instance, wario shake it, and wario world, yet, however, out of these 2 games, and 2 feats, they were still counted as legit feats, not saying it shouldn't, while other games before and after, didn't resemble or reference such feats, heck they were considered big jumps, but were still included based on powerscale, while the mario series, which had a ton of legit feats for it to not be an outlier, still stuggles to pass those same boundaries, which again, is a series with no true canoncity.
However, these feats aren't even enough to scale towards atleast high end feats
Also there are many feats that indicate that mario is MFTL in reaction timing, more so than speed, which is relativistic
After those games, especially the glaxy games, there is no feat, nor statement, that truly makes the feat previously shown, an outlier.
Although, however, it would be too huge of a jump to include mario and luigi to multiversal ,for fighting antasma, and dreamy bowser, or a rather questionable, yet highly doubtful. leap at least.
Also, didn't dino agree that if mario recieves these changes, so shall other characters within this wiki, or am i mistaking, and if so, my apologies.
https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/513209
And, for stating something like " The enemies mario fought in the past is a smaller jump compared to the ones in mario galaxy which is a huge jump, therefore an outlier" think of this
think of how many other games came after galaxy, again, and how, again, they can be based on just powerscale,
Like the reason why did super sonic got such a jump was due to after the sonic battle series, yet games before that were scaled to that level, like for instance
Sonic adventure 2, It took both super sonic and shadow to defeat the final hazard, yet, the final hazard was most likely planet level, and didn't show higher feats. Again, if the series has no true canon, then why should it hold mario and some of the other characters back and not be represented as his high end feats. Heck, even kirby's high end feat is stated unknown, yet he has been changed to only 4-A alone before.
Also, another statement made was based off the fact that "Just because mario is a star child, doesn't mean he still has multi galactic powers, that's like saying every human is universal due to being reminants of the big bang" think of this as well
It was not just stated in Yoshi's island that alone they are just titled star children, it was clearly stated that they have an extraordinary amount of power within their heart, that all of the 7 star children combined, have enough power to take over the universe, although it can be used as a statement, considering the spinoff characters wouldn't scale to the mainstream characters as much. Heck, bowser even got regular babies stating that they don't match the power needs, therefore excluding such a comparison.
So overall, the characters before galaxy, who were not scaled on the same level of feats, like mostly spinoff characters, should be scaled to 4-A
However, the mainstream characters, like mario, luigi, yoshi, base bowser, maybe bowser jr which machines, aside from peach, considering that she gets kidnapped by bowser, and barely stands up for herself, should at max tier, be universal +,
TOP tiers should be multiversal, such as dreamy bowser, antasma, and the dream keeper
Ofc I'm not stating this is the king of all verses in strength, like, just no...Im just a simple researcher who does this for fun.
Woah, then again, there may be some trouble with my elaboration
To be honest, i didn't think dino really resolved *all* of the points made in the last revision of mario. For instance, he doesn't really clarify about the fact that with all the characters stated after super mario galaxy could be power scaled based off the feats from super mario galaxy, rather only clarifying for the mario galaxy feats, why the feats aren't multi universal, which i can agree. Also, are there truly any outliers in the regular mario(Aside from Dreamy Bowser), considering that there is no true canon within the mario verse, therefore no true consistency. Although the verse was never intended to show who is the most powerful, why should it matter what the core of the series is about when powerscaling, ofc most video games aren't like that. Also, He is discluding more evidence of how mario and the gang can be universal +, or atleast higher than just 4-A, like for instance,
Mario and Rabbids, containing a universal + feat, even statied by dino it is
Mario galaxy series, containing alot, multiple of times, referenced, not even mentioning how even though bowser survived the whole reset of the universe, the gang isn't still based off power scaling, heck, even the galaxy bosses contain an item, named the grand star, which is scaled 3-C to low 2-C, yet they aren't scaled close to that. Heck, there are enimies which overwhelmed lumas, yet mario is not scaled towards those enemies, and stated to be a wank.
Luigi's mansion, also containing a universal + feat, although that wasn't based on luigi's raw power, he still fought king boo in the RPG games.
Mario Bros 2, stated within Arceus's Discussion, with evidence
Making it enough feats for it to not be an outlier
Heck, even in the wario series, only 2 games resemble planet level feats, for instance, wario shake it, and wario world, yet, however, out of these 2 games, and 2 feats, they were still counted as legit feats, not saying it shouldn't, while other games before and after, didn't resemble or reference such feats, heck they were considered big jumps, but were still included based on powerscale, while the mario series, which had a ton of legit feats for it to not be an outlier, still stuggles to pass those same boundaries, which again, is a series with no true canoncity.
However, these feats aren't even enough to scale towards atleast high end feats
Also there are many feats that indicate that mario is MFTL in reaction timing, more so than speed, which is relativistic
After those games, especially the glaxy games, there is no feat, nor statement, that truly makes the feat previously shown, an outlier.
Although, however, it would be too huge of a jump to include mario and luigi to multiversal ,for fighting antasma, and dreamy bowser, or a rather questionable, yet highly doubtful. leap at least.
Also, didn't dino agree that if mario recieves these changes, so shall other characters within this wiki, or am i mistaking, and if so, my apologies.
https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/513209
And, for stating something like " The enemies mario fought in the past is a smaller jump compared to the ones in mario galaxy which is a huge jump, therefore an outlier" think of this
think of how many other games came after galaxy, again, and how, again, they can be based on just powerscale,
Like the reason why did super sonic got such a jump was due to after the sonic battle series, yet games before that were scaled to that level, like for instance
Sonic adventure 2, It took both super sonic and shadow to defeat the final hazard, yet, the final hazard was most likely planet level, and didn't show higher feats. Again, if the series has no true canon, then why should it hold mario and some of the other characters back and not be represented as his high end feats. Heck, even kirby's high end feat is stated unknown, yet he has been changed to only 4-A alone before.
Also, another statement made was based off the fact that "Just because mario is a star child, doesn't mean he still has multi galactic powers, that's like saying every human is universal due to being reminants of the big bang" think of this as well
It was not just stated in Yoshi's island that alone they are just titled star children, it was clearly stated that they have an extraordinary amount of power within their heart, that all of the 7 star children combined, have enough power to take over the universe, although it can be used as a statement, considering the spinoff characters wouldn't scale to the mainstream characters as much. Heck, bowser even got regular babies stating that they don't match the power needs, therefore excluding such a comparison.
So overall, the characters before galaxy, who were not scaled on the same level of feats, like mostly spinoff characters, should be scaled to 4-A
However, the mainstream characters, like mario, luigi, yoshi, base bowser, maybe bowser jr which machines, aside from peach, considering that she gets kidnapped by bowser, and barely stands up for herself, should at max tier, be universal +,
TOP tiers should be multiversal, such as dreamy bowser, antasma, and the dream keeper
Ofc I'm not stating this is the king of all verses in strength, like, just no...Im just a simple researcher who does this for fun.
Woah, then again, there may be some trouble with my elaboration
