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A possible Class M upgrade for Dragon Ball
- Thread starter Hagane_no_Saiyajin
- Start date
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You linked to your comment but that one that's actually been evaluated and accepted is Null's version which is still Class M but 533525.275 tons.
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Nullflowerblush
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Wow, two Class M feats. Can't forget the Class K cherry; I find it hard to, considering there only exists the one.
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They def have some "good" feats being able to punch out a planet but only being class M being "good" is up for debate, but I was looking at a handful to calc when I skimmed it awhile back unfortunately, i can confirm that nothing above class M exists too, sucks to suck ig
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cant believe Class M all the way till late super
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Yeah iirc the only contrasting problems are the über infamous Z Goku and Magetta anti - feats.
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Oh yeah, I forgot about the anti-feats... Those would probably take higher priority since they're the more recent depictions of the character's lifting strength.
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That ain't how anti-feats work. If Goku randomly tied to a 1 ton bomb next chapter, we wouldn't use that because it's "more recent" because there's a fucktllon feats that contradict that. It's the same reason why recent feats can still be outliers, what matters, is how they add up in the grand scheme of things.
The 40 ton feat doesn't even make much sense anyway when factored in with other random stuff like random rock lifting
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It's not the sole deciding factor but it does have an influence on how I'd have to evaluate the situation. Of course things like consistency and context matter too. Didn't mean to imply that it being more recent is the only thing that matters.
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I'd agree, but in this case there's literally like a 1000+ feats contradicting the 40 ton thing
Gilad_Hyperstar
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With Magetta stepping on Vegeta it might also be him pushing Vegeta down rather than him just using his mass to press on him. That may explain why Vegeta was struggling even though he shouldn't logically struggle
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We could calc that based on the damage to the ground, it'd still prob only be a few k
Nullflowerblush
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By the time of the Tournament of Power, Super Saiyan Kale lifting Magetta was still considered an impressive feat.
Gilad_Hyperstar
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Super Saiyan Kale is much stronger than U6 SSJ Vegeta so it makes sense she could lift him
Gilad_Hyperstar
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Yeah, but it also runs into aoe fallacy, since this doesn't necessarily means that was how much he actually pushed down, much like how a kamehameha from DBS Goku doesn't destroy the planet when fired
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No that's literally how pushing down works. It wouldn't be affected by ki control unlike a kamehameha.
If we were to calc it, it'd be what it is.
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- Thread starter
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Gilad_Hyperstar
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It's DBS Anime feat though, while Magetta's incident is from the manga
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- Thread starter
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I thought both the DBS Anime and Manga were meant to be sequels to the original Dragon Ball manga, while the original Dragon Ball and DBZ are succeeded by Dragon Ball GT
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I have a LS feat for Base Vegeta during Moro arc if that helps. And another one for the Anime.
Gilad_Hyperstar
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Did you calc them? If they work sure it'll help
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https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:LaserPrecision/Dragon_Ball_Super:_Weighted_Clothing
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:LaserPrecision/Dragon_Ball_Super:_Building_press
I talked with a friend about LS feats too, and they brought to my attention Goku's avatar being able to grapple with Planet Moro who's arms are larger than mountains which seems like easy Class T stuff.
Nullflowerblush
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The original calculation applies hollowness incorrectly; 80% hollowness is 652.96 m^3, not 2611.84 m^3.
Furthermore, the pixel measurements are lacking in detail.
A more accurate recalculation begets a mass of 948.144576 tons, which reduces the force to 106,706.745 tons (Class M).
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Class M hell...
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There is still this to be fair. That's probably one of the better feats I recall in Super.
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Giant forms should definitely have those LS ratings in giant forms; and LS portrayals in Dragon Ball have always gone back and forth but basically pin pointed anything exceeding planetary is fairly impossible. And even things such as Trunks blocking Frieza's Supernova or Goku blocking Trunks' sword strikes with his finger can be interpreted as within the stellar range LS, except those would be textbook examples of calc stacking.
I really have nothing against using the best LS feats and having characters of higher PL scaling from those, but I'd try to avoid multipliers for LS as they really aren't linear to energy output transitions or speed. Anti-feat inconsistencies are typically played off as gags and it would be sad for the main cast to have less LS in their 2-C keys compared to their Moon level keys. And there was a Class G feat in DBS that Goku did lifting those giant red metal plates on King Kai's planet. And some have argued if using telekinesis should just scale to physical LS for Dragon Ball giving both TK and muscle inflation use the same type of energy to lift/move large objects.
I really have nothing against using the best LS feats and having characters of higher PL scaling from those, but I'd try to avoid multipliers for LS as they really aren't linear to energy output transitions or speed. Anti-feat inconsistencies are typically played off as gags and it would be sad for the main cast to have less LS in their 2-C keys compared to their Moon level keys. And there was a Class G feat in DBS that Goku did lifting those giant red metal plates on King Kai's planet. And some have argued if using telekinesis should just scale to physical LS for Dragon Ball giving both TK and muscle inflation use the same type of energy to lift/move large objects.
Gilad_Hyperstar
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Isn't Moro literally planet sized in that form? Shouldn't he have Planetary ls by default for that?
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Technically he is only active in and only moves a very small portion of the Earth. It remains to be seen if he could manipulate the entire planet at once.
Gilad_Hyperstar
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Moro said the entire planet IS his body, so yeah he merged with all of it
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Yes, but he never showed Lifting Strength of manipulating the entire planet.
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Do the arms on that page look planet sized?
Yes, Moro's body is the entire planet, but he only ever manifests his appearance in smaller portions. His face, arms, etc. are clearly not Planetary sized. They are however massive from what a friend showed me (a CGM). Bigger than mountains, and IIRC, in some panels looks as though his body is reaching into clouds. That would at least be Class T. I could even see Class P if someone accounted for force. It'd just be a matter of someone calculating it. Because it's definitely one of, if not the best feat LS feats Goku has.
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- Thread starter
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Also to clarify, if we go by Null's version, then that mean we need to downgrade Tao from Hypersonic+ to just Hypersonic and while he would be still High 8-C via scaling, the AP comes out to only 8-C+
Gilad_Hyperstar
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Honestly from Moro swinging his fists alone it'd probably be Class P very much like Super Sonic's feat in the second movie (I used this since Goku stopping him is very similar to that scene)
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The fists vary in size, keep that in mind. When he first emerges from the ground, his fists are only bigger than Goku. After coming out of the ground further, we see trees on him that look small, and when Goku uses his Ki avatar, both of their heads are in the clouds. Or near them anyways. Which means the fists are obviously much larger by extension. But yeah, Class P might be possible. At the very least it should be Class T tho
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You know we can actually see Goku inside the Ki avatar's head here. It is definitely not hundreds of meters tall.
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As my friend noted, while you can see Goku. Goku is also the size of trees on Moro in that panel. So unless Goku is like as tall as trees, I'm not sure it's the most accurate representation. Especially considering their avatar is reaching into the clouds.
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There is more consistency for Goku than for the tree (which is an unknown size).
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