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A Murderer and A Judge

Any time they interact with other objects, they're physical. They almost never go intangible for attacks, so we shouldn't assume that they were intangible when attacking the bubbles. It's not like Kira stood there walling everything, which would be a situation where they could have taken the time to try intangibility, but that's not what happened. Honestly the fact that Kira never even tried to phase through Stray Cat's bubbles despite only trying to step on them should be proof enough that no one even thought of using intangibility to go through these shields.

That's my point. Whether they're used offensively or defensively they're the same thing.

Except he isn't. Because he is stuck in Killer Queen's stomach. He can't see attacks coming unless he's let out. Even then, Sans wouldn't just let Kira approach him if he's being walled and Kira can't really attack at a distance with the shield up, so that's pointless. And even then, Sans' attacks ignore durability so saying that he can't go through the shields make no sense.
 
That too. Also the bubble shields are a purely physical barrier, nothing's stopping Sans from just teleporting an attack in. Or teleporting Kira out. Really, the idea that a basic shield made out of air can literally wall Sans forever is silly in many ways.
 
That's false. They often are, because they have the intention of interacting with it, but there are several cases where stands simply phase through objects. If what you say is true, then the bullet should have just bounced off ratt instead of going through it and hitting bug eaten. Honeslty, I would say the extact opposite. The fact that he was wailing on it yet was never able to pass through it is evidence that intangible beings cannot ass through stray cats bubbles

Yes, but Stray Cat uses them to defend itself automatically. Kira will obviously have his stand summoned for this whole fight

He made it a part of his stand. Whe Killer Queen is unsummoned, Stray Cat became unsummoned. Regardless, its in his equipment. Sans attacks only ignore durability due to the soul magic which won't effect the bubbles
 
They aren't when they punch things. They almost never attempt to go through things when hitting objects for obvious reasons. No reason to assume it would be the case here. Also Kira never even punched with Killer Queen on Stray Cat. If he thought it could be used to just phase through the bubble he would have used it.

Itself, but not Kira. I still have a blatant lack of proof for a constant omnidirectional shield around Kira because pretty sure that never happened.

Doesn't mean Stray Cat can see things normally. You saying that Stray Cat become part of Killer Queen doesn't change that. It still can only see things and do things when KQ's stomach isn't closed.

I'm honestly 100% sick of people saying that Sans ignores durability due to soul manipulation when literally everyone in UT uses soul manip and in a much better way, yet do not ignore durability in-universe. His attacks can also physically ignore durability. This has been said I don't know how many times.
 
They are tangible to what they are trying to hit. Kira easily would have just gone intangible if he could have. Because when other stands/stand users have needed to get through or around objects thye go through it. I don't see how Kira not punching while he had stray cat is relevent. Yes, that's right. If he thought he could have phased through the bubble he would have used it, but he can't so he didn't.

Did I claim it was constant? No, I claimed it was automatic. Stray Cat was shown to have omnidirectional shields during his fight with Kira

Are you saying he has some kind of augmented vision? I don't see your point. Kira just leaves his stomach open

That may be true, but that's not what his profie says. Go make a CRT. Also, I claimed it was by his soul magic, not some generic ability. I wa more refering to his KARMA, which I do know bypass durability, just not on something like the air sheilds. The bones also don't actually bypass durability, at least according to his profile, but they deal so much damage over time that they might as well. However, as soon as any of the bones touch kira he can atomize them
 
Stands don't just choose to be tangible to one thing specifically. Like all selective intangibility, they just choose when to turn intangible or not and what part of their body. So no, stands punching Stray Cat's bubbles doesn't mean they were intangible during that time. Are you implying he was somehow unable to? Because that's a lie. He just decided not to. He also had no way to know if Stray Cat could block his stand or not.

It needs to be constant if you want Kira to wall Sans forever like you claim he is going to be. I also still require proofs for that.

I'm saying he DOESN'T have said augmented vision. He can't automatically counter stuff when not in use. And no, Kira doesn't just leave KQ's stomach hanging at all time. He would need to activate it first.

His profile doesn't say that. The part about "ignoring durability to an extent" is something that's added to all monster profiles due to harming the soul and doesn't relate to his own ability to ignore durability. I honestly don't know why we just left Sans at 8-C without explaining how he ignores dura but we shouldn't.

Sans just attacking fast is just game mechanics. It doesn't work that way in reality, since his opponent was at the very least 7-C. Even if that was true (it's not), Sans could damage Kira and his shields way faster than against Frisk. And no, Kira is nowhere near fast or skilled enough to destroy literally every bone thrown against him. Nevermind the fact that Sans uses lasers in his attacks as well.
 
Sans fra, he has better range (dozens of meters as opposed to Kira's two meters), and negating durability could get rid of Mr. Kosaku really quickly; the best thing Kira could really do here is maybe releasing Sheer Heart Attack, but Sans could probably finish him off before he does that due to spaming bone attacks and blasters.
 
I honestly don't know why I bother keeping this up. You aren't debunking any previous argument and thus certainly not reversing the 8 votes Sans has until the end of the Grace Period. You also haven't covered my previous arguments about how Sans can just use teleportation to get Kira out of the shield.
 
Also I'm sure that KR means KARMA but regardless, giving Kira the benefit of the doubt and not making KR KARMA will still lead to an insta-Kill and even if it means KARMA still an insta-Kill.(Also how does soul manipulation work? Will someone help me? If KR did 1/9th of the damage to a 2-C being does that make KR 2-C or no. I would love it if someone can explain that.)
 
Stands themsleves are non-corporeal, and since stands cannot pass through other stands, why would he bother to make his stand tangible to stomp on another stand? As we saw from the Goo Goo Doll fight, a stand does not need to become corporeal to attack another stand. Yes, I am sayng he was unable to get past Stray Cat's bubbles despite being incorporeal. As I have said from the beggining. The fact that he doesn't know, means he had no reason to be corporeal when he struck since stands do not need to be corporeal to strike another stand

So long as it is thrown up before any attack lands. Stray Cat's air manipulation is based on Eye Cite and speed is equalised. I also never claimed it would be forever, don't put words in my mouth

He doesn't need augmented vision, so what's your point? That's not how it happened in the fight. he left the hatch open, and at this point it will be in use.

"Building level physically (The weakest monster who can be faced in combat, even below Monster Kid in terms of raw strength. However, he is still roughly comparable to the lowest tier monsters), Can ignore Durability to an extent via SOUL Magic." this is what it says. Go modify it if it is innacurate or if there is more that he can bypass durability with

So why does it day that on his profile? he just needs to touch the bones before they get destroyed, but if what you say is true, and you fix the profile, the I guess he really will melt through Kira on the first bone
 
Also did we forget to mention that Sans' attacks are intangible too and Soul Manipulation get's rid of Intagibility and Non-Corpreality. Also Do Stands have a soul?(I don't think they do since I don't Know much about JoJo)
 
Stands are not regular intangibles, but that's not really what is being argued here.

Stands are actually partially composed of their user's soul, along with their will power, a dash of life energy, and psychic power.
 
Saikou The Lewd King said:
Except that stands needs to activate their intangibility. Since it's almost never used offensively, we have no reasons to assume that they used intangibility in these sequences. Also the shield is just an extension of Stray Cat's offensive abilities. It's still just air that shouldn't have any stand power into it outside of being controlled by Stray Cat.
Click to expand...
No, Stands are inherently intangible by default.

They need to activate their tangibility, you've got it backwards. Look, it's never said if they are really intangible or not in the series, it all stems from a single rule about their properties:

"Stands can only be affected by other Stands"

This has been further repeated by characters such as the Empress and demonstrated every now and then. This means Stands are exempt from interaction from everything else but themselves. There are of course exist exceptions, like Love Deluxe and Stray Cat, but unless a Stand has demonstrated that it does not follow the aforementioned rules, then it should automatically have all of them by default.

Plus, if what you're suggesting is true, then you're suggesting that if someone can catch the Stand user off-guard they can harm the Stand? Then someone in a speeding truck can run over Star Platinum if Jotaro is not paying attention. Sounds silly, right?
 
Just a note, because all Stands can interact with each other they all have non-physical interaction on their spiritual level. Stray Cat can block punches from Crazy Diamond because it carries it's inherent property of being a Stand. It can also hurt Crazy Diamond because of the same reason.

However, because the Stand energy takes the form of a material object, it is still subject to harm from the outside world. I can punt Stray Cat into the road and potentially kill it. I can't punt Star Platinum.

Saikou The Lewd King said:
That too. Also the bubble shields are a purely physical barrier, nothing's stopping Sans from just teleporting an attack in. Or teleporting Kira out. Really, the idea that a basic shield made out of air can literally wall Sans forever is silly in many ways.
Click to expand...
This would mean that Stray Cat can shield against direct forms of Soul Manipulation, since that at essence is exactly what a Stand is. If you have a "Soul Blast" attack then Stray Cat can potentially block regardless of if it conventionally ignores dura.

So no Saikou, they are not a purely physical barrier if they can physically interact with Stands.
 
I don't know enough about UT to dispute that. Can you source it please?

I'm just saying that everyone is spreading misinformation about Stands. They are not inherently tangible, lol. I can't snipe and kill Star Platinum just because he wasn't paying attention.
 
It's the reason sans' attacks are intangible while others aren't, because his attacks pass through you while they damage you.

Can't really source it directly on a phone tough.
 
Yeah I'll just wait till someone can explain it better to me. Like I said, I only know the general plot of UT, I have no idea how we handle it's hax and abilities. I don't know what you mean by his attacks pass through while they damage.
 
I mean that his attacks litirally pass through you, as in pass through armor, body and soul, all the while doind a set amount of damage regardless of dura.
 
All of his attacks, mostly bone danmaku and ghaster blasters (dragon shaped skulls that fire lasers).

They all do soul damage.

They all pass through the soul too, so trying to block them would have it still pass through, but be damaged on top of it
 
If that's true than yes, it would bypass Stray Cat and Killer Queen's ability to interact with them.

Though it does seem like game mechanics rather than an explicit ability of Sans.
 
...How was this not a stomp? Pairing a durability negator teleported against someone with literally no chance in hell to even get close to winning? Can someone give me an actual reason why this was not considered a stomp?
 
I think this may be a decisive but I'm leaning towards stomp, I don't think Kira has any chance of winning going into the matchup unless you nerf Sans somehow.
 
I don't know Kira to tell if it isn't a stomp, but the fact that sans does not have speed on his side would make dodging quiet a bit harder.
 
It's really a stomp. Kira doesn't have the durability to survive long enough nor the speed to catch Sans if they start at Sans' distance.
 
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