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9-A Tournament Round 3: The Beast vs The Pyro! 1-3-0

Jackythejack

Jackythejack

They/Them
20,008
1,717
I know nothing about The Beast so I can't really comment, but we're going to see just who is the better "The". As always, speed is equalized. Pyro has his stock flamethrower, fire axe and flare gun, just to not make anything too weird. They start ten meters from each other.

The Beast (26 MJ): 1

Pyro (29 MJ): 3
 
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I mean Pyro just sets him ablaze and can push him away with the airblast to maintain distance? It's the recommended way to play Pyro ingame, so
 
Yeah Pyro has quite a few ways to screw Beast here, whether it be via flamethrower or just shooting him with a shotgun there isn't much Beast can do that Pyro can't deal with with relative ease.
 
Side note I'm surprised Pyro has two wins. Perfect streak so far (that this tourney will inevitably ruin)
 
Wait up!

I'm wanna make an argument but was kinda busy.

DaReaperMan said:
Yeah Pyro has quite a few ways to screw Beast here, whether it be via flamethrower or just shooting him with a shotgun there isn't much Beast can do that Pyro can't deal with with relative ease.
Click to expand...
The Beast once catches a bullet at point-blank, what to say he can't dodge shotgun shells fired at him?

Flamethrower is cool and all but The Beast can propel himself to close the distance. If you believe that Pyro just shoot him before he can do than then think again; Sing, who is very agile, still got hit by The Beast for three times.
 
Speed equalized doesn't necesarilly mean they aren't at bullet catching speed. I think the better argument is 1. Pyro has a flamethrower, decidingly not a bullet and easy to just shoot around and do damage (W+M1), and 2. Pyro has a shotgun, which shoots a spreaed of bullets and not one singular round. He literally doesn't have enough hands to catch all of them, nor do I think he could get out of the spread in time.
 
The_Impress said:
Speed equalization.

Pyro can react in time, since speed equalization.
Click to expand...
Speed is equalized, yeah. The Beast would still able to dodge/avoid bullets because he have done it before. If anything, The Beast would try to avoid Pyro's right when he pull the shotgun out.

Also, both Sing and The Beast are comparable in speed but the latter still managed to take him by surprise three times.

While flamethrower are lethal are close range, The Beast would able to tell that Pyro has the intent to kill him with Extrasensory Perception. He would back down to avoid it then charges himself toward Pyro.
 
Jamesthetaker said:
Wait up!

I'm wanna make an argument but was kinda busy.


The Beast once catches a bullet at point-blank, what to say he can't dodge shotgun shells fired at him?

Flamethrower is cool and all but The Beast can propel himself to close the distance. If you believe that Pyro just shoot him before he can do than then think again; Sing, who is very agile, still got hit by The Beast for three times.
Click to expand...
He'd have to aim dodge cause trying to dodge a Supersonic shotgun spread compared to Athletic Human combat speed is a no.

Pyro has subsonic+ reactions, unless the Beast is literally in kissing distance Pyro has the reactions needed to aim and fire a shotgun.

But then again it's far more IC for Pyro to flame someone down with the flamethrower and keep them from actually getting into melee then it is to shoot them with a shotgun.
 
Jackythejack said:
Speed equalized doesn't necesarilly mean they aren't at bullet catching speed. I think the better argument is 1. Pyro has a flamethrower, decidingly not a bullet and easy to just shoot around and do damage (W+M1), and 2. Pyro has a shotgun, which shoots a spreaed of bullets and not one singular round. He literally doesn't have enough hands to catch all of them, nor do I think he could get out of the spread in time.
Click to expand...
Shotgun shoot multiple rounds but it's also more difficult to aim because the pellets are spread out. Therefore, The Beast would able to do it with high difficulty.
 
Even then the main part is the flamethrower, which would realistically be harder to dodge and easier to aim. It also comes with an airblast to keep the dude away from him.
 
Jamesthetaker said:
Shotgun shoot multiple rounds but it's also more difficult to aim because the pellets are spread out. Therefore, The Beast would able to do it with high difficulty.
Click to expand...
When he's athletic human in speed? Nah, the bullets either hit or they don't, end of story.
 
DaReaperMan said:
He'd have to aim dodge cause trying to dodge a Supersonic shotgun spread compared to Athletic Human combat speed is a no.

Pyro has subsonic+ reactions, unless the Beast is literally in kissing distance Pyro has the reactions needed to aim and fire a shotgun.

But then again it's far more IC for Pyro to flame someone down with the flamethrower and keep them from actually getting into melee then it is to shoot them with a shotgun.
Click to expand...
The clips above shown The Beast stopping a bullet at point-blank. Speed equalized doesn't take that away.

The Beast combat, reaction speed are assumed to be the same as Pyro which mean he can react to Pyro pulling a shotgun out. The Beast, having Extrasensory Perception would know Pyro trying to pull a weapon out.

The_Impress said:
Again like, who said this weird half-speed equalization logic?
Click to expand...
Nobody, I'm trying to say that The Beast has bullet-stopping feat before.
 
If nobody said it then it's not vs. debate standard onsite? It's a speed equalized match, he can't dodge bullets unless he has some explicit mechanic to. End of story.
 
does speed equalize to the lowest speed, then?

I legitimately don't know the standards on that
 
Jackythejack said:
does speed equalize to the lowest speed, then?

I legitimately don't know the standards on that
Click to expand...
Not really relevant, but projectiles are proportionately faster than the equalized level, so for Pyro's speed gap on his bullets vs. himself (Multiplier between Athletic Human and Supersonic+), that multiplier remains on the equalization too
 
The_Impress said:
Again like, who said this weird half-speed equalization logic?
Click to expand...
I have no idea, far as I know...

Wait, is he misinterpreting the whole "Abilities based on speed are assumed to be retained. Characters that can run over water via speed can, for example, still do so even if now technically too slow for that. Likewise, a character who can create a tornado by running fast in a circle can still create one by this manner, even though they are now running slower." Thing?

Jamesthetaker said:
The clips above shown The Beast stopping a bullet at point-blank. Speed equalized doesn't take that away.

The Beast combat, reaction speed are assumed to be the same as Pyro which mean he can react to Pyro pulling a shotgun out. The Beast, having Extrasensory Perception would know Pyro trying to pull a weapon out.


Nobody, I'm trying to say that The Beast has bullet-stopping feat before.
Click to expand...
Because, when he's NOT under speed equal, he's Supersonic+. Here, because speed is equalized, he's Athletic human. The only way he's dealing with the shotgun when he's not in kissing range is literally by trying to aimdodge it.

Yes, but A. Pyro is far more likely to burn Beast to death LOOOOOOONG before he even thinks about trying whatever the shotgun is in his mind, B. Has to actually be in-range to stop Pyro from doing so, and C. Speed equal wouldn't equalize their reactions.
Jackythejack said:
does speed equalize to the lowest speed, then?

I legitimately don't know the standards on that
Click to expand...
It equalized to the slower party's combat speed, seeing as Pyro only has prove-able Athletic Human combat speed... well...
 
The_Impress said:
Not really relevant, but projectiles are proportionately faster than the equalized level, so for Pyro's speed gap on his bullets vs. himself (Multiplier between Athletic Human and Supersonic+), that multiplier remains on the equalization too
Click to expand...
What about that Subsonic reaction on Pyro page? If The Beast speed are equalized then he would be "Athletic Human movement with Subsonic to Subsonic+ reaction speed"
 
Jamesthetaker said:
What about that Subsonic reaction on Pyro page? If The Beast speed are equalized then he would be "Athletic Human movement with Subsonic to Subsonic+ reaction speed"
Click to expand...
Hahahahahaha...

"The combat speed of that faster character is assumed to be equalized to the combat speed of the slower character. Every other speed the faster character has is reduced by the same multiplier. This includes the speed of any attacks, projectiles, reactions, perception, flight etc." ~ Versus Thread Rules

No.
 
I feel like too much attention is put to the shotgun anyways when Pyro is so like, not likely to use it, to the point of not using it in any official material.
 
Jackythejack said:
I feel like too much attention is put to the shotgun anyways when Pyro is so like, not likely to use it, to the point of not using it in any official material.
Click to expand...
Which is why I kinda want you to give him like, the Scorch Shot or some shit like that. Something that isn't basically an instant win if he pulls it out
 
DaReaperMan said:
Hahahahahaha...

"The combat speed of that faster character is assumed to be equalized to the combat speed of the slower character. Every other speed the faster character has is reduced by the same multiplier. This includes the speed of any attacks, projectiles, reactions, perception, flight etc." ~ Versus Thread Rules

No.
Click to expand...
This is honestly most likely an oversight lol
 
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