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2 Questions about Sonic Super forms

Peptocoptr27

Peptocoptr27

1,278
660
1: How high is Super Sonic, Shadow and co. into 2-C? I've heard some say that they scale to the destruction of hundreds of timelines, but how do we even know Solaris was going to consume hundreds of timelines at once rather than over time? How many universes are in Sonic cosmology? Can we even even scale the Super hedghogs to the full extent of Solaris's power since they only knocked him out by attacking his conciousness? They should somehwat scale since they destroyed the exoskeleton and the head of his first form, but still. I see nothing that goes beyond a low 2-C rating.

2: Do they have a time limit or not? Everyone just seems to have accepted that it's a game mechanic without really bringing up any evidence. If they really don't have a time limit, then I feel like the reason why should be stated on thier profiles.

I know many of you are tired of seeing Sonic downgrade threads, but this information can't be glanced over tbh
 
Starsprite53 said:
For the time limit:

1:40
Click to expand...

I looked into it, and I guess it makes sense. Kind of dumb that every outside Sonic media decided to give it a time limit anyway... That begs the question though, if rings are a game mechanic in the Sonic game continuity, then why does Sonic have access to transmutation via ring time?
 
ShakeResounding said:
How can they scale partially to Solaris (a 2-C that's above baseline) but only warrant Low 2-C? That doesn't make any sense. Additionally, the timeframe that Solaris would've destroyed the cosmology is stated (or alluded) to be very quickly. I'll see if I can grab a link.
Click to expand...
Because I don't know the cosmology of Sonic's multiverse or how quickly Solaris was going to consume the timelines. A link would indeed be very helpful.
 
Hey wait a second. I just remembered something.
(at 26:10)
If the Super forms don't have a time limit, then why did Sonic let himself fall right over a pit of lava?
 
I've heard staff and blue names alike say it was because of the Werehog's energy being drained from Sonic by Dark Gaia, leaving him with little energy after the fact. So when he detransformed from Super, that still carried over.

And even if it held any basis for an argument, it's an egregious outlier compared to any other time he detransforms. Ironic that you used that as an example too, considering the next-gen versions of the game (360 and PS3) have no time limit within the fight either.
 
ShakeResounding said:
I've heard staff and blue names alike say it was because of the Werehog's energy being drained from Sonic by Dark Gaia, leaving him with little energy after the fact. So when he detransformed from Super, that still carried over.

And even if it held any basis for an argument, it's an egregious outlier compared to any other time he detransforms. Ironic that you used that as an example too, considering the next-gen versions of the game (360 and PS3) have no time limit within the fight either.
Click to expand...
He had no time limit within the fight? Damn, I just remembered that. Lol. Still, the more damage Sonic gained, the closer he got to losing the form, and rings were what allowed him to heal that damage, so isn't that a weakness worth putting on his profile?
 
When you find that link, can I suggest for it to be added to Sonic's profile in his AP section? It's very valuable info that specifies exactly how strong he is, so again, I really hope you find the link you're looking for.
 
Super Sonic varies in power, therefore the Dark Gaia fight is irrelevant to Super Sonic's full power
Solaris profile already has a link to the feat and to the cosmolgy, all you have to do is just re-read it better
 
Theuser789 said:
Super Sonic varies in power, therefore the Dark Gaia fight is irrelevant to Super Sonic's full power
Solaris profile already has a link to the feat and to the cosmolgy, all you have to do is just re-read it better
Click to expand...
I checked Solaris's profile at least 4 times, and I don'the see anything that states Solaris was going to consume all timelines in a short time frame. Eggman said that the space time rift they were in wasn't going to remain for much longer, but that's it. How do we know the space time rift was going to disappear AFTER every other timeline? Besides, I still have no idea how many universes exist in Sonic game cosmology, so Super Sonic's exact AP would still be in unknown territory if it is in fact 2-C.
 
ElixirBlue said:
Ok, I looked around the wiki for you.

vsbattles.fandom.com

Sonicverse 2-C Depth and the Cosmology

vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com

Not sure how up to date this is but the best we got so far.
Click to expand...
Thanks! This is all really interesting. I'm surprised I never found that before. I assume the 371 universes is what ended up being accepted? If the multiversal or high multiversal option was accepted instead, then the time it takes for Solaris to consume all timelines would be irrelevant but since we're stuck with a finite number between 371 and 550, then it still matters
 
Theuser789 said:
Super Sonic varies in power, therefore the Dark Gaia fight is irrelevant to Super Sonic's full power
Solaris profile already has a link to the feat and to the cosmolgy, all you have to do is just re-read it better
Click to expand...
Also, what I don't understand about Super Sonic's varying tier is that if it's reliant on positive emotions, then why would his determination and desire to save the world (which I'm assuming is the positive emotion he's feeling while fighting final bosses) is so much lower when fighting Dark Gaia, Perfect Chaos and the Biolizard, than when he's fighting the Egg Wizard, Time Eater and Solaris? The reasoning behind the Super forms having a tier that varies makes sense, but Sonic constantly switching back and forth between his lowest and highest key doesn't. Unless his power adjusts itself depending on the threat? In which case he would only ever tap into his full power if he's fighting someone who is threatning multiple universes? When he's fighting someone who's just gonna destroy his planet, he doesn't care as much and that makes him weaker? Shadow could have stopped himself from falling into orbit and almost dying in SA2 if he just cared more and had a more positive attitude? Which reminds me, why did he fall to begin with if the Super forms don't have a time limit? Why didn't Sonic save him if he also doesn't have a time limit and could just amp up his speed with willpower or any other heroic emotion?
 
Dude, I feel you just don't know much about Sonic if you are asking those basic questions, you are just extremely trying to overcomplicate basic questions, so I will answer them in the most simple way I can

1: There's nothing that shows that Solaris took as much time as you are implying it took, Solaris shows up, they are immediately throw in the rift with Silver who is from a diferent timeline, meaning that he already affected multiple timelines. The rift was caused by all timelines being destroyed, so of course it would it would take them being destroyed for the thing caused by the destruction to end

Dark Gaia was literally spreading negative energy to the entire world, of course Sonic would have less positive energy than praying for the emeralds

Shadow was explicitly stated in SA2 that he couldn't handle a super form and would disappear if he kept going, and that was explicitly something Sonic did not suffer, this is very clearly a weakness of Shadow's super form at the time, due to inexperience, this is basic reading comprehension

Anymore questions?
 
Theuser789 said:
Dude, I feel you just don't know much about Sonic if you are asking those basic questions, you are just extremely trying to overcomplicate basic questions, so I will answer them in the most simple way I can

1: There's nothing that shows that Solaris took as much time as you are implying it took, Solaris shows up, they are immediately throw in the rift with Silver who is from a diferent timeline, meaning that he already affected multiple timelines. The rift was caused by all timelines being destroyed, so of course it would it would take them being destroyed for the thing caused by the destruction to end

Dark Gaia was literally spreading negative energy to the entire world, of course Sonic would have less positive energy than praying for the emeralds

Shadow was explicitly stated in SA2 that he couldn't handle a super form and would disappear if he kept going, and that was explicitly something Sonic did not suffer, this is very clearly a weakness of Shadow's super form at the time, due to inexperience, this is basic reading comprehension

Anymore questions?
Click to expand...
I'mean actually a pretty die-hard Sonic fan. I just play devil's advocate to make sure this Wiki doesn't have a Sonic bias like many people claim it does. To be fair, it seems hard to believe at first glance, that they're really this OP.

I guess that's the most reasonable assumption.

Sonic was never affected by Dark Gaia's negative influence to begin with though. Are you implying that Super Sonic also draws his power from the positive emotions of others or simply that the negative aura he spread somehow nullified most of the emeralds' power?

I never got that far in the Biolizard boss fight so I never learned that lol. I just saw all the dialogue on Youtube and it makes sense.
 
Oh ok, that's fair then, I wouldn't say the wikia has a sonic bias, most people yell bias ironically enough when their own bias are in conflict with others

The latter, we see it happen at the start of the game and everything, Sonic needs to go to the Gaia Temples to do so
 
It’s still a process. Sonic’s various continuities are still being analyzed. We are far from solving the Sonic’s franchise in power and abilities. The Games aren’t the only verse that we have to focus on. Archie has made that clear a long time ago with its own merits(and is our trump card when other franchises’s fans snubbed thier nose at the Sonic franchise in vs debating)
 
While I have other Sonic related questions, they deserve thier own thread since they're not related to this specific topic. I guess this can be closed. Thanks for your answers
 
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