This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.
For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.
Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.
Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.
Yeah, there is a book often ridiculed by some fans (Guide to Hell), in which Jazirian and her brother Ahriman created the Outer Planes. Both are champions of the alignment of Law (in fact are called the Serpents of Law), but Jazirian is good and Ahriman evil. So, when they fought over whether if...
Are you talking about Merrshaulk proper? Or about the archetype of the World Serpent? Because those are two different things.
The World Serpent is just an archetype of a being that represents totality. The archetype has the shape of an infinitely large multi-faceted and really complex...
Well, they are doing all the other Magic settings for free on DM's Guild. They will be releasing Dominaria soon. Tho, dunno if they are going to release D&D stuff on Magic.
If it becomes a permant offical thing I don't see why not.
It has, that is why I asked. There is a hardcover book about Ravnica to be released soo, and Magic now is available on DM's Guild (so fans can create D&D Magic-inspired content).
I doubt Allabar scales to Orcus' avatar form or whatever you'd like to call it.
Well... Allabar and is ilk (the Far Realm-touched stars) are mostly featless in canon. The only star we do know is active in one FR novel is Caiphon, and she only serves as a patron for the warlock protagonist. By...
Possibly, yes. LoP and the Serpent are among of the few beings that can reorder the whole D&D multiverse (that includes the "lesser multiverses" of the Material Plane(s) and the external planes).
Though I was talking figuratively.
If this is the case, why is he not "At least 2-A", exactly?
I never said Ao was not a High 2-A. I just said he will be in the low tier of High 2-A if he fights another High 2-A that has none of his limitations (beings like the Lady of Pain or the Serpent).
Overpowers are really confusing. For instance, in Forgotten Realms there are three overpowers (Ao, Fate and the Celestial Bureaucrat). I don't know how they can coexist.
Oh. Allabar. I've heard of that, I think. Would that scale to Orcus?
It's one of the stronger monsters in 4e. It's a lv.30...
Ao is not the Overdeity of all of this (each multiverse has an Overpower, apparently). Lumi is the ultimate being of all of this, however. Dunno what that'd mean for him, if a tier change is even needed aside from him being infinitely and transcendentally superior to a High 2-A
Each overpower...
Do you know that CS Alphamon does have its Ouryken mode, right? He got it in the Cyber Sleuth updated version that comes alongside the japanese edition of Hacker's Memory.
That said, which Alphamon Ouryken are we talking about here?
They are. Or at least were, at beginning of the D&D multiverse. If we go by the baernaloth creation myths, the "main" alignments (law, chaos, good and evil) fought against each other for eons before reaching a stalemate because all were equally powerful. They then created agents and champions to...
Another question: how do you rank beings that exist from before gods (and demons, and primordials), such as the obyriths, the loths or the alignments themselves?
And yeah, I was never stating that Ao is not 2-A. My question is why he is stated to be stronger than LoP, as she is something from outside of his sphere, meaning she will be stronger than him just because of that. The only way Ao could overpower LoP would be if LoP made a local, Torilian aspect...
I honestly have no idea what that'd be, since we can safely call a sphere a multiverse.
The concept of the multiverse is... confusing in D&D. But it seems that there are many Material Planes (there is the "canon"/as published MP, and the other MPs are the reflections of that one, ie. if I DM...
Ergo, High 2-A. Lady of Pain erased a being from all spheres (I'll believe you, you're pretty damn knowledgeable)?
Multi-spheric gods that die only loss their aspect on the sphere they are killed, but their other aspects on other spheres survive, unaffected by the event. Aoskar is one of the...
Isn't Highgod from Krynn another one sphere overdeity?
Indeed, he is the Overpower of that pantheon.
Again, this isn't the reason Ao is High 2-A. He is shown to be infinitely superior to 2-A beings (as in, beings that can damage on a multiversal scale).
I would have to ask a source for this...
She has to be infinitely superior to a 2-A; Ao transcends 2-A characters, hence High 2-A.
In fact, that statement is inaccurate. It's true that Ao control the gods of Realmspace, but only within Realmspace. He can control Lolth's aspect in Toril, but he cannot control Lolth's aspect in Oerth...
Unless we see she is infinitely superior, then she is just a "likely higher".
Does the aforementioned link that states the LoP can re-order the whole reality does not mean she is higher than a guy that cannot stop something that comes from outside his realm?
Remember that in 4e and 5e, there is a level cap, unlike in earlier editions. In 4e the level cap is 30 for players (there is no level cap for monsters, though the strongest seen in the edition's life was Bahamut with 36 lv.). And in 5e is lv. 20 for players and 30 for monsters (with players...
Lady of Pain, to be comparable to Ao's status, must be infinitely superior to beings like Vecna when he was ascending to Greater God status. A 2-A threat
She IS. She cannot stop him that time because she would have destroyed the multiverse just for merely try it. That's why players had to do...
Link of the above statement (of Ao being powerless to stop the Spellplague): https://i.imgur.com/fQ2Lc7S.png
He is infinitely above all deities, including Multiversal level beings. Lady of Pain shows no showings of this.
The Lady of Pain is one of the few known beings credited with the...
Question:
Why is Ao said to be more powerful than the Lady of Pain? I mean, Ao is all powerful, but as stated before "only within the bounds of the spheres of Abeir-Toril". He has no power beyond that (he couldn't stop the Spellplague because of this: the Spellplague was powered by something...
Wasn't the purpose originally given to it by the Primordials something along the lines of "destroy the world so that it could be remade" or whatever?
Primordials in general want the world destroyed to be remade. But the Cult of Elemental Evil only wants to destroy the gods and the demon lords...
Well, in the current lore 4e/5e (Dawn War), the Tarrasque was actually created to defeat the enemies of the Princes of Elemental Evil (namely, the gods, but also the Demon Lords). It's supposed that the Tarrasque was never unleashed because the gods won the war before the Princes were able to...
That would make a more interesting fight.
Just wait for other opinions, though. As you can see, my opinions are based on actual feats from the games. I know you guys here have other parameters to base your power ratings.
Hell, in 5e, the Tarrasque has a higher CR than Demogorgon when fought in his home layer. It's higher than all demon lords and archdevils who have stats, actually.
Didn't the Tarrasque was created to defeat gods (and demons)? Or that is just current 4e/5e lore ?
Millenniumon is just hype (even more if you look at Adventure's Mille... he got defeated by a bunch of child and adult level Digimon in Anode/Cathode Tamer).
Zeed vs Alphamon X?
You mean Alphamon: OURYUKEN? (cuz', you know, base Alphamon is a natural X-Antibody carrier—that's why he is so...
Mmmm... I don't think so. Moon was defeated by a first timer Imperialdramon: FM in Tag Tamers. And tri. outright showed us that the same Impi (now a seasoned warrior) was not a rival for a non-RK Alphamon.
However, if you go up to Zeed, then perhaps this would become unbalanced for a base Alphamon
So, one with abilities pretty similar to the one seen in XW (as the one from Adventure was defeated by a bunch of average Joe megas). If Alphamon can BFR him, then he wins rather easily.
but both also have skills that'd let them finish the other in an instant, like sealing or Chrono Breaker
I dunno. Because, Alphamon (even in base) transcends time and space. That means he is immune to abilities that affect time or space (duh), that are the only big weapons of Mille. Mille other...
4e has a few epic level beholders, like the Ultimate Tyrant (Monster Manual 2), that is level 29; or the Eternal Tyrant (from Dragon mag 377) that surpasses the max level PC can reach -30-, as it has two versions: one at 31 level and the other at 33 level. Mind you, Bahamut is 36 level in 4e, so...
Also that entire Sphere of Annihilation section should probably be removed from Ao's profile.
Why? Ao actually has a feat with a Sphere of Annihilation, only that his is way more powerful than the normal ones (cuz' is a primordial that can kill the entire Faerunian Panthoen on its own).
From...
I remember that magic in Athans is different in compassion to other worlds.
It's not that magic in Athas is different, is that magical practices are different. Arcane casters of Athas can exploit some bug in the "arcane weave" (for the lack of a better term) of Athas to increase the power of...
Neither are gods, yeah. Though Iggwilv can defeat demon lords (she defeated Graz'zt among others), so she will be at least at the level of a lesser deity.
but I think the mage-kings are technically gods (even if they were a ridiculously high level).
They fancy themselves gods, but they are...
At that high of a level? Maybe I'm just not well versed in the novels then.
Well, in the novels magic is more logical than in-game. If you're burned, you will not walk away as if nothing happened because "didn't lower my HP to zero".
In general most fighters are going to pack magical equipment...