Acheron does NOT have acausality type 2

[Mbpoops]

Hello again!

So i was looking over the profiles and noticed that currently Acheron has Acausality type 2 for these reasons

• Acausality (Type 2; Acheron does not show up in Elio's script even though he can see an infinite amount of possible futures and she has no past as the Nihility erased it. When one walks on the Paths formed by Aeons, their various possibilities will eventually collapse into a single one, as fate are weaved under their radiance

I will try to explain why these doesn't work:

Spoiler: Elio's script.

1. Acheron doesnt show up in elio's script.

Acheron asked S.A.M if she was in the script elio gave her and S.A.M says she didnt see anything about Acheron in the script. This would be a good case seeing that Elio can see infinite possibilities, even possibilities of Aeons. The problem here is that Elio never gives the full script as it would completely mess up his plan, So it’s far more likely that he simply didn’t give S.A.M. the full script, rather than Acheron somehow not appearing in it.

Spoiler: "her past was erased"

2. "Her past was erased by Nihility"

Is the statement in the room with us? No seriously what does this scan prove? This only implies that her past is hidden by the path of Nihility, something we already accept for Aeons. It makes even less sense when you realise this implies the trailblazer can time travel which is something only 2 to 3 characters we know of can do, them being Terminus and Fuli/Cyrene who are Aeons. You can actually apply the same logic used to remove aca type 2 from Aeons to Acheron because Terminus is actively traveling to he past meaning he had to have encountered Acheron at some point in time unless we wanna say acheron just removes herself from existence whenever a black cat shows up. Another thing that disproves this is the history of Izumo, which is Acheron's home world. The relic set thoroughly describes Izumo's history before it was destroyed meaning they have records of this place but they are confused on why it suddenly disappeared. The only one who knows what happened to it is IX THEMSELVES since THEY were the one who destroyed it however IX doesnt speak so no one will ever find out. Other statements of Acheron not having a past are just characters saying "she's hiding something" so its pretty unlikely her past just straight up doesnt exist.

Spoiler: Passive probability issues

3. Passive probability justification copy and paste

This and this actually has nothing to do with aca type 2, this actually kills the idea she has it, yet it is used as supporting evidence for her having it. It implies that there are multiple versions of the same Acheron in different timelines. Now why is this an Issue? Well Acausality type 2 is having no Temporal presence, she shouldnt exist in the past or future thus there shouldnt be any possibilities other than her present self, this also implies that EVERY pathstrider has acausality type 2 because this justification is on EVERY pathstrider for passive probability manip.

Conclusion:

Acheron will lose her Acausality type 2, since the justification on the profiles are inadequate, unless a better justification is provided.

Agree: @ActuallySpaceMan42 @Vietthai96 @Elizhaa

Neutral:

Disgaree:

 

[PedjaTarzan]

lowkey terminus stuff would also just be them bypassing aca 2 since they are obviously aeon making their powers FAR superior to acherons mere aca 2. but passive probality stuff and relic sets? yeah good luck for that

 

[Voidnether]

Acheron asked S.A.M if she was in the script elio gave her and S.A.M says she didnt see anything to which S.A.M says she couldnt see her in it. This would be a good case seeing that Elio can see infinite possibilities, even possibilities of Aeons. The problem here is that Elio never gives the full script as it would completely mess up his plan, so it is more likely that he just didnt give S.A.M the entire script than it is acheron not showing up in it.

Entirely different context by the way, the latter context as in Elio not giving the full script is just so that Kafka wouldn't do stupid shit, because let's be frank; All of the Stellaron Hunters were withdrawn information from Elio because it's for a good reason, as they were on the script and Elio can't have these Stellaron Hunters to know how they will die. But that is completely unrelated, because Acheron literally said if she was within Elio's script and SAM stated not a thing came up. There's genuinely no reason for Elio to withdraw Acheron's information from the entire script in Penacony LMFAO, this is the sole reason why Firefly is wary of Acheron in 3.8. Why the heck would Elio withdraw it? Absolutely zero reason, heck it goes against the principles of Path of Nihility where your self is literally erased (Self-Annihilators shit).

The shadow of Nihility covers the stars equally, and Self-Annihilators may form in any world. If we call them phenomena, these poor souls do share one thing in common: Their various existential properties — such as corporeal body, mental cognition, and personal memories... will gradually fade away in their journey of self-annihilation.

2. "Her past was erased by Nihility"

Is the statement in the room with us? No seriously what does this scan prove? This only implies her past is hidden by the path of Nihility, something we already accept for Aeons. It makes even less sense when you realise this implies the trailblazer can time travel which is something only 2 to 3 characters we know can do that being Terminus and Fuli/Cyrene who are Aeons (Cyrene is stuck in a time loop). You can actually apply the same logic used to remove aca type 2 from Aeons to Acheron because Terminus is actively traveling to he past meaning he had to have encountered Acheron at some point in time unless we wanna say acheron just removes herself from existence whenever a black cat shows up. Another thing that disproves this is the history of Izumo, which is Acheron's home world. The relic set thoroughly describes Izumo's history before it was destroyed meaning they have records of this place but they are confused on why it suddenly disappeared. The only one who knows what happened to it is IX THEMSELVES since THEY were the one who destroyed it however IX doesnt speak so no one will ever find out. Other statements of Acheron not having a past are just characters saying "she's hiding something" so its pretty unlikely her past just straight up doesnt exist.
[/SPOILER]

Spoiler: Passive probability issues

3. Passive probability justification copy and paste

This and this actually has nothing to do with aca type 2, this actually kills the idea she has it, yet it is used as supporting evidence) for her having it. It implies that there are multiple versions of the same Acheron in different timelines. Now why is this an Issue? Well Acausality type 2 is having no Temporal presence, she shouldnt exist in the past or future thus there shouldnt be any possibilities other than her present self, this also implies that EVERY pathstrider has acausality type 2 because this justification is on EVERY pathstrider for passive probability manip.

Conclusion:

Acheron loses her Acausality type 2, the evidence doesnt hold up.

1. Acheron has a past before she became an Emanator of Nihility, obviously.
2. IX, The Nihility erases her past completely the moment she became an Emanator of Nihility.

Genuinely doesn't prove shit, because we know Acheron did have a past, but that SHIT WAS BEFORE SHE BECAME AN EMANATOR.

Consider me disagreeing with Acausality type 2 because the counterarguments are straight up buns, neutral about Passive Probability Manipulation lmfao

 

[Nighting4l33yes]

Disagree.

Unfortunately, the world has long vanished from the astral charts. The truth of history eludes us, and the Remembrance no longer exists. When the Armed Archaeologists arrived, the galaxy resounded solely with the melody of the Enigmata: ▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇ tears, rain's boundless outpour. Beneath faint curtain, the survivor departs from her shore. Her homeland, ▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇▇..."

Tbh this statement alone neutralizes this entire thread. If not even Remembrance, which isACAUSAL in itself, can recount it when not even Irontomb could destroy memories despite annihilating the entire universe, it clearly means that it's erased from history, reality, existence, past existence etc. Destroyed timelines alone leave behind memoria. Izumo left behind nothing because Nihility erased it from time itself (as Remembrance is time)

This too btw

Last but not least, we know from the owlbert trailer, that she can cut through cause and effect aka create acausal paradoxes which is the power of nihility.

 

[Mbpoops]

Entirely different context by the way, the latter context as in Elio not giving the full script is just so that Kafka wouldn't do stupid shit, because let's be frank; All of the Stellaron Hunters were withdrawn information from Elio because it's for a good reason, as they were on the script and Elio can't have these Stellaron Hunters to know how they will die.

This would only apply to firefly silverwolf and maybe blade which supports what the op is saying, he didnt give her the full script.

But that is completely unrelated, because Acheron literally said if she was within Elio's script and SAM stated not a thing came up. There's genuinely no reason for Elio to withdraw Acheron's information from the entire script in Penacony LMFAO, this is the sole reason why Firefly is wary of Acheron in 3.8.

what are you even talking about the video you sent doesnt even support what you said, the dahlia had to explain what acheron was because elio didnt tell her

Why the heck would Elio withdraw it? Absolutely zero reason, heck it goes against the principles of Path of Nihility where your self is literally erased (Self-Annihilators shit).

The reason he wihdrew it is explained in the OP

1. Acheron has a past before she became an Emanator of Nihility, obviously.
2. IX, The Nihility erases her past completely the moment she became an Emanator of Nihility.

So which one is it? She has a past or she doesnt? You’re contradicting yourself here

Genuinely doesn't prove shit, because we know Acheron did have a past, but that SHIT WAS BEFORE SHE BECAME AN EMANATOR.

So she has a past? Then she doesnt have aca 2

Consider me disagreeing with Acausality type 2 because the counterarguments are straight up buns, neutral about Passive Probability Manipulation lmfao

You cant be neutral passive probability and disagree with aca type 2 removal. Passive probability posits that there are other possibilities she has meaning she has a temporal presense and thus no acausality type 2

 

[Voidnether]

Btw I still don't know why the entire time travel issue is being brought up as if it'd be a miraculous antifeat for Acausality (it's not because no one is able to time travel and kill Acheron by going to the past) when we have Fuli being Acausality type 1 due to how Path of Remembrance works;

Acausality (Type 1; Fuli has not been born yet. The one we currently see are the memories that Fuli in the future projects backwards in time when it is born at the end of the universe and "remembers" it, re-creating it. Currently, Fuli exists as one of many Pure Children of Anasrava who are capable of ascending and becoming the Aeon of Remembrence at the end of the universe. This means that Fuli effectively is the cause of it's own birth, causing a causality paradox and loop[15])

 

[Voidnether]

This would only apply to firefly silverwolf and maybe blade which supports what the op is saying, he didnt give her the full script.

what are you even talking about the video you sent doesnt even support what you said, the dahlia had to explain what acheron was because elio didnt tell her

The reason he wihdrew it is explained in the OP

No you didn't, Acheron asked a very straightforward question and that was whether she was included in Elio's script about Penacony. You can't make this up.

So which one is it? She has a past or she doesnt? You’re contradicting yourself here

So she has a past? Then she doesnt have aca 2

Read again, your evidence of Acheron having a past is BEFORE she became an Emanator of Nihility, AFTER she became one, she doesn't have a past anymore.

You cant be neutral passive probability and disagree with aca type 2 removal. Passive probability posits that there are other possibilities she has meaning she has a temporal presense and thus no acausality type 2

??? Passive Probability Manipulation there only confirms that each Acheron within its own timeline only exist in the present, and that it doesn't exist on the past and future. Since when is it a disqualifier for Acausality type 2 if you have infinite versions of yourself across the infinite multiverse existing in the present only but not exist in the past and future lmfao

 

[Mbpoops]

Disagree.

Tbh this statement alone neutralizes this entire thread. If not even Remembrance, which is ACAUSAL in itself, can recount it when not even Irontomb could destroy memories despite annihilating the entire universe, it clearly means that it's erased from history, reality, existence, past existence etc. Destroyed timelines alone leave behind memoria. Izumo left behind nothing because Nihility erased it from time itself (as Remembrance is time).

The statement gets contradicted by the relic set going over the history of izumo the place clearly existed they just dont know what happened to it. Irontomb has nothing to do with aca because hes specifically a nous killer he doesnt target the past or anything. Actually the fact that the relic set posits the IX knows what happened to it kills acausality type 2

This too btw

“History stopped there” just means that after a certain point they lost track of what happened to the planet. We know they have records of it from the relic set but the planet suddenly vanish because of IX

Last but not least, we know from the owlbert trailer, that she can cut through cause and effect aka create acausal paradoxes which is the power of nihility.

Thats.. not how acausality works.. this is just causality manip

 

[Mbpoops]

Btw I still don't know why the entire time travel issue is being brought up as if it'd be a miraculous antifeat for Acausality (it's not because no one is able to time travel and kill Acheron by going to the past) when we have Fuli being Acausality type 1 due to how Path of Remembrance works;

Because the trailblazer cant time travel..? Also acausality type 2 means they dont exist in the past or future terminus is seeing her while traveling to the past which means she has a past so theres no aca type 2

 

[Mbpoops]

No you didn't, Acheron asked a very straightforward question and that was whether she was included in Elio's script about Penacony. You can't make this up.

And we dont know why but we have an explanation from kafka saying elio never gives the full script so its likely that elio didnt give her that part i mean even the dahlia knew who she was

Read again, your evidence of Acheron having a past is BEFORE she became an Emanator of Nihility, AFTER she became one, she doesn't have a past anymore.

Dude. This just means her past is obscured not that it doesnt exist you cant say she has a past then say she doesnt have a past

??? Passive Probability Manipulation there only confirms that each Acheron within its own timeline only exist in the present, and that it doesn't exist on the past and future. Since when is it a disqualifier for Acausality type 2 if you have infinite versions of yourself across the infinite multiverse existing in the present only but not exist in the past and future lmfao

So she has a temporal presense? Thanks for agreeing with the thread

 

[Nighting4l33yes]

So which one is it? She has a past or she doesnt? You’re contradicting yourself here

bro. she had a past before it was destroyed. the past and future just stopped existing after nihility killed it. thats where the whole "emanator who should not exist" came from.

The statement gets contradicted by the relic set going over the history of izumo the place clearly existed they just dont know what happened to it. Irontomb has nothing to do with aca because hes specifically a nous killer he doesnt target the past or anything. Actually the fact that the relic set posits the IX knows what happened to it kills acausality type 2

for starters, we dont know who is saying all of this. it could just be an omniscient narrator. besides it's not contradicted at all. its how the paradox works.

Thats.. not how acausality works.. this is just causality manip

...

let me make it simple.

We have A, B and C. Removing the linkage between A and B gives =
A (no longer leads anywhere)
B (no longer has origin)
C (exists without traceable ancestry)

Aka she's not anchored to causal chain. Nor are the relics, in any case.

 

[Mbpoops]

bro. she had a past before it was destroyed. the past and future just stopped existing after nihility killed it. thats where the whole "emanator who should not exist" came from.

Her past wasnt destroyed though, just hidden

for starters, we dont know who is saying all of this. it could just be an omniscient narrator. besides it's not contradicted at all. its how the paradox works.

Why does that matter when they are explaining the history if izumo? If its accurate to it’s lore why does the person whos reading it matter

...

let me make it simple.

We have A, B and C. Removing the linkage between A and B gives =
A (no longer leads anywhere)
B (no longer has origin)
C (exists without traceable ancestry)

Aka she's not anchored to causal chain.

Again this isnt acausality just causality manip

 

[Mr._East_Statement]

So far I am seeing no counters to CRT?

Based on the OP's promise, Acheron's past does not "not exist" in the sense of being none existence, but rather veiled by the path of Nihility (thus, the reason why it is blank). And I didn't saw anything to actually refute their point?

Furthermore, yes, the second part about possibilities is absolutely nonsensical to be used for Ac 2, as the possibilities explicitly said to be the point which all possibilities collapse in favor of the existence of a singular possibility for the individual Pathstriders that partake in the way of their path, rather than rejecting the existence of any moments of past or future in favor of a single eternal now for the said possibility.

Following for now, agree with the thread until I see a concrete refutation, because in so far nothing in the op is actually refuted.

 

[Nighting4l33yes]

Her past wasnt destroyed though, just hidden

No it was destroyed. She specifically says so in one of the linked images. Her past has nothing there except Nihility. Nihility is NOT ENIGMATA. It does not obscure. It annihilates.

Why does that matter when they are explaining the history if izumo? If its accurate to it’s lore why does the person whos reading it matter

What? The story comes from an omniscient narrator. It has no source.

Again this isnt acausality just causality manip

No this is literally acausality.

C has no cause. It exists without a causal chain. Man. Srsly.

 

[Zanesucksatlife]

Agree

 

[Mbpoops]

No it was destroyed. She specifically says so in one of the linked images. Her past has nothing there except Nihility. Nihility is NOT ENIGMATA. It does not obscure. It annihilates.

Who said anything about enigmata? The fact IX knows the past of izumo means the history wasnt destroyed just obscured by nihility’s philosophy and this doesnt even get into how terminus is seeing her in the past

What? The story comes from an omniscient narrator. It has no source.

The source is the relic set, are we going to say all readables, relics, etcetc are unuseable? We might ad well delete the verse atp

No this is literally acausality.

C has no cause. It exists without a causal chain. Man. Srsly.

No its not acausality its even indexed on her profile as causality manip because it has nothing to do with acausality

 

[Mbpoops]

No you didn't, Acheron asked a very straightforward question and that was whether she was included in Elio's script about Penacony. You can't make this up.

actually coming back to this, acheron asked sam if she appeared in HER (sam’s) script meaning the script elio gave her in which we know elio never gives the full script so yea elio just didnt give her that info

 

[Natsuki012]

neutral for now

 

[Zanesucksatlife]

Snip

No he's right
It is Causality manipulation
What you're showing isn't proof for
Type 2: Temporal Singularity: Characters with this type of Acausality do not exist in either the past or the future, only the present. This means they cannot be affected by changes to the past, while also making them resistant to Precognition that works by viewing the future, as they do not exist within it, and Fate Manipulation, for the same reason. In essence, they are able to choose their own fates, but they remain just as vulnerable at the point in time in which they do exist.
Past or future
Past = unknown doesn't equal her being immune. You know terminus does exist?, he'd have to go back and time and see her
Which would undo that cause every time.

(Stupid example I will use)
Acheron can have both her cause and effect changed,
Relying on the conversation about Elios script or whatever doesn't prove Type 2

You need more proof to prove that Elio can't actually see her.

 

[Mr._East_Statement]

No this is literally acausality.

C has no cause. It exists without a causal chain. Man. Srsly.

… This absolutely is not called Acasuality and just casuality manipulation, really.

To cut the relation that correspond between the cause and the effect is not called making things "acasual." It means the ability to cut through a relation.

As the VSBW also says

The user can redirect any cause to any effect, undo anything by inverting the relation cause/effect, or even separate them entirely, making a specific effect impossible to be caused or a specific cause not producing any effect.
This allows one to achieve virtually anything by redirecting the selected cause to the desired effect. A finger snap that normally causes sound and kinetic force could instead cause a sun explosion or a massive resurrection. The user could also instantly erase anything from existence, by making its existence the cause of its own nonexistence. Another possibility is the instant rewriting of a whole reality, by making Reality X (the current reality) the cause of Reality Y (a tailor-made one).

At a high level, the user would be able to rewrite the laws of causality as a whole, essentially playing God.

You stab someone (cause), they get injured (effect), but if the someone manipulates the cause-and-effect, it basically means they either make the effect never happens, or skipping the cause and jumping on effect (depending on whatever the verse wants to does it but anyway).



While Acasuality means something like not being bound by normal cause-and-effect rules. An acausal being may ignore fate or still exist after their own origin is erased (which is what is argued here).



So cutting through cause and effect here doesn't mean creating acasual paradoxes, you are confusing three different things entirely (casuality, acasuality, and paradox).

Cutting causality can lead to "paradoxical" situations, but it is not inherently "creating acausality" and "acausal paradox" is itself kind of nonsense terminology unless specifically defined by the verse to actually having some form of meaning.



There can be two simple examples for it:

Case 1 — Causality Manipulation

A sniper fires a bullet.

Character cuts causality.

Result:

Bullet leaves the gun but impact never occurs

This can be causality manipulation.


Case 2 — Acausality


However in case two, a god erases the sniper from history before he was born. But the sniper still exists and shoots anyway. Now the sniper is acting independently of causal history.

That’s acausality.


So "cutting cause-and-effect and creating acasual paradoxes" is mixing THREE different ideas that does not necessarily mean anything toward each other.

 

[Nighting4l33yes]

Who said anything about enigmata? The fact IX knows the past of izumo means the history wasnt destroyed just obscured by nihility’s philosophy and this doesnt even get into how terminus is seeing her in the past

Well he destroyed it why wouldnt he know about it? It's an aeon...

The source is the relic set, are we going to say all readables, relics, etcetc are unuseable? We might ad well delete the verse atp

Brother how in the blazes did you reach that conclusion? Where tf did I say its unusable? Do you understand what an omniscient narrator is? It's a voice outside of the story's events. It knows everything and delivers information. It's not an in-game character. The relic story is the same. It's not from an in-game character.

No its not acausality its even indexed on her profile as causality manip because it has nothing to do with acausality

Severing cause and effect IS causality manip. But an object whose cause has ceased to exist, has no origin aka no cause, and is thus, acausal.

No he's right
It is Causality manipulation
What you're showing isn't proof for
Type 2: Temporal Singularity: Characters with this type of Acausality do not exist in either the past or the future, only the present. This means they cannot be affected by changes to the past, while also making them resistant to Precognition that works by viewing the future, as they do not exist within it, and Fate Manipulation, for the same reason. In essence, they are able to choose their own fates, but they remain just as vulnerable at the point in time in which they do exist.
Past or future
Past = unknown doesn't equal her being immune. You know terminus does exist?, he'd have to go back and time and see her
Which would undo that cause every time.

(Stupid example I will use)
Acheron can have both her cause and effect changed,
Relying on the conversation about Elios script or whatever doesn't prove Type 2

You need more proof to prove that Elio can't actually see her.

same as above.

 

[Zanesucksatlife]

Snip

Severing cause and effect IS causality manip ok and??
Where does this prove type 2? Can you give a direct scan or statement to prove it's temporal? A scan that says her past being unknown means she can't be changed?
Burden of proof falls onto you.
Elios script or whatever means nothing
As we know that he doesn't give our full details.

Also you saying Well he destroyed it why wouldnt he know about it? It's an aeon...
Also means nothing, it goes against type 2, if he knows about the past then IX clearly knows about Acheron, so her being an nihility Emanator with unknown past doesn't add much if one knows about it
Not too mention, we have terminus who can literally go back in time,
Are you saying it's impossible for Terminus to see or know about her? If so then wheres that stated? I need to see proof of that if so.
Also.. Terminus kills Acausality 2, if going in time to rewind the verse or whatever. So there's nothing to prove why it wouldn't affect Acheron.

EDIT: and actually, we have ample amounts of proof for why Acheron is affected by the time rewind if anything

 

[Mbpoops]

Well he destroyed it why wouldnt he know about it? It's an aeon...

Aeons arent omnipotent

Brother how in the blazes did you reach that conclusion? Where tf did I say its unusable? Do you understand what an omniscient narrator is? It's a voice outside of the story's events. It knows everything and delivers information. It's not an in-game character. The relic story is the same. It's not from an in-game character.

Im not sure why this matters at all

Severing cause and effect IS causality manip. But an object whose cause has ceased to exist, has no origin aka no cause, and is thus, acausal.

Acheron’s blade doesnt sever her own cause, read east’s comment

same as above.

 

[Mbpoops]

Also you saying Well he destroyed it why wouldnt he know about it? It's an aeon...
Also means nothing, it goes against type 2, if he knows about the past then IX clearly knows about Acheron, so her being an nihility Emanator with unknown past doesn't add much if one knows about it
Not too mention, we have terminus who can literally go back in time,

Adding to this part, IX knowing about izumo’s history and what happened to it proves that it’s history exists if it didnt he wouldnt know about it

 

[Nighting4l33yes]

Aeons arent omnipotent

That's not a matter of power. It's a matter of knowledge and awareness.

Im not sure why this matters at all

Well that's your issue. Lol. There's a tremendous difference between an in-game character saying something through their own, individual, specific knowledge and another for a dev to just tell you so by writing it somewhere. Your reasoning is that there's knowledge about it. That's not from any in-game character. No guild, no organization, no character. It's just a narrated piece. It's existence has no lore implications.

Acheron’s blade doesnt sever her own cause, read east’s comment

Her power comes from Nihility. Her own cause was severed.

 

[Mbpoops]

That's not a matter of power. It's a matter of knowledge and awareness.

So he knows about the history which like i said in my previous messages nukes aca type 2 because it has a history

Well that's your issue. Lol. There's a tremendous difference between an in-game character saying something through their own, individual, specific knowledge and another for a dev to just tell you so by writing it somewhere. Your reasoning is that there's knowledge about it. That's not from any in-game character. No guild, no organization, no character. It's just a narrated piece. It's existence has no lore implications.

And this doesnt matter at all to the thread. The relic set is in the game, they put it there for a reason. Its not contradicted by any source so it is useable

Her power comes from Nihility. Her own cause was severed.

And is there any proof of this that hasnt been addressed in this thread?

 

[Nighting4l33yes]

So he knows about the history which like i said in my previous messages nukes aca type 2 because it has a history

Why would he not know it? He destroyed it and he's an Aeon. Knowledge of it doesn't invalidate it either. If you think so, prove it by this wiki's standards. It just doesn't exist any longer in the timeline, hence it being a temporal paradox.

And this doesnt matter at all to the thread

It does because you're reasoning is that knowledge of it exists. Yet it doesn't exist to anyone in the game except for us.

And is there any proof of this that hasnt been addressed in this thread?

? You are debating its existence. Acheron draws that power from Nihility and it was also used on her. We literally know what this power does. What are you talking about?

 

[AlipheeseXIV]

I mean, while it's true that a character can still "have" a past before the specific point where they become a type 2 acausal being, it is also true that some of these scans took a fair bit of creative liberty. Also don't forget to add the vote tally to the OP I always forget it

 

[Mbpoops]

I mean, while it's true that a character can still "have" a past before the specific point where they become a type 2 acausal being, it is also true that some of these scans took a fair bit of creative liberty. Also don't forget to add the vote tally to the OP I always forget it

I will but bad wifi

 

[AlipheeseXIV]

I will but bad wifi

 

[Mbpoops]

Why would he not know it? He destroyed it and he's an Aeon. Knowledge of it doesn't invalidate it either. If you think so, prove it by this wiki's standards. It just doesn't exist any longer in the timeline, hence it being a temporal paradox.

Knowledge of something’s history invalidates aca type 2 because it has history, its not lacking a temporal presense

It does because you're reasoning is that knowledge of it exists. Yet it doesn't exist to anyone in the game except for us.

what are you even talking about? You can have scans and information come from sources that arent specified factions im not sure how that invalidates the relic set if it doesnt contradict anything in the lore. If it was contradicted i wouldnt use it but they put it in the game for a reason and it hasnt been contradicted

? You are debating its existence. Acheron draws that power from Nihility and it was also used on her. We literally know what this power does. What are you talking about?

Again where are the scans that say her past doesnt exist because of nihility? All of them have been addressed in the thread

 

[Eseseso]

Neutral on passive probability hax, leaning in favor of cutting Aca 2

 

[Mbpoops]

Neutral on passive probability hax, leaning in favor of cutting Aca 2

The passive probablility is used as justification for aca type 2 (like literaly its the same justificstion) so its either we axe passive prob or axe aca type 2

 

[Nighting4l33yes]

Knowledge of something’s history invalidates aca type 2 because it has history, its not lacking a temporal presense

It can have history until the point it was erased. For Acheron, her past exists as knowledge only to her only. For the rest of the world, it's gone.

what are you even talking about? You can have scans and information come from sources that arent specified factions im not sure how that invalidates the relic set if it doesnt contradict anything in the lore. If it was contradicted i wouldnt use it but they put it in the game for a reason and it hasnt been contradicted

... Okay. Can you please read what I am saying? I didn't say it's invalidated. Go back and re-read what I said.

Again where are the scans that say her past doesnt exist because of nihility? All of them have been addressed in the thread

You didn't rly address anything. You said "Nuhuh, this is not a thing because I said so". Arguing that Nihility "hides" things when that's what Enigmata does has no basis on anything we know about it so far. And you didn't prove it in any way. You just it does it because you said so.

 

[Mbpoops]

It can have history until the point it was erased. For Acheron, her past exists as knowledge only to her only. For the rest of the world, it's gone.

You just admitted she has a past and that shes hiding it (something consistsnt with owlbert and black swan’s statements linked in the op)

... Okay. Can you please read what I am saying? I didn't say it's invalidated. Go back and re-read what I said.

Then what was the point in bringing it up? Actually there is no point

You didn't rly address anything. You said "Nuhuh, this is not a thing because I said so". Arguing that Nihility "hides" things when that's what Enigmata does has no basis on anything we know about it so far. And you didn't prove it in any way. You just it does it because you said so.

Why are we acting like because one path can do something the others cant? Just because enigmata covers the past to counteract nous doesnt mean nihility deletes the past. This idea is actually contradicted by the relic set because IX knows the history of izumo which shouldnt be possible if izumo’s history was deleted or doesnt exist

 

[Mbpoops]

Why are we acting like because one path can do something the others cant? Just because enigmata covers the past to counteract nous doesnt mean nihility deletes the past. This idea is actually contradicted by the relic set because IX knows the history of izumo which shouldnt be possible if izumo’s history was deleted or doesnt exist

Also, as i linked im the op we currently have it accepted that paths hide or “veil” the history/past of Aeons because of terminus

 

[Nighting4l33yes]

You just admitted she has a past and that shes hiding it (something consistsnt with owlbert and black swan’s statements linked in the op)

I think you are just looking for keywords and not actually reading what I am saying. Her past is gone. Her knowledge that it once existed isn't.

Then what was the point in bringing it up? Actually there is no point

That history existing only to our knowledge, the players, does not mean it exists inside the verse.

Why are we acting like because one path can do something the others cant? Just because enigmata covers the past to counteract nous doesnt mean nihility deletes the past. This idea is actually contradicted by the relic set because IX knows the history of izumo which shouldnt be possible if izumo’s history was deleted or doesnt exist

Well it does mean that. Because we are straight up told of it. That's nihility's nature and that's what ix is. A void of nothing. You're the one huffing and puffing about primium mobiles and that aeons can't deviate from them. So why would ix suddenly want to hide things?

 

[Mbpoops]

I think you are just looking for keywords and not actually reading what I am saying. Her past is gone. Her knowledge that it once existed isn't.

You’re taking the words too literslly and ignoring the context surrounding them. Her past isnt gone in a sense that it doesnt exist they just dont know what happened to it because nihility is obscuring it we have information of her past and terminus sees her while actively traveling to the past so she does exist in the past and she exists in the future unless we say those 4 other timelines acheron doesnt exist

That history existing only to our knowledge, the players, does not mean it exists inside the verse.

And where is the proof it doesnt exist? They have records of it from the relic set this is information they have access to inverse its up to you to prove that these are either inaccurate or not canon

Well it does mean that. Because we are straight up told of it. That's nihility's nature and that's what ix is. A void of nothing. You're the one huffing and puffing about primium mobiles and that aeons can't deviate from them. So why would ix suddenly want to hide things?

Again where id the proof??? The primium mobiles are about the paths ENERGY they arent deviating from their paths its just the paths can do similiar things this has nothing to do with primium mobiles. We dont know why IX hides this info but we know he has it and this kills aca type 2

 

[Mbpoops]

And none of this has addresded the huge elephant that is her passive probability because that also proves shes temporally present across multiple timelines

 

[PedjaTarzan]

And none of this has addresded the huge elephant that is her passive probability because that also proves shes temporally present across multiple timelines

shes present across multiple timelines??? QUICK ACA 3 OMGGGGG