The Pirate Hunter challenges another Sword Master to a duel (Roronoa Zoro{One Piece} vs Valencina{Project Moon}) 7-0-0 (Grace)

[MysticBrawler]

that goes against every showcase in the series. Again it's his blade that uses the necessary weak point against the object... Not that he just finds the weak point in objects

No not really, All the context shows is that prior to fighting Mr. 1 and getting the Breath of All Things Zoro wasn't capable of finding the weakpoints in metal nothing more.

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

No not really, All the context shows is that prior to fighting Mr. 1 and getting the Breath of All Things Zoro wasn't capable of finding the weakpoints in metal nothing more.

Try downplaying the ability more my guy...

 

[Ubdon]

that goes against every showcase in the series. Again it's his blade that uses the necessary weak point against the object... Not that he just finds the weak point in objects

I asked you what it go against several times and non of scan outright said "yeah no it's wrong that's how it works" nor contradicted what I said

The scan with Mr. 1 shown zoro sensing and sword undestanding him follow what he wants do to, which is to strike weak point with proper technique instead of just force alone.

Zoro can have the sharpest knife and still not cut... And its not by just "find weak point" but by using the necessary power, timing and vital point against the object with the blade

You said 50 times I already adressed it. Yes technique matters. Just in real life one can't cut even bamboo with swing while other cutting 5 cuz they now angle time and force to do it.

Doesn't contradict what I said

 

[Ubdon]

Try downplaying the ability more my guy...

Aren't you guy who said Zoro precog better than Musashi seeing future

 

[MysticBrawler]

Try downplaying the ability more my guy...

Correct me if I"m wrong but isn"t it common standard for the wiki to default to the lowest interpretation and not the highest?

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

I asked you what it go against several times and non of scan outright said "yeah no it's wrong that's how it works" nor contradicted what I said

It goes against that Zoro only attacks weak points in objects, even tho he never focuses on that.

A "weak point" in metal would've be to attack the less metal areas... Yet he didn't do that... He can cut anything anywhere on the object and dura neg it based on him using the necessary vital point that the sword makes... Combined with force and timing

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

Correct me if I"m wrong but isn"t it common standard for the wiki to default to the lowest interpretation and not the highest?

no...? The most accurate and accepted interpretation

Aren't you guy who said Zoro precog better than Musashi seeing future

Maybe? Idk, show me musashi seeing future/ability

There's a character that can see decedes or more into the future... And that's still way worse precog than someone seeing and knowing exactly 3 second beforehand at all times

There are multiple different precog with multiple usages... Some for combat, some for surviving, and some for something else entirely

If this is the ability... Yes, the ability's explanation itself says how limited and unprecise it is

 

[Ubdon]

no...? The most accurate and accepted interpretation

Maybe? Idk, show me musashi seeing future/ability

There's a character that can see decedes or more into the future... And that's still way worse precog than someone seeing and knowing exactly 3 second beforehand at all times

There are multiple different precog with multiple usages... Some for combat, some for surviving, and some for something else entirely

It was musashi vs zoro thread

You were also saying that zoro precoq somehow gonna counter fate power cut all possiblities

Thing gone so far there was even crt or qna thread just to say it doesn't work like that

So yeah idk you sound like last guy to me talk about downplaying stuff

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

You were also saying that zoro precoq somehow gonna counter fate power cut all possiblities

Zoro can change the future... That's what I argued, which is a fact.

So yeah idk you sound like last guy to me talk about downplaying stuff

I'm going with the profiles... The people in the thread were not. the problem is not on me, it was fate fans arguing in bad faith.

 

[Ubdon]

It goes against that Zoro only attacks weak points in objects, even tho he never focuses on that.

A "weak point" in metal would've be to attack the less metal areas... Yet he didn't do that... He can cut anything anywhere on the object and dura neg it based on him using the necessary vital point that the sword makes... Combined with force and timing

Anyway now I think? I get it so I prob should apologise and move to other points

Btw can you remind me why you think it's a stomp? Cuz you saying that is kinda main reason why I even trying to argue

 

[MysticBrawler]

no...? The most accurate and accepted interpretation

And how exactly is your interpretation supposed to be the more accurate one when your extrapolating something that's unsupported by all of the scans in Zoro's profile as well as the scans that you yourself posted?

 

[MysticBrawler]

Btw can you remind me why you think it's a stomp? Cuz you saying that is kinda main reason why I even trying to argue

It's because Kachon and MonkeyofLife was arguing that Zoro starts with his Iai technique, which is capable of Blitzing those who have Precognition(Analytical Prediction), and that Zoro's Limited Durability Negation isn't covered by Valencina Resistance to Durability Negation. These two things put together would mean that Valencina would end up getting instantly killed the moment the fight starts. Now earlier MonkeyofLife argued that Zoro would initially hold back against Valencina since he doesn't like going all-out against women, so now the question is what would his next move be. cause if he just follows up with another Iai attack then this would still result in a stomp either way.

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

And how exactly is your interpretation supposed to be the more accurate one when you’re extrapolating something that's unsupported by all of the scans in Zoro's profile as well as the scans that you yourself posted?

I’m literally the one who discussed and helped Eminiteable add dura neg to Zoro’s profile. It’s all about how the sword cuts, not what areas in the object it targets. That does not exist anywhere in any of the links or the profiles.

It used to be damage boost before, because it’s how it cuts not where it cuts. Which you are were trying to argue by only focusing on the vital point statement and misunderstanding it

Here, an unbiased AI explanation

Based on the texts you provided and the core philosophy of swordsmanship in One Piece, it is a very specific combination of both, but the emphasis is deeply on how the sword cuts.

It is not about finding a physical crack or a structural flaw in the steel (like a traditional "weak point"). Instead, it is about aligning your sword's intent with the "spiritual rhythm" of the object.

Here is how the "Where" and the "How" work together in this technique:

1. The "Where": Targeting the "Breath" (呼吸 - Kokyū)​

When the text mentions grasping the "vital point" (急所 - Kyūsho), it doesn't mean Zoro is looking for a rusty spot or a weak joint on Mr. 1's body.

• Everything in the world (stones, trees, steel) has a "breath" or a unique frequency.
• Observation Haki (or the "Breath of All Things") allows Zoro to locate that frequency.
• The "Where" is entirely spiritual. He is targeting the "essence" of the steel.

2. The "How": The Intent of the Blade (力とタイミング - Power and Timing)​

This is the most critical part of the technique, and it comes directly from his master’s teachings. His master told him:

"A sword that can cut nothing can cut steel."

If the technique was just about hitting a specific weak spot, the "cutting nothing" part wouldn't make sense. The "How" is about the intent and flow of the swordsman:

• To cut nothing (like the palm leaves): Zoro swings the sword, but he matches the "breath" of the leaves perfectly so that his blade passes through without disrupting them. He uses zero hostile "power."
• To cut steel: He finds the "breath" of the steel and applies the exact right "power" (力 - Chikara) and "timing" (タイミング - Taimingu) to disrupt and sever that specific frequency.

The Wano Confirmation (Ryuo)​

Years later in the Wano Arc, this exact concept is explained as Ryuo (Advanced Armament Haki). The samurai explain that a blade is an extension of the swordsman's will.

• You don't just swing harder (which is why Zoro's earlier attacks just bounced off Mr. 1).
• You flow your invisible armor (Haki) into the blade and tell it exactly what to cut and how to interact with the target's surface.

Summary​

Zoro targets a spiritual location (the "breath" of the steel) by changing the physical nature of his cut (adjusting his power, timing, and Haki flow to match that breath). He isn't aiming for a weak spot on Mr. 1's armor; he is turning his sword into a tool that specifically understands how to bypass steel.

Now earlier MonkeyofLife argued that Zoro would initially hold back against Valencina since he doesn't like going all-out against women, so now the question is what would his next move be. cause if he just follows up with another Iai attack then this would still result in a stomp either way.

If there’s a chance where she doesn’t get one shot, then it’s not a stomp. Winning via blitz techniques is allowed as a solid win

 

[MysticBrawler]

I’m literally the one who discussed and helped Eminiteable add dura neg to Zoro’s profile. It’s all about how the sword cuts, not what areas in the object it targets. That does not exist anywhere in any of the links or the profiles.

The fact that grasping an object's vital points and knowing where he needs to strike were both specified while he's doing his Limited Durability Negation means that those are necessary components for making use of this ability, and I don't see any reason to assume otherwise.

If there’s a chance where she doesn’t get one shot, then it’s not a stomp. Winning via blitz techniques is allowed as a solid win

Even if it takes a thousand strikes to down an opponent it would still be a stomp if they aren't be able to strike back at all during that time. If he uses his other moves after using his Iai technique then I'm fine with Zoro taking the win here. Though with that said, why are you even assuming that him starting with him starting with his Iai technique is guaranteed when that's one of his lesser used moves anyway?

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

The fact that grasping an object's vital points and knowing where he needs to strike were both specified while he's doing his Limited Durability Negation means that those are necessary components for making use of this ability, and I don't see any reason to assume otherwise.

What I said is already accepted…

The AI explains it and explains how that isn’t the case and why your interpretation doesn’t make sense

Here, an unbiased AI explanation:

Read then stop downplaying and misconstruing the ability

Even if it takes a thousand strikes to down an opponent it would still be a stomp if they aren't be able to strike back at all during that time.

that’s never been a thing, it has to be a one shot for it to be invalid.

If he uses his other moves after using his Iai technique then I'm fine with Zoro taking the win here. Though with that said, why are you even assuming that him starting with him starting with his Iai technique is guaranteed when that's one of his lesser used moves anyway?

That’s not his lesser used moves at all, he has basically used it on every fight and most at the start.

The fight starts at 3 meters away, Zoro would utilize Iai, and if it doesn’t one shot and she still continues to fight, Zoro could put her down with ranged slashes

 

[Ubdon]

Given he could cut someone who could tank every single one of his attacks without even a scratch, the durability gap needs to be like a tier difference at least

Monkey since you here do you perhaps know which scene this refer to

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

Monkey since you here do you perhaps know which scene this refer to

Either Daz bones or Kuma

Both could work I guess

 

[Ubdon]

Either Daz bones or Kuma

Both work I guess

I mean

If it's daz bones he not exactly one tier above and if it's kuma there like 100-200 chapters gap from skypiea I believe

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

I mean

If it's daz bones he not exactly one tier above and if it's kuma there like 100-200 chapters gap from skypiea I believe

She is 4.6 megatons an 8x would be a one tier above

Zoro could not do any type of damage to then one shot

 

[MysticBrawler]

It is already accepted…

The AI explains it and explains how that isn’t the case and why your interpretation doesn’t make sense

Read then stop downplaying and misconstruing the ability

Even if Zoro's Limited Durability Negation is valid the fact still remains that none of the scans in his profile nor any of the ones you sent say what you assume it does(which is his Breath of All Things allows him to create weaknesses in his targets and not him simply finding out already existing weaknesses that he Initially couldn't see wit his base Information Analysis)

that’s never been a thing, it has to be an one shot for it to be invalid.

The definition of a Curb-stomp battle is "defeating an opponent with barely any effort", but if this really is valid by wiki standards then I won't argue any further.

That’s not his lesser used moves at all, he has basically used it on every fight and most at the start.

The fight starts at 3 meters away, Zoro would utilize Iai, and if it doesn’t one shot and she still continues to fight, Zoro could put her down with ranged slashes

Lesser used as in it's one of the move that he starts with the least with there being apparently only 2 examples Pre-Timeskip where he did start the fight with it.

 

[Kachon123]

Monkey since you here do you perhaps know which scene this refer to

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

Lesser used as in it's one of the move that he starts with the least with there being apparently only 2 examples Pre-Timeskip where he did start the fight with it.

After daz bones (he used it instantly when he gain it), then there’s Zoro fighting a flying opponent, meaning he couldn’t use it… then Ohm which he had to fight from a distance because of his range… him vs train, he used it instantly, then Kaku also has ranged attacks and whenever Zoro got serious and went for the kill, he used it as like his second move… then for Kuma 1st round he started with it, the second he start with it again.

He uses it most of the time and especially at the start (that’s 4 instances he started with it)

Even if Zoro's Limited Durability Negation is valid the fact still remains that none of the scans in his profile nor any of the ones you sent say what you assume it does(which is his Breath of All Things allows him to create weaknesses in his targets and not him simply finding out already existing weaknesses that he Initially couldn't see wit his base Information Analysis)

Yea it does, no where does it say he targets weak points. Your misunderstanding it and what the ability does

 

[Ubdon]

The fight starts at 3 meters away, Zoro would utilize Iai, and if it doesn’t one shot and she still continues to fight, Zoro could put her down with ranged slashes

Btw I think val has counter to zoro speed amp

One of her passive fix apply status on oponent that fix their speed at lowest (game start) (I believe lowest for the speed rating they in since one character in verse has that stat at infinite but that just allegory of her being faster than anyone) and nulify all effects of haste (status that boost speed)

Now why you ask it's not listed on her profile despite being on her passive page and that passive even having lore? Ask mystic cuz I wanna ask him as well

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

Btw I think val has counter to zoro speed amp

One of her passive fix apply status on oponent that fix their speed at lowest (I believe lowest for the speed rating they in since one character in verse has that stat at infinite but that just allegory of her being faster than anyone) and nulify all effects of haste (status that boost speed)

Now why you ask it's not listed on her profile despite being on her passive page and that passive even having lore? Ask mystic cuz I wanna ask him as well

Zoro’s speed comes from technique/skill

You can’t argue for that when it doesn’t exist on her profile, she has a resistance to speed reduction tho which is what you might be thinking of

 

[MysticBrawler]

Btw I val has counter to zoro speed amp

One of her passive fix aply status on oponent that fix their speed at lowest (I believe lowest for the speed rating they in since one character in verse has that stat at infinite but that just allegory of her being faster than anyone) and nulify all effects of haste (status that boost speed)

Now why you ask it's not listed on her profile despite being on her passive page and that passive even having lore? Ask mystic cuz I wanna ask him as well

Because there is no in-universe explanation for it , and dice numbers in general are a purely gameplay thing, with no correlation to any of the story elements, so I figured that would just be counted as game mechanics.

 

[Ubdon]

Because there is no in-universe explanation for it , and dice numbers in general are a purely gameplay thing, with no correlation to any of the story elements, so I figured that would just be counted as game mechanics.

I mean there is general correlation between dice speed and characters

Like most characters who gets haste are usually specify on quick assasination or just maneuvers enough

And in general their low and max speed being tied to their ranking

 

[Ubdon]

Zoro’s speed comes from technique/skill

I just wanna point out that most of haste comes from simmilar skills as well

But ig if I can't argue then I can't

 

[Ubdon]

Skypiea Zoro has heat resistance up to lightning heat, so I doubt that will do anything

Also while we talk about what on profile and what not

This doesn't look like lightning heat

 

[Ubdon]

And skype zoro page doesn't mention that his abilities are on greater scale from that feat either nor show any other feat

 

[Kachon123]

Also while we talk about what on profile and what not

This doesn't look like lightning heat

This is

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

Also while we talk about what on profile and what not

This doesn't look like lightning heat

It’s accepted what heat levels his resistance scales to

 

[Ubdon]

It’s accepted what heat levels his resistance scales to

so is scan i showed above scale to lightning?

 

[Ubdon]

Cuz currently his page doesn't show this for base nor skype key

This is

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

so is scan i showed above scale to lightning?

This is

Lightning heat is 30 000°C so it's way above (accepted here)

 

[Ubdon]

Why it's not on skype zoro page then

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

Why it's not on skype zoro page then

Because there’s nothing on skypiea saga where Zoro develops a new resistance to heat, that’s probably why

 

[Ubdon]

Because there’s nothing on skypiea saga where Zoro develops a new resistance to heat

well page also doesn't say that any of his abilities on greater scale from feat i shown above either


maybe for ennies lobby cuz it say that all abilities on greater scale now but not here

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

Idk what you saying

 

[MysticBrawler]

After daz bones (he used it instantly when he gain it), then there’s Zoro fighting a flying opponent, meaning he couldn’t use it… then Ohm which he had to fight from a distance because of his range… him vs train, he used it instantly, then Kaku also has ranged attacks and whenever Zoro got serious and went for the kill, he used it as like his second move… then for Kuma 1st round he started with it, the second he start with it again.

He uses it most of the time and especially at the start (that’s 4 instances he started with it)

Ok then I guess I'll change the starting distance to 10 meters then.

Yea it does, no where does it say he targets weak points. Your misunderstanding it and what the ability does

no shit they are the same... You just don't understand it

I'll say it again... Zoro grasps the necessary force, timing and weak point for his blade against an object, all those 3 together is what creates the dura neg when he cuts objects

He is not aiming at a specific weak point/area but making one based on his blade coming into contact with the object

Why would him grasping his target's weakpoint be a part of the information that he obtains when using Breath Of All Things if it wasn't a necessary part of his Durability Negation?

 

[Ubdon]

Idk what you saying

I'm saying his page has no mention of skype zoro being above that flame attack despite that thread for some reason

It just says "All previous abilities plus:"