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Sonic General Discussion Zone Act 1: New Frontiers

In all honesty care bears or smurfs collabing with sonic is a nonissue. Sure it doesnt look sonic look slick but with how rumble looks. I dont mind it at all, many franchises such as mario or even aot has appealed to the younger than 8 audience. Hope this all makes sense.
 
Snek said:
Sonic Question Time: This should be interesting to discuss as I imagine we will all have different takes and preferences for this, so.
What do you want from Sonic's villains in the future and why? This can be broad preferences like wanting them to be portrayed more or less seriously or it can be hyper specific things like a story idea for a certain character that you think would be interesting. So anything really.
Click to expand...
I know I'm super late to this question, but it finally gives me an excuse to be active in this thread after so long.

So to answer this question: as a certified Metal Sonic fan and as a fan of the one shot comic Reflections, I'd just like to see the writers and or SEGA explore more of Metal Sonic's psyche and mentality. Like the comic heavily implies without any dialogue that Metal Sonic knows he isn't the real Sonic and it deeply affects him, but I'd like to see how much it affects him and maybe have a story exploring the themes of being a copy of a pre existing entity.
 
TMaakkonen said:
Ironically Metal is technically one of the most recurring chatacters atm due to his return in 2010s. Too bad he is literally just a boss to beat so he is still nothing lol
Click to expand...
Which is unfortunate because, of all of Eggman's creations and allies throughout the franchise, Metal Sonic has pretty consistently been the closest of Eggman's creations to be Sonic's direct equal and has come close to winning on a few occasions had it not been for ass pull.

It's genuinely wasted potential for whom I consider to be one of the most interesting characters in the franchise.
 
Is there any counter arguments against Master Core: ABIS feat of spinning galaxies and that scaling to the cast in AP and speed? I wasn't able to find anything myself but yk just wanted to make sure in case I missed a really tiny detail somewhere
 
Omegabronic said:
Alo i just realized... this "Earth" like planet we see is BEFORE the final battle with the feat in question... why would it invalidate it at all?
Click to expand...

Because it means negga only had to travel less than 1 AU ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astronomical_unit) to get close enough to the planet to use the cameras hax and transform it into a card? Rather than flying light-years back?
 
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Mephistus said:
Because it means nega only had to travel less than 1 AU ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astronomical_unit) to get close enough to the planet to use the cameras hax and transform it into a card? Rather than flying light-years back?
Click to expand...
I don't think it was ever specified he needed to be close enough to use the Camera's power. Wasn't the most he mentioned was that the giant camera just needed energy from the cards and the camera in order to do such to Earth? Plus Earth, or what we assume might be Earth, was perfectly visible
 
Mephistus said:
Because it means negga only had to travel less than 1 AU ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astronomical_unit) to get close enough to the planet to use the cameras hax and transform it into a card? Rather than flying light-years back?
Click to expand...
... that was always the case, we don't know WHY Nega choose to travel that far, that fast... but he did

The camera might just have good range at that point
 
TheStinkeer said:
I don't think it was ever specified he needed to be close enough to use the Camera's power. Wasn't the most he mentioned was that the giant camera just needed energy from the cards and the camera in order to do such to Earth? Plus Earth, or what we assume might be Earth, was perfectly visible
Click to expand...
Neggas weak plan if the planet already can be visible in the game pov frame window 😂. But yeah if he needed to fly closer regardless it's indicated that's the case.
 
On an unrelated note to everything this is probably the first time I've actually dreaded an issue of IDW before it released with issue #86. That's probably not fair to IDW but with how issue #85 went I feel like getting my concerns off my chest but I'll do it in bullet point format for the sake of brevity (brevity lol I got carried away).

  • Sage will like Belle after being rescued simply because she was "wrong" about her. I've talked about why I don't like how Sage is so incapable in IDW but something I like less is the thought that Sage will be made to "like" Belle by the end of the issue not because of any real character growth from either of them but simply because Belle was more competent than she thought and presumably saves Sage in issue #86. Anyways there are many ways I'd have loved to see Sage and Belle develop a relationship however making the development as shallow as Sage being like "I was wrong about Belles capabilities and she rescued me so let's be adorable together now after only three issues" is a method I dread happening.
  • When Sage goes home and tells Eggman what happened to her Eggman will only be somewhat mad but not actually do anything about it but he will compliment Belle. Basically I'm worried that Sage potentially almost dying after being kidnapped will have no plot relevance. Sage herself will not shift as a character (more than she already has) from such an event besides being forced by the narrative to appreciate Belle. Eggman won't be utterly furious as it looks like he won't turn up in issue #87 based on the covers or synopsis even though Sage nearly being murdered should be an absolutely gargantuan plot point in any sane story with how much Eggman cares for her. And at the end of it all I'm worried Eggman will flippantly compliment Belle which is usually something he'd begrudgingly do if Belle say, only saved Metal Sonic. However it would be massively out of character if he spared the time to compliment Belle but never considered making the mystery villain pay dearly, upgrading Sage to ensure she's never ever put in mortal danger again or uploading Sage to the EggNet to ensure she's basically immortal (he should have done that already but the writers need Sage to be in life threatening danger for "stakes") before the thought of Belle even comes to mind. In other words Eggman should have priorities and I'm worried he will only be slightly mad about the situation and also compliment Belle when he shouldn't which would make him look less caring towards Sage than he should be just to validate Belle as a character more.
  • Sage herself will only play a minor supporting role in solving the problem. I won't elaborate much on this. And for the record I like Belle as a character however issue #85 is the very first time I've felt like Belle has actively robbed the spotlight from another character like a weed and I'm worried that issue #86 will somehow make it worse.
  • Sage being nerfed won't have a reasonable explanation. That or it will have an unsatisfying explanation that keeps Sage so weak that she has almost no niche as a threat to the cast. To keep it short I will be slightly more forgiving of issue #85 in retrospect if they let Sage be powerful in different circumstances but give her an interesting limitation that explains why she couldn't do much in issue #85. For a brief list "Sage can only access her full power when connected to a network like Cyberspace or the EggNet" or "Sage has different powers depending on how she manifests, in a purely physical form she has lasers, barriers and telekinesis but she can be projected differently to instead have intangibility and teleportation so her powerset was essentially split in half after Frontiers" are acceptable and interesting nerfs in different ways (I'm sure you could think of other nerfs that still let Sage be powerful but not busted as well). However what I wouldn't like is them not addressing it or worse simply saying Sage's powers changed after she left the Starfall Islands as the excuse for her being about as dangerous as a puppy now.
Overall: My opinion of the current IDW mini arc will hinge alot on what issue #86 does. And I'm just worried that the story will simply turn into the "Belle validation show" at the expense of Sage in the very arc that introduces her to the comics.
 
TheStinkeer said:
Where's is it indicated? I don't recall seeing any mention of it /genq
Click to expand...
Taking a picture of the Earth in a loose definition is achievable simply doing so in it's general direction wouldn't really matter if it was light years away, the snapshot would just need to be a patch of the sky with all the stars around it rather if he didn't need to have the earth visible in frame and falls apart as a indication of negga just trying to get away from the hogs. Also the camera grabs and stores grouped objects in the photos.

Kinda being hung up on the details here anyway, the rocket was being a catalyst for the energy to use it, the main point made is the proximity of the planet to start with.
 
Mephistus said:
Taking a picture of the Earth in a loose definition is achievable simply doing so in it's general direction wouldn't really matter if it was light years away, the snapshot would just need to be a patch of the sky with all the stars around it rather if he didn't need to have the earth visible in frame and falls apart as a indication of negga just trying to get away from the hogs. Also the camera grabs and stores grouped objects in the photos.

Kinda being hung up on the details here anyway, the rocket was being a catalyst for the energy to use it, the main point made is the proximity of the planet to start with.
Click to expand...
He could have just been trying to shake off the critters going after him, then he would be able to come back and just do it with no interference
 
It's late, so I won't look for the scan. Didn't the last chapter of IDW mention something about it taking a lot of energy to overdrive Metal Sonic's personality? That would imply he has some kind of resistance, right?
 
Omegabronic said:
He could have just been trying to shake off the critters going after him, then he would be able to come back and just do it with no interference
Click to expand...
I used to somewhat think this but the stage is under a time limit, granted we don't have footage of what exactly happens when time runs out but eh
 
Last edited:
So I wanted to do an arbitrary list of main character usage that are in CrossWorlds that are used in "mainline" games. With the caveat of my arbitrary list of mainline games being:
  • Sonic1
  • S2
  • S3&K
  • CD
  • Adventure1
  • Adventure2
  • Heroes
  • 2006
  • Unleashed
  • Colors
  • Generations
  • LostWorld
  • Mania
  • Forces
  • Frontiers
  • Superstars
  • ShadowGenerations

I put major usage as to having a role in story, voiced appearance, multiplayer extra and even allowed some updated game extra content as well. I didnt count ColorsDS tho ig, sorry maybe.

So with 17 games, how much has important characters appeared?:
  • 17: Sonic
  • 16: Eggman, Tails
  • 15: Amy
  • 14: Knuckles
  • 10: Metal
  • 6: Shadow, Rouge
  • 5: Egg Pawn
  • 4: Big, Omega
  • 3: Chaotix, Silver
  • 2: Cream, Blaze, Zavok
  • 1: Zazz, Sage
Yeah, funky results. Origins and some ports helped Tails, Knux, Amy and Metal immensely. The usage between Knux, Metal and Shadow/Rouge is kinda wild. They really just snubbed character usage for modern cast after 06. There are like 7 games with no proper main character usage, not helped by 2 Classic era games banning modern stuff. But Unleashed, main Colors, LW, Frontiers and even Shadow Gens limit roster a lot.

Sonic's shitty friends really did hurt brand huh lol

Honestly curious, were some other games ever said to be mainline? I mostly just use SonicTeam's big ones and couple extras with Mania and SS. ShadowGens also feels to be treated more importantly than his own game, which is sth. Its this weird thing where Advance Trilogy, Rush games and 4 are kinda ignored nowadays.
 
TMaakkonen said:
So I wanted to do an arbitrary list of main character usage that are in CrossWorlds that are used in "mainline" games. With the caveat of my arbitrary list of mainline games being:
  • Sonic1
  • S2
  • S3&K
  • CD
  • Adventure1
  • Adventure2
  • Heroes
  • 2006
  • Unleashed
  • Colors
  • Generations
  • LostWorld
  • Mania
  • Forces
  • Frontiers
  • Superstars
  • ShadowGenerations

I put major usage as to having a role in story, voiced appearance, multiplayer extra and even allowed some updated game extra content as well. I didnt count ColorsDS tho ig, sorry maybe.

So with 17 games, how much has important characters appeared?:
  • 17: Sonic
  • 16: Eggman, Tails
  • 15: Amy
  • 14: Knuckles
  • 10: Metal
  • 6: Shadow, Rouge
  • 5: Egg Pawn
  • 4: Big, Omega
  • 3: Chaotix, Silver
  • 2: Cream, Blaze, Zavok
  • 1: Zazz, Sage
Yeah, funky results. Origins and some ports helped Tails, Knux, Amy and Metal immensely. The usage between Knux, Metal and Shadow/Rouge is kinda wild. They really just snubbed character usage for modern cast after 06. There are like 7 games with no proper main character usage, not helped by 2 Classic era games banning modern stuff. But Unleashed, main Colors, LW, Frontiers and even Shadow Gens limit roster a lot.

Sonic's shitty friends really did hurt brand huh lol

Honestly curious, were some other games ever said to be mainline? I mostly just use SonicTeam's big ones and couple extras with Mania and SS. ShadowGens also feels to be treated more importantly than his own game, which is sth. Its this weird thing where Advance Trilogy, Rush games and 4 are kinda ignored nowadays.
Click to expand...
The implication that Big is more relevant than the Deadly Six is funny to me...
 
TheStinkeer said:
Is there any counter arguments against Master Core: ABIS feat of spinning galaxies and that scaling to the cast in AP and speed? I wasn't able to find anything myself but yk just wanted to make sure in case I missed a really tiny detail somewhere
Click to expand...
I can think of some points someone could bring up. "The stage is spinning", Abis lifting the characters shows the stage as still. "The galaxies are outside the black hole", they spin and move rapidly even when we sit still and they aren't tinted purple. Earth is both tinted and motionless when we don't move. "The black hole pulled them in and ABIS didn't make them", I think this requires Sonic's Earth as being denser than a galaxy for one to get pulled in from light years away without Earth being moved. Tails is also worried about Earth getting pulled in and the game gives you a time limit, which makes more sense if ABIS made the galaxies instead of pulling them in.
 
The characters also had to fly through the black hole to what I think is the center, with Babylon Garden. So, they had to somehow not get yanked off of their air boards in the galaxy spinning field.
 
MysticMania said:
"The stage is spinning", Abis lifting the characters shows the stage as still.
Click to expand...
Also when some things move slower than others, which wouldn't work if it was just the stage spinning. This has a very still view (volume warning)

But yeah I had those same thoughts in mind, minus points about the Earth. I was just thinking there was a tiny detail in some other part of the game that messes everything up
 
Question: if a character (somehow) does NOT have a future, making them immune to both Precog and Fate Manip, what kind of hax would they have?



I'd like to think Sonic is too chaotic by nature to have a future. Only the present exists for him... the "here and now".
 
TMaakkonen said:
So I wanted to do an arbitrary list of main character usage that are in CrossWorlds that are used in "mainline" games. With the caveat of my arbitrary list of mainline games being:
  • Sonic1
  • S2
  • S3&K
  • CD
  • Adventure1
  • Adventure2
  • Heroes
  • 2006
  • Unleashed
  • Colors
  • Generations
  • LostWorld
  • Mania
  • Forces
  • Frontiers
  • Superstars
  • ShadowGenerations

I put major usage as to having a role in story, voiced appearance, multiplayer extra and even allowed some updated game extra content as well. I didnt count ColorsDS tho ig, sorry maybe.

So with 17 games, how much has important characters appeared?:
  • 17: Sonic
  • 16: Eggman, Tails
  • 15: Amy
  • 14: Knuckles
  • 10: Metal
  • 6: Shadow, Rouge
  • 5: Egg Pawn
  • 4: Big, Omega
  • 3: Chaotix, Silver
  • 2: Cream, Blaze, Zavok
  • 1: Zazz, Sage
Yeah, funky results. Origins and some ports helped Tails, Knux, Amy and Metal immensely. The usage between Knux, Metal and Shadow/Rouge is kinda wild. They really just snubbed character usage for modern cast after 06. There are like 7 games with no proper main character usage, not helped by 2 Classic era games banning modern stuff. But Unleashed, main Colors, LW, Frontiers and even Shadow Gens limit roster a lot.

Sonic's shitty friends really did hurt brand huh lol

Honestly curious, were some other games ever said to be mainline? I mostly just use SonicTeam's big ones and couple extras with Mania and SS. ShadowGens also feels to be treated more importantly than his own game, which is sth. Its this weird thing where Advance Trilogy, Rush games and 4 are kinda ignored nowadays.
Click to expand...
The poster characters have appeared in more mainline games than I expected. That "Sonic's shitty friends" rhetoric fr did some damage
 
My only hope for this DE is that they fix the horrendous pop in that's plagued Frontiers since it came out in 2022 (god, has it already been four years since then? That's crazy). Like Sonic Frontiers has its fair share of problems, but the pop in was my biggest problem by far since it constantly ruined the immersion and atmosphere of the game.
 
The_Unknown_Warrior1 said:
My only hope for this DE is that they fix the horrendous pop in that's plagued Frontiers since it came out in 2022 (god, has it already been four years since then? That's crazy). Like Sonic Frontiers has its fair share of problems, but the pop in was my biggest problem by far since it constantly ruined the immersion and atmosphere of the game.
Click to expand...
Not really Sonic-related, but I’ve been replaying both Pokémon Scarlet and Pokémon Sword for the first time since either of them released and I get what you mean. Scarlet’s Switch 2 addition did wonders for the game’s frame rate, but all the other jank including the pop-in thing has been pretty noticeable. Sword on the other hand doesn’t really have that kind of jank and looks very presentable.

Visual jank has never bothered me that much in games and it still doesn’t, but after directly comparing Scarlet to Sword I now get why it bothers other people so much.
 
While I'm not particularly a fan of Frontiers' story, at least in execution, my only hope for DE is that they don't rewrite anything like with SXSG. That's the main reason I don't want any remasters of Sonic games nowadays
 
TheStinkeer said:
While I'm not particularly a fan of Frontiers' story, at least in execution, my only hope for DE is that they don't rewrite anything like with SXSG. That's the main reason I don't want any remasters of Sonic games nowadays
Click to expand...
I'm just hoping that timed parrying is a setting you can toggle on or off because going against Wyvern with a timed parry in the master king trial felt spectacular when I started to get the hang of it and that would be great for the rest of the game (a non timed parry is too easy anyways). Oh and maybe new moves for the Titans as I hear some of their attacks didn't make it to the finished game but people have restored them with mods before. Tails, Knuckles and Amy being playable on other islands in the post game would be great too.
 
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