Vladimir Makarov (OG) vs L Lawliet (8-0-0)

[VladimirMakarov317]

Basically L will be taking the main casts position at the start of the second modern warfare game to find Makarov as being the one responsible for nuking the US military in the first game and killing thousands. L's winning condition is successfully capturing Vladimir in custody before he causes WW3, can he do it or will he fail like Price?

Vladmir Makarov: @Mr. Bambu, @Doggo, @DemonicDude, @Pyro9278, @VladimirMakarov317, @Shadowslash125, @Thermor, @AppleMaker
L Lawliet:
Neutral:

 

[Doggo]

I've only played a handful of COD games so im rather unfamiliar with Makorov here

 

[VladimirMakarov317]

I've only played a handful of COD games so im rather unfamiliar with Makorov here

You only need to know the OG MW2 and MW3 Cod regarding Makarov but I'll drop some feats from Makarov (simple version)

-Rose to power from a grunt, to a leader of his own organization
-Destroyed the entire combined forces of US army which led to the deaths of over 30k armed personal
-Responsible for the largest human trafficking and genocide in the world including capturing and killing multiple global agencies such as Israel's Mossad agents

-Did the infamous "No Russian", killing all civilians while using USA weapons and bullets so he can instigate a war between USA and the Russian government, even managed to kill the CIA agent that was undercover during the mission and use it to further instigate the Russian government that the American government is responsible for the terrorism. The CIA agency even admits that Makarov is always one step ahead of them
-Successfully made Russia to secretly ambush USA and make a landing in their mainland soil, bypassing their radar detections and even taking over Washington DC. Captain Price and his team had to steal a nuke just to stop Russia from completely conquering USA
-Killed Captain Price's elite soldiers, Ghost and Roach, by influencing USA's top general, Shepherd, to betray them
-While both the British and French agency knew that Makarov was sending chemical gas bombs to London via intercepting messages, they still fail to prevent the attack as Makarov used a decoy truck which led to the deaths of countless people
-Officially started WW3 after weakening all of Europe by using chemical gas attacks which led to the Russian army successfully invading most of it and even reaching Paris
-Successfully hijack the Russian President's plane and kidnapped him and his daughter so the war continues until Russia conquers all of Europe
-Able to make Captain Price and his entire team to be on the top wanted list by all global nations including the American government
-Able to ambush Captain Price and his team, predicted they will be arriving to his location, even killing another elite soldier such as Soap and made Price distrust his own friend
-Able to fight Captain Price and his elite soldier at the same time despite injured from the helicopter crash, same Price that was able to take down General Shepherd and his entire army by himself and Soap

 

[Doggo]

You only need to know the OG MW2 and MW3 Cod regarding Makarov but I'll drop some feats from Makarov (simple version)

-Rose to power from a grunt, to a leader of his own organization
-Destroyed the entire combined forces of US army which led to the deaths of over 30k armed personal
-Responsible for the largest human trafficking and genocide in the world including capturing and killing multiple global agencies such as Israel's Mossad agents

-Did the infamous "No Russian", killing all civilians while using USA weapons and bullets so he can instigate a war between USA and the Russian government, even managed to kill the CIA agent that was undercover during the mission and use it to further instigate the Russian government that the American government is responsible for the terrorism. The CIA agency even admits that Makarov is always one step ahead of them
-Successfully made Russia to secretly ambush USA and make a landing in their mainland soil, bypassing their radar detections and even taking over Washington DC. Captain Price and his team had to steal a nuke just to stop Russia from completely conquering USA
-Killed Captain Price's elite soldiers, Ghost and Roach, by influencing USA's top general, Shepherd, to betray them
-While both the British and French agency knew that Makarov was sending chemical gas bombs to London via intercepting messages, they still fail to prevent the attack as Makarov used a decoy truck which led to the deaths of countless people
-Officially started WW3 after weakening all of Europe by using chemical gas attacks which led to the Russian army successfully invading most of it and even reaching Paris
-Successfully hijack the Russian President's plane and kidnapped him and his daughter so the war continues until Russia conquers all of Europe
-Able to make Captain Price and his entire team to be on the top wanted list by all global nations including the American government
-Able to ambush Captain Price and his team, predicted they will be arriving to his location, even killing another elite soldier such as Soap and made Price distrust his own friend
-Able to fight Captain Price and his elite soldier at the same time despite injured from the helicopter crash, same Price that was able to take down General Shepherd and his entire army by himself and Soap

Wow, those are some great long-term planning and manipulation feats

He probably beats L in those categories.

Can you give me a detailed explanation of Makarov's overarching plan? And also, what are some potential leads L could use to catch him? How hard is it to catch Makarov (as in details of how hard he is to reach, find, or capture)?

I'm also assuming L has his entire resources and connections in this scenario.

 

[VladimirMakarov317]

Wow, those are some great long-term planning and manipulation feats

He probably beats L in those categories.

Can you give me a detailed explanation of Makarov's overarching plan? And also, what are some potential leads L could use to catch him? How hard is it to catch Makarov (as in details of how hard he is to reach, find, or capture)?

I'm also assuming L has his entire resources and connections in this scenario.

Makarov's plan is basically wanting Russia to conquer Europe, even if it's under a pile of ashes, not sure if I can be more detailed rn, you can check the feats I sent as they are chronological. L has leads from the newspapers as Makarov made himself public for causing the nuking of the entire US army. Here if you want his list of crimes

Makarov is hard to catch as:
-He has an entire army of his own that has very modern weapons and equipments including tanks, helicopters and jets. Even made connections with other terrorist groups in South America, Africa and Middle East
-Outsmarted entire global agencies such as CIA, M16, Mossad, SVR, etc
-He secretly has influence over US top General and would make him betray anyone who got to close to the truth
-Has multiple bases and always in the move switching places across entire continents
-His skill is relative to Captain Price and Yuri, who both considered to be the most dangerous as took down entire armies such Americans and Russians

 

[VladimirMakarov317]

Wow, those are some great long-term planning and manipulation feats

He probably beats L in those categories.

Can you give me a detailed explanation of Makarov's overarching plan? And also, what are some potential leads L could use to catch him? How hard is it to catch Makarov (as in details of how hard he is to reach, find, or capture)?

I'm also assuming L has his entire resources and connections in this scenario.

Are there other DN supporters btw?

 

[Mr. Bambu]

this is such a bizarre match that I find it difficult to even consider

Makarov's reach and resources far outweigh L's, acknowledging that L's are not exactly miniscule, either. L is far, far, far more intelligent than anyone who faced Makarov previously, though he lacks any really relevant combat ability (since he does martial arts and shit, and Makarov has armies of dudes with automatic machine guns). I guess my opinion broadly would be that, L could easily figure out how to maneuver to apprehend Makarov, but would lack the ability to actually do so, barring some weird confluence of fate that left Makarov a lot more vulnerable than he ever was in Modern Warfare. L himself is a shitload more capable than Makarov but just does not have the ability to force his capture, personally or via influence.

...now, if it was L and Captain Price...

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

I agree with Bambu on this. L is vastly more capable than a majority of singular individuals in the original Modern Warfare trilogy but he can't quite take out Makarov by himself just because of the insane amount of shit the dude has up his sleeve and because he's fairly intelligent.

 

[LegendariumOfLies]

Assuming this takes place in the COD Verse, L easily tracks down Makarov and sends in Price to sweep.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Assuming this takes place in the COD Verse, L easily tracks down Makarov and sends in Price to sweep.

Implicitly, I don't think L has Price. I think the OP suggests that L replaces the main cast of Modern Warfare. I'm sure he can get access to raw manpower, convince some governments to lend some, but the governments of the Modern Warfare series were pretty ******* powerless on their own, and he lacks Price and his team.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Implicitly, I don't think L has Price. I think the OP suggests that L replaces the main cast of Modern Warfare. I'm sure he can get access to raw manpower, convince some governments to lend some, but the governments of the Modern Warfare series were pretty ******* powerless on their own, and he lacks Price and his team.

Maybe he can get his hands on someone like Frost? He's pretty good for a regular on the ground soldier as he put in hella work in MW3 on the American side of things.

 

[LegendariumOfLies]

Implicitly, I don't think L has Price. I think the OP suggests that L replaces the main cast of Modern Warfare. I'm sure he can get access to raw manpower, convince some governments to lend some, but the governments of the Modern Warfare series were pretty ******* powerless on their own, and he lacks Price and his team.

If that is the case, L is kinda ****** TF 141 was internationally the best of the best of Spec Ops, so average soldiers aren't gonna cut it unless OP specifies L isn't held back by laws and moral conduct like he was in Death Note. In that case, I can see L just bumrushing Makarov with meatwaves to win

 

[Vzearr]

Implicitly, I don't think L has Price. I think the OP suggests that L replaces the main cast of Modern Warfare. I'm sure he can get access to raw manpower, convince some governments to lend some, but the governments of the Modern Warfare series were pretty ******* powerless on their own, and he lacks Price and his team.

L just outsmarts.

I've got a few docs for L. If need be I'll use them.

L gathered the global attention of the police force, it was a large criminal case, him being so well known, he'd likely be able to gather global attention for somebody as destructive as Makarov, who commits mass genocide. Destroying the US army is one thing, destroying an ALMOST global army is something different.

I don't think L could even be found if need be. Makarov wouldn't be able to find him therefore unable to kill him, L would have a time advantage. Just like how he deduced Kira was in Japan, and not somewhere in the entire world, he'd deduce Makarov's location, and just like how he found Kira amongst 8 billion, there is no way he couldn't find Makarov.

 

[VladimirMakarov317]

L just outsmarts.

I've got a few docs for L. If need be I'll use them.

L gathered the global attention of the police force, it was a large criminal case, him being so well known, he'd likely be able to gather global attention for somebody as destructive as Makarov, who commits mass genocide. Destroying the US army is one thing, destroying an ALMOST global army is something different.

I don't think L could even be found if need be. Makarov wouldn't be able to find him therefore unable to kill him, L would have a time advantage. Just like how he deduced Kira was in Japan, and not somewhere in the entire world, he'd deduce Makarov's location, and just like how he found Kira amongst 8 billion, there is no way he couldn't find Makarov.

The problem is gonna be Shepherd who controls the entire US military and would cover up everything and kills anyone who got too close to the truth so he and Vladmir can start WW3. Police Force is one thing but the global military? Both Russia and USA are on edge against each other which Vladimir just instigating further

 

[Vzearr]

The problem is gonna be Shepherd who controls the entire US military and would cover up everything and kills anyone who got too close to the truth so he and Vladmir can start WW3. Police Force is one thing but the global military? Both Russia and USA are on edge against each other which Vladimir just instigating further

L would deduce Shepherd controlling the US military, and figure out a way to kill him. Intelligence diff.

 

[VladimirMakarov317]

L would deduce Shepherd controlling the US military, and figure out a way to kill him. Intelligence diff.

Shepherd has his shadow company protecting him at all times and he's the most respectable General so anyone who dares to kill him, will be branded as world's most wanted criminal, just like Price and his team. Not only that, Shepherd was able to kill Price if it weren't for Soap, and you know Price can took entire armies by himself

 

[Mr. Bambu]

L just outsmarts.

I've got a few docs for L. If need be I'll use them.

L gathered the global attention of the police force, it was a large criminal case, him being so well known, he'd likely be able to gather global attention for somebody as destructive as Makarov, who commits mass genocide. Destroying the US army is one thing, destroying an ALMOST global army is something different.

I don't think L could even be found if need be. Makarov wouldn't be able to find him therefore unable to kill him, L would have a time advantage. Just like how he deduced Kira was in Japan, and not somewhere in the entire world, he'd deduce Makarov's location, and just like how he found Kira amongst 8 billion, there is no way he couldn't find Makarov.

I'm not positing that L doesn't outsmart. I'm positing that Makarov outresources to such an insane degree that L will know very well how much of a bad spot he's in.

L's resources depend on results. For government resources, he has to cater to the government and deliver-- such that when he started faltering, the Japanese government just abandoned him. He's extremely capable, though the world governments will need to see his efficacy immediately to continue extending to him any resources, and that means errors will probably be punished with finding other options. He's not exactly got the reputation for military operations, either.

I do agree Makarov would face some difficulty in finding L, he's one of the most obscured individuals available for a hypothetical match like this, but I contend that finding Makarov is not the issue. It is successfully neutralizing Makarov. Makarov, on the other hand, would have no difficulty neutralizing L, should he find him, and of the two, I think it is easier to find L than neutralize Makarov.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

L would deduce Shepherd controlling the US military, and figure out a way to kill him. Intelligence diff.

I do think this one is probably true, though. Whatever Makarov's fate, I cannot foresee an eventuality where Shepherd doesn't get ****** in the crossfire. There's no chance L doesn't smell that dude out.

 

[VladimirMakarov317]

I do think this one is probably true, though. Whatever Makarov's fate, I cannot foresee an eventuality where Shepherd doesn't get ****** in the crossfire. There's no chance L doesn't smell that dude out.

Captain Price doesn't trust Shepherd from the beginning so L could do the same but main problem, could L gather evidence to convict him? We know both Ghost and Roach got killed for it and got their bodies burned to cover it up. We know Price and his team are reputable special forces but Shepherd could flip the narrative and make them as the top wanted list criminals, not impossible that he could do the same to L's reputation

 

[Mr. Bambu]

L could absolutely prove that guy was a traitor, I don't even think it would be difficult. He is not so distant and difficult to access for L. My stance is that L intelligence-mogs literally 100% of all characters in the Modern Warfare pantheon with such a huge divide that it is so impossible that Shepherd escapes. That dude is toast, long before L is probably killed by Makarov via some hacked ICBM or something.

 

[VladimirMakarov317]

L could absolutely prove that guy was a traitor, I don't even think it would be difficult. He is not so distant and difficult to access for L.

Hm so do you vote for Makarov or L?

 

[Doggo]

L just outsmarts.

I've got a few docs for L. If need be I'll use them.

L gathered the global attention of the police force, it was a large criminal case, him being so well known, he'd likely be able to gather global attention for somebody as destructive as Makarov, who commits mass genocide. Destroying the US army is one thing, destroying an ALMOST global army is something different.

I don't think L could even be found if need be. Makarov wouldn't be able to find him therefore unable to kill him, L would have a time advantage. Just like how he deduced Kira was in Japan, and not somewhere in the entire world, he'd deduce Makarov's location, and just like how he found Kira amongst 8 billion, there is no way he couldn't find Makarov.

Outsmarting is one thing, but having the actual resources and influence to capture the guy is different

Also, L's influence with law enforcement is not as good as you make it out to be. The NPA and FBI pretty much quit the Kira case early on, despite Kira being a worldwide serial killer. Never mind the fact that Makarov also has connections with those same law enforcement, meaning he can plant spies to steal L's intel, and use that to plan ahead of him or sabotage.

L organizing the entire globe seems unrealistic and still ineffective when you realize Makarov not only has Russia under him (which realistically includes its international allies like China and North Korea), but also the US general under his thumb, and various terrorist groups under him. If anything, L instantly fails because organizing the globe like that would kickstart WW3, aka Makarov's wincon in OP's conditions. Remember, his goal here is to stop WW3, bringing the entire globe against a guy who has 3 superpowers directly (Russia) or indirectly (America and China) under him, is GONNA gonna make Makarov's plan easier.

Why would Makrov need to find L when his wincon is to start WW3? If anything, Makarov has the advantage here if he simply stalls long enough for WW3 to beigin. L is the one with the time disadvantage here

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Hm so do you vote for Makarov or L?

Right now, Makarov.

Also, L's influence with law enforcement is not as good as you make it out to be. The NPA and FBI pretty much quit the Kira case early on, despite Kira being a worldwide serial killer. Never mind the fact that Makarov also has connections with those same law enforcement, meaning he can plant spies to steal L's intel, and use that to plan ahead of him or sabotage.

L organizing the entire globe seems unrealistic and still ineffective when you realize Makarov not only has Russia under him (which realistically includes its international allies like China and North Korea), but also the US general under his thumb, and various terrorist groups under him. If anything, L instantly fails because organizing the globe like that would kickstart WW3, aka Makarov's wincon in OP's conditions. Remember, his goal here is to stop WW3, bringing the entire globe against a guy who has 3 superpowers directly (Russia) or indirectly (America and China) under him, is GONNA gonna make Makarov's plan easier.

Why would Makrov need to find L when his wincon is to start WW3? If anything, Makarov has the advantage here if he simply stalls long enough for WW3 to beigin. L is the one with the time disadvantage here

I will say that, I do think L's influence would hold better against a mundane threat. Against Kira, people were essentially shadowboxing and being killed at random. A more corporeal threat probably makes L's abilities a lot better, and a lot of those nations inevitably will swing sides. And, it is in Makarov's best interest to find and kill L, whether it is necessary or not, because L is certainly a tangible and unpredictable threat.

Makarov probably wins and probably kills L, but I don't think L is so helpless.

 

[Doggo]

Right now, Makarov.


I will say that, I do think L's influence would hold better against a mundane threat. Against Kira, people were essentially shadowboxing and being killed at random. A more corporeal threat probably makes L's abilities a lot better, and a lot of those nations inevitably will swing sides. And, it is in Makarov's best interest to find and kill L, whether it is necessary or not, because L is certainly a tangible and unpredictable threat.

Makarov probably wins and probably kills L, but I don't think L is so helpless.

I'm simply saying L's global connections aren't as good as the guy is implying. The fact that Makarov could influence the FBI and CIA makes things rougher for L since he has to make sure his plans don't get sabotaged or none of his intel is leaked to Makarov. Heck Makarov could exert his influence to sow distrust within L's allies, similar to what Light did.


Currently also voting for Makarov.

 

[DemonicDude]

Wouldn't L need extended prepration/time for outsmarting ?
like for instance he quite in advanced prepare himself to test light as a detective.


He also worked with several detectives to come up with a plan of using a dummy in death note 2 to get Light's attention on tv. (which again is prepration feat)

Without prep time, i doubt his martial arts alone can takedown Marakov based off of his military combat skills



I'm voting Marakov who based off of the scans have better combat moves and would work faster on the fly during their battle while L would need prep time to pull of more of his insane plans.

 

[Doggo]

Wouldn't L need extended prepration/time for outsmarting ?
like for instance he quite in advanced prepare himself to test light as a detective.


He also worked with several detectives to come up with a plan of using a dummy in death note 2 to get Light's attention on tv. (which again is prepration feat)

Without prep time, i doubt his martial arts alone can takedown Marakov based off of his military combat skills



I'm voting Marakov who based off of the scans have better combat moves and would work faster on the fly during their battle while L would need prep time to pull of more of his insane plans.

Sorry but I fail to see your point here. Given this is a intelligience based fight, prep time is already in the table. Heck Makarov's wincon (starting WW3) requires prep time. If anything, he needs it more than L due to how grand his plan is. Every plan, deduction, and manipulation requires prep. Both sides inherently have this due to the nature of fight. Makarov also needs prep here to disrupt L's plans to catch him.

Also combat has nothing to do here when L is gonna have others do the fighting for him. So Makarov being a better fighter is a mute point. Nevermind the fact Makarov is gonna have a hard time catching L too.

 

[Doggo]

Captain Price doesn't trust Shepherd from the beginning so L could do the same but main problem, could L gather evidence to convict him? We know both Ghost and Roach got killed for it and got their bodies burned to cover it up. We know Price and his team are reputable special forces but Shepherd could flip the narrative and make them as the top wanted list criminals, not impossible that he could do the same to L's reputation

Actually, L is the type of guy to deadass hold him in prison without evidence and a trial. Look at Misa, she was illegally held and even tortured by L, who merely suspected her as the 2nd Kira. If L identifies him as a potential lead, he is just gonna sweet talk the president and have them secretly capture and interrogate Shephard.

But I kust ask, how damning is this gonna be for Makarov if L catches Sherpard? Like how does this affect his plan or L's chances of catching him

As for the whole narrative thing. Uhh.....I know its non-canon but L faced the exact same scenario in the Change the World Novel. He had the entire UN on his ass, yet he somehow turned things around by stating "L" is a group, not a person. Therefore the "L" the went "rouge", is simply a member who became radicalized. This made the "other Ls" innocent

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Wouldn't L need extended prepration/time for outsmarting ?
like for instance he quite in advanced prepare himself to test light as a detective.


He also worked with several detectives to come up with a plan of using a dummy in death note 2 to get Light's attention on tv. (which again is prepration feat)

Without prep time, i doubt his martial arts alone can takedown Marakov based off of his military combat skills



I'm voting Marakov who based off of the scans have better combat moves and would work faster on the fly during their battle while L would need prep time to pull of more of his insane plans.

Yeah both sides require prep time. Makarov can't exactly mobilize his forces with nothing. Of the two of them, L requires a lot less. It's not like L is a moron without prep time, he remains absurdly intelligent, he just can't pull stunts like the TV thing to test his ideas.

Actually, L is the type of guy to deadass hold him in prison without evidence and a trial. Look at Misa, she was illegally held and even tortured by L, who merely suspected her as the 2nd Kira. If L identifies him as a potential lead, he is just gonna sweet talk the president and have them secretly capture and interrogate Shephard.

But I kust ask, how damning is this gonna be for Makarov if L catches Sherpard? Like how does this affect his plan or L's chances of catching him

As for the whole narrative thing. Uhh.....I know its non-canon but L faced the exact same scenario in the Change the World Novel. He had the entire UN on his ass, yet he somehow turned things around by stating "L" is a group, not a person. Therefore the "L" the went "rouge", is simply a member who became radicalized. This made the "other Ls" innocent

As far as I am aware, Makarov remains operational with or without Shepard, he just loses a high value asset and a lot of influence on the inside of US operations. Which sucks, but probably won't prevent WW3.

 

[Doggo]

As far as I am aware, Makarov remains operational with or without Shepard, he just loses a high value asset and a lot of influence on the inside of US operations. Which sucks, but probably won't prevent WW3.

This is actually big


Like, I guess L does not need to worry about internal sabotage or intel leakage that much.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Makarov will definitely still have options in that regard. Perhaps not as high access or all-covering but L's networks will definitely not be absolutely secure.

 

[DemonicDude]

Bambu agreeing with me yay

 

[VladimirMakarov317]

Maybe he can get his hands on someone like Frost? He's pretty good for a regular on the ground soldier as he put in hella work in MW3 on the American side of things.

If that is the case, L is kinda ****** TF 141 was internationally the best of the best of Spec Ops, so average soldiers aren't gonna cut it unless OP specifies L isn't held back by laws and moral conduct like he was in Death Note. In that case, I can see L just bumrushing Makarov with meatwaves to win

L would deduce Shepherd controlling the US military, and figure out a way to kill him. Intelligence diff.

You guys gonna vote?

 

[Pyro9278]

Makarov FRA

 

[Doggo]

fudge pit L against the Front Man or Kramer or something

I need my boy to get those juicy Dubs

 

[VladimirMakarov317]

fudge pit L against the Front Man or Kramer or something

I need my boy to get those juicy Dubs

I could make him fight Raul Menendez after this. He's only gifted in intelligence but should still pose a challenge

 

[Shadowslash125]

Makky FRA

 

[Thermor]

Vlad fra.

 

[VladimirMakarov317]

Alright it's grace I believe

 

[AppleMaker]

Vlad FRA

 

[DemonicDude]

I could make him fight Raul Menendez after this. He's only gifted in intelligence but should still pose a challenge

My Goat

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Niko_Bellic