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Devil May Cry: Low 1-C

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Mbpoops said:
So basically, the human and demon worlds are equal infinities separated by a dimensional barrier? If thats the case then the demon world would still be 4D right?
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There is no equal infinity. Human world is just a nuisance into Demon World and was removed, that's it.
 
BestMGQScalerEver said:
Can we not use the ray of light statement as any sort of indicator of significance please? We've been through this so many times it deserves a discussion rule barring its usage. I don't get how people wont let go of a statement thats so clearly flowery and a way to say the world was split into two in a sort of dichotomous relationship rather than a real size difference of infinity.
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The Cosmology blog @SuperSonicTL linked in his first comment debunks this notion as there are multiple space times within the DW. So splitting in two is a bit of a misnomer here. Kindly reread the blog again. Additionally, what evidence exists supporting flowery language that inaccurately represents the realities of the DW and HW?
 
GilverTheProtoAngelo said:
Other way around actually. Just because something is flowery doesn't mean it's useless. Our Tier 0 explanations literally uses poems lol. Let's not go there.
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Still it's not even a size difference. We've been through this crap so many god damn times. Only for it to be removed and repeatedly rejected because staff decidedly critically analyze the scan and context surrounding it rather than succumbing to powerscaler brainrot.
Mbpoops said:
So basically, the human and demon worlds are equal infinities separated by a dimensional barrier? If thats the case then the demon world would still be 4D right?
Click to expand...
Maybe the demon world could be higher tiered (I don't think it's beyond 4-D imo) due to other contexts that are in no way related to that ray of light statements. With that ray of light statement it'd be silly to think the writer was taking the powerscaler approach of taking every single aspect of the cosmology into account in different contexts and using that to mean that what they wrote in manga is a size comparison of infinite degree. So I don't even think it counts as support even if there is other stuff in cosmology that might potentially be higher.
 
BestMGQScalerEver said:
Still it's not even a size difference. We've been through this crap so many god damn times. Only for it to be removed and repeatedly rejected because staff decidedly critically analyze the scan and context surrounding it rather than succumbing to powerscaler brainrot.

Maybe the demon world could be higher tiered (I don't think it's beyond 4-D imo) due to other contexts that are in no way related to that ray of light statements. With that ray of light statement it'd be silly to think the writer was taking the powerscaler approach of taking every single aspect of the cosmology into account in different contexts and using that to mean that what they wrote in manga is a size comparison of infinite degree. So I don't even think it counts as support even if there is other stuff in cosmology that might potentially be higher.
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Provide evidence that the writer was being figurative or inaccurate or fold? Simply saying it's figurative and providing zero evidence of this point won't achieve your goal you know? That earns you a Hitchens Razor.
 
BestMGQScalerEver said:
Still it's not even a size difference. We've been through this crap so many god damn times. Only for it to be removed and repeatedly rejected because staff decidedly critically analyze the scan and context surrounding it rather than succumbing to powerscaler brainrot.
Click to expand...
Misinformation and Mandela Effect. The size angle has been settled long before in the PoC days. I made those upgrades so I know the result. PoC debacle happend and shit that got capped. The manga was never one of those casualties. People just like to keep regurgitating same puke and pretend and propagate as if it never got passed. Which has continued it's infamy.
 
Unoriginal777 said:
Provide evidence that the writer was being figurative or inaccurate or fold? Simply saying it's figurative and providing zero evidence of this point won't achieve your goal you know? That earns you a Hitchens Razor.
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Hope you know this way of debating makes you look kinda silly. Not even trying to insult you. I just don't get it. Hence why I originally gave the nerd emoji.
 
BestMGQScalerEver said:
Hope you know this way of debating makes you look kinda silly. Not even trying to insult you. I just don't get it. Hence why I originally gave the nerd emoji.
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(the point is I don't need to give scans for absolutely every single argument especially when I'm arguing around the scans and using inductive reasoning so do you expect me to have a weird impossible meta-scan for every argument around the scan I make)
 
BestMGQScalerEver said:
Hope you know this way of debating makes you look kinda silly. Not even trying to insult you. I just don't get it. Hence why I originally gave the nerd emoji.
Click to expand...
The fact that you do not provide evidence and only make blind claims and inflammatory provocations says plenty. Fallacies exist for a reason you know? No need for me to speak to you further.
 
Random-Helper323 said:
Honestly, according to the FAQ, at least as I'm reading it, the Demon World seems to qualify for this, given that:

1. It's stated that a 5-D structure containing space-time continuums as small parts of itself qualifies. (Demon World contains several structures with their own space-time continuum as tiny parts, and these structures can only be accessed via portals)

2. It's stated that the space containing or between such structures would be 5-D but of an unknown size by default.

3. That space between or around is the main Demon World which is repeatedly stated to be infinite.

Unless there's something I'm misunderstanding, this seems to qualify for 5-D Low 1-C under the FAQ.
Click to expand...
I guess this makes sense?
 

Summary Time​

The argument relies on two specific FAQs in which both require demonstrating that the Demon World is a continuous, uncountable, infinite higher-dimensional object relative to the 4-dimensional universes it contains. This includes the Human World and many other dimensions which is treated as a dimensional subset within the Demon World.

The argument begins with the Chaos Timeline which is a unique region that exists between universes and is explicitly described as a crack or rift between worlds. This region includes locations such as Nightmare Space where Helfilth typically resides. Helfilth is described as a master of dimensional rifts and is stated to wander "beyond time and space." Additionally, I used a scan that puts both Human and Demon World as lower and upper realms respectively whose purpose was to reinforce that their relationship is hierarchical rather than equivalent or symmetrical.

The next step addresses significance of whether the higher-dimensional object in question is infinite as a whole. This is directly supported by statements describing Demon World as an infinite, unending and endless darkness and not merely a large or expanding space. This distinction is crucial because an expansive space can still be infinite of unknown range whereas the text describes an infinity in its entirety.

As for how the thread has progressed so far? The discussion mainly centered on how the scans connect to one another and whether the "line of light" should be treated as a contradiction or as a supporting evidence. Vietthai argued that it must appear as a 2D flat space to be convincing whereas my position was that it only needs to function as a dimensional subset and not a geometrically flattened panel. Ultimately, the discussion converged on a possible 5D spatial interpretation with Planck and KingTempest later entering the thread and fully agreeing with a significant 5D space.

You can tag mods for better view over the situation @Random-Helper323
 
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SuperSonicTL said:
The argument relies on two specific FAQs in which both require demonstrating that the Demon World is a continuous, uncountable, infinite higher-dimensional object relative to the 4-dimensional universes it contains. This includes the Human World and many other dimensions which is treated as a dimensional subset within the Demon World.

The argument begins with the Chaos Timeline which is a unique region that exists between universes and is explicitly described as a crack or rift between worlds. This region includes locations such as Nightmare Space where Helfilth typically resides. Helfilth is described as a master of dimensional rifts and is stated to wander "beyond time and space." Additionally, I used a scan that puts both Human and Demon World as lower and upper realms respectively whose purpose was to reinforce that their relationship is hierarchical rather than equivalent or symmetrical.

The next step addresses significance of whether the higher-dimensional object in question is infinite as a whole. This is directly supported by statements describing Demon World as an infinite, unending and endless darkness and not merely a large or expanding space. This distinction is crucial because an expansive space can still be infinite of unknown range whereas the text describes an infinity in its entirety.

As for how the thread has progressed so far? The discussion mainly centered on how the scans connect to one another and whether the "line of light" should be treated as a contradiction or as a supporting evidence. Vietthai argued that it must appear as a 2D flat space to be convincing whereas my position was that it only needs to function as a dimensional subset and not a geometrically flattened panel. Ultimately, the discussion converged on a possible 5D spatial interpretation with Planck and KingTempest later entering the thread and fully agreeing with a significant 5D space.

You can tag mods for better view over the situation @Random-Helper323
Click to expand...
I already fired some pings into some mailboxes earlier. We'll see what happens with that.
 
leaning towards agree unless there's valid arguments against the human world previously being apart of the demon world. seems like the majority agree though vergil vs hi3 keqing could be real
 
AlipheeseXIV said:
Yeah, Idrk why the lower dimensional slice would need to appear as a flat 2D space to be convincing? That'd just be kinda odd to me, anyways can put me down for agree even though my vote doesn't mean shit 🗿
Click to expand...
At this point people don't understand, Sonic write in his OP that the Human World, which is stated to be the ray of light, or line of light is a "slice" of the Demon Realm to argue that Demon Realm is a higher dimension. Because there is no explicit statement of Human World being literal lower-dimensional sloce within the higher-dimensional Demon Realm, Sonic need to prove it

About flat 2D space, the slice argument for higher-dimension come from Brane Cosmology where the universe is actually a membrane, a slice of a higher-dimensional universe, from the perspective of higher-dimensional universe, 3-4D universe will appear as flat 2D slice, a membrane
 
SuperSonicTL said:
There is no equal infinity. Human world is just a nuisance into Demon World and was removed, that's it.
Click to expand...
I'm confused.
The franchise has always talked about a merging between the Demon World and the Human World, not an assimilation/absorption of the Human World by the Demon World iirc.

If the Demon World is infinitely larger than the Human World, it makes no sense to talk about a merging imo, it would be like saying that a character simultaneously moved a house and a random object so that the latter would be included in the house, or something like that.
 
Ser_Hakim_Dayne said:
I'm confused.
The franchise has always talked about a merging between the Demon World and the Human World, not an assimilation/absorption of the Human World by the Demon World iirc.

If the Demon World is infinitely larger than the Human World, it makes no sense to talk about a merging imo, it would be like saying that a character simultaneously moved a house and a random object so that the latter would be included in the house, or something like that.
Click to expand...
It may sound weird but that's just how it is. At every point, it is Demon World consuming our dimension throughout games, novels, mangas and guides. You can ask the experts over the verse. Here is one of many examples as a reference.
 
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SuperSonicTL said:
It may sound weird but that's just how it is. At every point, it is Demon World consuming our dimension throughout games, novels, mangas and guides. You can ask the experts over the verse. Here is one of many examples as a reference.
Click to expand...
I also came across that:

Perhaps we should only use Nightmare's statements that he can destroy the Demon World as justification for the 2-C/Low 1-C and not the absorption and separation of the Demon World and Human World. It would be better to see this feat just as a BFR like, for example, Marvel Odin who BFRs the tenth realm of Yggdrasil (but I digress).
 
Ser_Hakim_Dayne said:
I also came across that:

Perhaps we should only use Nightmare's statements that he can destroy the Demon World as justification for the 2-C/Low 1-C and not the absorption and separation of the Demon World and Human World. It would be better to see this feat just as a BFR like, for example, Marvel Odin who BFRs the tenth realm of Yggdrasil (but I digress).
Click to expand...
Yup, that's the plan.
 
Ser_Hakim_Dayne said:
I'm confused.
The franchise has always talked about a merging between the Demon World and the Human World, not an assimilation/absorption of the Human World by the Demon World iirc.

If the Demon World is infinitely larger than the Human World, it makes no sense to talk about a merging imo, it would be like saying that a character simultaneously moved a house and a random object so that the latter would be included in the house, or something like that.
Click to expand...
You are utterly and consistently wrong. The franchise always states that the Demon world consumes the Human world. Additionally, the Human World came from the Demonworld and would thus be smaller then it. Nevermind the statements showing multiple realms as large as the Humaworld located throughout the Demonworld demonstrated in the cosmology blog. Lastly, your talk on the word merge shows a lack of understanding literary conventions as merge only requires that two elements combine. Not that they exist on the same level of existence. Or that they both be equal in size even. Anyways I've got shopping to do.
 
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