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The biggest Deltarune CRT in history: Chapters 3 & 4 Tiering, LS and Speed Upgrades

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Lilybitdun said:
It's from adding the angles of scan 1 and scan 2 together
Click to expand...
Scan 1 is when Tenna jumped and brought his hand behind his back, isn't? Why is it added to measurement, when:
1) it's not in same timeframe
2) was performed when electric attacks didn't even appear yet
 
Sparkive said:
I mean, idk
The minigame literally ends with "no TVs were harmed in the making of the minigame" so it's probably dramatization on his part? (Besides,If they achieve anything, it's because there are several of them at the same time, and what you're losing by taking damage is popularity, which you share with Susie {I think} {Apart of the Shadowguys, the projectiles that reduce popularity are tennis balls, a cardboard dozer, and the final boss is said to be made of papier-mâché})
I wouldn't take the minigame too seriously
Click to expand...
Perhaps, but Tenna also summons Zapper to aid him (but so does Berdly while summoning Werewires to his side in the second fight, and we already know that a x3 gap is enough to still damage a superior opponent as shown with base Spamton).

I suppose that I'll concede that the evidence for directly scaling people from Tenna for now is pretty lacking... if I didn't find something else.

In the Rouxls Kaard battle of Chapter 3 we have Susie saying that if they do not do something about Rouxls forcing ACTs on the Fun Gang, they'll "get their asses kicked", with Rouxls himself saying to Lancer that "he's busy harming his friends", and given that Rouxls uses Shadowmen and later on the Weather Duo, he's effectively saying that he's a threat to them.

This would mean that a value of 13 ATK (Shadowmen) is enough to be roughly scaled to Tenna's feat, and thus, given that the Weather Duo is also involved in that fight and has 22 ATK, people who chain-scale to them (Rouxls Kaard himself and Tasque Manager) would be on the same tier as Tenna, meaning that ATK stats of 10 (Tasque Manager) and above would be Low 7-C (1299 Tons), and ATK values of 9 and below would be 8-A (433 Tons) from Spamton's reverse multiplier

The people scaling from base Spamton would be the following:
  • Chapter 1-2 fodders, with the exception of K Round:
  • Clover: She's a mini-boss and can be fought at the Fight Dojo just like Tasque Manager, but so do Chapter 2 fodders, making her scaling point pretty weak.
  • The Original... Starwalker: Yeah, sorry guys but the guy has no real feats despite all the memes on him. He should still be comparable to base Spamton off being a regular citizen like him though.
  • Sweet Cap'n Cakes: They're not really comparable to K Round despite being also a mini-boss, as they need to heal already after 2 hits, which tells me they are not as tanky as it.
  • C Round and Dummy: Obvious reasons
  • Pipis: Also same, have no real reason to scale to Spamton NEO's full value besides game mechanics (and even then you can say that the Pipis used from SNEO are stronger given they're directly created by him rather than off-screen). I'd say that they should get a "8-A, up to Low 7-C" given this issue.
Everyone else chainscales from Spamton NEO in a way through the Fun Gang.

Regardless, Tier 7 might be more consistent than we thought (I'll credit @Eden_Warlock99 for the first idea).

Miss Mizzle is heavily hinted to have generated a thunderstorm given certain statements that are made right after her transformation:

Given it's a storm with thunders, it'd make her scale to 1.3 or 3.24 Megatons (Low 7-B either way, base Spamton gets High 7-C/Low 7-B for being 431.94 Kilotons or 1.08 Megatons).

Spamton NEO instead is hinted to sustain to some degree the City he creates and warps, and the city is removed pretty fast the moment NEO de-activates (happens also if you beat him up with violence), which would be 7-B (with Titan, GIGA Queen and Thrash Machine then heavily upscaling from it). Though apparently a similar case was rejected in the past, and Pizzaface is not physically High 6-A despite him warping the Moon and that also was undone instantly at his defeat, so I can see if Spamton NEO's feat is rejected too however.

Would this push people to prefer the Ground Waves end for Sound of Justice too so we get another Tier 7 feat plz.
Maverick_Zero_X said:
@Therefir @Psychomaster35 @Drite77 @TheRustyOne
Click to expand...
What do you think of the above Tier 7 feats that could be used to support the new Low 7-C Tenna calc?
 
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StrymULTRA said:
Miss Mizzle is heavily hinted to have generated a thunderstorm given certain statements that are made right after her transformation:

Given it's a storm with thunders, it'd make her scale to 1.3 or 3.24 Megatons (Low 7-B either way, base Spamton gets High 7-C/Low 7-B for being 431.94 Kilotons or 1.08 Megatons).
Click to expand...

I did a quick calc and put her at about 1.1 Megatons
StrymULTRA said:
What do you think of the above Tier 7 feats that could be used to support the new Low 7-C Tenna calc?
Click to expand...
I still need to fix both calcs (probably later this day or tomorrow)
 
StrymULTRA said:
Wait what? I thought the average feats one would be enough to handle it.
Click to expand...
To the cloud i used the maximun distance a human can hear a thunder (about 10 miles) and then I used Nimbostratus cloud height & thickness. It could probablty be far higher since the Fun Gang is superior than the average human
 
StrymULTRA said:
Perhaps, but Tenna also summons Zapper to aid him (but so does Berdly while summoning Werewires to his side in the second fight, and we already know that a x3 gap is enough to still damage a superior opponent as shown with base Spamton).

I suppose that I'll concede that the evidence for directly scaling people from Tenna for now is pretty lacking... if I didn't find something else.

In the Rouxls Kaard battle of Chapter 3 we have Susie saying that if they do not do something about Rouxls forcing ACTs on the Fun Gang, they'll "get their asses kicked", with Rouxls himself saying to Lancer that "he's busy harming his friends", and given that Rouxls uses Shadowmen and later on the Weather Duo, he's effectively saying that he's a threat to them.

This would mean that a value of 13 ATK (Shadowmen) is enough to be roughly scaled to Tenna's feat, and thus, given that the Weather Duo is also involved in that fight and has 22 ATK, people who chain-scale to them (Rouxls Kaard himself and Tasque Manager) would be on the same tier as Tenna, meaning that ATK stats of 10 (Tasque Manager) and above would be Low 7-C (1299 Tons), and ATK values of 9 and below would be 8-A (433 Tons) from Spamton's reverse multiplier

The people scaling from base Spamton would be the following:
  • Chapter 1-2 fodders, with the exception of K Round:
  • Clover: She's a mini-boss and can be fought at the Fight Dojo just like Tasque Manager, but so do Chapter 2 fodders, making her scaling point pretty weak.
  • The Original... Starwalker: Yeah, sorry guys but the guy has no real feats despite all the memes on him. He should still be comparable to base Spamton off being a regular citizen like him though.
  • Sweet Cap'n Cakes: They're not really comparable to K Round despite being also a mini-boss, as they need to heal already after 2 hits, which tells me they are not as tanky as it.
  • C Round and Dummy: Obvious reasons
  • Pipis: Also same, have no real reason to scale to Spamton NEO's full value besides game mechanics (and even then you can say that the Pipis used from SNEO are stronger given they're directly created by him rather than off-screen). I'd say that they should get a "8-A, up to Low 7-C" given this issue.
Everyone else chainscales from Spamton NEO in a way through the Fun Gang.

Regardless, Tier 7 might be more consistent than we thought (I'll credit @Eden_Warlock99 for the first idea).

Miss Mizzle is heavily hinted to have generated a thunderstorm given certain statements that are made right after her transformation:

Given it's a storm with thunders, it'd make her scale to 1.3 or 3.24 Megatons (Low 7-B either way, base Spamton gets High 7-C/Low 7-B for being 431.94 Kilotons or 1.08 Megatons).

Spamton NEO instead is hinted to sustain to some degree the City he creates and warps, and the city is removed pretty fast the moment NEO de-activates (happens also if you beat him up with violence), which would be 7-B (with Titan, GIGA Queen and Thrash Machine then heavily upscaling from it). Though apparently a similar case was rejected in the past, and Pizzaface is not physically High 6-A despite him warping the Moon and that also was undone instantly at his defeat, so I can see if Spamton NEO's feat is rejected too however.

Would this push people to prefer the Ground Waves end for Sound of Justice too so we get another Tier 7 feat plz.

What do you think of the above Tier 7 feats that could be used to support the new Low 7-C Tenna calc?
Click to expand...

The problem is for feats like these to scale to physicals you would need an UES, otherwise it's either weather manipulation or reality warping
 
Lilybitdun said:
The problem is for feats like these to scale to physicals you would need an UES, otherwise it's either weather manipulation or reality warping
Click to expand...
I think it could be easier for Elnina given it's still related to water.

NEO is much harder to argue for, yes.
 
I have many problems with most the calcs but I won't argue over them in a content thread, but why we assume tha Tenna is only 20% Hollow?
CRT Tvs were like this:
250px-Macintosh_Plus_interior.jpg
 
Lilybitdun said:
Was there a UES thread made for Deltarune yet?
Click to expand...
No but we can discuss it here, given it pertains to AP.
Edutyn said:
I mean, it could be argued that the Elements are UES in Deltarune (given that practically every character has an element).
Click to expand...
Tbh if you have arguments go ahead, for UES you'd need evidence that [Insert non-physical thing] is something that if amped, will increase the physical stats and powers of a character. If you have it for Deltarune then show it.
 
Lilybitdun said:
The jump part got evaluated
vsbattles.fandom.com

Tenna Is Fast

vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com
Click to expand...
Personally I'd make the Non-Tenna Characters "Class K, likely Class G" as Tenna's physiology played a big part in it, though there's the benefit of the doubt given it's a casual AP feat from him, so them scaling to him even there is not far fetched.

Chapter 4 Top Tiers however should be straight up the latter given Sound of Justice feat and their superiority to the rest, going to edit OP later today.

Edit: Damn forgot about SoJ being Class G too. So I suppose a "Class G, likely higher" to account for both feats given that Tenna's is still quite higher.
 
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