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Sonic General Discussion Zone Act 1: New Frontiers

If the Flickies being called pan-dimensional refers to their Dimensional Travel abilities rather than their being (still doesn't sound like they're talking about DT tbh), wouldn't this grant Big Rings Low 1-C range? Since pan-dimensional means pertaining to all dimensions of reality.
 
McFriesGuy075 said:
If the Flickies being called pan-dimensional refers to their Dimensional Travel abilities rather than their being (still doesn't sound like they're talking about DT tbh), wouldn't this grant Big Rings Low 1-C range? Since pan-dimensional means pertaining to all dimensions of reality.
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Sure. What makes you think it could be reffering to their being though? They're just birds lol
 
For future reference small lil parts of Erazor's profile may have to be changed, specifically for Alf Layla wa-Layla. Here's the text after he transforms:

"我ガ名ハ
アルフ・ライラ・ワ・ライラ

我ハ アラビアンナイトの世界
我ハ 新タナ創造主

コノ 世界ト 現実ヲイレカエ
私ハ スベテノ統治者ト
ナル"

It doesn't seem to say stuff like "I will remake this world and this reality in my own image!" at the end. I'll put Windii's translation below but take it with a grain of salt as we don't know how accurate it may be

"My name is Alf Layla wa-Layla. I am the world of the Arabian Nights. I am the new creator. I will replace reality with this world, and I will be the ruler of all."

Depending on what this actually translates to, the justification for his reality warp may need to have a small wording change or even removed. (Of course, not remove the reality warping, I think even without him saying anything it's pretty obvious he warped reality with Sonic restoring it 2 minutes later unless you just want to downplay Sonic like crazy)

oh and btw for the sake of not posting twice in the same thread I'm a little more fond of the hypertimeline, still wouldn't say it's 100% reliable but ay it makes sense and ig it's generally agreed upon
 
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If Infinite were to return, should he burn bridges from Eggman or should he still be willing to join Eggman's conquests if he asks for Infinite's help?
 
Hello its me again replying to old stuff in the thread
Theuser789 said:
They did mention immeasurable, the counter arguments were just... bad.

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Lowkey I think it's actually a fair point to bring up bc, well, the game is pretty badly made. Of course I do also think it's still a viable scaling point as Solaris exists throughout past present and future but there's no denying that part of the reason it happens is because the game was rushed. If the game was remade today (though I'd prefer they not remake it, personally) I doubt they'd keep that in. However, that being said, what confuses me is how the blog says that it doesn't make sense lore wise for Solaris to attack the past, present, and future all at once. Like I'm ngl it makes perfect sense lore wise
Issen_Mk_III said:
Even if one doesn't buy immeasurable speed from fighting Solaris,Shadow & Silver quite explicitly fly to the past & future with raw speed before they even engage Solaris.
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I actually think this is a near instant immeasurable speed qualifier, though the only issue is the "time-space intersection" Solaris made, which iirc brought the past, present, and future into one place. But then again, Eggman does refer Solaris as the "present" Solaris so it's possible everything is in the present. But eh shit is complicated (Plus Shadow also said the distortion is expanding which could impact things but I didn't know where to put this)
 
Out'o'Sound said:
@Theuser789 @ShakeResounding I don't know if this really helps in this hypertimeline downgrade thread, I also don't even know if we should use this stuff, but I don't remember seeing this being brought up anywhere on the Wiki, so I wanted to share it.

On the official SonicChannel YouTube, there are Q&A videos answered by Sonic (Vtuber) where he usually answers everything with great accuracy to anything related to the games material and lore. In one of these videos, when answering a question about stages/places that stuck in his mind, Sonic mentions that he liked when the color went back to the areas and zones that the Time Eater attacked, and that it boils down to basically every place he's ever been. This would obviously include Blaze's dimension, Maginaryworld, Story Books Worlds, all Special Stages, all alternate futures of Sonic CD and etc:

(at 10:06)

As I said at the beginning, I don't know exactly what this influences, but I think it's important to bring this up here in case it helps in any way.
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Am going to be honest, how is sonic still alive in japan? I feel like sega of america is more powerful than the sega of japan throughout the last decade or so
 
TheStinkeer said:
You all think Secret Rings Sonic should get a "possibly" added onto his fate/plot manipulation resistance?

Mainly due to Shahra sacrificing herself to save Sonic, but I think a possible resistance can remain. I think this because Sonic was written to be the sacrifice (heavily implied in English, possibly confirmed in Japanese but translations differ,) in the book, since this was an actual story Sonic got added onto, he really shouldn't have been able to do anything to stop it, even Shahra was leading him towards it as much as she hated to do so. But then Sonic reached out to Shahra, to tell her to do what she truly believed was right, which led to Sonic not dying. I might be trying too hard to justify it but look man Sonic without SOME KIND of resistance to fate is WEIRD

Also we gotta talk about Sonic and Shahra's friendship omfg i love them I've written a good bit about them with my extremely limited meda analysis ability
Image
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wasn't secret rings & black knight stated to be non-canon?
 
TheStinkeer said:
Like doesn't God Of War also suffer this issue for example? I've seen how it pretty much gets memes on places like Reddit for how big it is on statements and the creator also having Kratos be weaker than fans have him as

That being said I'm not familiar with the GOW franchise nor its scaling so I could be completely wrong about everything
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yes, GOW suffers from the same reason as it, the differences being that sonic still gets nerfed & biased about it being still popular
 
Chianli said:
Am going to be honest, how is sonic still alive in japan? I feel like sega of america is more powerful than the sega of japan throughout the last decade or so
Click to expand...
If i recall correctly, Sonic Frontiers gave him a good rise in popularity in Japan.
 
TheStinkeer said:
Hello its me again replying to old stuff in the thread

Lowkey I think it's actually a fair point to bring up bc, well, the game is pretty badly made. Of course I do also think it's still a viable scaling point as Solaris exists throughout past present and future but there's no denying that part of the reason it happens is because the game was rushed. If the game was remade today (though I'd prefer they not remake it, personally) I doubt they'd keep that in. However, that being said, what confuses me is how the blog says that it doesn't make sense lore wise for Solaris to attack the past, present, and future all at once. Like I'm ngl it makes perfect sense lore wise

I actually think this is a near instant immeasurable speed qualifier, though the only issue is the "time-space intersection" Solaris made, which iirc brought the past, present, and future into one place. But then again, Eggman does refer Solaris as the "present" Solaris so it's possible everything is in the present. But eh shit is complicated (Plus Shadow also said the distortion is expanding which could impact things but I didn't know where to put this)
Click to expand...
These are hardly fair points. The game being badly made doesn't exactly make stuff unhappen or put stuff into question. Sure a lot of us don't like Forces, but it isn't like we're going to take feats into question because the game was bad. Hindsight is 20/20. Let's just stick to what actually happened and there are statements or showings to the contrary, then none of it should really be taken into question in terms of what actually happened or what would happen if it was written today.
 
ZothythoTheNephalem said:
These are hardly fair points. The game being badly made doesn't exactly make stuff unhappen or put stuff into question. Sure a lot of us don't like Forces, but it isn't like we're going to take feats into question because the game was bad. Hindsight is 20/20. Let's just stick to what actually happened and there are statements or showings to the contrary, then none of it should really be taken into question in terms of what actually happened or what would happen if it was written today.
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I'm just saying I think it's important to question things and bringing it up may be something important to note. And the thing with Forces is that it isn't known to be filled with glitches and such, while 06 has the infamous "ITS NO USE TAKE THIS!"

Regardless I did say also thought Solaris beams going throughout all time was still valid as it still happens and it checks out with the lore. My main concern is with the whole "space-time interception/rift" and what that means for Shadow and Silver flying to the past and future
 
Should I start attempting 2-C Adventure Era? Granted, I already have more than enough for 2-C Classic Era, but that'd feel a bit too hasty.
 
TheStinkeer said:
I'm just saying I think it's important to question things and bringing it up may be something important to note. And the thing with Forces is that it isn't known to be filled with glitches and such, while 06 has the infamous "ITS NO USE TAKE THIS!"

Regardless I did say also thought Solaris beams going throughout all time was still valid as it still happens and it checks out with the lore. My main concern is with the whole "space-time interception/rift" and what that means for Shadow and Silver flying to the past and future
Click to expand...
Image

I personally don't use Prima guides as a huge source but I know scaling here does, there's also this statement that the characters are still in the time-space intersection due to rocketing into the heart of it (Solaris) I'd like to know how that's treated
 
TheStinkeer said:
Image

I personally don't use Prima guides as a huge source but I know scaling here does, there's also this statement that the characters are still in the time-space intersection due to rocketing into the heart of it (Solaris) I'd like to know how that's treated
Click to expand...
It’s a weird coincidence this happened right as I was having a second guess on if Solaris is actually omnipresent again.

I wish ‘06 was more clear
 
JJSliderman said:
It’s a weird coincidence this happened right as I was having a second guess on if Solaris is actually omnipresent again.

I wish ‘06 was more clear
Click to expand...
Nah Solaris is def temporally omnipresent in a way, Eggman says he exists in the past, present, and future after all. You could still probably get Sonic, Shadow, and Silver to immeasurable if we assume the lasers are 100% going throughout the past, present, and future.

The time-space interception COULD also have its own sense of past, present, and future as Eggman says defeating Solaris "here and now" would mean nothing. It's also possible to just ignore the prima guide as it's unreliable anyways, though there's still the issue of the background of the Solaris fight looking like the interception.
 
I know that Solaris exists in the past/present/future, but he could accomplish his feat of consuming all of time even if he himself was limited to just three time points, if his attacks were able to reach across all of time. And from there, it could be argued his attacks reaching across time is moreso hax than speed, so dodging wouldn’t mean anything, and that super forms have time travel naturally baked in so their feats of going through time are also hax rather than speed
 
JJSliderman said:
I know that Solaris exists in the past/present/future, but he could accomplish his feat of consuming all of time even if he himself was limited to just three time points, if his attacks were able to reach across all of time. And from there, it could be argued his attacks reaching across time is moreso hax than speed, so dodging wouldn’t mean anything, and that super forms have time travel naturally baked in so their feats of going through time are also hax rather than speed
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Hmmm Solaris attacks reaching across time, even if it was simply Solaris using hax, would still grant immeasurable speed from dodging I think bc you're dodging something that's attacking you from the past, present, and future. And the point on Super Forms is a bit weird as they're shown flying rather than using portals to move and such, which is their movement speed, and doing immeasurable feats through movement is immeasurable i think

of course this is assuming the time-space interception would still allow for immeasurable speed but thats another can of worms
 
Honestly I’m kinda feeling all the multi+ evidence recently might be iffy.
Crossworlds, TailsTube, many worlds theory, the dream multiverse (barring 5-D args), all of them seem to have some kind of hole in them.
 
TheStinkeer said:
I'm just saying I think it's important to question things and bringing it up may be something important to note. And the thing with Forces is that it isn't known to be filled with glitches and such, while 06 has the infamous "ITS NO USE TAKE THIS!"

Regardless I did say also thought Solaris beams going throughout all time was still valid as it still happens and it checks out with the lore. My main concern is with the whole "space-time interception/rift" and what that means for Shadow and Silver flying to the past and future
Click to expand...
It's not important to note. A game's mechanical glitches has no bearing on lore. I don't think these concerns are too founded, honestly. It seems to focus in on the wrong things or overly-question things that've already been stated, shown, or heavily implied. When there's undeniable proof and showings that are right in your face, it feels like a reach to find some sort of impurity in the very evident and obvious. Not saying to "take everything at face value" obviously, but questioning if 2+2 equals 4 is a bit strange, isn't it?
 
Also reminds me that I dislike the Mural Theory for Shadow. Feels like too much headcanon, a leap in logic, and kind of cheapens Shadow as a character a little bit to just be "a copy of [insert character]" whilst making things feel a bit too Sonic-centric in a bad way, imo. Metal Sonic exists for a reason. We don't need Metal Sonic 2. I always preferred them being distinct characters who are still reflections conceptually, but no deeper than that lore-wise.
 
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If Prima guide was written by someone outside Sega, it shouldnt be used tbh. and to be fair to a certain thing
 
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