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Garou vs Cooler (0-0-0)

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Greatsage13th said:
Provide the roentgens for GRB and the sun. So that it is undeniable we are dealing with that much difference.
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It is hard to find values for what you are requesting as radiation is often just measured the same way as energy in general, and we know that a Gamma Ray Burst produces more energy in 1 second than the sun will in its entire lifetime.

We also know that gamma ray burst produce so much gamma radiation that they'd be able to destroy the Earth's atmosphere and kill all life on the planet that even if one came within like hundreds to thousands of lightyears of our solar system.

In less than a second, they produce as much energy as the Sun will emit in 10 billion years, and they can easily be detected from billions of light-years away. They are also quite deadly. According to some theories, if a gamma-ray burst were to occur within about 200 light-years of Earth, and the jets were pointed directly at us, our planet would be vaporized. At greater distances, but still in the Milky Way, the radiation would sterilize all life on the side of the Earth pointing toward the burst. [Source]
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Since GRBs are thought to involve beamed emission along two jets in opposing directions, only planets in the path of these jets would be subjected to the high energy gamma radiation.[143] A GRB could potentially vaporize anything in its beams' paths within a range of around 200 light-years. [Source]
Click to expand...


The sun's radiation is absolutely fodder compared to this.
 
Phoenks said:
It is hard to find values for what you are requesting as radiation is often just measured the same way as energy in general, and we know that a Gamma Ray Burst produces more energy in 1 second than the sun will in its entire lifetime.

We also know that gamma ray burst produce so much gamma radiation that they'd be able to destroy the Earth's atmosphere and kill all life on the planet that even if one came within like hundreds to thousands of lightyears of our solar system.






The sun's radiation is absolutely fodder compared to this.
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Fair enough, but what about the radiation level that's away from the jet? Would it still be that much higher than the sun?
 
Greatsage13th said:
Fair enough, but what about the radiation level that's away from the jet? Would it still be that much higher than the sun?
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I already sent that. Even if you're 200 light years away from the jet trajectory, it could still vaporize you. It could vaporize the entire Earth lmao.

Like, just from the beam passing by 200 light years in the distance. The radiation exposure would be enough to vaporize the Earth. Even at a thousand light years, I'm pretty sure it would still be an extinction level event.

They ain't called the most energetic explosions in the universe for nothing.
 
Seems like cooler only wins if he instantly uses IT + supernova as his first move, otherwise garou copies IT which stops cooler from having guranteed hits and a single grb which garou in character used like 6 panels after becoming cosmic will wipe out all coolers regardless of their numbers and even the gete star.
 
Phoenks said:
I already sent that. Even if you're 200 light years away from the jet trajectory, it could still vaporize you. It could vaporize the entire Earth lmao.

Like, just from the beam passing by 200 light years in the distance. The radiation exposure would be enough to vaporize the Earth. Even at a thousand light years, I'm pretty sure it would still be an extinction level event.

They ain't called the most energetic explosions in the universe for nothing.
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Alrighty, 'nough said. Cooler is held back by the technology of his time. He loses this one the moment GRB is unleashed. Unless that tech he uses can somehow get stronger and survive GRB from having one Metal Cooler killed off.
 
Also some stuff about gamma radiation/ionizing radiation effects on technology:

Ionizing radiation breaks down the materials within the electrical equipment. For example, when wiring is exposed to gamma rays, no change is noticed until the wiring is flexed or bent. The wire’s insulation becomes brittle and will break and may cause shorts in the equipment. The effect on diodes and computer chips is a bit more complex. The gamma rays disrupt the crystalline nature of the inside of the electronic component. Its function is degraded and then fails as more gamma radiation exposure is received by the electronic component. [Source]
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A total dose greater than 5000 rads delivered to silicon-based devices in a timespan on the order of seconds to minutes will cause long-term degradation. [Source]
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Basically, enough radiation will cause machines to fail as it destroys the functionality of the semiconductors inside.

And, for comparison, a gamma ray burst is on the order of... 83.6 billion Grays (At a distance of 1 parsec / 3.2 lightyears away). Converted into Rads (0.01 Grays = 1 Rad), that is 836,000,000 Rads. Astronomically above the 5,000 dose limit for silicon-based devices mentioned above.
 
Phoenks said:
Also some stuff about gamma radiation/ionizing radiation effects on technology:





Basically, enough radiation will cause machines to fail as it destroys the functionality of the semiconductors inside.

And, for comparison, a gamma ray burst is on the order of... 83.6 billion Grays (At a distance of 1 parsec / 3.2 lightyears away). Converted into Rads (0.01 Grays = 1 Rad), that is 836,000,000 Rads. Astronomically above the 5,000 dose limit for silicon-based devices mentioned above.
Click to expand...
So, basically almost every robotic character who uses silicon-based tech regardless of their tier would be killed off by anything above 5000 rads in a matter of moments?
 
Greatsage13th said:
So, basically almost every robotic character who uses silicon-based tech regardless of their tier would be killed off by anything above 5000 rads in a matter of moments?
Click to expand...
Yes, at least for ionizing radiation cases. Since radiation ignores durability. Especially highly-piercing radiation like gamma rays which can go through solid material and infect internal structures directly.

I mean, even for non-ionizing radiation like microwaves, I just want you to imagine what would happen to a phone if you put it in the microwave for even 10 seconds.
 
Even if Cooler could, he'd still play with his food first. Like, Cooler has advantages of numbers and IT and strength, but it legit doesn't matter if he's not going to capitalize on it.

Conversely, once Garou realizes how stacked Cooler is in this matchup, (basically immediately), he'd just whip out the GRB. (Exactly as he did in canon). Not to mention copy IT and use his crazy RE and AD to surpass Cooler.

And while Cooler is definitely one to immediately try and game end as soon as he realizes he's boned too, (see his Supernova in his first film), he'd still do it second/only would do so in response to Garou doing it first. Garou doing so first is an autowin, so Cooler auto-loses.

This isn't an incon, because both have wincons--It's just Garou legit would immediately go for the kill in a way that prevents Cooler from winning, and while Cooler could try and do the same, he won't.
 
Phoenks said:
Yes, at least for ionizing radiation cases. Since radiation ignores durability. Especially highly-piercing radiation like gamma rays which can go through solid material and infect internal structures directly.

I mean, even for non-ionizing radiation like microwaves, I just want you to imagine what would happen to a phone if you put it in the microwave for even 10 seconds.
Click to expand...
Yeah. Cooler is not winning this one.
 
I wonder what would the effects of the GRB have on Ghost Warrior Cooler, given he’s a living hatred gas. Would the ionizing effect on molecular structures like, disassemble his gaseous form? Genuine scientific curiosity, here.
 
RedReaper616 said:
…Because I was explaining your argument. I quoted you and explained the implication of your words. They don’t match what you later claim (mostly because of how you phrased it).
Click to expand...
RedReaper616 said:
Quoting you.
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I was answering from the phone and had to close it every 2 min :d So i might have messed it up a little 😅
RedReaper616 said:
It’s never been implied it’s due to being a different dimension of time. All that is said is that it cuts you off from the world (entirely). This even applies to the Eternal Dragons, which explicitly affect other dimensions (as well as their time).
Click to expand...
RedReaper616 said:
Not the case.
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Wasn't it the reason given by the Elder Kai?

nvm, i guess i was wrong then, seems like it's the HCT only as it is sealed off from the world.

Phoenks said:
Especially GRB
Click to expand...
Extremely safe attack as he's in the singularity while it's happening :d
Greatsage13th said:
Provide the roentgens for GRB and the sun. So that it is undeniable we are dealing with that much difference.
Click to expand...
The difference isn't comparable. Way too high.
Greatsage13th said:
Fair enough, but what about the radiation level that's away from the jet? Would it still be that much higher than the sun?
Click to expand...
Yes. The distance matters in this case, but lightyears of distance just for it to be comparable to Sun.
 
2 things to add:

Garou learns IT: Okey, to use IT he needs to signal a Ki signature to use the teleport, Cooler is a robot, he has no Ki signature and Goku could not sense the real Cooler inside the Gete Star as well, so him learning Ki is completely useless without anyone to apply the technique

Information Analysis & Power Bestowal (The main computer of the Big Gete Star is constantly monitoring Meta-Cooler's body, immediately detecting and then repairing any damage he receives, then corrects whatever flaws in his design that allowed the injury<a href="https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Cooler#cite_note-The_Return_of_Cooler-1"><span>[</span>1<span>]</span></a>)


It seems that Cooler got IT thanks to his defeat in Earth and the big gete star gave him this technique after being repaired thanks to the data


If Garou use GBR, the Gete star will give Cooler the same technique and the resistance to use it, to use IT you need spirit control which is not something normal Ki users can do

Now, let the Dragon ball fans debate about this, I am not changing my vote
 
Phoenks said:
It is hard to find values for what you are requesting as radiation is often just measured the same way as energy in general, and we know that a Gamma Ray Burst produces more energy in 1 second than the sun will in its entire lifetime.

We also know that gamma ray burst produce so much gamma radiation that they'd be able to destroy the Earth's atmosphere and kill all life on the planet that even if one came within like hundreds to thousands of lightyears of our solar system.






The sun's radiation is absolutely fodder compared to this.
Click to expand...
I never really looked at the Garou's GRB attack before but why the hell does it have the power of a real one again? The justification is just "it was compared to a real one" which on itself shouldnt be an justification for that, the picture link for that statement doesnt works, and then if it was as strong as a real one the entire solar system would get evaporated even without garou not direcing it to earth because its in the Atmosphere and the heat transfer would ignite the atmosfer transfering all the Oxygen to ozone and Ozone oxidizing Nitrogen to nitrogen pentaoxide, If not outright atominizing the planet.

Which is supported by the fact the Blackhole Garou created was much much than normal ones (smallest known one has 3 solar masses with a radius of 8.8kms)

Also his Gamma ray bursts isnt instant he creates a blackhole and then explodes it which is very easy to dodge (not for the planet body though). Nuclear attack is a better wincon tbh since dbs characters lack the heat resistance.

​

 
Kazuma_kuwabara said:
The main computer of the Big Gete Star is constantly monitoring Meta-Cooler's body, immediately detecting and then repairing any damage he receives, then corrects whatever flaws in his design that allowed the injury
Click to expand...
There are multiple huge problems with this point:
1. He lacks the regeneration/immortality to allow him to come back from radiation damage in the first place, as it is great enough to entirely vaporize him and any clones.
2. No-Limits-Fallacy to assume he can correct something he has never shown any ability to correct in his own series, especially if he's never shown to correct something even remotely in the same area or concept as said radiation damages. The one example shown on the page is his ability to grow in statistics, which is literally useless against Garou because that just gives him more fuel.
3. Radiation from the GRB explosion can cause the complete malfunction of the Gete Star Core in the first place, given that it is rather explicitly made up of semiconductors and computer chips. Meta-Cooler's body will also completely break and malfunction as well, severing any connections he had via his technology.

Gamma Ray Burst, from what I can tell, is a one-shot move that ends the fight the moment Garou fires it.
 
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