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Well, I’m opening this post at the request of many, as they’re concerned about the absurdity these threads about the Nasuverse have become. All of them are wrong and nonsensical — for example: Morgan is possibly 1-C, while beings like ORT, Arcueid, Gilgamesh and others, who scale above her, are only listed as 2-A. Or even more ridiculous cases like Ishtar being 6-B, Ereshkigal 6-C, and Musashi 6-C. This isn’t just lacking in sense — it’s lacking in basic knowledge of the series, and that’s clearly reflected in the tiers imposed by this wiki. It’s truly concerning because when a wiki claims to analyze different works and aims to inform and clarify factual information, it should not fail in its most basic duty: to analyze impartially. That’s something I simply don’t see when it comes to topics related to Type-Moon. What we see is a space dominated by a single person or group who clearly dislike the subject matter — like the user Wank Breaker — and who explicitly, in every thread they participate in, makes their intent to downplay it very clear, even if it means using irrelevant or invalid arguments that don’t meet the wiki’s own standards, and whose approach invariably leans into shallow, negative interpretations of the work. In short, a wiki that becomes hostage to the ill will of its own contributors and administrators fails to fulfill its role to users and members who assess things properly. But since this is just a topic for review and not a full-on critique, I won’t dwell on this too much.
As I mentioned earlier, this wiki has not been properly evaluating the level of Type-Moon — not due to a lack of evidence, as I’ve seen several threads here that weren’t refuted but simply ignored. And this happens because the team responsible for the Nasuverse simply doesn’t conduct a proper analysis. That’s why I ask that this thread be properly discussed based on what I’m going to present below regarding the general cosmology update and scaling of beings within the Nasuverse.
To speak directly, the requirements on the wiki for a 1-A rating, as described in the FAQ, are:
Q: Are there any disqualifiers for qualitative superiority?
Q: What tier is transcending dimensions?
These are exactly the requirements for "qualitative difference" within this wiki, and as I will prove below, this is how the nasuverse works. Rin explains that everything there is perceived in the way it is absorbed in R>F.
(She insists on using 中にいた (naka ni ita), meaning "was inside," referring to the fact that she was inside the book. The surface of the "scroll" is an event from a lower dimension, but the perspective is that of a book, and later you see her mentioning 'flat parchment' as a sheet of a book, where each sheet is an event in the world's timeline.
The question is, why is this not accepted? Since she makes it clear that "existence (存在)" kanji for existence, it is not just a perspective, she is talking about ontology. And the argument to invalidate this is to say that she says "respective 2D" in English, to affirm that it is an additive difference, when this NEVER EXISTED. In the official Japanese translation this is not said, the only thing mentioned is an analogy to a perspective she made right after the book, she did not mention that it was a two-dimensional perspective.
The translation where it says this is the English one made by fans, it is not even canonical, and the type moon itself talks about this on its wiki.
typemoon.fandom.com
Pseudo-Spiritrons are the essence of all things, including souls as higher-dimensional structures within the verse. Spiritrons are said to be metaphysical -形而上- in Extra CCC, which indeed demonstrates a 1-A level of superiority as described on this wiki. It also refutes “inconsistencies” regarding interactions, since, as described in the FAQ, it is possible for two beings to interact as long as there is a metaphysical gap between them.
Now, how many of them are there? So far, this would prove the 1-A level of gods, servants, and other beings above humanity—but it's more than that. This is shown in section 12 of the final singularity. Specifically speaking about Human Textures, they exist in an infinite number of layers, as seen in the Goetia incineration event.
And what does this imply for R>F within the human texture? Simple: the kanji for scroll or roll referred to when talking about R>F in Fate are the following: "織物" and also "巻物", and scroll: "スクロール" in katakana. All of them refer to the same thing: dimensions—or in this case, Textures.
Directly speaking about metaphysics, it is mentioned by Ishtar during the Age of Gods, where she states that heaven, earth, and the underworld were all on the same intertwined scroll/fabric (roll), like a single carpet. And that the concept of an ‘afterlife’ or a ‘world beyond’ as something metaphysical only arose later in the human world, because it became a different dimension. She explicitly mentions that being a lower dimension is what makes it metaphysical here, and we notice that it is the same kanji introduced in Extra CCC.
In FGO Ooku, there's an initial dialogue about human history and the Lostbelts, which I previously showed to have infinite layers. But here we see a quote from Sion that explicitly refers to human history as scrolls:
Not only that, but we also have Merlin in Babylonia mentioning that books are stories/scrolls written by humanity, based on what they imagine or experience through their history. And Merlin's statement is proven when we see Alexander's favorite scroll/book, which is about one of the oldest Greek classics attributed to Homer. He describes exactly what is told as legend in his story as a scroll, which to human eyes are nothing more than sheets of paper—but at the same time, they are stories of lower dimensions.
Just like in LB6, the illustrated book of Morgan's story being fiction is also an example that tales are real worlds.
And finally, we have Camazotz in LB7 referring to human history as a scroll, just like in CCC:
In summary, this would place the Human Texture at 1-A+, and beings above it—such as gods, ancestors, servants, or elementals—would easily qualify as High 1-A. And of course, if there is any disagreement with this interpretation, I ask that counterarguments be presented to invalidate it. After all, I am attaching an R>F that aligns almost perfectly with the criteria proposed by the wiki—there is no longer any reason for disagreement.
As I mentioned earlier, this wiki has not been properly evaluating the level of Type-Moon — not due to a lack of evidence, as I’ve seen several threads here that weren’t refuted but simply ignored. And this happens because the team responsible for the Nasuverse simply doesn’t conduct a proper analysis. That’s why I ask that this thread be properly discussed based on what I’m going to present below regarding the general cosmology update and scaling of beings within the Nasuverse.
To speak directly, the requirements on the wiki for a 1-A rating, as described in the FAQ, are:
Q: Are there any disqualifiers for qualitative superiority?
Q: What tier is transcending dimensions?
These are exactly the requirements for "qualitative difference" within this wiki, and as I will prove below, this is how the nasuverse works. Rin explains that everything there is perceived in the way it is absorbed in R>F.
(平面: Refers to something that has a surface like a sheet of paper or a screen; in this context, it refers to a sheet since it is within the illustrated book.)
(She insists on using 中にいた (naka ni ita), meaning "was inside," referring to the fact that she was inside the book. The surface of the "scroll" is an event from a lower dimension, but the perspective is that of a book, and later you see her mentioning 'flat parchment' as a sheet of a book, where each sheet is an event in the world's timeline.
The question is, why is this not accepted? Since she makes it clear that "existence (存在)" kanji for existence, it is not just a perspective, she is talking about ontology. And the argument to invalidate this is to say that she says "respective 2D" in English, to affirm that it is an additive difference, when this NEVER EXISTED. In the official Japanese translation this is not said, the only thing mentioned is an analogy to a perspective she made right after the book, she did not mention that it was a two-dimensional perspective.
The translation where it says this is the English one made by fans, it is not even canonical, and the type moon itself talks about this on its wiki.
Fate/EXTRA CCC
Fate/EXTRA CCC (フェイト／エクストラ CCC, Feito/Ekusutora CCC?) is a Role Playing Game for PlayStation PortableWP and a sequel and companion game to Fate/EXTRA. As with its predecessor, the game was developed by Image Epoch in collaboration with TYPE-MOON. The scenario was written by Kinoko Nasu, with...
typemoon.fandom.com
Pseudo-Spiritrons are the essence of all things, including souls as higher-dimensional structures within the verse. Spiritrons are said to be metaphysical -形而上- in Extra CCC, which indeed demonstrates a 1-A level of superiority as described on this wiki. It also refutes “inconsistencies” regarding interactions, since, as described in the FAQ, it is possible for two beings to interact as long as there is a metaphysical gap between them.
Now, how many of them are there? So far, this would prove the 1-A level of gods, servants, and other beings above humanity—but it's more than that. This is shown in section 12 of the final singularity. Specifically speaking about Human Textures, they exist in an infinite number of layers, as seen in the Goetia incineration event.
And what does this imply for R>F within the human texture? Simple: the kanji for scroll or roll referred to when talking about R>F in Fate are the following: "織物" and also "巻物", and scroll: "スクロール" in katakana. All of them refer to the same thing: dimensions—or in this case, Textures.
Directly speaking about metaphysics, it is mentioned by Ishtar during the Age of Gods, where she states that heaven, earth, and the underworld were all on the same intertwined scroll/fabric (roll), like a single carpet. And that the concept of an ‘afterlife’ or a ‘world beyond’ as something metaphysical only arose later in the human world, because it became a different dimension. She explicitly mentions that being a lower dimension is what makes it metaphysical here, and we notice that it is the same kanji introduced in Extra CCC.
In FGO Ooku, there's an initial dialogue about human history and the Lostbelts, which I previously showed to have infinite layers. But here we see a quote from Sion that explicitly refers to human history as scrolls:
Not only that, but we also have Merlin in Babylonia mentioning that books are stories/scrolls written by humanity, based on what they imagine or experience through their history. And Merlin's statement is proven when we see Alexander's favorite scroll/book, which is about one of the oldest Greek classics attributed to Homer. He describes exactly what is told as legend in his story as a scroll, which to human eyes are nothing more than sheets of paper—but at the same time, they are stories of lower dimensions.
Just like in LB6, the illustrated book of Morgan's story being fiction is also an example that tales are real worlds.
And finally, we have Camazotz in LB7 referring to human history as a scroll, just like in CCC:
In summary, this would place the Human Texture at 1-A+, and beings above it—such as gods, ancestors, servants, or elementals—would easily qualify as High 1-A. And of course, if there is any disagreement with this interpretation, I ask that counterarguments be presented to invalidate it. After all, I am attaching an R>F that aligns almost perfectly with the criteria proposed by the wiki—there is no longer any reason for disagreement.
