Yumiella 1A pre-reincarnation key creation

[Velvian_can]

Hello everyone! I believe this is my first making a thread on this wiki. I'd like to propose an upgrade regarding Yumiella's tier whereas her pre-reincarnation key was overlooked in the last thread which I will be presenting it more properly. It's not really that long so please stay with me. (sorry if my wordings suck)





Yumiella’s original self pretty much viewed her current world much like a story, suggesting that her original world holds a some sort of superiority over her present one. This notion is backed up by herself and Kugelschreiber, who confirms that her soul originates from a higher-level world which by itself should be r>f but it's still shaky so let's go to the next argument



Yumiella blatantly describes in her analogy that the higher world is fundamentally more real than them where she quotes—“full of higher beings reading that manga” in which this framing clarifies that the hierarchy involves entire worlds rather than just individual caretakers or entities within them.



Since every caretaker holds power/authority over their respective Tree/otherworld where it's highlighted that Otherworlds are different to parallel worlds,and every tree has its own caretaker ,it makes sense that Kugelschreiber would observe and even manipulate Yumiella’s soul across dimensional boundaries since this notion goes against the laws of the universe. We already know that her soul is from a higher world and that world has an ontological difference/superiority to her current one but the problem arises, how can her soul be reduced to non-1A. We can safely assume that Yumiella's original soul was reduced by the caretaker of Yumiella's previous "otherworld" to be able to reincarnate her into the otome game

 

[Astral_Trinity439]

We already know that her soul is from a higher world and that world has an ontological difference/superiority to her current one but the problem arises, how can her soul be reduced to non-1A. We can safely assume that Yumiella's original soul was reduced by the caretaker of Yumiella's previous "otherworld" to be able to reincarnate her into the otome game

This bit of reasoning seems fine, yeah, since we assume a 1-A can be reduced to Non 1-A when quaIitative power reduction is invoIved, which 1-A are capabIe of.

 

[SweetDao]

We already know that her soul is from a higher world and that world has an ontological difference/superiority to her current one but the problem arises, how can her soul be reduced to non-1A. We can safely assume that Yumiella's original soul was reduced by the caretaker of Yumiella's previous "otherworld" to be able to reincarnate her into the otome game

I forgot to comment, but beside this part that feels a bit iffy for me (we talked about it) the rest seems logical enough.

 

[Lynieryz]

Yeah, that doesn't work. The multiverse consists of cyberspace worlds, this would be the same case as seeing games as fiction, which does not qualify as R>F in the current standard.

“Could it be that I only think that the worlds I govern are part of their own tree? What if they’re actually a clump of branches on a much bigger tree? I can’t deny the possibility that this world might be something like a dollhouse created by a being from a much larger world. Picture it! Those beings could be watching us from above, enjoying us as entertainment!”
“Oh...!” I was going to say that sounds stupid, but I almost forgot. This world is the world of an otome game. There are definitely people who are enjoying this world as entertainment. I was one of those very people. “What’s wrong?” the god of evil asked, curious about the sound I’d made. “Oh, it’s nothing. Please continue.” “Well, from the perspective of those in that larger world, I’m nothing but a trivial being frolicking around in their tiny dollhouse. I’m just a clown to them!” Man, if I tell him that this is the world of an otome game, he might just explode from anger. Also, from the way he’s talking, it sounds like the world I’m originally from might be in danger. After gathering enough powerful pawns, the god of evil will probably end up invading Japan. After being attacked by an otome game, Japan will... Wait. Maybe it’s not actually that dangerous of a situation? Upon thinking about it, it just didn’t sound that dire. If you said a god from cyberspace was going to attack, that sounded more urgent. If you instead said it was a god from an otome game, it instantly sounded immensely unthreatening. Well, god of evil, you’re acting pretty high and mighty, but I hate to break it to you: this is just the world of a dating simulation, buddy. Either way, while this might’ve been the world of a fictional story, the people here were definitely alive, and they made their own choices. That seemed like enough of a qualification for somewhere to be considered a proper world. On top of that, there was no guarantee that Japan was the “original” world either. My first life could’ve been set in the world of a manga where sorcerers were secretly battling spirits behind the scenes in modern Japan, and my previous self was simply unaware of all that. And then, the world full of even higher beings reading that manga might not be the original either... And so, it was an endless cycle. I pointed this out. “Even if you were to take over the hypothetical world watching over this world, that world might be fictional, just another, bigger dollhouse.” “Then I’ll just take over the world above that one.” “There might be another world above even that one.” “Even if they go on forever, I’ll just continue climbing up.” His ambition knew no bounds. Even if he were to endlessly continue invading successive worlds, how would he ever know for certain that he’d reached the root of the tree?
I can’t keep dealing with this. I wonder: can he even observe Japan, or even any part of the world where the Japan in which I lived was located?

This is shown more explicitly through Reality Warping which works by manipulating the game code.

he said, “Activate Administrator Code: Shut off targets in current space.” I was about to ask him what he was doing, but I realized my mouth couldn’t move. It wasn’t just my mouth, but also my arms and legs—heck, not even my eyeballs could move an inch. Patrick and 2 were just barely visible in the corner of my peripheral vision, and it didn’t seem like they were moving either. They were likely frozen as well. My only lifeline was Lemn, who was hopefully still watching everything from the shadows.“You can’t move, can you?” the god of evil cackled. “This is the power of a being who is truly a god. The four of you are... Wait, four...? Oh, I see, he must be in the shadows. Lemn, was it? You’re no different from humans in my eyes.”

“Activate Administrator Code: Shut off target.” The breath disappeared, and the god reappeared as his usual calm, wobbling, censored self. It didn’t seem like Ryuu’s attack had done anything. Not only that, but since he didn’t utter a single roar or issue another attack, I assumed that Ryuu couldn’t move anymore either, frozen midwingbeat in the sky above.

“Activate Administrator Code: Shut off targets in current area.” The cheat code rang out in its entirety at last.We were frozen—not even a single joint in a single one of my fingers would budge. Patrick and I were completely still, and the same was likely true for Lemn and Sanon, although they were too far out of my field of vision for me to say for sure. Everyone in the god of evil’s presence had been stopped.

 

[Astral_Trinity439]

Yeah, that doesn't work. The multiverse consists of cyberspace worlds, this would be the same case as seeing games as fiction, which does not qualify as R>F in the current standard.

Not sure where you are getting that from, because per the standards on the page:

Potential mediums for viewing a cosmology as fiction include: written media (Books or stories), images (Paintings, comics, or movies), data (Simulations or video games), or mental constructs (thoughts or dreams). All of the above would be considered less 'real' than the person who views the cosmology as such, and can directly imply qualitative superiority. Note that the medium is usually a representation or container for the fiction on a higher plane and not necessarily the fiction in itself.

So that argument itself is flawed.

 

[Bernkastelll]

which does not qualify as R>F in the current standard.

Except that it does and the Cosmology already was accepted as 1-A in previous CRTs, it is even in the verse page, if you disagree you should make a CRT instead

Villainess Level 99: I May Be the Hidden Boss but I'm Not the Demon Lord

Villainess Level 99: I May Be the Hidden Boss but I'm Not the Demon Lord (悪役令嬢レベル99　～私は裏ボスですが魔王ではありません～, Akuyaku Reijō Reberu 99: Watashi wa Ura Bosudesuga Maō de wa Arimasen) is a Japanese light novel series written by Satori Tanabata with illustrations by Tea. Yumiella Dolkness was a college...

vsbattles.fandom.com

so yeah, Yumiella should be 1-A in her pre-reincarnation key, I agree

 

[Bernkastelll]

Also, I think the OP should mention and show that the cosmology already was accepted as 1-A in previous CRTs and link the blog page to avoid confusion

 

[Lynieryz]

Except that it does and the Cosmology already was accepted as 1-A in previous CRTs, it is even in the verse page, if you disagree you should make a CRT instead

Thread '[VL99] 1-A Invalid Cosmology.'

Dec 22, 2024

It's quite simple, the cosmology was accepted as a 1-A because of the real Yumiella's soul.
Problems:
1° The real Yumiella's soul was manipulated by the Evil God, this goes directly against the entire argument in favor of 1-A.(This is an anti-feat because of a fictional being [Evil God] in relation to the real Yumiella's soul being able to interact with this soul)

So, I thought I’d give it a try, and put another soul inside you. It's a weak soul, drifting...

• Lynieryz
• villainess level 99
• Replies: 41
• Forum: Content Revision

 

[Astral_Trinity439]

Thread '[VL99] 1-A Invalid Cosmology.'

Dec 22, 2024

It's quite simple, the cosmology was accepted as a 1-A because of the real Yumiella's soul.
Problems:
1° The real Yumiella's soul was manipulated by the Evil God, this goes directly against the entire argument in favor of 1-A.(This is an anti-feat because of a fictional being [Evil God] in relation to the real Yumiella's soul being able to interact with this soul)

So, I thought I’d give it a try, and put another soul inside you. It's a weak soul, drifting...

• Lynieryz
• villainess level 99
• Replies: 41
• Forum: Content Revision

Rather then making a thread about it, you could have first asked a staff to confirm whether your counter argument was even worth making a separate instant-thread about... but no....

In any case, since @Ultima_Reality was among the staff who agreed to the cosmology upgrade on the previous CRT, this won't even effect anything.
Next time, try to be more thoughtful of that rather then making seemingly spite-threads

 

[Rakih_Elyan]

Weakest 1-A fr.

 

[Astral_Trinity439]

Weakest 1-A fr.

true lol
1-A for just a key that did not have more then a few seconds of screentime at the start of it all

 

[Bernkastelll]

bump

 

[Digital_Franz]

Weakest 1-A fr.

Fraud. One hit from another 1-A character and she is gone

 

[Bernkastelll]

I think the 1-A should be mentioned in the title of the CRT, unfortunately it's the only way to catch attention

 

[Velvian_can]

I think the 1-A should be mentioned in the title of the CRT, unfortunately it's the only way to catch attention

I think that should work (Maybe)

 

[Bernkastelll]

bump

 

[Velvian_can]

Fraud. One hit from another 1-A character and she is gone

I'm writing this on my manifesto True enough

 

[Bernkastelll]

bump

 

[Bernkastelll]

bump

 

[GarrixianXD]

The information I got is that Kugelschreiber is a caretaker, and your OP argues that caretakers are part of the higher world and, hence are part of 1-A realities. This is true, right?

I would like a better explanation for how Kugelschreiber was able to affect Yumiella's soul; breaking the laws of the universe doesn't really seem like a strong qualification by itself.

 

[Velvian_can]

your OP argues that caretakers are part of the higher world and, hence are part of 1-A realities. This is true, right?

While Kugelschreiber is depicted as a caretaker within the narrative, the role alone does not inherently place him within a 1-A framework. There’s no evidence indicating that he views or views the lower realities as fiction the same as the higher beings do

“So... Does that world above ours actually exist?”

“Theoretically it does. I can’t observe it for myself, but there’s no doubt about it. Why don’t we show those who are blithely watching over us what we’re capable of!”

“I’m sorry, but I’m not interested.”

This by itself shows that Kugelschreiber can't do nothing to the Higher Otherworld which clarifies that he's on the level of the Higher Otherwolrd's Caretaker's capabilities or existence.

It also clarifies that the scope of his capabilities are limited to their Tree

I would like a better explanation for how Kugelschreiber was able to affect Yumiella's soul; breaking the laws of the universe doesn't really seem like a strong qualification by itself.

We used a logical deduction to make an assumption that Yumiella's soul was already reduced by the Overseer of her previous otherworld when she arrived at the edge of the dimensional barrier since Caretakers/Overseers of Trees are able to Manipulate the soul of the habitants of their respective tree

 

[GarrixianXD]

I don't agree with the scaling then. Simply boasting about showing inhabitants the higher-reality of your capabilities isn't really an indication of being able to interact with them. Just take 4th wall breaks for example; the fictional characters interact with the people of reality and show off their capabilities, but that doesn't mean that they can interact with us.

 

[Velvian_can]

I don't agree with the scaling then. Simply boasting about showing inhabitants the higher-reality of your capabilities isn't really an indication of being able to interact with them. Just take 4th wall breaks for example; the fictional characters interact with the people of reality and show off their capabilities, but that doesn't mean that they can interact with us.

I don't quite understand what you're trying to say but I'm just going to assume that you're trying to imply that Kugelschreiber interacted with the soul of Yumiella which we assume as 1-A. The thing is that the soul was already reduced to non-1-A before he interacted with the soul

 

[GarrixianXD]

The thing is that the soul was already reduced to non-1-A before he interacted with the soul

How exactly?

 

[Velvian_can]

How exactly?

So you see, Kugelschreiber couldn't have done it since he couldn't even do anything to the Otherworld which is where Yumiella originates from. He was even theorizing on whether it exists or not, so logically, if it wasn't him that manipulated the soul of Yumiella, it would've been someone or something from her original world

 

[Lynieryz]

if it wasn't him that manipulated the soul of Yumiella

Now you're just making things up, it's explicitly shown that he was the one who manipulated Yumiella's soul.

So, I thought I’d give it a try, and put another soul inside you. It's a weak soul, drifting in the rift between dimensions. It’s likely to fail, but I was troubled enough to try it out.

「そこで物は試しと思ってだな、貴様の中に別な魂を入れてみた。次元の狭間を漂う弱々しい魂だ。まず駄目であろうが、それを試すほどには悩んでいたのだ」

 

[Velvian_can]

Now you're just making things up, it's explicitly shown that he was the one who manipulated Yumiella's soul.

I think these scans speak for themselves, both Lemn and Kugelschreiber only theorizes and are unsure themselves (showing subjectivity upon their statements) which are only confirmed by Yumiella herself.

Edit:

Kugelschreiber manipulated her soul WHEN it was already reduced, not when it was still in her previous tree.

 

[Velvian_can]

Bump (This is so dead that even the king of Kot acknowledges that it is more deserted than the kingdom of twilight itself)

 

[Bernkastelll]

This just be a simple thread since the profile already accepts the cosmology as 1-A, we just forgot to give her a Real Key lol

 

[Velvian_can]

This just be a simple thread since the profile already accepts the cosmology as 1-A, we just forgot to give her a Real Key lol

After this gets accepted, hax additions will be next I think? It's like 2-3 (not sure with the other one) major abilities granted in volume 6

 

[Bernkastelll]

bumpty bump

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

I'm not really getting the implication of 1-A from what I've read in the OP albeit if it did then this is a serious weak case of 1-A. My problem stems from the fact that “story” seems to be treated as a parallel world even if it is “higher” which occupies some sort of place in the same space that can be accessible.

I'm neutral to disagreeing and I don't really see any implication of the more “real than the real” aspect of it to be that great of a case either(I don't recall that being mentioned within the scan.) Though that notion is common and great for 1-A, it also needs to be fully in the context that it is completely distinct from the baseline level of existence. However, that can't be established well if all “endless cycles of stories” are just contingent on higher and lower worlds of stories.

I'm down to be proven wrong but I just see the evidence as being weak. Unless, I'm missing context that's not in the OP itself or if I wasn't reading some of that right.

 

[Velvian_can]

I'm not really getting the implication of 1-A from what I've read in the OP albeit if it did then this is a serious weak case of 1-A. My problem stems from the fact that “story” seems to be treated as a parallel world even if it is “higher” which occupies some sort of place in the same space that can be accessible.

I mean, the cosmology itself was already accepted as 1-A and there's an explicit statement of parallel worlds being different to Other worlds. The last statement was quite disproven by Kugelschreiber who was the one who holds authority over the tree apparently which I explained in the OP

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Villainess_Level_99_Cosmology_Page

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

I mean, the cosmology itself was already accepted as 1-A and there's an explicit statement of parallel worlds being different to Other worlds. The last statement was quite disproven by Kugelschreiber who was the one who holds authority over the tree apparently which I explained in the OP

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Villainess_Level_99_Cosmology_Page

I don't see it still. I'm going to disagree. Though, you need to convince the mods and since it was accepted in the previous CRT then I see it as fine as far as convincing the mods go. However, I'm not all that impressed by the information. I swiftly read through the cosmology blog and it hasn't changed my stance.

 

[Reiner04]

I was asked to tag some staff here;

@Elizhaa @Qawsedf234 @Firestorm808 @LephyrTheRevanchist @Nierre @FinePoint

Your opinion on this thread will be appreciated.

 

[FinePoint]

Could you link to the profile, please?

 

[Velvian_can]

Could you link to the profile, please?

Sorry if I was kinda inactive but here's her current profile, I think?

 

[FinePoint]

Sorry if I was kinda inactive but here's her current profile, I think?

Could you give sort of a summarized scaling chain/justifications linking her to up to 2-C and up to the proposed 1-A?

 

[Velvian_can]

Could you give sort of a summarized scaling chain/justifications linking her to up to 2-C and up to the proposed 1-A?

So basically.
For her 2-C key which shouldn't be confused since this is after her reincarnation: She has these things called "Elixirs" that are capable of reverting time for an entire parallel world, which could also destroy multiple worlds.

and for her 1-A key: Yumiella used to view her current world as fiction before she got reincarnated into the world of LMH by a caretaker of her previous tree.

 

[FinePoint]

So basically.
For her 2-C key which shouldn't be confused since this is after her reincarnation: She has these things called "Elixirs" that are capable of reverting time for an entire parallel world, which could also destroy multiple worlds.

and for her 1-A key: Yumiella used to view her current world as fiction before she got reincarnated into the world of LMH by a caretaker of her previous tree.

Well the jump from 2-C to 1-A is massive.

I'm not entirely sure if the statement of viewing the previous world as fiction is enough to reach it without further context.

A similar effect could be achieved just by being one dimensional layer higher, in theory.