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BAN-KAI! Bleach General Discussion
- Thread starter Zoro21043
- Start date
Apollonir.Scale
He/Him- 2,082
- 1,145
Friends, is there any evidence supporting that Toshiro really went from Base Yammy level to Halibel level with training? Halibel was already holding herself back when Toshiro was against her. Toshiro does not scale Halibel as a raw ap. She could only freeze her with an attack that she received help from the clouds. In addition to Halibel holding herself back, Toshiro even has an elemental advantage. She can turn water, which is Halibel's power, into ice. Bazz B was much more superior to Toshiro with his elemental superiority. As you mentioned in the previous pages, the hollow named Hooleer was able to disperse Yamamoto's flames just because he has wind. Arc already explained this with the example of wind and fire when explaining that Hooler should fall. If a character is crushed by his opponent's holding himself back despite his elemental advantage, there is no reason for him to scale his Raw Ap.
Besides, I just looked at the manga again. Let alone 3 months, Orihime is taken to Hueco Mundo 12 hours after Toshiro fights Base Yammy. The morning they learn about this incident, news reaches Ichigo and the others. In the next episode, 239, Ichigo goes to school and Tatsuke tells him that Orihime disappeared yesterday. Let's add a day from here. Let's assume that Ichigo and Tatsuke's conversation at school is not the same as the day Ichigo received the news, but 1 day after he received the news. I assumed this because I don't know what time Ichigo goes to school. He goes to Urahara for the portal in the evening. It takes 1 day to save Orihime. The Vasto Lord form and the Dangai form appeared on the same day.
So how did Toshiro work in 2-3 days to get from the Base Yammy level to the Halibel level? It was confirmed by Renji, Chad and Rukia that Base Yammy is weaker than Nnoitra, AA and Granz, and the Base Yammy they are facing is their peak. He is stronger than the Base Yammy Toshiro fought.
Let's come to the Shinji example. Was it stated that the Vaizards were preparing to fight Aizen? No, we shouldn't expect a big change even in 3 days. Shinji thought that Ichigo couldn't make much progress with a month of training. Besides, Ichigo develops faster than most characters. We know that Mashiro is the only one who has controlled the Hollow Mask without training. So I don't understand what else you expect characters who already have mastery in hollow masks to do to reach Halibel level in 3 days?
Besides, I just looked at the manga again. Let alone 3 months, Orihime is taken to Hueco Mundo 12 hours after Toshiro fights Base Yammy. The morning they learn about this incident, news reaches Ichigo and the others. In the next episode, 239, Ichigo goes to school and Tatsuke tells him that Orihime disappeared yesterday. Let's add a day from here. Let's assume that Ichigo and Tatsuke's conversation at school is not the same as the day Ichigo received the news, but 1 day after he received the news. I assumed this because I don't know what time Ichigo goes to school. He goes to Urahara for the portal in the evening. It takes 1 day to save Orihime. The Vasto Lord form and the Dangai form appeared on the same day.
So how did Toshiro work in 2-3 days to get from the Base Yammy level to the Halibel level? It was confirmed by Renji, Chad and Rukia that Base Yammy is weaker than Nnoitra, AA and Granz, and the Base Yammy they are facing is their peak. He is stronger than the Base Yammy Toshiro fought.
Let's come to the Shinji example. Was it stated that the Vaizards were preparing to fight Aizen? No, we shouldn't expect a big change even in 3 days. Shinji thought that Ichigo couldn't make much progress with a month of training. Besides, Ichigo develops faster than most characters. We know that Mashiro is the only one who has controlled the Hollow Mask without training. So I don't understand what else you expect characters who already have mastery in hollow masks to do to reach Halibel level in 3 days?
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Like ? genuine question
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I'm not sure that's a correct interpretation. Toshiro never used his Bankai against Yammy, and it's important to note that Toshiro trains every day as well and he is very young.
He even admits that, even when using Bankai, he holds back because he’s not sure he can fully control its power. But when he does unleash it, he manages to impress both Starrk and Harribel.
Additionally, right after witnessing Soifon’s Bankai being used against Barragan and seeing Toshiro's Bankai at full power against Harribel, Starrk asks Shunsui whose Bankai would be stronger, his or Toshiro’s. This implies that Starrk found Toshiro’s performance more impressive than even Soifon’s Bankai.
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Verification - Klub Outside - Kubo Answers Translations
www.fanverse.org
Verification - Klub Outside - Kubo Answers Translations
www.fanverse.org
Somehow, I think this was one of the dumbest Klub Kubo Q&A's, and it's both really funny and sad.
If anyone cares, this is the cover the first question was about (a bit NSFW, obviously). (Also, the translator slightly messed it up, the question was able chapter 353, not 535).
Verification - Klub Outside - Kubo Answers Translations
www.fanverse.org
On a side note, I found that out this interview from Bleach JET was a thing. It's funny to know that Kubo at one point preferred small boobs, especially since he continually extolls his love of large breasts all of the time (including in this week's Q&A).
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Finally beat the main story of RoS. Super hyped to start the secret story mission. The main story was so bad it was funny. The goofy animations and wild cut content to adapt 423 chapters was super blatant. I still enjoyed playing through it tho.
I’m hoping the secret story missions aren’t like the random filler they inserted in the main story lol
I’m hoping the secret story missions aren’t like the random filler they inserted in the main story lol
Apollonir.Scale
He/Him- 2,082
- 1,145
You made a good point. But there is no reason to scale Soi Fon to Barragan. Barragan is always on low guard, thinking he's refuting everything. It's been shown many times in the series that when your guard is low, you can take damage from people who are thousands of times weaker than you. For example, Tosen-Hisagi.
Also, when Toshiro fights Bazz B, he says "Hyorinmaru is probably the least different between the captain-level zanpakuto, shikai and bankai powers." So even if he goes into Bankai against Yammy, the situation won't be much different. Unless he uses Sennen Hyoro like he did against off-guard Luppi.
You said that Halibel found his Bankai impressive, but the character finds it impressive because she can turn water into ice. I mentioned above that it has to do with the elemental advantage. If we don't scale Hooleer because he dispersed Yamamoto's flames with wind manipulation, we shouldn't scale Toshiro because he can freeze water in a similar way.
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Bazz-B said that because both the Shikai and Bankai control ice in various ways. That's it.
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@Adam1396 in case you are interested
vsbattles.com
Gerard Valkyrie vs Saitama (20-15-0)
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Gerard_Valkyrie https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Saitama Both at their multi solar system key (Saitama being parallel) Speed equalized Fight takes place in Z City LORE: Upon recieving news from Askin in the hospital bed that he failed to retrieve the...
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Whole OPM can not deal with mid godly.@Adam1396 in case you are interested
Gerard Valkyrie vs Saitama (20-15-0)
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Gerard_Valkyrie https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Saitama Both at their multi solar system key (Saitama being parallel) Speed equalized Fight takes place in Z City LORE: Upon recieving news from Askin in the hospital bed that he failed to retrieve the...
Gerard's cross can not be destroyed by conventional and physical means or it has regenerative properties like hogyoku or kubo just made comical statement to make fun of zaraki and toshiro considering Gerard was sk's part and unkillable needing sk yhwach to intervene. If spatial manipulation, durability negation, powernull, AZ failed to destroy it. What makes you think saitama can destroy it?
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Pretty sure it's just durability + resists to Gerard's cross
Apollonir.Scale
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When the quincy cross inside Gerard is destroyed, Gerard dies, yes, but how can we say that Saitama can destroy it? Toshiro and Zaraki, who are in the same Ap tier, could not destroy it either.
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You can see in the thread that many OPM supporters are voting Saitama due to his accelerated growth
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@ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn you should check on the thread because many opm supporters were saying Gerard's probability manipulation is too vague so therefore non combat applicable?
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Saitama also has accelerated development, I'm not going to claim it's impossible to blitz him. Just because he can grow faster doesn't mean he can't get blitzed.
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Using title as a way of scaling...cooking
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thats...him being able to keep up with zaraki
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It's also accepted in Gerard's profile that he gets faster with his AD
At least Massively Hypersonic (Despite being very huge in size, he could still keep up with Kenpachi Zaraki, Tōshirō Hitsugaya, and Byakuya Kuchiki and blocked attacks from them | At least Massively Hypersonic (Faster than before, can keep up with a Matured Tōshirō) | At least Massively Hypersonic (Should be faster than before)
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thats not what i asked for, well ill find it myself
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okayy i skimmed trough profile and he does not have Accelerated Development but Reactive Evolution instead
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If you click on "reactive power level", it would lead you to the AD page
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Then it shouldnt, since reactive power level is swapped to reactive evolution
And entire justification matches the ability since gerard needs to be harmed/killed to get stronger
Apollonir.Scale
He/Him- 2,082
- 1,145
By the way, I didn't think of it when I was replying to your message this morning, but I'm writing it now. If you scale Toshiro to Soi Fon's Bankai and Soi Fon's Bankai to Barragan as you said, you are making a circular scaling. In this case, Toshiro>Halibel should be the stat. Because you are increasing Toshiro over the stats of a character who is stated to be superior to Halibel.
Another thing that refutes the Reiatsu=Power logic is the equality of Ukitake and Shunsui. If Reiatsu=Power, Shunsui and Ukitake would not be equal. Because it was stated that Ukitake has more Reiatsu. So there is no need for me to give examples of the first 3 Espada and the noble problem in the novel. Shunsui and Ukitake also prove this situation.
If nothing very different is written, I will open a FKT Toshiro Downgrade CRT. Before I upgrade Uluqiorra, I need to lay the foundations for a few things.
ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn
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4-A Gremmy got accepted, and scaling that to other characters got accepted, too.
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Ap, speed advantage is not enough to deal with gerard. Not even close.
His almost whole body got destroyed including where his cross was supposed to be. Then he formed a new body.
I can also make an argument it has regenerative properties like hogyoku which wasn’t destroyed even after erasure.
Then what's your next argument?
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This match yeah but pretty sure it's a lost cause as Saitama got the fra train
BAN-KAI! Bleach General Discussion
I understand bankais aren't given a multiplier when they don't show stat Increase yes? But we know there is a stat increase with zaraki. Especially back in soul society arc where he fought ichigo. He sliced a sky scraper sized building in half with air pressure something he couldn't do before...
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It's about to be over since nobody except like four people here can actually debate with the verse to any respectable degree. I swear, anytime I see a new Bleach vs thread I know it's going to end poorly for the Bleach side since they can't argue 
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[/QUOTE]
We have seen before other object like hogyoku also didn’t get destroyed despite getting not just destroyed in conventional sense, erased as well.
Anyway Gerard doesn’t seem to have spatial hax resistance. I thought he resisted zaraki's shikai.
Should we make a thread about gerard's cross regenerative properties, spatial hax resistance? Etc. This is getting annoying.This match yeah but pretty sure it's a lost cause as Saitama got the fra train
BAN-KAI! Bleach General Discussion
I understand bankais aren't given a multiplier when they don't show stat Increase yes? But we know there is a stat increase with zaraki. Especially back in soul society arc where he fought ichigo. He sliced a sky scraper sized building in half with air pressure something he couldn't do before...
We have seen before other object like hogyoku also didn’t get destroyed despite getting not just destroyed in conventional sense, erased as well.
Anyway Gerard doesn’t seem to have spatial hax resistance. I thought he resisted zaraki's shikai.
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If you can argue in the thread and have Gerard winning at the end, I'll give you a cookieIt's about to be over since nobody except like four people here can actually debate with the verse to any respectable degree. I swear, anytime I see a new Bleach vs thread I know it's going to end poorly for the Bleach side since they can't argue
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Believe me, they won't even address his arguments and think they won counter argument.
FRA train supremacy
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I would but I just don't care about any of these match ups being made, to be honest. Trust me, if I wanted to debate on them, I would.
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Punching hard >>> Gerard
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Honestly, I dont think even you could fight off the opm supporters. They would still do the fra train
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We really do need a Miracle to break the grace
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That's true, and I say that as someone who tries to argue in Bleach vs threads (and then I forget about them, and then they close before I answer again...).It's about to be over since nobody except like four people here can actually debate with the verse to any respectable degree. I swear, anytime I see a new Bleach vs thread I know it's going to end poorly for the Bleach side since they can't argue
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