Updated/re-adjusting Demon King Daimaou ratings

[ArgentDragonPluto]

It is never even stated that Akuto has an avatar. do you have any evidence to back up your argument?

Akuto doesn’t need to say “I’m using avatars” because the narrative structure shows it. He observes fictional worlds, dies inside them, then moves on to view others. That’s literally what a self-inserted avatar does.

Akuto’s death in fiction (e.g., communist story) and rebirth elsewhere proves those aren’t the real Akuto, but rather they're narrative projections or self-inserts. He chooses endings across fictional possibilities. That’s not the behavior of a character in a story, it's the act of a storyteller outside it.

Sorry the story doesn’t hold your hand, Demon King Daimaou expects you to read between the lines.

 

[Antvasima]

Wankbreaker seems to make good points here.

@Ultima_Reality @DontTalkDT @Executor_N0 @Agnaa @Elizhaa @Qawsedf234 @Planck69 @Everything12 @Ovy7 @Rakih_Elyan @IdiosyncraticLawyer @RatherClueless @GrathOfLux @Udlmaster

Are you willing to help evaluate them please?

Updated/re-adjusting Demon King Daimaou ratings

Thank you. I trust your evaluation then. 🙏

vsbattles.com

 

[ArgentDragonPluto]

Wankbreaker seems to make good points here.

His points hinges on out of context quotes that are debunked by the story itself.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay.

 

[ArgentDragonPluto]

Okay.

I also want to mention, in case you haven't changed your own vote, this is the current staff tally: @DontTalkDT, @Antvasima, @Nierre, @ActuallySpaceMan42, and @Reiner04 agree. (He agreed with the CRT even after reading WankBreakers points)

 

[Antvasima]

Yes, but that was before Wankbreaker's objections, so it seems safest to get confirmations from a few knowledgeable members here.

 

[ArgentDragonPluto]

Yes, but that was before Wankbreaker's objections, so it seems safest to get confirmations from a few knowledgeable members here.

I doubt DT will change his stance, but I guess for others it should be confirmed, yes. (Though, as said, Reiner04 agreed with the CRT after WankBreakers post and my response to him.)

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. We are not in a great hurry though.

 

[ArgentDragonPluto]

Okay. We are not in a great hurry though.

Yeah, that's fine. Just trying to clear things up.

 

[Antvasima]

Yes. No problem.

 

[DontTalkDT]

Wankbreaker seems to make good points here.

@Ultima_Reality @DontTalkDT @Executor_N0 @Agnaa @Elizhaa @Qawsedf234 @Planck69 @Everything12 @Ovy7 @Rakih_Elyan @IdiosyncraticLawyer @RatherClueless @GrathOfLux @Udlmaster

Are you willing to help evaluate them please?

Updated/re-adjusting Demon King Daimaou ratings

Thank you. I trust your evaluation then. 🙏

vsbattles.com

Well, I continue to think the ratings suggested in the OP work.

What the R>F stuff is concerned, I think the story spells it out quite well that we are dealing with something like literal fictions. It mixes a bit between the "written fiction" and "dream" thing as a metaphor on occassion, but generally I find the point made clear.
To briefly focus on the dream metaphor: Consider that the dreamer is in the end TLOI. As in, she is the source of every being that has a sense of self. She "dreams" to be these people.
But as the linked quote says, there easily can be levels between her and the people. She could dream to be someone that dreams to be a human in the main reality.
What I mean to get to here is that the general reason we see people appear in different levels of R>F (Well, protagonists aside they only go one direction, really) is because their identity is a "divine spark" projected at them from the very top of all layers, i.e. from TLOI. Metaphorically speaking, it's pretty much a matter of waking up / falling asleep, I think.

But anyway, I agree more with the points made by StorytellingDemonKing for the most part.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. Then I am fine with this revision as well, and think that it can probably be reapplied.

 

[ArgentDragonPluto]

Okay. Then I am fine with this revision as well, and think that it can probably be reapplied.

I will reapply the revisions after work.

 

[Udlmaster]

@Udlmaster

Are you willing to help evaluate them please?

Sure.

I had a look at the blog, mostly everything within it seemed fine.

The only part that gives me pause is the Afterlife being High 1-A rather than 1-A+.

I've not read Demon King Daimaou, so I'm relying on the veracity of the blog, but the way it's described is an infinite regressive universe that seems to follow each of the fictional universes.

From just the blog itself, it didn't give me any impression it sees all Worlds as equally insignificant but that all Worlds can be made there, so if there's any additional context towards it being High 1-A, I would appreciate that.

I did read the explanation section, but you forgot to add in the stuff about the Archetypal Gods and some others existing prior to the Fictional structure.

Akuto Sai himself seems distinct from the Afterlife and given he seems to have actually existed prior to it all and specifically comes from when there was no stories, him being High 1-A seems fine, since he's originally outside the infinite regression of the Afterlife.

After that everything seems fine and well-reasoned, just the Afterlife section I'd like a bit more info on.

(btw, I'd probably have the Multiverse be At least 2-B, likely 2-A because more tiers means more possible battles )

 

[ArgentDragonPluto]

I've not read Demon King Daimaou, so I'm relying on the veracity of the blog, but the way it's described is an infinite regressive universe that seems to follow each of the fictional universes.

From just the blog itself, it didn't give me any impression it sees all Worlds as equally insignificant but that all Worlds can be made there, so if there's any additional context towards it being High 1-A, I would appreciate that.

I did read the explanation section, but you forgot to add in the stuff about the Archetypal Gods and some others existing prior to the Fictional structure.

If you read the explanation section then what extra evidence would you like? The infinite layers of R>F is just a mere fictional construct (lies) on a piece of paper in its entirety with the Afterlife being an infinitely vast "room" containing all possible worlds that are logically non-contradictory. It basically sees no difference between an infinite R>F hierarchy the same way a single R>F layer sees everything bellow it, that is, the entire framework of R>F would be nonexistent in comparison to its infinite size, and it not even the limit of it, as after all, all possible worlds include everything that can be put into writing.

“This place is... an endless flat plane. Like a desert, I guess.” Hiroshi looked around.

“Of course, I can make it look like anything I want. But I’m trying to keep stories from emerging.”

“This is your world, then.”

“I guess so. What do you want to drink? I haven’t decided what this is yet,” Akuto said casually. When Hiroshi looked in the cup, there was what he could only describe as a liquid that hadn’t become anything yet.

“I’ll take water. Natural mineral water,” Hiroshi said. The liquid bubbled and became cold mineral water.

“I see.” Hiroshi swallowed the water. It felt pleasant and cool as it went down his throat.

“What’s it like being able to do anything?” Hiroshi asked after a moment.

“It feels like I’ve reached the endpoint of the pleasure I can experience as a living thing,” Akuto said. Hiroshi laughed a little.

Volume 13

As for Archetype Gods existing prior:

“These are the original models that gave birth to the universes.”

Their voices compelled him to look behind them. He did so, looking out towards the horizon. There were shadows! Shadows! Shadows! as far as he could see. These were not simple figures like the ones he’d seen so far. They had different clothes. Different genders. Their shadows flickered in the corner of his eye. And within them, they had billions of beings. Each of the shadows had ghosts within them, just like Akuto.

Volume 13

They exist prior to structured reality and are the ones that give them meaning.

After that everything seems fine and well-reasoned, just the Afterlife section I'd like a bit more info on.

And I hope I provided an explanation for it.

(btw, I'd probably have the Multiverse be At least 2-B, likely 2-A because more tiers means more possible battles )

(the multiverse will be high 1-b+ since its already accepted as that, tier 2 segment will be changed once applying it to the blog. And not that it matter since no one has relevant scaling to it, only above it )

 

[ArgentDragonPluto]

Okay. Then I am fine with this revision as well, and think that it can probably be reapplied.

Alright, since I am off-work now I will apply the accepted changes.

 

[ArgentDragonPluto]

Okay. Then I am fine with this revision as well, and think that it can probably be reapplied.

The following pages can be closed:

• https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Ichiban_Ushiro_no_Daimaou_Explanation_Page
• https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Akuto_Sai
• https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Hiroshi_Miwa
• https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/The_Law_of_Identity
• https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/The_Extra-universal_Gods
• https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Boichiro_Yamato

And this CRT can be closed as well.

 

[Reiner04]

The following pages can be closed:

• https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Ichiban_Ushiro_no_Daimaou_Explanation_Page
• https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Akuto_Sai
• https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Hiroshi_Miwa
• https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/The_Law_of_Identity
• https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/The_Extra-universal_Gods
• https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Boichiro_Yamato

And this CRT can be closed as well.

@TWILIGHT-OP Can you close the following profiles?

 

[Antvasima]

@TWILIGHT-OP Can you close the following profiles?

I handled it.

 

[Reiner04]

Closing the thread then.

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you to everybody who helped out here.