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Nonduality -- Saint Seiya Part 1

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ActuallySpaceMan42 said:
I mean, I'm in no rush, but if you want to, go ahead
Click to expand...

Evidence #1: Explicit Statement Dualities and Logical Negations Within the Verse​


Saint Seiya directly acknowledges and emphasizes the concept of "dualities" and their inherent negations. The scans below illustrate this explicitly:


Dualities; the word, is straight up name dropped. In addition, we have descriptions of them having logical negations



Everything in verse from people, locations, hierarchies and even objects are straight up stated to be participating in dualities

and its then straight up stated that one must be annihilated because the neither can be true at the same time. This is a form of negation.

The above scans come from Saint Seiya: Episode G Assassins Chapter # 100 or Volume 14

To give you more context; Gold Cloth A and Gold Cloth B cannot both be Authentic at the same time. One must be False.


Another example from much earlier in the series; Shura cannot be "Not dead" in the present and "Dead" in the past. But he is alive in the present due to time travel. Thus the Universe attempts to kill him. This is another form of Negation.

JNsJ7fm.jpeg


DW4EIAr.jpeg


There is other explanations that can go into here, but ultimately all of these accumulation of events leads to Pope Kanon discussing these dualities in chapter 100 and how they cannot both be simultaneously true.


Keeping it short and simple its directly stated that there is a "Logical" System to the Universes. as lancelot is stated to be "separate* from the logic of this world." on its own this statement would probably yield nothing but the context is important because the fact he is "separate* of this logic" means He isn't going through the same hardships as shura who is being actively erased by the Universe for creating an "error" in the universes "Logic."

also because Time Paradox keeps coming up a lot as a counterargument. This scan say this Universal mechanic affects even siblings (Twins/ Kanon and Saga) who were born in the same timeline, in the same era, at the same time.

and we have Shura who was duplicated by a black hole so its more like Psuedo/faux Time Travel and not genuine time travel. Refer to this scan here. he is present in both worlds at the same time.

Anyways Kanon when talking about these dualities say this applies to everything. THe negation comes from the fact that only 1 can survive while the other will suffer annihilation or extinction. In Shura's case its shown that the Universal Mechanism is erasure

Edit: The word duality is name dropped and then kanon goes on further to explain how there is a form of Negation that does happen. This explanation is chapter 100 of Saint Seiya: Episode G Assassins.
 
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Two of the same things not being able to exist at he same time, even if they're described as dualities in the verse, wouldn't qualify as dualities as we describe them on the wiki, I don't believe.

After all, duality is something, and then non-something, not duplicates of something canceling each other out.
 
ActuallySpaceMan42 said:
Two of the same things not being able to exist at he same time, even if they're described as dualities in the verse, wouldn't qualify as dualities as we describe them on the wiki, I don't believe.

After all, duality is something, and then non-something, not duplicates of something canceling each other out.
Click to expand...
well i am arguing for that. hmm let me try to explain it this way. The scans are talking logical contradictions of two exclusive truths existing simultaneously. something being both A and not A. What’s being rejected isn’t a physical duplication, but a contradiction of identity or status that breaks the logic of the world.

Here in this scan we have this statement
"“Both are genuine… | It is impossible for two Aquarius Cloths to exist in this world… | it will be annihilation”"

A logical issue was set up

  • A = The Aquarius Cloth is a unique, genuine object that can only exist singularly within this world.
  • Not A = A second, equally genuine Aquarius Cloth exists in the same world, violating that uniqueness.

both cannot logically be true in the same system, the world annihilates the contradiction. the universe refuses to accept this as a logically valid state. Basically "Two truths cannot coexist so one must go for the other to be actively true."




The same thing happens with Shura: (The reason this is important is because this is one of the major events that led to the discussion and explanation by Kanon in chapter 100 of Saint Seiya Episode G Assassins about Dualities and this negation of the other state applies to everything.)

  • A = Shura is dead in this time period (per historical record).
  • Not A = Shura is alive in this same time period

“Shura’s existence is being devoured by the time of this world.” | "I will disappear forever" | "To be denied my whole existence, my whole history the fear of facing rejection from the whole world" | "He erased his own existence. denied himself everything."

Also Lancelot isn't a duplicate of the world, and additionally Kanon explains that him and his sibiling (Twin) Saga [whom are not duplicates of each other] are also subjected to this universal mechanism. Lancelot is only protected by this because his Holy Sword separates him from the Logic of the World. Otherwise he would be erased, which after his holy sword broke and couldn't be repaired was happening until Chaos Athena stepped in.

anyways, this aligns with VS Battle Wiki’s own wording:


“For this ability, dualities refer to logical dualities where the duality is between ‘A’ and ‘not A’, where A is some object or attribute.”
“Not all verses follow this logic, and many may treat things not logically considered dualities… as dualities, meaning what is and isn’t a duality can change between verses.”
Click to expand...

The Saint Seiya verse defines its own form of logical system.
 
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i tried fixing the vote count so it looks more organized. let me know if i put a vote in wrong please

thank you!
 
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Reiner04 said:
Super series serious bump.
Click to expand...
Evidence #2 has 3 staff agrees.

I think that's enough to close this thread as accepted for Evidence #2?

I can always revisit #1 in the future as it is rejected in this crt, but for right now

I'll focus on the follow up thread on what abilities this makes character immune too and who scales and why
 
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