Smooth DBS stuff

[TheGodOfICE777]

Side Note: Null’s scan did not have the wedding stuff, so my friend digged through Daizenshuu 7 himself and found it. The events outline what happened in OG DB and is literally just telling us the time period of when it occurred, such as it does for the movies and other world tourney (didn’t specifically look for this one, but trusting what Null said in his initial post). It doesn’t necessarily mean the events had to have occurred in the manga. I mean if your own criteria is that as long as it doesn’t contradict the manga you can argue for Cooler’s revenge and other world tournament being canon. Plus we already have it accepted that Annin is anime and not manga, so there’s no point of trying to make Annin canon to the manga. The fact that she’s canon to the DB anime and the wedding is shown should be enough.

Not sure what the point of this stonewalling is

This thread has been accepted, if one person disagrees, too bad

Just agree to disagree and move on

I wanted to make sure to address everyone’s comments, but I suppose you’re right.

 

[Omegabronic]

Again I’m not denying there’s manga events that it gives time periods too, but that doesn’t exclude the fact that there’s other stuff on that same page that isn’t merely manga events. Idk why you keep repeating yourself.

because the timeline of the manga event proves that it is canon? there is no way to make that clearer

Theres no manga scans of the manga arc taking place

It is an anime arc... the heck did you expected? it being canon doesn't change that

, I’m obviously not denying that Goku and Chi Chi got married, but the scene of it we see in Kai is the one in OG DB, where after Goku and Chi Chi deal with Ann they get married.

which is listed in the timeline of the manga as something that happened, aka, it is manga canon... the wedding arc are said to have canonically happened and have a placement, contrary to several other filler arcs,s top ignoring the point

Daizenshuu 7 is giving the time period of events that happened regardless of if they showed up in the manga

why them showing up in the manga matter for them being canon or not? again, it showing up in the manga doesn't matter for a canonicity talk, the timeline is for the events of the manga, so if it appears there it is something that happened in the timeline of the manga... it is such a simple point that i don't understand how you are not seeing this is what i am arguing for

, and again Null did not translate the scan

then how does he know what it is said in it?... this is silly, of course he did, else... how would he know what it says there? also

, so it’s not even 100% certain that it talks about the wedding arc itself and could just be talking about them getting married. You’re entire argument is based off something we don’t even have the full translation of.

We do have the translation, the events of the wedding arc are verbatim said to have happened

If that’s not the point you’re making then it really doesn’t matter, since it’s never shown or implied that the events of Ann took place in the manga.

It is literally said it did... in the official timeline of the manga in Daizenshuu 7... look, i get not agreeing... but ignoring the point as if i am not even arguing about it is silly

No it’s not being listed as manga canon, my dude that’s the argument I’m attacking, it’s just giving periods of certain events which is why I’m emphasizing the anime and movies so much.

the whole point of the section is listing all the events that TOOK PLACE in the world of the manga, and list them in Chronological order, the only movies listed are the most logical ones, besides... what does the movies have to do with the wedding arc at all? one is independent of the other... so why are you talking about it and not the subject at hand

I’m saying that I don’t have to debate the fact that the wedding arc occurred in the manga because in the current profiles we currently accept it being an anime thing.

which is prone to change? this is a CRT, if i am showing evidence of otherwise, and you are arguing about canon to begin with... then why can't we change it? it isn't set in stone and you are the one trying to change what is accepted as Kai canon to begin with, so like... nothing more to say, being accepted before the evidence of otherwise was shown doesn't make said evidence disappear

 

[Omegabronic]

I wanted to make sure to address everyone’s comments, but I suppose you’re right.

no? as one of the things of your blog is using stuff from a continuity that isn't accepted as Kai canon yet... Nierre and LordTracer asked for the scans for Toei DB to be Kai canon... we kind of need this proven for the blog to pass

Side Note: Null’s scan did not have the wedding stuff, so my friend digged through Daizenshuu 7 himself and found it. The events outline what happened in OG DB and is literally just telling us the time period of when it occurred, such as it does for the movies and other world tourney (didn’t specifically look for this one, but trusting what Null said in his initial post). It doesn’t necessarily mean the events had to have occurred in the manga. I mean if your own criteria is that as long as it doesn’t contradict the manga you can argue for Cooler’s revenge and other world tournament being canon. Plus we already have it accepted that Annin is anime and not manga, so there’s no point of trying to make Annin canon to the manga. The fact that she’s canon to the DB anime and the wedding is shown should be enough.

It did... i literally linked the translation, it does have the wedding stuff in it

also... i could argue for those... but that isn't the point of contention right now, the thing is showing a singular timeline of the story of DB's world: "Since the days when the universe was still in chaos, many warriors have been born, and the opening act of Dragon Ball's story began! We'll show you the Dragon Ball timeline, which has never been released publicly before!!"

you are wrong here, it does mean it happened in the manga... as that is exactly what the timeline is showing to begin with, you cannot add non accepted stuff, like OG DB being canon, to your blog without actually proposing it to begin with

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I reopened the thread for the purpose of continuing what was overlooked and to address a few additions added inappropriately. Though given that misunderstandings and accidents happen, I do not believe anyone in particular is to blame.

 

[LordTracer]

So, the main thing that needs to be be determined now is if DB Kai follows off of the Dragon Ball manga or anime.

 

[Omegabronic]

So, the main thing that needs to be be determined now is if DB Kai follows off of the Dragon Ball manga or anime.

One of the arguments used to say it is Dragon Ball anime is a scene from the filler wedding arc that appears in a flashback, however that arc is officially considered part of the manga timeline listed in Daizenshuu 7 in the section "Dragon Ball Chronology
Chronological Table of DB World", which deacribes the contents as

"Since the days when the universe was still in chaos, many warriors have been born, and the opening act of Dragon Ball's story began! We'll show you the Dragon Ball timeline, which has never been released publicly before!!"
Aka, it is listing the events that happened in the official main timeline in order

So it would be Manga canon to begin with

We do have the translation, the events of the wedding arc are verbatim said to have happened

 

[Dagoth_OwO]

One of the arguments used to say it is Dragon Ball anime is a scene from the filler wedding arc that appears in a flashback, however that arc is officially considered part of the manga timeline listed in Daizenshuu 7 in the section "Dragon Ball Chronology
Chronological Table of DB World", which deacribes the contents as

"Since the days when the universe was still in chaos, many warriors have been born, and the opening act of Dragon Ball's story began! We'll show you the Dragon Ball timeline, which has never been released publicly before!!"
Aka, it is listing the events that happened in the official main timeline in order

So it would be Manga canon to begin with

Ummm I'm reading the link you posted for the Daizenshuu 7 DB Chronology section and it literally mentions anime only things like Cooler, Garlick Jr. & the Afterlife Tournament arc

 

[ArcaneAbyss]

Cooler, garlic jnr, afterlife, z fighters facing those Saiyans in the past etc

It's clearly showing both manga and anime content

Not sure what his point is

 

[Omegabronic]

Ummm I'm reading the link you posted for the Daizenshuu 7 DB Chronology section and it literally mentions anime only things like Cooler, Garlick Jr. & the Afterlife Tournament arc

I don't get this argument, it mentions things introduced in the Anime... which has no bearing on the argument, that being them being listed in the Chronological timeline for the Manga

I am currently arguing for the Wedding arc, but i don't see why this just wouldn't make those that do not contradict the manga canon, you speak as if those are deal breakers when none of them have anything to do with the wedding arc

heck, very few movies are listed, and it is only the plausible ones... i honestly don't see the argument here, i am arguing that if it is added in the official timeline for the events of the manga, and it doesn't have contradictions, then it should be canon

 

[Omegabronic]

Cooler, garlic jnr, afterlife, z fighters facing those Saiyans in the past etc

It's clearly showing both manga and anime content

Not sure what his point is

not really else it would also include all other filler and Movies, all of which are anime canon... yet it doesn't, it only mentions specific ones, the section is clear in its description that it is listing the chronological events in the timeline of the manga, it having anime content just make those anime content in question canon as something that happened in the manga

 

[CryoTheMayo]

Okay my take is this:

• Anime-only content is not accepted as canon to the manga currently. Make a CRT for it.
• There is content that only appears in the original anime in DBZ Kai which supports the original anime being canon to Kai.
• Since there is evidence the original anime is canon to Kai that then means Time Rooms should be considered valid material for Kai

Any arguments regarding this (Wedding arc is canon to the manga) has to be addressed in an entire other CRT because it would also mean canonising Garlic Jr, Cooler Movie, etc. It can't be cherrypicked and it can't be settled in this CRT alone.

So in short using the Wedding arc as evidence is perfectly acceptable here. It is not illegitimate. Because the arguments being used to illegitimise it would have sweeping effects on the entire manga aspect of the verse.

 

[Omegabronic]

Okay my take is this:

• Anime-only content is not accepted as canon to the manga currently. Make a CRT for it.

Why not change it here alongside the change to include it in Kai? Why is one change ok to propose but others aren't? Kind of a double standard don't you think?

• There is content that only appears in the original anime in DBZ Kai which supports the original anime being canon to Kai.

The only thing brought up so far is the wedding arc... which i have shown it is clearly manga canon

• Since there is evidence the original anime is canon to Kai that then means Time Rooms should be considered valid material for Kai

There isn't any shown outside of 1 flashback tho... which i showed is manga canon to begin with

Any arguments regarding this (Wedding arc is canon to the manga) has to be addressed in an entire other CRT because it would also mean canonising Garlic Jr, Cooler Movie, etc. It can't be cherrypicked and it can't be settled in this CRT alone.

Why would it mean any of those need to be canon as well? None of them have anything to do with the wedding arx, what are you talking about?

So in short using the Wedding arc as evidence is perfectly acceptable here. It is not illegitimate. Because the arguments being used to illegitimise it would have sweeping effects on the entire manga aspect of the verse.

The wedding arc is minor and affects nothing on the grand scale of things... this is just untrue

 

[TheGodOfICE777]

Okay my take is this:

• Anime-only content is not accepted as canon to the manga currently. Make a CRT for it.
• There is content that only appears in the original anime in DBZ Kai which supports the original anime being canon to Kai.
• Since there is evidence the original anime is canon to Kai that then means Time Rooms should be considered valid material for Kai

Any arguments regarding this (Wedding arc is canon to the manga) has to be addressed in an entire other CRT because it would also mean canonising Garlic Jr, Cooler Movie, etc. It can't be cherrypicked and it can't be settled in this CRT alone.

So in short using the Wedding arc as evidence is perfectly acceptable here. It is not illegitimate. Because the arguments being used to illegitimise it would have sweeping effects on the entire manga aspect of the verse.

So, the main thing that needs to be be determined now is if DB Kai follows off of the Dragon Ball manga or anime.

Send them here

I don't get this argument, it mentions things introduced in the Anime... which has no bearing on the argument, that being them being listed in the Chronological timeline for the Manga

I am currently arguing for the Wedding arc, but i don't see why this just wouldn't make those that do not contradict the manga canon, you speak as if those are deal breakers when none of them have anything to do with the wedding arc

heck, very few movies are listed, and it is only the plausible ones... i honestly don't see the argument here, i am arguing that if it is added in the official timeline for the events of the manga, and it doesn't have contradictions, then it should be canon

not really else it would also include all other filler and Movies, all of which are anime canon... yet it doesn't, it only mentions specific ones, the section is clear in its description that it is listing the chronological events in the timeline of the manga, it having anime content just make those anime content in question canon as something that happened in the manga

Just trying to get your thoughts Nierre and LordTracer. Summarized here basically the justification for Kai continuing from the anime is showing stuff that happens in the wedding arc with Annin (who we currently accept is anime only, and not canon to the manga)

The argument for it continuing off the manga is that the chronological timeline in Daizenshuu 7 that shows the movies and other anime-only arcs, such as Otherworld tournament, Garlic Jr, and the wedding arc; however, seeming to argue that only the wedding arc is manga canon (not currently accepted, but it’s a point that keeps being brought up)

So where do you two stand in terms of this?

 

[CryoTheMayo]

Why not change it here alongside the change to include it in Kai? Why is one change ok to propose but others aren't? Kind of a double standard don't you think?

You're missing the point entirely. So I have no interest in bloating the thread needlessly with a circular argument with you. I made my stance clear.

 

[TheGodOfICE777]

You're missing the point entirely. So I have no interest in bloating the thread needlessly with a circular argument with you. I made my stance clear.

Yeah we really shouldn’t be arguing that those stretch of OG db anime-only episodes are canon, since on the current profiles literally accepted that she’s anime only. But he keeps doing it for some reason, I also told him on discord if he wants to change the canonicity status of the wedding arc he shouldn’t be trying to change that in this thread, since the only thing relevant right now is where Kai continues off of. From the looks of it I’m being ignored though, and can’t do much about it.

 

[ChoursDropoff]

Why not change it here alongside the change to include it in Kai? Why is one change ok to propose but others aren't? Kind of a double standard don't you think?

Because the thread is all but concluded, this is derailing at this point.

There isn't any shown outside of 1 flashback tho... which i showed is manga canon to begin with


Why would it mean any of those need to be canon as well? None of them have anything to do with the wedding arx, what are you talking about?


The wedding arc is minor and affects nothing on the grand scale of things... this is just untrue

But I don’t get what your point is though. What would the significance of the wedding narrative wise have to do with the legitimacy of the shared canon?

 

[LordTracer]

So, this statement from Kai’s producer, which is used in the cosmology blog as part of the justification for Kai being canon to DBS, says that Kai is meant to be “close to the original manga” and “as faithful as possible”. That implies to me that Kai is more connected to the manga than the anime.

However, as people have brought up, Kai does reference an anime-only moment like Goku and Chi-Chi’s wedding arc, so I would like to propose a compromise solution: Kai is based off of the manga and made to be faithful to it, but anything from the original anime that is directly referenced or mentioned by Kai, such as the wedding arc, can be considered canon as well.

@Nierre @DarkDragonMedeus Your thoughts on this suggestion would be much appreciated.

 

[TiltedFN]

So, this statement from Kai’s producer, which is used in the cosmology blog as part of the justification for Kai being canon to DBS, says that Kai is meant to be “close to the original manga” and “as faithful as possible”. That implies to me that Kai is more connected to the manga than the anime.

However, as people have brought up, Kai does reference an anime-only moment like Goku and Chi-Chi’s wedding arc, so I would like to propose a compromise solution: Kai is based off of the manga and made to be faithful to it, but anything from the original anime that is directly referenced or mentioned by Kai, such as the wedding arc, can be considered canon as well.

@Nierre @DarkDragonMedeus Your thoughts on this suggestion would be much appreciated.

Just to clarify, does this mean you think the time room would ONLY be canon to the dbs manga?

 

[ChoursDropoff]

So, this statement from Kai’s producer, which is used in the cosmology blog as part of the justification for Kai being canon to DBS, says that Kai is meant to be “close to the original manga” and “as faithful as possible”. That implies to me that Kai is more connected to the manga than the anime.

The DBS anime also shows scenes from Kai exclusively, Kai should be canon to both.

However, as people have brought up, Kai does reference an anime-only moment like Goku and Chi-Chi’s wedding arc, so I would like to propose a compromise solution: Kai is based off of the manga and made to be faithful to it, but anything from the original anime that is directly referenced or mentioned by Kai, such as the wedding arc, can be considered canon as well.

@Nierre @DarkDragonMedeus Your thoughts on this suggestion would be much appreciated.

 

[Vietthai96]

So, this statement from Kai’s producer, which is used in the cosmology blog as part of the justification for Kai being canon to DBS, says that Kai is meant to be “close to the original manga” and “as faithful as possible”. That implies to me that Kai is more connected to the manga than the anime.

However, as people have brought up, Kai does reference an anime-only moment like Goku and Chi-Chi’s wedding arc, so I would like to propose a compromise solution: Kai is based off of the manga and made to be faithful to it, but anything from the original anime that is directly referenced or mentioned by Kai, such as the wedding arc, can be considered canon as well.

@Nierre @DarkDragonMedeus Your thoughts on this suggestion would be much appreciated.

To be fair, the suppose "close to the original manga" and "as faithful as possible to manga" is just removing filler episodes, so in a sense, it is just DBZ Anime without fillers, and DBZ Anime is canon to DB OG Anime, even DBZ Kai still have scenes and references about DB OG Anime, so DBZ Kai should be more canon to DB OG Anime, it could also be canon to both OG Anime and Manga, since iirc, OG Anime is pretty faithful to manga, just with some added fillers that contradict nothing, such as the Time Room stuffs

 

[LordTracer]

Just to clarify, does this mean you think the time room would ONLY be canon to the dbs manga?

No? I wasn’t talking about the DBS manga at all.

The DBS anime also shows scenes from Kai exclusively, Kai should be canon to both.

I don’t think you’re understanding what I mean. I’m talking about the original DB anime/manga and which one Kai connects to, since that’s what’s currently in question. I’m not talking about Kai’s connection to the DBS anime, which has already been accepted.

To be fair, the suppose "close to the original manga" and "as faithful as possible to manga" is just removing filler episodes,

You’re not necessarily incorrect, in the sense that they did remove filler as a way to make Kai more faithful to the manga, but that’s also not what the statement actually says. They edited and organized the story to be more faithful to the manga, and they exclusively compare it to the original manga, not the anime, so saying it should be more canon to the DB anime doesn’t seem right.

Hence why I prefer the idea of Kai continuing from the DB manga, but if something from the DB anime is referenced in Kai, that specific thing can be treated as canon.

 

[Killerdrone123]

You’re not necessarily incorrect, in the sense that they did remove filler as a way to make Kai more faithful to the manga, but that’s also not what the statement actually says. They edited and organized the story to be more faithful to the manga, and they exclusively compare it to the original manga, not the anime, so saying it should be more canon to the DB anime doesn’t seem right.

Hence why I prefer the idea of Kai continuing from the DB manga, but if something from the DB anime is referenced in Kai, that specific thing can be treated as canon.

I mean can't we agree on a common ground that time room should be included to since like it is mention in guides,even official db site list it under toyataro art meaning it is something that is present in the franchise,I remember you saying the art would be canon to manga and now we are considering db manga canon to kai not to mention it doesn't contradict anything

Smooth DBS stuff

Not much to say about this blog, but that it has stuff for the cosmology of DBS.

vsbattles.com

 

[LordTracer]

under toyataro art meaning it is something that is present in the franchise

Present in the franchise =/= canon to every single continuity. As I already said last time you mentioned this, an article explaining what a sketch Toyotaro did is based on means literally nothing for canonicity.

saying the art would be canon to manga and now we are considering db manga canon

That is not what I said. I said that even if it did mean something for canonicity (which clearly implies that it doesn’t) it’d be for the DBS manga (not the original DB manga, which is what Kai would be canon to) since that’s what Toyotaro works on. But again, Toyotaro doing a sketch of the characters doesn’t even remotely mean that the episode they appeared in is canon.

 

[TheGodOfICE777]

So, this statement from Kai’s producer, which is used in the cosmology blog as part of the justification for Kai being canon to DBS, says that Kai is meant to be “close to the original manga” and “as faithful as possible”. That implies to me that Kai is more connected to the manga than the anime.

However, as people have brought up, Kai does reference an anime-only moment like Goku and Chi-Chi’s wedding arc, so I would like to propose a compromise solution: Kai is based off of the manga and made to be faithful to it, but anything from the original anime that is directly referenced or mentioned by Kai, such as the wedding arc, can be considered canon as well.

@Nierre @DarkDragonMedeus Your thoughts on this suggestion would be much appreciated.

The anime is an adaptation of the manga, so it being made more faithful than originally doesn’t mean that it’s the literal sequel to the OG DB Manga because in the context of DB. The OG DB anime was also made as an adaptation to the manga. There’s no real thing as DBZ in the manga; it’s just one DB manga with over 600 chapters. Kai being intended to be more faithful to the original story, doesn’t really necessitate that the first 300 chapters apply, while the next 300 chapters don’t apply to the anime.

I feel like arguing that anime-only stuff being shown in Kai means that, that material is suddenly canon to the manga is a bit strange, since you could also apply that logic to pretty much any flashback we see in Kai. I don’t see how that wouldn’t be an evidence of it continuing from it continuing from the OG DB Anime when it literally has to be. I also feel it’s a bit weird that we’re attempting to canonize arcs that aren’t in the manga, to avoid the issue of Kai showing legitimate flashbacks from that are anime exclusive to OG DB, when we currently accept that as being an anime only thing with profiles like Annin.
I guess there’s not much to do if the rest of the staff agree with this though, I just wanted to give my thoughts on this. I do think if we’re being consistent though that would mean information within Kai applies to those manga chapters within the DB Manga too.

 

[AwkguyDB]

With all the current agreements with staff and the constant moot points (and some stonewalling), can we not conclude this thread?

 

[Kroneii1]

The blog looks good and is well constructed, I wonder why there are different voids.

 

[Da3ggman]

This was doomed to keep extending for several unnecessary pages as soon as you had DBS in the title lol

Is there like a summary of each sides points or something? I don’t feel like going back through the thread tbh

 

[TheGodOfICE777]

This was doomed to keep extending for several unnecessary pages as soon as you had DBS in the title lol

Is there like a summary of each sides points or something? I don’t feel like going back through the thread tbh

Basically it’s regarding whether time room scan should be used:

Arguments for: Chozenshuu & Daizenshuu mention the time room so we should be able to use it for Kai; Kai continues off from DB Anime because it shows a scene from the wedding arc of Goku and Chi Chi which had Annin (who we currently accept is anime canon), wasn’t present in the manga showing that it has DB anime exclusive scenes; DB official site references the time room and that young roshi and crane master were revealed when Goku used the time room.

Arguments against: I believe the argument against the Chozenshuu & Daizenshuu statements was that it was merely a reference to DB anime; The wedding arc should now be considered canon, since Kai is meant to be more faithful and anything that Kai adapts should now be considered canon to the first portion of DB manga (even though they should realistically just be a point against it continuing from that portion, especially considering that we don’t accept this currently); DB official site statement of Toyataro doesn’t necessarily make it canon since the context of it is relating to a sketch.

The arguments against it will probably be accepted, but I just hope with it and allow Kai information to apply to the DB Manga then, and vice versa.

 

[LordTracer]

With all the current agreements with staff and the constant moot points (and some stonewalling), can we not conclude this thread?

The cosmology blog has already been accepted and applied. However, the blog originally used material from the original DB anime, which hadn’t yet been accepted as canon, so that was removed from the blog and the thread was re-opened to determine if the anime should be used or not.

 

[Robo432343]

Can someone make a new thread to explain why it should be canon

 

[Omegabronic]

The cosmology blog has already been accepted and applied. However, the blog originally used material from the original DB anime, which hadn’t yet been accepted as canon, so that was removed from the blog and the thread was re-opened to determine if the anime should be used or not.

The blog linked in the Hypertimeline section uses the Time Room, Original DB Anime material, for its main points, should probably be reworded depending on how this concludes

 

[Gp972]

1. Fusion Zamasu is weaker

https://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/dragon-ball-super-tori-toyo-free-talk-vo-2/

2. Dragon Ball Z: Battle of Gods is a continuation of the manga, and Bills (Beerus) is the strongest enemy

Translations | "Battle of Gods" Promotional Pamphlet #2 - Akira Toriyama

Translation of Akira Toriyama's comments on the film Battle of Gods from the movie's second promotional pamphlet in Japan

www.kanzenshuu.com

3. Akira confirms that the Golden Freezer movie is a continuation of the manga

Translations | V-Jump (September 2014): Akira Toriyama's Comment

www.kanzenshuu.com

4. Akira claims that the DBS anime follows the DB manga

Translations | Dragon Ball Super: Super Start Guide - Message From Akira Toriyama

English translation of the 'Message From Akira Toriyama' introduction comment from the July 2015 'Dragon Ball Super: Super Start Guide' book

www.kanzenshuu.com

5. Akira reviews the storyboards for Toyotaro

Translations | "Dragon Ball Super" Manga Vol. 1 Tori-Toyo Interview (Web Version)

English translation of the web interview with Akira Toriyama and Toyotaro in conjunctions with the first 'Dragon Ball Super' manga volume

www.kanzenshuu.com

6. Toei confirms that they work based on Akira's script

Translations | Dragon Ball Official Site - The Artisans Who Made the Universe Survival Arc

English translation of the 'The Artisans Who Made the Universe Survival Arc of Dragon Ball Super, Now Reaching Its Climax' interview from the official Japanese Dragon Ball website

www.kanzenshuu.com

7. Toei and Shueisha say the manga is canon



8. Akira is in charge of the direct script of the manga

MANGA Plus by SHUEISHA

mangaplus.shueisha.co.jp

9. V-Jump confirms that the DBS anime is based on the creator's drafts

News | Early "Dragon Ball Super" Story Details in August 2015 V-Jump

The August 2015 issue of V-Jump in Japan provides preliminary details on the upcoming 'Dragon Ball Super' TV series set to debut in July

www.kanzenshuu.com

10. Toyotaro and Toei work based on Akira's drafts

News | "Dragon Ball Super" TV Series Debut Set For July 5th

The 'Dragon Ball Super' TV series will debut on Fuji TV in Japan beginning 05 July 2015

www.kanzenshuu.com

11. Toyotaro confirms that the DBS manga is promotional

News | Early "Dragon Ball Super" Story Details in August 2015 V-Jump

The August 2015 issue of V-Jump in Japan provides preliminary details on the upcoming 'Dragon Ball Super' TV series set to debut in July

www.kanzenshuu.com

12. Toyotaro confirms that the anime and manga are equally valid

Interview: Dragon Ball Super's Toyotarou

First he was a super-fan of Dragon Ball - now he's drawing the official manga adaption of Akira Toriyama's Dragon Ball! Find out what makes mangaka Toyotarou tick!

www.animenewsnetwork.com

13. Dragon Ball Super anime is supervised by Akira

https://web.archive.org/web/20150513045343/https://www.toei-animation.com/files/PressRelease_DBS_ENG_0.pdf

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

1. Fusion Zamasu is weaker

https://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/dragon-ball-super-tori-toyo-free-talk-vo-2/

2. Dragon Ball Z: Battle of Gods is a continuation of the manga, and Bills (Beerus) is the strongest enemy

Translations | "Battle of Gods" Promotional Pamphlet #2 - Akira Toriyama

Translation of Akira Toriyama's comments on the film Battle of Gods from the movie's second promotional pamphlet in Japan

www.kanzenshuu.com

3. Akira confirms that the Golden Freezer movie is a continuation of the manga

Translations | V-Jump (September 2014): Akira Toriyama's Comment

www.kanzenshuu.com

4. Akira claims that the DBS anime follows the DB manga

Translations | Dragon Ball Super: Super Start Guide - Message From Akira Toriyama

English translation of the 'Message From Akira Toriyama' introduction comment from the July 2015 'Dragon Ball Super: Super Start Guide' book

www.kanzenshuu.com

5. Akira reviews the storyboards for Toyotaro

Translations | "Dragon Ball Super" Manga Vol. 1 Tori-Toyo Interview (Web Version)

English translation of the web interview with Akira Toriyama and Toyotaro in conjunctions with the first 'Dragon Ball Super' manga volume

www.kanzenshuu.com

6. Toei confirms that they work based on Akira's script

Translations | Dragon Ball Official Site - The Artisans Who Made the Universe Survival Arc

English translation of the 'The Artisans Who Made the Universe Survival Arc of Dragon Ball Super, Now Reaching Its Climax' interview from the official Japanese Dragon Ball website

www.kanzenshuu.com

7. Toei and Shueisha say the manga is canon



8. Akira is in charge of the direct script of the manga

MANGA Plus by SHUEISHA

mangaplus.shueisha.co.jp

9. V-Jump confirms that the DBS anime is based on the creator's drafts

News | Early "Dragon Ball Super" Story Details in August 2015 V-Jump

The August 2015 issue of V-Jump in Japan provides preliminary details on the upcoming 'Dragon Ball Super' TV series set to debut in July

www.kanzenshuu.com

10. Toyotaro and Toei work based on Akira's drafts

News | "Dragon Ball Super" TV Series Debut Set For July 5th

The 'Dragon Ball Super' TV series will debut on Fuji TV in Japan beginning 05 July 2015

www.kanzenshuu.com

11. Toyotaro confirms that the DBS manga is promotional

News | Early "Dragon Ball Super" Story Details in August 2015 V-Jump

The August 2015 issue of V-Jump in Japan provides preliminary details on the upcoming 'Dragon Ball Super' TV series set to debut in July

www.kanzenshuu.com

12. Toyotaro confirms that the anime and manga are equally valid

Interview: Dragon Ball Super's Toyotarou

First he was a super-fan of Dragon Ball - now he's drawing the official manga adaption of Akira Toriyama's Dragon Ball! Find out what makes mangaka Toyotarou tick!

www.animenewsnetwork.com

13. Dragon Ball Super anime is supervised by Akira

https://web.archive.org/web/20150513045343/https://www.toei-animation.com/files/PressRelease_DBS_ENG_0.pdf

??

 

[Gp972]

??

Just to clarify the anime canocity

 

[Demon_Lord18]

Just to clarify the anime canocity

I didn't see any reference to DB anime in your comment

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

Just to clarify the anime canocity

Are you arguing that the DBS anime is a continuation of the Dragon Ball Z manga?

 

[TheGodOfICE777]

1. Fusion Zamasu is weaker

https://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/dragon-ball-super-tori-toyo-free-talk-vo-2/

2. Dragon Ball Z: Battle of Gods is a continuation of the manga, and Bills (Beerus) is the strongest enemy

Translations | "Battle of Gods" Promotional Pamphlet #2 - Akira Toriyama

Translation of Akira Toriyama's comments on the film Battle of Gods from the movie's second promotional pamphlet in Japan

www.kanzenshuu.com

3. Akira confirms that the Golden Freezer movie is a continuation of the manga

Translations | V-Jump (September 2014): Akira Toriyama's Comment

www.kanzenshuu.com

4. Akira claims that the DBS anime follows the DB manga

Translations | Dragon Ball Super: Super Start Guide - Message From Akira Toriyama

English translation of the 'Message From Akira Toriyama' introduction comment from the July 2015 'Dragon Ball Super: Super Start Guide' book

www.kanzenshuu.com

5. Akira reviews the storyboards for Toyotaro

Translations | "Dragon Ball Super" Manga Vol. 1 Tori-Toyo Interview (Web Version)

English translation of the web interview with Akira Toriyama and Toyotaro in conjunctions with the first 'Dragon Ball Super' manga volume

www.kanzenshuu.com

6. Toei confirms that they work based on Akira's script

Translations | Dragon Ball Official Site - The Artisans Who Made the Universe Survival Arc

English translation of the 'The Artisans Who Made the Universe Survival Arc of Dragon Ball Super, Now Reaching Its Climax' interview from the official Japanese Dragon Ball website

www.kanzenshuu.com

7. Toei and Shueisha say the manga is canon



8. Akira is in charge of the direct script of the manga

MANGA Plus by SHUEISHA

mangaplus.shueisha.co.jp

9. V-Jump confirms that the DBS anime is based on the creator's drafts

News | Early "Dragon Ball Super" Story Details in August 2015 V-Jump

The August 2015 issue of V-Jump in Japan provides preliminary details on the upcoming 'Dragon Ball Super' TV series set to debut in July

www.kanzenshuu.com

10. Toyotaro and Toei work based on Akira's drafts

News | "Dragon Ball Super" TV Series Debut Set For July 5th

The 'Dragon Ball Super' TV series will debut on Fuji TV in Japan beginning 05 July 2015

www.kanzenshuu.com

11. Toyotaro confirms that the DBS manga is promotional

News | Early "Dragon Ball Super" Story Details in August 2015 V-Jump

The August 2015 issue of V-Jump in Japan provides preliminary details on the upcoming 'Dragon Ball Super' TV series set to debut in July

www.kanzenshuu.com

12. Toyotaro confirms that the anime and manga are equally valid

Interview: Dragon Ball Super's Toyotarou

First he was a super-fan of Dragon Ball - now he's drawing the official manga adaption of Akira Toriyama's Dragon Ball! Find out what makes mangaka Toyotarou tick!

www.animenewsnetwork.com

13. Dragon Ball Super anime is supervised by Akira

https://web.archive.org/web/20150513045343/https://www.toei-animation.com/files/PressRelease_DBS_ENG_0.pdf

This thread isn’t making DBS Anime canon to manga; it’s already accepted as being canon to Kai. You can’t change that aspect in this thread.

 

[Omegabronic]

After a talk with Ice in private, i stopped arguing here and decided with him to just do a thread on the matter to cover the Chronological timeline stuff, posting here in case anyone was wondering why i stopped talking about it all of a sudden

I posted my thread about the wedding arc + other things, so if anyone wants to continue that argument, go here

 

[TheGodOfICE777]

So, this statement from Kai’s producer, which is used in the cosmology blog as part of the justification for Kai being canon to DBS, says that Kai is meant to be “close to the original manga” and “as faithful as possible”. That implies to me that Kai is more connected to the manga than the anime.

However, as people have brought up, Kai does reference an anime-only moment like Goku and Chi-Chi’s wedding arc, so I would like to propose a compromise solution: Kai is based off of the manga and made to be faithful to it, but anything from the original anime that is directly referenced or mentioned by Kai, such as the wedding arc, can be considered canon as well.

@Nierre @DarkDragonMedeus Your thoughts on this suggestion would be much appreciated.

This thread was made to make wedding arc manga canon, however it was rejected. So the argument of wedding arc being something manga related doesn’t work anymore. So can we finally settle this thread?

 

[LordTracer]

So the argument of wedding arc being something manga related doesn’t work anymore.

That doesn’t really affect my suggestion though? At no point did I suggest making the wedding arc canon to the manga, I just said that DB Kai continues from the DB manga, based off of the statement from the producer, but anything from the DB anime that Kai references can be considered canon to Kai itself.