Dark Tower: High 1-A Content Revision

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

As I said, the tier 0 issue is currently unclear. Gan may be the first thing that comes to everyone's mind, but Gan is a creature that takes direct damage and there are a few creatures that are equal to it. But there is a being far superior to Gan. This entity is currently thought to be the same person as Gan in Gan's VSBW profile, but is a completely separate entity from him.

The Final Other?

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

The Final Other?

Yes

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

The Final Other?

And what is your current thought?
Do you agree, disagree or neutral? I need to add you depending on the situation.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

And what is your current thought?
Do you agree, disagree or neutral? I need to add you depending on the situation.

Seems fine but is that all the information about it?

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

Seems fine but is that all the information about it?

Yes

 

[Radman69]

Yes

Do you mean The Other from IT? I thought he is Gan also

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

Do you mean The Other from IT? I thought he is Gan also

Once upon a time, my friends and I thought the same thing. But we currently think that Gan and Other are not the same beings. Maybe we can open a separate CRT for this.

 

[RigelBR7]

Agree and following.

 

[Duragoji123]

Looks fine from just a glance. Mark me down as agreeing

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

Agree and following.

Bump

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

Looks fine from just a glance. Mark me down as agreeing

Bump

 

[Cropfist]

Why is this in Turkish

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

Why is this in Turkish

Take a look again

 

[Kairach]

I haven't scaled nor read a Stephen King book in about a year, but I pretty much agree with everything said here. I do think that some if not most of the conclusions that you came to about the verse could be wrong (such as where what goes), but I don't have the time or effort to go through my books again. Either way here are some scans I could pull up with little effort that could help.

You don't show evidence for why the void between worlds is called "a void of possibility", so heres the scan for that:

Mort had not died of fright; the gunslinger felt with a deep instinct which was the same as knowing that if Mort died, their kas would be expelled forever, into that void of possibility which lay beyond all physical worlds. -Drawing of the Three

There's also the quote people use for a type 4 multiverse:

Who emptied the beaker loses importance beside the general truth: At the end of all rationalism, the mass grave. The laws of physics, the laws of biology, the axioms of mathematics, they’re all part of the deathtrip, because we are what we are. If it hadn’t been Captain Trips, it would have been something else. The fashion was to blame it on ‘technology,’ but ‘technology’ is the trunk of the tree, not the roots. The roots are rationalism, and I would define that word so: ‘Rationalism is the idea we can ever understand anything about the state of being.’ It’s a deathtrip. It always has been. -The Stand

Though I don't know the context behind this quote, a type 4 would be enough evidence for an ultimate reality (Wherever this site scales that to):

I argued to Bill that complete mathematical democracy holds: that mathematical existence and physical existence are equivalent, so that all structures that exist mathematically exist physically as well. Then each other box in Figure 12.1 also describes a physically real universe—just a different one from the one we happen to inhabit. This can be viewed as a form of radical Platonism, asserting that all the mathematical structures in Plato’s “realm of ideas” exist “out there” in a physical sense. -Our Mathematical Universe

The story (other King works as well) quite clearly states that anything a person imagines will become true, not just true but it already exists:

Good! If someone has to die here, let it be you! To hell with Gan’s navel, to hell with the stories that come out of it, to hell with the Tower, let it be you and not my boy! -Dark Tower Book 7

Would you risk destroying that world as well as this, and the other worlds sai King has touched with his imagination, and drawn from? For it was not he that created them, you know. To peek in Gans navel does not make one Gan, although many creative people seem to think so. Would you risk it all? -Dark Tower Book 7

“Once I thought I was, but that was just the booze. And pride, I suppose. No writer is Gan—no painter, no sculptor, no maker of music. We are kas-ka Gan. Not ka-Gan but kas-ka Gan. Do you understand? Do you… do you ken?” -Dark Tower Book 7

"This is the inner keep," she said. "Beyond it is the village of Fedic, now deserted, all dead of the Red Death a thousand years ago and more. Beyond that — ""The Red Death?" Susannah asked, startled (also frightened in spite of herself). "Poe's Red Death? Like in the story?" And why not? Hadn't they already wandered into —and then back out of — L. Frank Baum's Oz? What came next? The White Rabbit and the Red Queen? -Song of Susannah

The story quite clearly follows Platonism and Jungian Psychology quite well so to say that it is barred from any tiers that this type of evidence proves would be disingenuous.

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

You don't show evidence for why the void between worlds is called "a void of possibility", so heres the scan for that:

First of all, thanks. "Probability Gaps" are actually in the first panels I used. There it is stated that there are worlds and spaces between worlds as Jack senses all possible worlds.

The story (other King works as well) quite clearly states that anything a person imagines will become true, not just true but it already exists:

I have nothing to say about Type 4 because it really is useless whether it exists or not, and it is useless whether it doesn't exist or not. But where does the "world that everyone can imagine" context that you mentioned in this quote come into play?

I do think that some if not most of the conclusions that you came to about the verse could be wrong (such as where what goes),

Like what

 

[Kairach]

I have nothing to say about Type 4 because it really is useless whether it exists or not, and it is useless whether it doesn't exist or not. But where does the "world that everyone can imagine" context that you mentioned in this quote come into play?

A type 4 would matter a lot, Max Tegmark (The Author of the theory) describes it as a form of Platonism, basically connecting it to Plato's world of forms which is part of an ultimate reality and would probably be good evidence for an extremely high tier with the way the system is set up.

The imaging worlds thing is also basically another view on an ultimate reality. Carl Jung taught a theory of a "collective unconscious", which he based a lot on Platonism, he stated that within said world existed Archetypes which we base are culture and literature off of, meaning that with this context Gan would be a sort of collective unconscious.

Like what

Can't really tell you, I had my own views on the verse and created some over the year while I was interested in other things, though most of my stuff is theoretical or based on quotes that I probably couldn't for the life of me find. I used to scale on my off time but moved over to philosophy so most of my notes and arguments are pretty much lost to time.

I do know that The Revival has some pretty good info on what you were talking about with the tier 0 stuff. One of the central characters at the beginning of the story relates God to whatever people view it as, which would be a key defining aspect for tier 0 but I don't know if you'd want to use that.

Overall a big reason why I stopped even thinking about the story was because of how scrambled a bunch of it is, but I believe that understanding the context of the things the authors based their work on is probably the best step.

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

Also about the "imagining worlds" thing, it's made quite clear that Gan is called the supreme author, being that through his force the characters can connect to different worlds that appear to be a sort of "fiction" created by basically anyone who thinks, they (the thinkers) are described as authors but it can really be anybody. These powers can connect to manifest people to their own realities as fiction that they can manipulate, suggesting that even within the layer of reality that we see the setting of the Dark Tower in might just be another piece of fiction.

There is no clear evidence for this, at least not yet. Just speculation. Most of the authors mentioned there are probably unknown. (Except for King and Poe) And maybe Gan's authorship quote isn't really accurate. What I mean is that all the stories are just things that revolve around Gan's axis, and we call them Dark Tower universes. For example, one of the universes that Jack Sawyer senses in the book Talisman explains a parallel universe that was destroyed by a virus in the book The Stand. So all the stories revolve around Gan, and uncovering the Tower may have, in a way, revealed these stories as well. But I do not believe that Gan is the original author. Maybe I'll explain why some other time.

Overall a big reason why I stopped even thinking about the story was because of how scrambled a bunch of it is, but I believe that understanding the context of the things the authors based their work on is probably the best step.

Oh I understand

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

@Antvasima
Hey man how are you?
Well I need some help here. Could you tag a few people to see this post? Because even if I don't know why, this is the third CRT to ascend Dark Tower and almost none of the admins wrote anything for all three. We look forward to supporting you soon, goodbye.

 

[Antvasima]

@Antvasima
Hey man how are you?
Well I need some help here. Could you tag a few people to see this post? Because even if I don't know why, this is the third CRT to ascend Dark Tower and almost none of the admins wrote anything for all three. We look forward to supporting you soon, goodbye.

@DarkDragonMedeus @Agnaa @Celestial_Pegasus @Wokistan @Ultima_Reality @Elizhaa @Qawsedf234 @ByAsura @Sir_Ovens @Damage3245 @Starter_Pack @Abstractions @Colonel_Krukov @SamanPatou @GyroNutz @Firestorm808 @Maverick_Zero_X @Crabwhale @GrathOfLux @Dereck03 @Planck69 @LephyrTheRevanchist

Are any of you willing and able to help out here?

 

[Firestorm808]

It seems compelling, but I would have to go over the tier Requirements again to be sure.

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

It seems compelling, but I would have to go over the tier Requirements again to be sure.

Ah, of course.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

@DarkDragonMedeus @Agnaa @Celestial_Pegasus @Wokistan @Ultima_Reality @Elizhaa @Qawsedf234 @ByAsura @Sir_Ovens @Damage3245 @Starter_Pack @Abstractions @Colonel_Krukov @SamanPatou @GyroNutz @Firestorm808 @Maverick_Zero_X @Crabwhale @GrathOfLux @Dereck03 @Planck69 @LephyrTheRevanchist

Are any of you willing and able to help out here?

We need Ultima definitely. This is not compelling at all on how High 1-A+ works.

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

We need Ultima definitely. This is not compelling at all on how High 1-A+ works.

What did you want to say? Does this mean that the scale is not H1A+ or does it mean that the scale has anti-feats for H1A+?

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

What did you want to say? Does this mean that the scale is not H1A+ or does it mean that the scale has anti-feats for H1A+?

Naming-dropping possible worlds holds no merit in tiering when it's not the cosmological apexes. I don't have a problem with the Todash Darkness being the second variant since it more or less fills the niche. However, if you describe the Sea of Prim as a drop-in the infinity that is the totality of darkness beyond it then the Tower rising from that Sea that does not scale to the Todash Darkness. It’s not on the same plane as the Todash Darkness if it’s consider as non-existence to it in size.

​

Anti-Feat:​

• Is the Sea of Prim some sort of actualized form of the Todash Darkness or is it completely separate? From what I’ve seen it’s different and completely overshadowed by it in size trivializing it as a small drop in the ocean that it is.
• Are the possible worlds functioning on pure logistic possibilities? From what I’ve seen they don’t, at least not how they’re contained within Dark Tower and superseded by things outside of it.
• Is the Dark Tower all encompassing where the physical body that is represented by Gan just an emanation of some sort from a truer being? Based on what I’ve read of this OP, I can’t be sure, but based on reasoning it doesn’t seem to be the case.

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

Is the Sea of Prim some sort of actualized form of the Todash Darkness or is it completely separate? From what I’ve seen it’s different and completely overshadowed by it in size trivializing it as a small drop in the ocean that it is.

Logically, we can consider the Tower and Prim as the same thing. Because the Tower is something that emerged from the boiling water of the Prim and there is no difference between the two. As for Todash Darkness, as we discussed before, I can say again that it must be H1A+ Type 2 since it leaves Prim like a drop.

Are the possible worlds functioning on pure logistic possibilities? From what I’ve seen they don’t, at least not how they’re contained within Dark Tower and superseded by things outside of it.

By what sort of things? You mean that external entities change these logical possibilities?

Is the Dark Tower all encompassing where the physical body that is represented by Gan just an emanation of some sort from a truer being? Based on what I’ve read of this OP, I can’t be sure, but based on reasoning it doesn’t seem to be the case.

Gan and the Tower are exactly the same thing. In this wiki it is said that the Tower is a manifestation of Gan, but as I said before I don't think so. The reason people separate the Tower from Gan must be because of The Other.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

Logically, we can consider the Tower and Prim as the same thing. Because the Tower is something that emerged from the boiling water of the Prim and there is no difference between the two. As for Todash Darkness, as we discussed before, I can say again that it must be H1A+ Type 2 since it leaves Prim like a drop.

That’s the problem, they’re a disconnected between the Sea of Prim and the Todash Darkness. This is at best High 1-A for the Tower. That’s purely going on the Tibetan scans since the rest hardly qualifies with the “mirages” being an ok example of an ontological transcendence.

By what sort of things? You mean that external entities change these logical possibilities?

The Dark Tower would be one of many possibilities then and all of its level transcended entirely by said “external entities.”

Gan and the Tower are exactly the same thing. In this wiki it is said that the Tower is a manifestation of Gan, but as I said before I don't think so. The reason people separate the Tower from Gan must be because of The Other.

Then the Tower and Gan hardly qualifies for High 1-A+.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

Also, until we’ve discussed all points then I would not like to be in the agreeing consensus.

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

That’s the problem, they’re a disconnected between the Sea of Prim and the Todash Darkness.

On what basis do you say it is disconnected? Because the difference between Prim and Todash Darkness should be the same as the difference between the Tower and Todash Darkness. Instead, it would be most logical to see the Tower as an outward extension of Prim. Prim = Tower. Because in essence, Prim and the Tower are the same thing.

The Dark Tower would be one of many possibilities then and all of its level transcended entirely by said “external entities.”

No, I didn't understand or there may be translation errors. Could you please explain what you mean in more detail?

This is at best High 1-A for the Tower. That’s purely going on the Tibetan scans since the rest hardly qualifies with the “mirages” being an ok example of an ontological transcendence

And I disagree. Because this hierarchy is always explained consistently in the same books and in different books. Just as in the same book they are seen as a mirage and in the same book beings from higher levels say that other levels are inaccessible to them. It seemed pretty consistent.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

On what basis do you say it is disconnected? Because the difference between Prim and Todash Darkness should be the same as the difference between the Tower and Todash Darkness. It would be a mistake to consider the Tower and Prim as separate entities. Instead, it would be most logical to see the Tower as an outward extension of Prim. Prim = Tower

I meant the Prim and Todash Darkness.

No, I didn't understand or there may be translation errors. Could you please explain what you mean in more detail?

Essentially, no one would qualify for said entities that can control the Dark Tower since you said the examples you listed are still connected to the Dark Tower in some way or another.

And I disagree. Because this hierarchy is always explained consistently in the same books and in different books. Just as in the same book they are seen as a mirage and in the same book beings from higher levels say that other levels are inaccessible to them. It seemed pretty consistent.

I, hardly, count the “mirages” thing as some sort of basis for higher transcendence ie High 1-A. I did ask about the Multiverse being within the tower as the baseline level of existence. If it was then I see more of a 1-A+ hierarchy and less of a High 1-A hierarchy.

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

I, hardly, count the “mirages” thing as some sort of basis for higher transcendence ie High 1-A. I did ask about the Multiverse being within the tower as the baseline level of existence. If it was then I see more of a 1-A+ hierarchy and less of a High 1-A hierarchy.

The tower and the multiverse are separate "in terms of location". Yes, the tower encompasses the multiverse, but the multiverse is not a plane located within the tower. If you mean what Walter said, it seems that he was just giving an example in the sentence.

Essentially, no one would qualify for said entities that can control the Dark Tower since you said the examples you listed are still connected to the Dark Tower.

I remember we talked about this before. And for this, we gave the Type 1 add-on to the Tower and the Type 2 add-on to the Macroverse. In general, these beings are not qualitatively superior to the Tower. They are just superior, that's all. And that should make them H1A+ type 2.

I meant the Prim and Todash Darkness.

Oh I see. In this case, the Tower being an extension of Prim makes the Tower the same as Prim. And the fact that the macroverse is beyond this Tower/Prim and sees it as a drop of potential is an example of ordinary, non-qualitative superiority.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

The tower and the multiverse are separate "in terms of location". Yes, the tower encompasses the multiverse, but the multiverse is not a plane located within the tower. If you mean what Walter said, it seems that he was just giving an example in the sentence.

Then where is the established baseline level of existence within the tower? I don’t consider the universe having R>F as a strong case for a 1-A+ Multiverse either since the examples are quite poor and the Tower itself getting High 1-A coming from scaling above the Multiverse should honestly just be 1-A+.

I remember we talked about this before. And for this, we gave the Type 1 add-on to the Tower and the Type 2 add-on to the Macroverse. In general, these beings are not qualitatively superior to the Tower. They are just superior, that's all. And that should make them H1A+ type 2.

No, that’s a terrible suggestion. It doesn’t qualify for High 1-A+ and the High 1-A case is also shaky.

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

It doesn’t qualify for High 1-A+ and the High 1-A case is also shaky.

In order for you to reject H1A+, you have to say something that I haven't answered yet. Or an anti-feati that I've missed.

Then where is the established baseline level of existence within the tower?

Existing inside the tower?

I don’t consider the universe having R>F as a strong case for a 1-A+ Multiverse either since the examples are quite poor and the Tower itself getting High 1-A coming from scaling above the Multiverse should honestly just be 1-A+.

That's your opinion. But the universe is good enough for 1A+. R>F alone gives 1A. On the other hand, I stated that stories are things that spill into universes.And I said that these universes are inaccessible, like a mirage, and that there is a transcendence between them in another story, based on the words of a child that encompasses the entire universe. So why don't you join me here? These are the words of a child who is almost capable of anything.

and the High 1-A case is also shaky.

If the tower is a structure of the universe, or "beyond infinite reality and everything" depending on the context, this takes it to a different plane. At the same time, the fact that it is a structure independent of the laws of the hierarchy that I gave 1A+ elevates it to a meta level governed by a separate algorithm. Therefore, the Tower must be a level H1A structure.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

Existing inside the tower?

Like I mentioned I would see that as more of a 1-A+ hierarchy. Unless, the levels are purely existent on without relying on the Multiverse, but even then I don’t see the universes as 1-A, nor High 1-A+ as you mentioned simply because they name drop possible worlds. So, the hierarchy starts at the Tower and that’s only 1-A+ in what I’ve seen.

That's your opinion. But the universe is good enough for 1A+. R>F alone gives 1A. On the other hand, I stated that stories are things that spill into universes.And I said that these universes are inaccessible, like a mirage, and that there is a transcendence between them in another story, based on the words of a child that encompasses the entire universe. So why don't you join me here? These are the words of a child who is almost capable of anything.

“Inaccessible” is hardly a basis for 1-A or High 1-A, I hope you know what.

As for the “mirage” that simply is not enough.

Your final example being completely baseless and could rank anywhere with 1-A being the highest interpretation. Encompassing a universe hardly counts as much.

If the tower is a structure of the universe, or "beyond infinite reality and everything" depending on the context, this takes it to a different plane. At the same time, the fact that it is a structure independent of the laws of the hierarchy that I gave 1A+ elevates it to a meta level governed by a separate algorithm. Therefore, the Tower must be a level H1A structure.

That’s because the example you have a rather egregious and barely even fits as a High 1-A+ a you propose. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that it can be High 1-A, but the “+” modifiers need to be removed.

In order for you to reject H1A+, you have to say something that I haven't answered yet. Or an anti-feati that I've missed.

I’ve already stated this:

Naming-dropping possible worlds holds no merit in tiering when it's not the cosmological apexes. I don't have a problem with the Todash Darkness being the second variant since it more or less fills the niche. However, if you describe the Sea of Prim as a drop-in the infinity that is the totality of darkness beyond it then the Tower rising from that Sea that does not scale to the Todash Darkness. It’s not on the same plane as the Todash Darkness if it’s consider as non-existence to it in size.

Rebuttal for the Anti-Feat:​

• Is the Sea of Prim some sort of actualized form of the Todash Darkness or is it completely separate? From what I’ve seen it’s different and completely overshadowed by it in size trivializing it as a small drop in the ocean that it is.
• Are the possible worlds functioning on pure logistic possibilities? From what I’ve seen they don’t, at least not how they’re contained within Dark Tower and superseded by things outside of it.
• Is the Dark Tower all encompassing where the physical body that is represented by Gan just an emanation of some sort from a truer being? Based on what I’ve read of this OP, I can’t be sure, but based on reasoning it doesn’t seem to be the case.

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

I’ve already stated this:

Yes, and I answered them all as best I could.

So, the hierarchy starts at the Tower and that’s only 1-A+ in what I’ve seen.

Where exactly does this take place? Because these levels are part of the Tower Nowhere did I find a sentence that this hierarchy begins with the 1st layer of the Tower or anything like that. I just said that the Tower covers these.

“Inaccessible” is hardly a basis for 1-A or High 1-A, I hope you know what.

I hope you're not commenting on this definition of inaccessible alone. Because that's exactly what you're doing right now. You cannot consider the contexts used in this hierarchy separately. Because this is a consistent hierarchy, you need to reconcile the word inaccessible with the word mirage. On the other hand, I still haven't received an answer to my statement that stories are things that spill out into universes.Each universe is a layered story. This is directly consistent with the mirage metaphor. Because a structure that looks like a mirage is not real and is a product of imagination. Just like a story. And as I said (pay special attention here) You can't just treat the contexts used in this hierarchy separately. You have to take them all into account.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

Yes, and I answered them all as best I could.

They weren't very good points, no offense.

Where exactly does this take place? Because these levels are part of the Tower Nowhere did I find a sentence that this hierarchy begins with the 1st layer of the Tower or anything like that. I just said that the Tower covers these.

If there's no established first/ground level then where are the transcendence coming from? Anyways, as I said probably 1-A+, with High 1-A being possible.

I hope you're not commenting on this definition of inaccessible alone. Because that's exactly what you're doing right now. You cannot consider the contexts used in this hierarchy separately. Because this is a consistent hierarchy, you need to reconcile the word inaccessible with the word mirage. On the other hand, I still haven't received an answer to my statement that stories are things that spill out into universes.Each universe is a layered story. This is directly consistent with the mirage metaphor. Because a structure that looks like a mirage is not real and is a product of imagination. Just like a story. And as I said (pay special attention here) You can't just treat the contexts used in this hierarchy separately. You have to take them all into account.

You're repeating these points as if they bolstered a new argument for High 1-A+, but as I already mentioned they weren't very good or strong points.

This is the final response. I'll just see what the mods say to not further derail the thread.

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

You're repeating these points as if they bolstered a new argument for High 1-A+

Some of my last posts were for 1A+ and H1A. I'm not talking about H1A+ at the moment.

If there's no established first/ground level then where are the transcendence coming from?

I'm really serious. What are you talking about? You said at the beginning that the Tower and the Hierarchy are on the same level, that this hierarchy is on the first level of the Tower. And I answered that.You asked, "Where's the transcendence part?" It could have happened on any level. Because they are infinite, so to speak.But know that the Tower and the multiverse hierarchy are completely independent things.

This is the final response.

Okey

 

[Firestorm808]

We need Ultima definitely. This is not compelling at all on how High 1-A+ works.

I see. Which of the requirements of High 1-A do you believe we need better proof of?

High 1-A: High Outerverse level​

Characters or objects who transcend 1-A characters in the same vein that 1-A characters transcend the rest of the system.

That is to say: If there is a hierarchy of 1-A layers, each of which operates within the same framework, with the same "algorithm" dictating the difference between them, a High 1-A character would transcend the framework entirely, and instead operate on a different, higher hierarchy, governed by another, likewise higher algorithm. In other words, whereas 1-A is a qualitative superiority, High 1-A represents a "meta"-qualitative superiority.

Similarly to 1-A, this tier can be generalized to higher levels of existence. Just as 1-A encompasses qualitative hierarchies, so too can there be meta-qualitative hierarchies. In addition, there can also be "meta"-meta-qualitative superiorities, and so forth, endlessly.

The apex of this tier, represented also by a "+" modifier in their Attack Potency section (High Outerverse level+), corresponds to characters whose power encompasses meta-qualities, meta-meta-qualities, and any and all conceivable extensions of this process, being on a which in which their power influences the space of all logically possible worlds ("Logical space," where the laws governing it are the three laws of thought), being characters who either have the ability to actualize arbitrarily large worlds, or embody the framework of such worlds itself.

That said, characters who embody the framework of all possible worlds properly speaking may be rightly considered more powerful than those that can simply create arbitrarily big possible worlds while nevertheless existing in one.

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

I see. Which of the requirements of High 1-A do you believe we need better proof of?

I think there is no problem with H1A+ tier. (Or at least that's how I know it) The real problem comes from the idea that there are anti-feats for the H1A+ tier. I think this is why. On the other hand, if we go back to the H1A tier only, (again, if I am not mistaken) He must be thinking that the multiverse hierarchy, which is 1A+, is from the first floor of the Tower.That's why he may see the H1A tier as inadequate. However, as I said, the Tower and the universe hierarchy have no connection, both ontologically and physically.

 

[Firestorm808]

I think there is no problem with H1A+ tier. (Or at least that's how I know it) The real problem comes from the idea that there are anti-feats for the H1A+ tier. I think this is why. On the other hand, if we go back to the H1A tier only, (again, if I am not mistaken) He must be thinking that the multiverse hierarchy, which is 1A+, is from the first floor of the Tower.That's why he may see the H1A tier as inadequate. However, as I said, the Tower and the universe hierarchy have no connection, both ontologically and physically.

I would ask that you make a summary post that sorts your scans with their respective Tier requirement. IE: Which scans support reaching 1-A, transcending 1-A, and the 1-A+ stuff.

 

[Jason_Voorhees1986]

I would ask that you make a summary post that sorts your scans with their respective Tier requirement. IE: Which scans support reaching 1-A, transcending 1-A, and the 1-A+ stuff.

Here right now?