Genshin Lifting strength upgrade to "Class Y"

[OmniScalator]

My this upgrade is based on the fact that drops from narwhal whale are heavy enough to trap light just like blackholes, and skirk holded narwhal whale in hand after compressing it into blackhole with it's own event horizon, so we can calculate lifting strength of skirk from this.


description of Lightless Eye of the Maelstrom-
"A strange "substance" obtained from fighting against the All-Devouring Narwhal. Its actual weight far exceeds what would be expected given its size.
Everything gathers around heavy objects, just as gold attracts more than iron, or the ground more than in the breeze blowing above. Just as light cannot escape from the vortex of darkness, cause and effect is attached to fate, perhaps irreversibly so." -source

skirk holding compressed narwhal - link

so it must be a blackhole and since skirk held it in her palm we can deduce it must be about 12 cm in diameter based on average palm of person with 160cm height.

and now to calculate minimum mass required to get a gravitational collapse for forming blackhole we need schwarzschild radius formula.

putting r = 6 cm and solving for M we get 4.03977*10^25 kg which falls within "class Y" category of lifting strength.

in my opinion this upgrade can be applied to archons

any questions are welcome.

Edit - Added Calculation blog.

 

[OmniScalator]

Bump

 

[PedjaTarzan]

My this upgrade is based on the fact that drops from narwhal whale are heavy enough to trap light just like blackholes, and skirk holded narwhal whale in hand after compressing it into blackhole with it's own event horizon, so we can calculate lifting strength of skirk from this.


description of Lightless Eye of the Maelstrom-
"A strange "substance" obtained from fighting against the All-Devouring Narwhal. Its actual weight far exceeds what would be expected given its size.
Everything gathers around heavy objects, just as gold attracts more than iron, or the ground more than in the breeze blowing above. Just as light cannot escape from the vortex of darkness, cause and effect is attached to fate, perhaps irreversibly so." -source

Change the link to this instead

skirk holding compressed narwhal - link

so it must be a blackhole and since skirk held it in her palm we can deduce it must be about 12 cm in diameter based on average palm of person with 160cm height.

and now to calculate minimum mass required to get a gravitational collapse for forming blackhole we need schwarzschild radius formula.

putting r = 6 cm and solving for M we get 4.03977*10^25 kg which falls within "class Y" category of lifting strength.

in my opinion this upgrade can be applied to archons

any questions are welcome.

Theres already accepted calc for making blackholes in genshin
Overall the premise is okay, however these blackholes do not act as real ones as they are physically held and moved around, can be nullified with arkhe or just generaly getting hit fast (which is mostly gameplay mechanic so it shouldnt count) and thats basically what nullifies blackhole from being actual one
However if this can still work as a heavy ass ball of gravity ("pseudo black hole" or kugelblitz) given its properties i completely agree with the thread.

 

[OmniScalator]

however these blackholes do not act as real ones as they are physically held and moved around, can be nullified with arkhe or just generaly getting hit fast (which is mostly gameplay mechanic so it shouldnt count) and thats basically what nullifies blackhole from being actual one

as you said it is gameplay mechanic so they should be considered real blackholes as they are heavy enough to trap light

However if this can still work as a heavy ass ball of gravity ("pseudo black hole" or kugelblitz)

as you mentioned kugelblitz, it have same mass as any ordinary blackhole with only difference being that it was made from energy(radiation) instead of mass, it is basically a prediction using theory of general relativity, which gave Mass–energy equivalence so in the end whether a blackhole is created by mass like blackholes found irl or if blackhole is formed by energy like kugelblitz they weigh the same.

which means above calculation can be directly used to upgrade the lifting strength.

 

[OmniScalator]

However if this can still work as a heavy ass ball of gravity ("pseudo black hole" or kugelblitz)

also if we consider it to be kugelblitz then energy required to form it can be calculated by putting mass from above calculation in e=mc2 equation

and it gives energy equivalent of 3.63*10^42 joules which can be used for AP if it can be considered, but in my opinion it should not be used

 

[PedjaTarzan]

also if we consider it to be kugelblitz then energy required to form it can be calculated by putting mass from above calculation in e=mc2 equation

and it gives energy equivalent of 3.63*10^42 joules which can be used for AP if it can be considered, but in my opinion it should not be used

probably can not sure, id just get upgrade LS like you and give blackhole/gravity manip for skirk and narwhal

 

[OmniScalator]

can we use it to upgrade archon tier characters via chain scaling?

 

[OmniScalator]

Bump

 

[OmniScalator]

Bump

 

[OmniScalator]

Bump

 

[PedjaTarzan]

can we use it to upgrade archon tier characters

I mean yeah, but from fontaine onwards not sure abt those before

 

[OmniScalator]

I mean yeah, but from fontaine onwards not sure abt those before

I think should be for all archon except nahida as she is the only one we know lacks physical power.

Can also be for top 3 harbinger

Or atleast capitano

 

[AyOgUyS]

Correct me if I am wrong: but nobody scales to Skirk.

 

[PedjaTarzan]

Correct me if I am wrong: but nobody scales to Skirk.

Traveler can also hold a blackhole that he gets as item in inventory, and there are plethora of mfs who are simply superior than him.
For skirk case, its just sinners and sovereigns at best

 

[AyOgUyS]

Traveler can also hold a blackhole that he gets as item in inventory, and there are plethora of mfs who are simply superior than him.
For skirk case, its just sinners and sovereigns at best

Well we would have to make a separate calc for Traveler's black hole feat, if it is a real black hole but imma leave that stuff up to more knowledgeable members.

 

[OmniScalator]

Well we would have to make a separate calc for Traveler's black hole feat, if it is a real black hole but imma leave that stuff up to more knowledgeable members.

traveler's feat can be considered inferior but yet relative to skirk.

and many people are on a whole different level than traveler, who are all archons (except nahida) and high tier characters like arlecchino. that means they can do that too.

but we do not need to recalculate as we can see traveler's "Lightless Eye of the Maelstrom" is same size as skirk's.

 

[OmniScalator]

Bump

 

[Weaver261]

Bump

You can only bump after one day iirc

 

[OmniScalator]

You can only bump after one day iirc

full 24h?does it not work if used earlier?

ohhh i feel dumb

 

[AyOgUyS]

traveler's feat can be considered inferior but yet relative to skirk.

and many people are on a whole different level than traveler, who are all archons (except nahida) and high tier characters like arlecchino. that means they can do that too.

but we do not need to recalculate as we can see traveler's "Lightless Eye of the Maelstrom" is same size as skirk's.

ok then

 

[Elizhaa]

The case should need an accepted calculation in a blog first.

 

[OmniScalator]

The case should need an accepted calculation in a blog first.

Can I add this calculation to a blog?

 

[PedjaTarzan]

The case should need an accepted calculation in a blog first.

Change the link to this instead

Theres already accepted calc for making blackholes in genshin
.

can we use this too?

 

[OmniScalator]

The case should need an accepted calculation in a blog first.

I made a blog as you asked.

 

[OmniScalator]

Bump

 

[Elizhaa]

I made a blog as you asked.

The calculation should be accepted first; Antvasima left instructions on your blog:

 

[OmniScalator]

The calculation should be accepted first; Antvasima left instructions on your blog:

Ok

 

[Dog3352]

Some problems with this CRT.

There is no "barrier", "strength field" or anything around the "black hole", if it is to consider it a black hole, the white "aura" around the sphere would be part of the black hole, and black holes have it around them, just see an image. Every moment when we see this apparent black hole, it looks the same, so obviously it's not any kind of shield around it.

What leads to the obvious problem, which is the fact that did not behave like a black hole. And that's not just Skirk, the apparent black hole in the Shadow Phase we face after Narwhall swallows us either doesn't behave like a black hole.
The Eye of Maelstrom invoked by Narwhall is the only one that shows the most characteristics of a black hole (gravitational force), and yet it is an extremely low gravitational force. In addition to just pulling the person and exploding, he doesn't pull and "erases" anything around him like a black hole does.

Even when Narwhall swallows us, inside it is also shown one of these black holes, which does not act as a black hole either.

Just the fact that the Eye of Maelstrom that Skirk has done literally show nothing like a real black hole already makes it impossible to be accepted.

 

[OmniScalator]

Some problems with this CRT.

1. There is no "barrier", "strength field" or anything around the "black hole", if it is to consider it a black hole, the white "aura" around the sphere would be part of the black hole, and black holes have it around them, just see an image. Every moment when we see this apparent black hole, it looks the same, so obviously it's not any kind of shield around it.

We can literally see that there is a polygonal forcefield around blackhole, and that purplish white thing is called accretion disk not "aura". Although it is barely visible we know it is there as it is in the end visible. So this problem just came from ignorance.

What leads to the obvious problem, which is the fact that did not behave like a black hole. And that's not just Skirk, the apparent black hole in the "knight" we face after Narwhall swallows us either doesn't behave like a black hole.

It behaves like a blackhole, it was sucking Atmosphere near it, we were given visual representation of it, and other people like Neuvillette and Traveler are obviously strong enough to not get sucked in as they are relative to skirk as she herself says they are relative to her.

The Eye of Maelstrom invoked by Narwhall is the only one that shows the most characteristics of a black hole (gravitational force), and yet it is an extremely low gravitational force. In addition to just pulling the person and exploding, he doesn't pull and "erases" anything around him like a black hole does.

We see Traveler literally dissipate a blackhole before entering that area, obviously those forces would look weak against traveler. And don't say that irl blackhole can not be dissipated, read hawking radiation and how it causes evaporation of blackhole.

Even when Narwhall swallows us, inside it is also shown one of these black holes, which does not act as a black hole either.

If it would suck us or platform how would we fight? simple gameplay mechanic. Somethings are adjusted to make gameplay possible.

 

[Dog3352]

We can literally see that there is a polygonal forcefield around blackhole, and that purplish white thing is called accretion disk not "aura". Although it is barely visible we know it is there as it is in the end visible. So this problem just came from ignorance.

So your theory is that the polygons around the sphere is a forcefield?
Even the "portals" through which Narwhall is going through have these polygons, this is simply the "magic" of Skirk and Narwhall, not a barrier.
Narwhall portals have these polygons, Narwhall himself when he is pulled by Skirk is with these polygons, these polygons also appear on the Eye of Maelstrom invoked by Narwhall, Skirk's portals have these polygons, even Shadow Phase himself makes these polygons appear.

It behaves like a blackhole, it was sucking Atmosphere near it, we were given visual representation of it, and other people like Neuvillette and Traveler are obviously strong enough to not get sucked in as they are relative to skirk as she herself says they are relative to her.

Polygons are simply Skirk's "magic", it is not matter and nothing of the type being absorbed.

We see Traveler literally dissipate a blackhole before entering that area, obviously those forces would look weak against traveler. And don't say that irl blackhole can not be dissipated, read hawking radiation and how it causes evaporation of blackhole.

And when he is not dissipated he simply shows this extremely weak suction force for a while and then simply explodes alone.
And I am not saying that the suction force is weak only because the Traveller can resist it, but because the attraction area is low.

If it would suck us or platform how would we fight? simple gameplay mechanic. Somethings are adjusted to make gameplay possible.

I'm not talking about the platform, but the wreckage that fly close and around the "black hole".

 

[OmniScalator]

So your theory is that the polygons around the sphere is a forcefield?
Even the "portals" through which Narwhall is going through have these polygons, this is simply the "magic" of Skirk and Narwhall, not a barrier.
Narwhall portals have these polygons, Narwhall himself when he is pulled by Skirk is with these polygons, these polygons also appear on the Eye of Maelstrom invoked by Narwhall, Skirk's portals have these polygons, even Shadow Phase himself makes these polygons appear.

Polygons are simply Skirk's "magic", it is not matter and nothing of the type being absorbed.

There is a polygonal force field lke thing and triangles in skirk's scene while in whales there are just triangles, but in the end it doesn't matter as gameplay is not considered canon in Genshin impact.

And when he is not dissipated he simply shows this extremely weak suction force for a while and then simply explodes alone.
And I am not saying that the suction force is weak only because the Traveller can resist it, but because the attraction area is low.

I'm not talking about the platform, but the wreckage that fly close and around the "black hole".

You might not be a player that is why you didn't knew but even if you defeat Narwhal whale with Hu tao or charlotte it wouldn't be feat for them or anti feat for whale as they are not considered canon within game.

and the canon things like lore, cutscenes etc says it is a real blackhole.

 

[Dog3352]

There is a polygonal force field lke thing and triangles in skirk's scene while in whales there are just triangles, but in the end it doesn't matter as gameplay is not considered canon in Genshin impact.

Honestly, I could simply say that this is a headcanon argument, since there is no evidence that it is a barrier, besides Skirk's hand directly touching the Eye of Maelstrom, which makes it very clear that it is not a barrier.
But still, to be clear, the polygons that exist around the Eye of Maelstrom created by Skirk, the Shadow Phase also makes these polygons appear several times when he attacks with his sword. Just like those "triangles", the polygons are also simply their magic, and not a barrier.

You might not be a player that is why you didn't knew but even if you defeat Narwhal whale with Hu tao or charlotte it wouldn't be feat for them or anti feat for whale as they are not considered canon within game.

and the canon things like lore, cutscenes etc says it is a real blackhole.

Dude, I've been playing the game since it came out, I just stoped playing it the 6 month, I know very well what is canon and what is not.

And no, the only evidence for this being a black hole is a poem that says that apparently light is not able to escape the Eye of Maelstrom, but while we have several visual anti-feats in the game, it definitely won't be scaled to a black hole, especially the created by Skirk, which, apart from its appearance, does not show the nature of a black hole at all.

 

[OmniScalator]

Honestly, I could simply say that this is a headcanon argument, since there is no evidence that it is a barrier, besides Skirk's hand directly touching the Eye of Elestrom, which makes it very clear that it is not a barrier.
But still, to be clear, the polygons that exist around the Eye of Elestrom created by Skirk, the Shadow Phase also makes these polygons appear several times when he attacks with his sword. Just like those "triangles", the polygons are also simply their magic, and not a barrier.

Dude, I've been playing the game since it came out, I just started playing it for about a year, I know very well what is canon and what is not.

And no, the only evidence for this being a black hole is a poem that says that apparently light is not able to escape the Eye of Elestrom, but while we have several visual anti-feats in the game, it definitely won't be scaled to a black hole, especially one created by Skirk.

What anti feats exactly?

Excluding gameplay as it is not canon

 

[Dog3352]

What anti feats exactly?

Excluding gameplay as it is not canon

• The Eye of Maelstrom created by Skirk in the cutscene not demonstrating anything that is necessary to climb into a black hole;
• The Eye of Maelstrom inside the Narwhall that has debris flying around it without being pulled in;
• The Eye of Maelstrom from Shadow Phase also not demonstrating anything that is necessary to climb into a black hole.

 

[Furina003]

• The Eye of Maelstrom created by Skirk in the cutscene not demonstrating anything that is necessary to climb into a black hole;
• The Eye of Maelstrom inside the Narwhall that has debris flying around it without being pulled in;
• The Eye of Maelstrom from Shadow Phase also not demonstrating anything that is necessary to climb into a black hole.

Not during this scene, we are really interested and see the beam of light also drawn towards it, and actually we can also see with the depiction structure in hoyoverse, you can compare the image of the black hole in the acheron and skirk characters, it really looks the same

 

[OmniScalator]

What @Furina003 said is valid but i would like to add

• The Eye of Maelstrom created by Skirk in the cutscene not demonstrating anything that is necessary to climb into a black hole;

It Literally shows that not even light is escaping it and it even have an accretion disk also it is even sucking atmosphere around it as in this video.

• The Eye of Maelstrom inside the Narwhall that has debris flying around it without being pulled in;

We actually don't know how far away or near debris is to blackhole so this point is not that valid on it's own until we are sure it is in the range, also this applies.

• The Eye of Maelstrom from Shadow Phase also not demonstrating anything that is necessary to climb into a black hole.

is this different from previous point?
are your point 2 and point 3 talking about same blackhole? Because the blackhole in second point is "The Eye of Maelstrom from Shadow Phase".

 

[PedjaTarzan]

tf is this arguing, i think its pretty much clear why blackhole isnt real its physically held and thrown, thats even said on wiki itself.
everything else described in eye of maelstrom description fits the criteria, but its still negated by the fact skirk can hold and move the blackhole.
No point of arguing if OP cant prove that blackhole can be real one despite breaking one of main criterias for it

 

[OmniScalator]

tf is this arguing, i think its pretty much clear why blackhole isnt real its physically held and thrown, thats even said on wiki itself.
everything else described in eye of maelstrom description fits the criteria, but its still negated by the fact skirk can hold and move the blackhole.
No point of arguing if OP cant prove that blackhole can be real one despite breaking one of main criterias for it

This Exists

atleast read arguments before saying anything.

 

[PedjaTarzan]

This Exists

atleast read arguments before saying anything.

i did say blackhole has its properties, but it doesnt fit in the standard because of this.

 

[OmniScalator]

i did say blackhole has its properties, but it doesnt fit in the standard because of this.

it does not apply as she is not holding event horizon, she is holding force field within which blackhole is as seen in this Image.

any more queries?

tf is this arguing, i think its pretty much clear why blackhole isnt real its physically held and thrown, thats even said on wiki itself.
everything else described in eye of maelstrom description fits the criteria, but its still negated by the fact skirk can hold and move the blackhole.
No point of arguing if OP cant prove that blackhole can be real one despite breaking one of main criterias for it

also i literally proved it, not my problem if you didn't read it.

can you tell what is wrong in reasoning?