Humans R>F Their Dreams

[Sniper670]

Well in Pokémon, it's mentioned all dreams are real. But of course it's just a dream so it disappears when they wake up


1. Those whose memories fade
seek to carve them in their hearts…

(記憶　かすみし者は
心に　刻みつける　ことを　望む……）

2. Every Dream is Another Reality. Don't Forget That.
(全ての　夢は　もうひとつの　現実
それを　忘れるべからず……)

It's a series of connected texts. What does one get with this?

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

Dreams are inherently unreal/imaginary, so you technically have r>f over it but then again, it isn't logically 'real'. The quote there says that a dream is another reality and if it's space-time + size is known, then it's low 2-C but considering the implication that it might be for all of humanity...That's 2-B.

Having r>f over those constructs is 5-D.

 

[Arceus0x]

Dreams are inherently unreal/imaginary, so you technically have r>f over it but then again, it isn't logically 'real'. The quote there says that a dream is another reality and if it's space-time + size is known, then it's low 2-C but considering the implication that it might be for all of humanity...That's 2-B.

Having r>f over those construct/s is 5-D.

Or 2-A cause infinite timelines = infinite humans

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

Or 2-A cause infinite timelines = infinite humans

Yeah.

 

[Sniper670]

Dreams are inherently unreal/imaginary, so you technically have r>f over it but then again, it isn't logically 'real'. The quote there says that a dream is another reality and if it's space-time + size is known, then it's low 2-C but considering the implication that it might be for all of humanity...That's 2-B.

I see

Having r>f over those construct/s is 5-D.

Huh, So humans are....... 5D?

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

Huh, So humans are....... 5D?

That's just a rating without taking into account:

• Are these realities equal to, greater or lower than non-dream origin realities? If they're lower, is it due to having a dream origin or does the verse treat it as any other 4D structure but they're lower on the scale before X type of 4D construct is superior in a r>f or non r>f way (the lower is a query regarding it's validity of being 4-D baseline at-least)
• If the dreamers see their dream-origin realities as fiction, how do they see realities born from other dreamers?

 

[Sniper670]

1. Well, like I said, they're just dreams.

They're lower. Most Humans and Pokémon don't know their dreams are real, it has no effect on them for that to worry them.
The dream reality thing was something that was mentioned in lore at Latias/Latios Lair.

But to summarize. Every human has a little heart(Arceus) in them. That is what they use to perceive the world in general and also for dreaming. At the Highest level, it is Arceus, in relation to the multiverse, as it's the same thing with Arceus. The multiverse is in The Original Heart, which is Pure Consciousness
It's something like

Humans R>F dreams with the heart

Arceus(Original Heart) R>F the multiverse and their R>F dreams


2. That hasn't happened before iirc

There's a reverse instance that I remember a bit similar to what you're asking. A fight between Dialga/Palkia caused a space time distortion that blurred the lines between dreams and reality . A Pokémon who was dreaming about being the mayor, became the mayor irl. And that was the case with all manifested dreams from dreamers

To summarize, these dreams aren't important enough to be worth noting by either humans or Pokémon. And even a lot of Pokémon eat dreams and destroy these dreams in normal combat. Nightmares have no effect on them other than scaring them. But in actuality these "dreams" are real

 

[TheGreatJedi13]

they are lower planes then. and since the main focus of the verse is the real world of humans and pokemons
by reality equalization we can't just say the original plane is the dreams which is insignificant towards the main worlds reality except to certain scenario such as mentioned above.

so to answer OP.
they get nothing

 

[Sniper670]

I guess so. But they're still dreaming realities

So 2A? Since the timelines are infinite=humans

 

[TheGreatJedi13]

Take it this way you can have as many infinite Flat space without any width but it will never reach or become 3 dimensional as a 2D flat thing

idk how this is going to be considered a full blown timeline because they exist as lower planes

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

1. Well, like I said, they're just dreams.

They're lower. Most Humans and Pokémon don't know their dreams are real, it has no effect on them for that to worry them.
The dream reality thing was something that was mentioned in lore at Latias/Latios Lair.

But to summarize. Every human has a little heart(Arceus) in them. That is what they use to perceive the world in general and also for dreaming. At the Highest level, it is Arceus, in relation to the multiverse, as it's the same thing with Arceus. The multiverse is in The Original Heart, which is Pure Consciousness
It's something like

Humans R>F dreams with the heart

Arceus(Original Heart) R>F the multiverse and their R>F dreams


2. That hasn't happened before iirc

There's a reverse instance that I remember a bit similar to what you're asking. A fight between Dialga/Palkia caused a space time distortion that blurred the lines between dreams and reality . A Pokémon who was dreaming about being the mayor, became the mayor irl. And that was the case with all manifested dreams from dreamers

To summarize, these dreams aren't important enough to be worth noting by either humans or Pokémon. And even a lot of Pokémon eat dreams and destroy these dreams in normal combat. Nightmares have no effect on them other than scaring them. But in actuality these "dreams" are real

Alright, you seem confident about the first part. You just need a CRT with just these:

• Establish that dreams aren't illusory but real (The quote has already done this).
• If dreamers have r>f over their dreams, then the same must be true either by a direct statement of heavy implication towards the dreams of other dreamers (I think you meant it in general sense that "Humans R>F dreams with the heart" so this is probably checked)

All that is left is to scale the cosmology with these dream realities being baseline and everything else being above that, provided there isn't already something lower.

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

Take it this way you can have as many infinite Flat space without any width but it will never reach or become 3 dimensional as a 2D flat thing

idk how this is going to be considered a full blown timeline because they exist as lower planes

Never saw a rule like that.

The main cosmology having something lower would be considered 2D or below in terms of dimensionality... But with proof of something being a 4-D construct and the main focus of the series being a higher world above that...Then it's clearly 5-D baseline (if it's r>f)

 

[Sniper670]

Take it this way you can have as many infinite Flat space without any width but it will never reach or become 3 dimensional as a 2D flat thing

idk how this is going to be considered a full blown timeline because they exist as lower planes

Dialga and Palkia space time distortion messed up it.. Implying these things are full space time continuums.

Theres also a realm that exists between dreams and Reality, the Interdream Zone.

We've only seen one instance of dream.

If they're dreaming about the universe it is the universe. That is the case of Ash when they were trapped in one of the dreams. It was the universe 1:1.

In other words Humans and Pokémon have physically moved into dreams before.

It's dangerous to humans and Pokémon in this case, but not dangerous when you're in external reality

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

A good example of this type of situation is Doctor Strange Multiverse of Madness. Dreams are another reality. If something had r>f over it, it's 5-D. It's spoiler because it's a recent movie that not everyone has seen.

 

[Sniper670]

How was that demonstrated. Sorry but I haven't seen it myself, and I don't mind spoilers

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

I saw it in the cinemas a-while ago so I'm not exactly sure that they create these realities through dreams, probably not. But they definitely do dream of other realities. It's sort of the main point, these realities, with Wanda searching for her kids.

 

[Sniper670]

I did a little digging around and yeah. A bit similar

 

[TheGreatJedi13]

Spoiler: Mcu spoiler

Multiverse of madness dreams doesn't have R>F situations because they are actual realities and they literally had to dreamwalk just to invade another universe from the multiverse.this show that dreams in the MCU isn't lower planes. you don't see DR strange or Wanda as 5D in this situation. let alone regular human

 

[Sniper670]

So theoretically it would be like this?

The Dream=4D
Main Reality=5D
CT realms =6D
Arceus Realm =7D

It won't work. Probably because GF didn't put too much thought into it but I wanted to know if this would've been the case

 

[Le'garde273]

So theoretically it would be like this?

The Dream=4D
Main Reality=5D
CT realms =6D
Arceus Realm =7D

It won't work. Probably because GF didn't put too much thought into it but I wanted to know if this would've been the case

Is there any proof that supporting CT realm are higher dimensional?
Giratina realm is quite 0D for real

 

[Sniper670]

They're already higher dimensional on the wiki tho.

 

[Arceus0x]

They're already higher dimensional on the wiki tho.

they're 4D

 

[Sniper670]

Where was it mentioned they're 4D. Can I get source?

 

[Arceus0x]

Where was it mentioned they're 4D. Can I get source?

at best 4D. That is if we assume Dialga's realm has time cause he's the god of time and all that.

 

[Le'garde273]

Yo they're really an aspect concept of universes and omnipresent, how does they're not 4D being.

Well bulbapedia state also four dimensional being, you can read it at extrarorial pokemon page

 

[Arceus0x]

Yo they're really an aspect concept of universes and omnipresent, how does they're not 4D being.

Well bulbapedia state also four dimensional being, you can read it at extrarorial pokemon page

we're not talking about CT themselves but rather their realms

 

[Sniper670]

Yo they're really an aspect concept of universes and omnipresent, how does they're not 4D being

Time can be 5D if it's beyond standard 4D realm

I'm asking specifically because nowhere was it mentioned time's dimensionality

Humans>Their dreams. Fictious time and space that disappears when they wake up

Well bulbapedia state also four dimensional being, you can read it at extrarorial pokemon page

They're using standard universal model tho.

 

[Arceus0x]

Time can be 5D if it's beyond standard 4D realm

I'm asking specifically because nowhere was it mentioned time's dimensionality

time is on average at least 4D. Not saying it can't be 5D but rather that it needs evidence

 

[Le'garde273]

we're not talking about CT themselves but rather their realms

Ouh... My bad
But yeah dialga realm has time and palkia realm should be equal

 

[Sniper670]

time is on average at least 4D. Not saying it can't be 5D but rather that it needs evidence

Are you sure buddy?

 

[Arceus0x]

Are you sure buddy?

not reading that, don't care about FE, never will

 

[Sniper670]

Humans and Pokémon have more feats than even Saitama. Lol

 

[TheGreatJedi13]

So theoretically it would be like this?

The Dream=4D
Main Reality=5D
CT realms =6D
Arceus Realm =7D

It won't work. Probably because GF didn't put too much thought into it but I wanted to know if this would've been the case

If the dream is alternate reality its 4D
if the dream is merely a dream then its less than 3D

If the dream is an alternate reality from the main reality
then main reality is only 4D or equal to dream
The dream no longer becomes R>F if there are confirmation that what you're dreaming is alternate timeline of the multiverse

Spoiler: MCU

That's why in Multiverse of Madness Chaves who is only one in the multiverse doesn't have dreams or can't dream because he doesn't have an alternate self in any alternate reality of their multiverse and when the Dreamer wakes up they simply return to their own reality and the reality in their dream continues in the alternate universe

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

If the Dream Realities are simply alternate realities then they would be 4D alongside the Main Reality. If the CT Realms embed or transcend the Main Reality I could see them being 5D, and obviously, Arceus would be further above that at 6D.

 

[Sniper670]

The Dream World is a plane. Interdream Zone is a space that seperates Dreams from Realities.

All Dreams manifest in that reality, but it's unique to what you're dreaming.

Interdream Zone is invisible to normal reality without a special device,

Dream World is unreachable without using a psychic type or some kind of magic to break into who's dream who want to go. But Humans and Pokémon can physically go there if they wanted through these means

 

[TheGreatJedi13]

then interdream zone is basically just a closed off dimension from main reality and alternate reality
basically a link or a gateway that connects both main reality and alternate reality that someone dreams off

 

[Sniper670]

Yes. So what is the relationship between Dream and Reality from your observation

R>F?

 

[TheGreatJedi13]

just like multiverse of madness
its not R>F
dreams just have special nature in this verse
so if Arceus treats the whole reality as a dream that thing is put into question as well due to the nature of dreams in this verse which makes him at best only 5D even if he just dreams the creation trio

 

[Arceus0x]

technically that would boost Pokemon's 2-B ratings.

I mean we're talking

120 million*countless*countless since there will be a countless amount of people over time

 

[Sniper670]

If the Dream Realities are simply alternate realities then they would be 4D alongside the Main Reality. If the CT Realms embed or transcend the Main Reality I could see them being 5D, and obviously, Arceus would be further above that at 6D.

I believe this could work