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Alex Mercer vs Doomguy

Dooms ignores the impact that affects both organics, inorganics, and space and matter. It's just a higher quality level.
But none of it are quantifiable based on the scans. It didn’t even explicitly state the scale of the Demonic Influence’s Corruption. As far as the scale of Matter/Biological/Disease Manipulation and Absorption goes, Mercer’s one has an explicit scale whereas Doom Slayer’s resistance to Corruption (which supposedly contains such abilities) involving such has no quantifiable scale, so it’s not quite valid to say Doom Slayer resists because Demonic Influence (which all happened off-screen and doesn’t even seem that combat applicable) is “higher level”.
 
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You are just trying to ignore the LOR (hopefully in English it spelled as well) and the peculiarities of the Doom verse. In the archives, notes, the codex, it is said about the influence exerted by the demonic presence and how the Titans tear reality with their presence. This is done passively and needs no demonstration.
 
All of which are done off-screen and has never been shown to be used on combat situations. Even lower-tier characters in Doom, such as Night Sentinels, was able to canonically combat and fend off those same Demons with those reality-tearing presence for a while, and I doubt the Night Sentinels possesses the same resistances Doom Slayer has. It being passive does not mean it can be combat applicable like you think it is, especially when we literally see no demonstration of such abilities being used in combat. Even some other characters in this site who has passive hax abilities have shown combat applicability with it, so if the Demons don’t show such combat applicability… Then it is assumed to be combat inapplicable just due to lack of explicit feats or scans alone.

And showing feats of Reality Warping is unquantifiable and means nothing (and even such feats of Reality Warping are all done off-screen and has not shown any cases of being used in combat). Reality Warping is a completely seperate ability from the other abilities such as Matter/Biological/Disease Manipulation and Absorption, so they don’t scale to each other at all. Trying to scale Reality Warping to such abilities is like comparing apples to oranges, it just doesn’t work as they aren’t the same and would work on a completely different basis.
 
You are just trying to ignore the LOR (hopefully in English it spelled as well) and the peculiarities of the Doom verse. In the archives, notes, the codex, it is said about the influence exerted by the demonic presence and how the Titans tear reality with their presence. This is done passively and needs no demonstration.
dude reality warping and biological manipulations are two different things
in doom the best we see from organic manipulation of hell is cellular level, the black light virus rips you apart on a molecular scale
 
This is not reality warping.
Reality is simply torn apart by his presence. It is passive and happens all the time.
How the surface of the Earth with its atmosphere was transformed is already a consequence of the demonic presence and is a clear demonstration.
If a person cannot be influenced by something that simply tears the matter and fabric of reality, simply not being able to break the structure of the body and armor, then it is strange to think that a virus will cope with this.
 
This is not reality warping.
Reality is simply torn apart by his presence. It is passive and happens all the time.
How the surface of the Earth with its atmosphere was transformed is already a consequence of the demonic presence and is a clear demonstration.
If a person cannot be influenced by something that simply tears the matter and fabric of reality, simply not being able to break the structure of the body and armor, then it is strange to think that a virus will cope with this.
That is literally Reality Warping.
There are various other characters in this site who has abilities categorised as such when they have scans of "destroying reality" or "distort reality with their presence" before. Just like how "destroying concepts" (either via one's own presence or through some other ability) would be classified as Conceptual Manipulation, so too does "destroying reality" would classify as Reality Warping. These are literally the universal standards for how this site categorise abilities as it has been done for many years, and if you don't like it, then you make a CRT about it to change such. Otherwise, trying to argue against the universal standards of this site would not get you far in the Versus forums of this site.

And again for the Demonic Influence being "passive" and "happens all the time":
It being passive does not mean it can be combat applicable like you think it is, especially when we literally see no demonstration of such abilities being used in combat. Even some other characters in this site who has passive hax abilities have shown combat applicability with it, so if the Demons don’t show such combat applicability… Then it is assumed to be combat inapplicable just due to lack of explicit feats or scans alone.

And showing feats of Reality Warping is unquantifiable and means nothing (and even such feats of Reality Warping are all done off-screen and has not shown any cases of being used in combat). Reality Warping is a completely seperate ability from the other abilities such as Matter/Biological/Disease Manipulation and Absorption, so they don’t scale to each other at all. Trying to scale Reality Warping to such abilities is like comparing apples to oranges, it just doesn’t work as they aren’t the same and would work on a completely different basis.
So you either provide me the feats/scans of the Demonic Influence being used in combat situations that includes Matter Manipulation, Biological Manipulation, Disease Manipulaton, and Absorption or it is combat inapplicable due to lack of explicit scans. Feats are everything on this site, especially so as to prevent No-Limits Fallacy.
The surface of Earth and its atmosphere being transformed seems to have happened off-screen and has not shown being used in a combat situation, so that is not a demonstration of combat applicability.

Also, tearing apart reality does not equate to Matter Manipulation, Disease Manipulation, Biological Manipulation or Absorption in the least. You are extrapolating abilities and are comparing apples and oranges. Destroying/Distorting Reality via One's presence (which is Reality Warping by how this site treats it) ≠ Matter/Biological/Disease Manipulation or Absorption.
 
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In Prototype 2, we see clear cutscenes of clear liquids in the memories every time Whitelight is mentioned with no mention of such liquids ever coming from organic sources from what I can recall, along with it being stored in barrels and containers/deposits that commonly indicates inorganic chemicals. Considering we know that Bloodtox is definitely inorganic in Prototype 1 and that Whitelight is being stored in the same way as Bloodtox suggests that Whitelight is also a type of inorganic chemical as well - though Whitelight’s composition is irrelevant considering Blacklight Virus already scales for affecting inorganic objects. Infecting inorganic matter is a feat already done by the Redlight Virus, which the Blacklight Virus already scales to.
Liquids aren't inherently inorganic, and there is no mention of those liquids being inorganic either. You previously calling Whitelight a virus also contradicts this; in which case Blacklight would be infecting the liquid materials produced by the Whitelight virus.
Don't recall the composition of Bloodtox being elaborated on; could easily be organic chemicals.

The Hives (buildings infected by Redlight Virus) having tendrils being inside of the walls and even have everything inside the infected building from the walls to the ground have tendrils being deeply embedded inside them is quite evident that it's more than just "sprouting on the surface" - merely sprouting on the surface wouldn't have had the building walls being durable enough to withstand heavy military attacks that also includes Attack Helicopters and M1 Abrams tanks (which ordinary walls definitely aren't durable enough to withstand), so for the integrity of the building to be enhanced as it was explicitly stated, it is definitely implied that the very structure of the buildings themselves are affected by the Redlight Virus infection. Unless those Hellgrowths are explicitly done by Biological Manipulation on living beings, that isn’t molecular level Biological Manipulation, and I from what I can see, Hellgrowths are caused by Reality Warping by appearing from nowhere from demonic presence off-screen rather than from Matter Manipulation of pre-existing objects based on the scans you’ve cited, and the diseases mentioned in those scans does not suggest anything that’s of molecular-level infection - thus, I heavily doubt causing Hellgrowths to manifest would directly scale to biologically altering living beings’ biology or the diseases that popped up from those hazardous environment. Unless the Biological Manipulation or similar feats are explicitly described to affect all molecules of the targets like the Blacklight Virus does, that isn’t really an explicit feat/scan of molecular-level Biological Manipulation. At best, it’s genetic/cellular level Biological Manipulation based on those humans being made into servants of hell via rewriting genetic information (which Doom Slayer would only be scaling to at the very best, and even then such seems to be quite questionable considering there’s no mention of Doom Slayer having resistance to Disease/Biological Manipulation anywhere in his profile or even any mentions of him resisting a Demon’s off-screen reality-distorting demonic influence anywhere), which Mercer can overpower with his Molecular-level infection and molecular-level Biological Manipulation.
Still don't see how this is Transmutation or Matter Manipulation, but Hellgrowth have a superior version of that.
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Per the codex they have rapid cancer-like growth and replication, so it isn't all reality-warping.

Reinforcement can be accomplished by having structural support from the inside and a durable layer on the outside.

You are basically claiming that the Blacklight virus no longer needs to consume biological materials for sustenance and growth, and can replicate by consuming metal, concrete, and other inorganic materials. This is quite the claim that is not explicitly mentioned anywhere.

I agree that Alex can control the molecular of the Blacklight Virus; what remains unsubstantiated is that the infection is inorganic and that the process targets molecules instead of cells/genes.

As for Mercer absorbing large amounts of metals, that happens when Blacklight characters absorbed the military armour of Blackwatch soldiers and replicated even everything from the clothing, including the gas masks, the LED of the masks, and even electronic devices such as radios being absorbed and mimicked to the point that it could communicate like how radios normally does. Even the properties of Hazmat Suits are replicated by the Blacklight characters’ Absorption, such as when James Heller used a Hazmat Suit disguise (that he has gotten from absorbing a person in a Hazmat Suit) to protect him from getting affecting by Bloodtox gasses in Prototype 2. The claws and blades of Blacklight characters being metallic when they shapeshift their arms into such for combat also demonstrates that they can replicate metals with their Shapeshifting (and the Blacklight characters’ Shapeshifting and Absorption are quite interconnected in the Prototype series) as well.
That is example of a small amount of metal; clearly not sufficient to establish he can absorb metallic objects as large as the Praetor Suit in the same way he absorbs flesh and bones. This does not answer my request nor bring something new (I already pointed out he can replicate metal).

Also he is not necessarily transforming the virus into electronic equipment; he can simply store the electronic equipment inside his body, and then whip it out to complete the disguise. James Heller takes out his cellphone from his 'pocket' to participate in video calls and play recorded videos; just like he can store the cellphone inside him with no need to presume he is creating cellphones from scratch, he can store his disguise's radio receiver and LED electronic components inside him.

As for the Argent Energy of the Praetor suit, that's because he wouldn't be dabbling with energy, only matter of the Praetor suit and Doom Slayer himself within the suit. Though he can also just as easily just infect Doom Slayer and the Praetor suit at a distance if he needs to.
Short of intangibility, I don't see how that works. So attempting absorption, assuming he can rip or metabolize the Praetor Suit, is a bad move.

Being temporarily incapacitated by severe injuries is irrelevant when Mercer should be able to recover well enough on his own without needing to absorb anything after a couple of moments, especially based on Mercer scaling to the Supreme Hunter (a being created from Mercer’s own DNA and has inherited Mercer’s Shapeshifting and regenerative abilities) that can reform a hand-sized worth of biomass from a puddle within only mere seconds (suggesting a similar timeframe for other it’s other body parts to reform) without ever having any biomass before hand. The Supreme Hunter being reduced to a puddle was heavily implied to have happened off-sceeen, especially given we only see it collapsing when Mercer defeated it in the gameplay.
And Doom Slayer would need to get through thousands of humans worth of biomass for Mercer to ever have his regeneration slow down, and even then, that wouldn’t stop Mercer from rapidly regenerating within moments based on the Supreme Hunter’s feat.
The Supreme Hunter remained incapacitated longer than a couple of moments, and finishing Alex off in that state would be easy. There is no evidence that the Supreme Hunter is able to reform more than a hand within a short time directly after his defeat.
James Heller gained the ability to generate a large amount of biomass after absorbing Alex, but Alex was weakened and incapacitated to the point that he could no longer regenerate. So Doom Slayer doesn't need to get through the maximum size of the biomass; he only needs to damage Alex to the point that he no longer has energy to regenerate.

As for the nuke explosion scene, that’s only due to the temperature of the nuclear fireball surpassing Mercer’s own heat resistance. Before the nuke, blasts from thermobaric weapons was endured by Mercer and thermobaric weapons could reach up to high temperatures as high as little over 1900 degrees Celsius. Unless Doom Slayer’s BFG9000 has an explicit statement/scan that mentions an explicit temperature value for the BFG9000 blasts, that isn’t really a good argument to suggest that Mercer can’t endure the temperature of those blasts.
Then the standard superheated plasma rifle is more than enough to do the job, and the BFG-9000 is a ridiculous overkill. Naturally occurring plasma is above 10000 degrees. Argent Energy such as the ones fired from BFG-9000 vastly exceeds that:
Argent Energy is produced by neutron activation of Argent plasma, a new and powerful substance that was discovered on Mars. This produces an exothermic reaction where recorded temperatures within the plasma have exceeded previously accepted theoretical limits. Through a process not yet fully understood, Argent plasma remains stable and self-contained throughout. Conventional nuclear power is obsolete. What used to take a nuclear reactor 12 months to produce can be generated in a few seconds by the Argent Tower and packaged into an Argent Accumulator no larger than Samuel Hayden's hand.
However, deeper analysis of the substance showed it to be an entirely new form of matter with a quantum signature never before recorded. Initial tests on this new matter immediately showed its potential. When a 2 megakelvin cutting laser was fired at the substance, it absorbed the heat with ease and remained self-contained. A second expedition was planned to further analyze this remarkable new "Argent plasma".

Argent Energy is stable with a temperature of 2000000 K, and the BFG-9000 fires supercharged and superheated Argent Energy.
Meanwhile, in gameplay the thermobaric tank can one-shot with max health upgrades.
 
I don't quite understand where the allegations came from about Mercer tanking thermobaric missiles. We don't have cutscenes with this, and in gameplay they cause him huge damage. Moreover, I searched the Internet and found out that the temperature of an underwater nuclear explosion is much lower than that of a conventional one due to a decrease in gas pressure. The heat wave evaporating water around the charge reaches 1000 kelvin. In any case, at a temperature of a million degrees, all the metal of the helicopter would simply evaporate, but we did not see this.
I also disagree with the fact that Mercer is regenerating from the ashes when we clearly see that he has recovered from a piece of biomass discarded by the shock wave.
The best regeneration in the verse is regeneration from a pool of blood. But it was something disposable, in the future the hunter could not repeat it without replenishing the biomass.
A few tearing apart and destroying the weapon-hands and Mercer is on his knees again
 
Hellgrowths are separate from the Demon's passive reality warping/corruption, they just grow in corrupted/warped areas via unknown means, really. They're just meaty... I don't know, cancer-like cells that spread and grow rapidly.
 
I like how you fellas totally forgot how AP and temperature work on this site BFG is not enough to damage mercer much less outright kill as its AP is 173.027 tons while mercer is rated at above 480.4 well over 2 times as powerful as the bfg so that is not going to be doing squat against mercer and thats not even including armor and muscle mass multipliers after which he could quite literally walk through the bfg


@NikHelton don't even bring up gameplay things into it cuse I can go on and bring up how the slayer gets gibed by the bfg prototypes prior to us getting the bfg itself or how he gets negged by molten metal in the foundry even though the suit he wears tanked a laser quite a bit hotter than the metal in lore. We use scaling to know that both mercer and doomslayer are way above the thermaberic blasts or the bfg in their respective verses with mercer by end game being beyond the mother who can tank quite a bit more than a thermaberic missile and by scaling being beyond the goliaths who can tank thermaberic blasts in game and lore alike and doomslayer being able to rip apart demons who can tank the complete bfg with little difficulty thus making both of them massively beyond either weapon and not to mention that the cals we use for their AP show us that they are in fact so far above both weapons in universe that they wouldn't even notice if either got hit. TL;DR don't use gameplay anti feats they go both ways mate


@ShadowWhoWalks nice of you to use the super gore nest without mentioning that its a single of its kind in the game and us taking it out was a massive blow to the invasion of hell not to mention that it works pretty much identically to the hives of P1 and 2 acting as a spawning pit with the massive exception that the gore nest simply allowed easier passage from hell to earth and not to mention that in lore it didn't just come about on its own

"The Super Gore Nest was created through a ritual conducted by UAC cultists under the command of Deag Ranak, which dramatically accelerated the development of a Hellgrowth within the reactor chamber of a UAC facility in central Europe. Its location is the initial origin point of the invasion of Earth, and the Hell portal sustained by the gore nest is capable of allowing millions of demons to pass through the void.

In an attempt to destroy the nest, four US Battle Mech divisions, the Con-EUR Long Range Naval Artillery Barrage Fleet, 27 US Night Bird Apaches, three NATO Shock Troop battalions, two CON-EUR Rapid Response Levi-Tank divisions, and 18,000 coalition Special Forces units sacrificed themselves; however, they failed in their effort."

so nice of you to misslead the actual facts and context of the actual thing not to mention that even size wise most of the nests in Prototype blow the gore nest out of the water
i
i

with the hives being underground and puncturing the ground and quite literally enveloping dozens of city blocks while the super gore nest which came about from extra involvement of the hell priests and even the khan mayker only being about 3/4 city blocks in range.

so to put that little Transmutation and Matter Manipulation debate to end the super gore nest is one of a kind and has not been replecated in game outside of hell ever again be it in the dlcs or in 2016 while prototype has hives spring up time and time again without any extra involvement with the hives created by powerful infected such as Greene being massively durable and massive in size

"you are basically claiming that the Blacklight virus no longer needs to consume biological materials for sustenance and growth, and can replicate by consuming metal, concrete, and other inorganic materials. This is quite the claim that is not explicitly mentioned anywhere."

no one is calming that the black light doesn't require biological matter it does, what the claim is, is that is capable of breaking down and transforming inorganic matter into its whole which it is and has shown to be doing since P1 with hives manifesting themselves on regular buildings capable of creating flesh sacks on said building and clearly breaking down the buildings themselves as seen with large amounts of ruble and metal being flung out each times the sacks spawn a powerful infected as well as being able to break down Kevlar armor like no one’s business with mercer and Heller being able to absorb the super soldiers who are covered head to toe with Kevlar.


"That is example of a small amount of metal; clearly not sufficient to establish he can absorb metallic objects as large as the Praetor Suit in the same way he absorbs flesh and bones. This does not answer my request nor bring something new (I already pointed out he can replicate metal)."

Again they are capable of breaking down people in full body armor not just small bits here and there but full suits covering the whole body

"Also he is not necessarily transforming the virus into electronic equipment; he can simply store the electronic equipment inside his body, and then whip it out to complete the disguise. James Heller takes out his cell phone from his 'pocket' to participate in video calls and play recorded videos; just like he can store the cell phone inside him with no need to presume he is creating cell phones from scratch, he can store his disguise's radio receiver and LED electronic components inside him."

that would be the case if we did not clearly see in game play that he breaks down the whole target and everything on its the virus rips the body apart on a molecular scale that includes the armor the electronics the whole bunch hell that is the only explanation as too how said equipment doesn't turn to shrapnel each time mercer or heller get hit by a massive explosion cuse most electronics would get fried from a direct missile strike which happens consistently in prototype and the radios that are on their damned chests the main point of impact function normally even after all of the explosions and bullets and massive shock waves the endure.

"
The Supreme Hunter remained incapacitated longer than a couple of moments, and finishing Alex off in that state would be easy. There is no evidence that the Supreme Hunter is able to reform more than a hand within a short time directly after his defeat.
James Heller gained the ability to generate a large amount of biomass after absorbing Alex, but Alex was weakened and incapacitated to the point that he could no longer regenerate. So Doom Slayer doesn't need to get through the maximum size of the biomass; he only needs to damage Alex to the point that he no longer has energy to regenerate."

yeah except that majority of the weapons we use in 2016 wouldn't even be able to deal any damage to alex in the slightest other then the doomslayers fits themselves
and again the heller vs mercer fight is massive PIS mercer had all the biomass that heller used in the end it wasn't some special ability that he gained from killing mercer but just how much of a store of biomass mercer had in himself which makes the whole ripping his hands of so massively questionable that it isn't even funny when we know for a FACT that mercer is capable of regenerating his body within moments after consuming a crow which means a crows worth of biomass is enough for mercer to speed up his regeneration to such an extent now imagine what a city worth of biomass would be able to do? So please stop using that fight it’s so full of plot holes and just general disregard of pre-established lore elements that it isn't even funny.

"Then the standard superheated plasma rifle is more than enough to do the job, and the BFG-9000 is a ridiculous overkill. Naturally occurring plasma is above 10000 degrees. Argent Energy such as the ones fired from BFG-9000 vastly exceeds that:"

ah yes a 9-A weapon will be enough to bring down a 8-A sure thing mate whatever


"Argent Energy is stable with a temperature of 2000000 K, and the BFG-9000 fires supercharged and superheated Argent Energy.
Meanwhile, in gameplay the thermobaric tank can one-shot with max health upgrades"

so can a bfg prototype one shot slayer in game does it make sense lore wise? No it does not stop trying to use gameplay anti feats when they clearly contradict lore
 
also dono why I haven't mentioned it earlier but the Transmutation that we see in majority of the "human" enemies in doom takes place through one of two ways one is being possesed by a demon this usually results in regular zombies or zombie soldiers or through Lazarus Waves which creates regular revenants never has it been shown that direct interactions with regular hell enemies or even the super gore nest that people turn into demons and mutate just from the passive presence of the demonic threat its only shown and told to us that humans transform that drastically through a direct implementation of argent into them through lazarus waves or through possesion not passively what so ever

the only things that effect people passively is the buff totems which drive people insane and even then not out right as in the codex it outright states that people incountered them and survived without losing their marbles

"Incarnal manifestations of human suffering, these totems are formed from the tortured resonance of the once living, made flesh by the black arts of demonic psychomancy. A beacon of necroplasmic dark-wave energy, the Buff Totem, once fully formed, radiates the surrounding environment with a dark cloud of Hell magic. This energy possesses influence of great power for anything living caught in it's wake: Demons, while in it's presence, become adrenalized; their aggressiveness and bloodlust amplified. Inversely, these totems have become symbols of fear for humans who have encountered them, it's presence tainting the mind with nightmarish terror. The propagation of these totems would ultimately necessitate the development of the ARC mind-shield, a cyber-neural implant which could immunize it's soldiers from the psionic properties of the Buff Totem."

so still no passive Transmutation and biological resitanace present
 
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