Dragon Ball Kai + Anime Canonicity

The Dragon Ball Z Anime is considered non-canon on VS Battles, as well as Dragon Ball Kai. I quote, "Due to considerable contradictions, we do not consider Dragon Ball Kai as part of the main canon, and strictly use the original manga and Dragon Ball Super for scaling the characters." Except for the filler, when has it ever been demonstrated that the DBZ Anime is connected to the movies and GT, or that the entire anime is non-canon?

Also, what is the contradictions that Dragon Ball Kai has? From what I've heard, its removed most of the filler from the original anime that contradicts the manga.

Anime in general are considered non-canon unless otherwise specified due to being adaptations made by other companies.

Cropfist said:

Anime in general are considered non-canon unless otherwise specified due to being adaptaions made by other companies.

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Really? Didn't Toriyama help work on the anime though? I mean, its never been officially stated to be non-canon. The difference is the movies have been stated to be a separate canon. DBZ Kai and the DBZ anime have not.

Toriyama only worked on Super. This may also help.

Okay. I understand GT and the filler in the original DBZ Anime being non-canon, but I still don't understand DBZ Kai being non-canon, since most of the non-canon filler was taken out, and this was made to be more similar to the manga.

Well, from what I vaguely recall, there were contradictions with Frieza's stay in hell, and certain other issues. I am the wrong person to ask however. Somebody else might remember the discussion better.

Ok. Then I guess I'll just wait for someone else's response then.

Well, I also vaguely recall that Buu's galaxy-busting feat remained in DB Kai, which is a sharp deviation from thd original manga, and we generally go by the original source material to stay on the safe side.

I know. However, I don't remember that being contradicted by anything like Frieza's stay in hell was. This was just an addition that the manga didn't have. It's not like something in the manga or Dragon Ball Super contradicted it.

It is still a massive deviation, and would lead to a much higher power level rating, that is not supported by the source material.

Hell can be treated as a retcon, since we were shown multiple times what hell was in Z, and that there was one hell, but in RoF, Freeza stated something about earths hell. Meaning the planets (at least ones with life at minimum) would have their own hell.

Buu's galaxy bust is supported by Goku's Universal spirit bomb, which drew power from the entire universe, which wouldn't be Universal, but at best Multi-Galaxy (or at least enough to support Kid Buu being Galaxy level). Yes, there are only 28 planets remaining with life, plus the 8 Beerus destroyed at the start of Super (something that happens after the Spirit Bomb, so yes, it is valid), however Goku borrows power from stars and planets themselves.

Stars in the universe:

1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000

Let's say one star outputs 380,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 j/s, which is the average output of the su

Assuming he took a small 5% of the power of each thing is a heavy lowball, as we saw it exausted the humans on earth once they gave their energy. However, I will use 5% anyways.

Meaning from every star, he took 1.9e+26 joules, or Large Continent level energy per star. Again, this is a massive low ball, as 5% of a humans energy wouldn't be enough to tire them, yet we see that doing so exhausted them. So the final result is actually much higher.

This adds up to 1.9e+50 joules for every star in the Universe. Yes, this would be only in the middle of solar system level, however there are a few more things to be considered:

1. This includes stars only.

2. Mystic Gohan, Goten, Trunks, Piccolo and Z fighters gave their power as well. Gohan is already solar system level here, easily and there are several Large Star beings giving their energy.

3. He was borrowing power from afterlife as well, as we saw King Yenma give his power. It's possible he also gathered from the Kaioshin Realm, which is technically part of U7 and has it's own suns as well.

4. The spirit bomb is truly effective against beings with even the smallest bit of evil in their hearts. Kid Buu was completley evil, no remorse whatsoever.

Not to mention small boosts of ki provide massive power boosts (which I can mae a thread on later. It was also gone over in that hangouts call)

So I don't see a problem with MSS Kid Buu.

Freeza's contradiction is out of the way, and MSS Kid Buu can be argued. I'm not sure of any other contradictions you guys may have seen in kai, but if you have any more maybe leave a list?

That's a good point. Like I said, DBZ Kai doesn't have as many contradictions as the original DBZ anime did. I never realized that there could be a retcon for Hell in the Dragon Ball series. Thanks for the info!

Well, I am definitely not going to start a massive DBZ revision without considerable input from the staff.

That's completley understandable, but would it be possible if we could get some of the staffs attention on the comments here? I don't think it's too big an issue if it stays civil, but maybe linking it to some staff is better, since if it gets highlighted, it'll attract more people and then it is extremely likely to get closed down.

Also, I just realized I said that each star gave him large planet level energy. Lemme fix that lol.

I have temporarily highlighted the thread.

Pretty sure that was disregarded before considering you can't really calc unquantifiable spiritual energy like that, or else we'd end up having 50% power Frieza nearly killed by a not even planet level attack.

Azathoth the Abyssal Idiot said:

Pretty sure that was disregarded before considering you can't really calc unquantifiable spiritual energy like that, or else we'd end up having 50% power Frieza nearly killed by a not even planet level attack.

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This.

Also if the galaxy destroying feat is not in the source material, I see no reason to even discuss it.

ScarletFirefly said:

Also if the galaxy destroying feat is not in the source material, I see no reason to even discuss it.

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Precisely. Source Material is the primary canon, any form of adaptation is at best either secondary canon or not canon at all.

I agree with the 3 above me.

Okay. Perhaps it is unnecessary to keep this thread highlighted then?

I suppose so.

I indeed agree with Azzy, Scarlet, and Sera. I'll go ahead and remove the highlight as well.