- 6,300
- 1,595
The table of contents
A.) Universal feats in the Classic Series
B.) Universal feats in the Light Novels
C.) The 1 statement from Omega about Time, and the Big Bang
D.) Universal feats of Episode G, and Assassins
E.) Some Scaling (but not all, yet)
F.) Inconclusion/Summary
The Classic Manga
1.) Kurumada, The Saint Seiya Author, gave us direct visuals of how he Illustrates/Draws "The Universe." We get a few examples such as this here, here, and here.
These illustrastions/drawings of "The Universe" are also seen in other chapters before this. Such as;
Virgo Shaka [1] [2] [3]
Aries Shion [4]
Hyoga Awakening his 7th sense [5]
Seiya [6]
2.) Taurus Aldebaran lolnopes a "Big Bang" from Seiya. [7] [8] The Japanese Raw translations also has Aldebaran screaming "Big Bang" in plain English. This is 59 pages down [9]
3.) Aquarius camus "Ice Coffin." Aquarius Camus's "Ice Coffin" won't shatter, or break even in the might of the combined power of several gold saints. This could only mean the Athena Exclamation. [10] Hyoga was able to shatter through it. [11] [12] [13] [14] [15] [16] [17]
4.) Shiryu is able to withstand the force of 2 Athena Exclamations colliding together. 2 Athena Exclamations colliding has an exponetial increase in power [18]. Shiryu withstood an unquantifablely above baseline Low 2-C/3-A attack. He also had to elevate his cosmo to a point where it can help push the attack back. [19] [20] [21] [22]
Warning a bit more speculative.
5.) The essence of ones cosmo, the 7th sense. Frist, some synonms for the word "Essence." Would be "Aspect (Main aspect), Core (Main core), Fundamental, or True Nature." One of the fundamentals of cosmo is the "Universe inside of you" and its connection to "The Big Bang." The Ultimate source of Cosmo is "The Big Bang" (The 7th sense). The Gold saints have completely mastered "The 7th Sense"during the time of the classic series. Tarurs Aldy said that "Seiya has reached the level of Gold Saints" after Seiya awakened his 7th sense and did a "Big Bang."
The Light Novels
1.) Seiya caused another Big Bang by using his 7th sense in the Gigamatchie (Probably spelled wrong) Light Novel. [23] This was an important plot point as it shattered a seal.
2.) The Golden Age Light Novel has this paragraph on the Essence of Cosmo (Refer to a paragraph above with my "Speculation";
"The Knights are warriors of hope that since the Mythological Age have continued to protect people. His fists rip through the skies and crack the Earth. The origin of its power lies in the deepest part of people's hearts, called the Cosmos. By burning his Cosmo his power is equal to that of the Big Bang, which gave rise to the universe. They originate this phenomenon that surpasses ordinary people. The explosion of your soul, this is the essence of the Knights' battles. ' [Page 07] '[24]
3.) The Golden age Light Novel has this Paragraph on Gold Saints;
A velocidade m├íxima de um Cavaleiro de Bronze é a velocidade do som. As pessoas comuns n├úo atingem este n├¡vel de velocidade. Mas a velocidade atingida por estes escolhidos é a velocidade da luz. As pessoas comuns n├úo possuem ideia da imensid├úo da velocidade da luz, mas para os Cavaleiros de Ouro, apenas uma explos├úo de Cosmo é suficiente para tornar isso poss├¡vel. Seu poder pode até mesmo destruir o universo.
Translation: The maximum speed of a Bronze Saint (Knight) is the speed of sound. Ordinary people do not reach this level of speed. But the speed reached by these chosen ones is the speed of light. Ordinary people have no idea of the immensity of the speed of light, but for the Golden Saints, just an explosion of Cosmo is enough to make this possible. Their power can even destroy the universe. (Page 37) [25]
Saint Seiya Omega
1.) "The Big Bang" Gave birth to the Time alongside the Universe. This is the only thing important within Omega. This scales all other "Big Bang" feats to Low 2-C [26]
Episode G, and G - Assassins
The Gladitors, and their scaling will be touched upon in a separate revision thread. I have my reasons for that
1.) The very first introduction of the ability "Photon Burst" Saga compares it to him. It is the power to "Destroy Galaxies." [27] [28]
This presents a problem in scaling. Episode G takes places before the events of the classic series within the same timeline, and same canon. The Ailoia, and Saga of Episode G are a younger version of them, and also more inexperienced with their cosmo. Aiolia for example progressively gets stronger as the series progresses. Therefore, Aiolia should be Multi-Galaxy, to Universal Tier in classic series. That would scale to Seiya. I also see no reason for Saga to be holding back aganist the likes of Seiya, and Ikki when he had full intention to go for the kill, and he had too for his plan to succeed. This should be an upgrade for any galaxian explosion survivor
2.) The Titan Iapeto Vs Aries Mu [29] Iapeto created a Universe, and Aries Mu absorbs it. The very next chapter [30] Aries Mu has his power compared to the Infinitely expanding Universe (This was through a miracle)
3.) The Titan Iapeto Vs Virgo Shaka, and Leo Aiolia - The Titan Iapeto of Dimension, is later shown again. The Titan Iapeto shows that he has his own Universe [31] [32]
[33]
[34]
Virgo Shaka stops an attack with "Khan" [35]
Shaka was able to defend himself with a barrier from a bloodlusted Titan who had killing intent [36]
Shaka decided to tank and attack from a blood lusted titan [37] [38]
Virgo Shaka used Tenma Kofuku to deflect an attack from a Titan [39]
Important Note: Shaka had his eye closed the entire time!!
Aiolia didn't use Photon Burst to defeat Iapeto he used Lightening Bolt [40]
Full context, and just continue on until the end of the fight [41]
3.) In Episode G Assassins, The Athena Exclamation was used to pierece the border of the Underworld (A sphere, or plane, that contains multiple separate time-space continuuums) This power was needed to get out of the Underworld, and it even was able to some level hold back Aiolios Lightening Void. it was even stated to 'Rend the underworld" [42]
Scaling
Not including any Episode G assassins scaling into here
Aries Mu with his Crystal wall was able to casually block the combined power of Deathmask, and Aphordite
Aries Shion was able to destroy the Crystal wall (Which blocked attacks from Iapeto in G) with a hand wave.
Aries Shion, and Old Man Dohko are comparable, but Aries Shion commented that Dohko in his prime did have have a technique that would kill Shion
Scorpio Milo is comparable to a galaxian explosion by Saga. Scorpio Milo had to actively defend aganist it to not be killed, or severly injured
Leo Aiolia is comparable to a closed eye Shaka Dohko and Shion scale together as well. Shion in his prime had the power to recreate, and destroy "The Universe"
Ikki raised his Cosmo to a level beyond Shaka's (Via the 7th sense)
Tarurs Aldy should scale to the big bang of Seiya's 7th sense.
Shiryu with his 7th sense scales above Shura.
Seiya scales to Aiolia as well with the 7th sense
Hyoga scales above Camus
The Bronze Saints being injured or hurt by Saga's Galaxian explosion happens after they exhausted and weakened themselves from so many onslaught of battles.
InConclusion
Without the statement from Saint Seiya Omega these would probably be only Tier 3-A Universe Level feats
However, the AE from Assassins should also help provide some light on Low 2-C, maybe...???
My Proposal, Gold Saints in the Classic series be upgraded to Tier 3-A; except for Saga, Aphrodite, Deathmask, and Milo. they should be Multi-Galaxy with only Saga being "Possibly Tier 3-A"
Along with the Bronze Saints that scale via the 7th sense. should get an upgrade from this as well.
Episode G Aiolia should have a Multi-Galaxy key
Episode G Assassins Gold Saints are different Gold Saints. They shouldn't be included into this except for the scaling of Athena Exclamation
We should also discuss if tier 3-A, or tier Low 2-C is more appropriate.
A.) Universal feats in the Classic Series
B.) Universal feats in the Light Novels
C.) The 1 statement from Omega about Time, and the Big Bang
D.) Universal feats of Episode G, and Assassins
E.) Some Scaling (but not all, yet)
F.) Inconclusion/Summary
The Classic Manga
1.) Kurumada, The Saint Seiya Author, gave us direct visuals of how he Illustrates/Draws "The Universe." We get a few examples such as this here, here, and here.
These illustrastions/drawings of "The Universe" are also seen in other chapters before this. Such as;
Virgo Shaka [1] [2] [3]
Aries Shion [4]
Hyoga Awakening his 7th sense [5]
Seiya [6]
2.) Taurus Aldebaran lolnopes a "Big Bang" from Seiya. [7] [8] The Japanese Raw translations also has Aldebaran screaming "Big Bang" in plain English. This is 59 pages down [9]
3.) Aquarius camus "Ice Coffin." Aquarius Camus's "Ice Coffin" won't shatter, or break even in the might of the combined power of several gold saints. This could only mean the Athena Exclamation. [10] Hyoga was able to shatter through it. [11] [12] [13] [14] [15] [16] [17]
4.) Shiryu is able to withstand the force of 2 Athena Exclamations colliding together. 2 Athena Exclamations colliding has an exponetial increase in power [18]. Shiryu withstood an unquantifablely above baseline Low 2-C/3-A attack. He also had to elevate his cosmo to a point where it can help push the attack back. [19] [20] [21] [22]
Warning a bit more speculative.
5.) The essence of ones cosmo, the 7th sense. Frist, some synonms for the word "Essence." Would be "Aspect (Main aspect), Core (Main core), Fundamental, or True Nature." One of the fundamentals of cosmo is the "Universe inside of you" and its connection to "The Big Bang." The Ultimate source of Cosmo is "The Big Bang" (The 7th sense). The Gold saints have completely mastered "The 7th Sense"during the time of the classic series. Tarurs Aldy said that "Seiya has reached the level of Gold Saints" after Seiya awakened his 7th sense and did a "Big Bang."
The Light Novels
1.) Seiya caused another Big Bang by using his 7th sense in the Gigamatchie (Probably spelled wrong) Light Novel. [23] This was an important plot point as it shattered a seal.
2.) The Golden Age Light Novel has this paragraph on the Essence of Cosmo (Refer to a paragraph above with my "Speculation";
"The Knights are warriors of hope that since the Mythological Age have continued to protect people. His fists rip through the skies and crack the Earth. The origin of its power lies in the deepest part of people's hearts, called the Cosmos. By burning his Cosmo his power is equal to that of the Big Bang, which gave rise to the universe. They originate this phenomenon that surpasses ordinary people. The explosion of your soul, this is the essence of the Knights' battles. ' [Page 07] '[24]
3.) The Golden age Light Novel has this Paragraph on Gold Saints;
A velocidade m├íxima de um Cavaleiro de Bronze é a velocidade do som. As pessoas comuns n├úo atingem este n├¡vel de velocidade. Mas a velocidade atingida por estes escolhidos é a velocidade da luz. As pessoas comuns n├úo possuem ideia da imensid├úo da velocidade da luz, mas para os Cavaleiros de Ouro, apenas uma explos├úo de Cosmo é suficiente para tornar isso poss├¡vel. Seu poder pode até mesmo destruir o universo.
Translation: The maximum speed of a Bronze Saint (Knight) is the speed of sound. Ordinary people do not reach this level of speed. But the speed reached by these chosen ones is the speed of light. Ordinary people have no idea of the immensity of the speed of light, but for the Golden Saints, just an explosion of Cosmo is enough to make this possible. Their power can even destroy the universe. (Page 37) [25]
Saint Seiya Omega
1.) "The Big Bang" Gave birth to the Time alongside the Universe. This is the only thing important within Omega. This scales all other "Big Bang" feats to Low 2-C [26]
Episode G, and G - Assassins
The Gladitors, and their scaling will be touched upon in a separate revision thread. I have my reasons for that
1.) The very first introduction of the ability "Photon Burst" Saga compares it to him. It is the power to "Destroy Galaxies." [27] [28]
This presents a problem in scaling. Episode G takes places before the events of the classic series within the same timeline, and same canon. The Ailoia, and Saga of Episode G are a younger version of them, and also more inexperienced with their cosmo. Aiolia for example progressively gets stronger as the series progresses. Therefore, Aiolia should be Multi-Galaxy, to Universal Tier in classic series. That would scale to Seiya. I also see no reason for Saga to be holding back aganist the likes of Seiya, and Ikki when he had full intention to go for the kill, and he had too for his plan to succeed. This should be an upgrade for any galaxian explosion survivor
2.) The Titan Iapeto Vs Aries Mu [29] Iapeto created a Universe, and Aries Mu absorbs it. The very next chapter [30] Aries Mu has his power compared to the Infinitely expanding Universe (This was through a miracle)
3.) The Titan Iapeto Vs Virgo Shaka, and Leo Aiolia - The Titan Iapeto of Dimension, is later shown again. The Titan Iapeto shows that he has his own Universe [31] [32]
[33]
[34]
Virgo Shaka stops an attack with "Khan" [35]
Shaka was able to defend himself with a barrier from a bloodlusted Titan who had killing intent [36]
Shaka decided to tank and attack from a blood lusted titan [37] [38]
Virgo Shaka used Tenma Kofuku to deflect an attack from a Titan [39]
Important Note: Shaka had his eye closed the entire time!!
Aiolia didn't use Photon Burst to defeat Iapeto he used Lightening Bolt [40]
Full context, and just continue on until the end of the fight [41]
3.) In Episode G Assassins, The Athena Exclamation was used to pierece the border of the Underworld (A sphere, or plane, that contains multiple separate time-space continuuums) This power was needed to get out of the Underworld, and it even was able to some level hold back Aiolios Lightening Void. it was even stated to 'Rend the underworld" [42]
Scaling
Not including any Episode G assassins scaling into here
Aries Mu with his Crystal wall was able to casually block the combined power of Deathmask, and Aphordite
Aries Shion was able to destroy the Crystal wall (Which blocked attacks from Iapeto in G) with a hand wave.
Aries Shion, and Old Man Dohko are comparable, but Aries Shion commented that Dohko in his prime did have have a technique that would kill Shion
Scorpio Milo is comparable to a galaxian explosion by Saga. Scorpio Milo had to actively defend aganist it to not be killed, or severly injured
Leo Aiolia is comparable to a closed eye Shaka Dohko and Shion scale together as well. Shion in his prime had the power to recreate, and destroy "The Universe"
Ikki raised his Cosmo to a level beyond Shaka's (Via the 7th sense)
Tarurs Aldy should scale to the big bang of Seiya's 7th sense.
Shiryu with his 7th sense scales above Shura.
Seiya scales to Aiolia as well with the 7th sense
Hyoga scales above Camus
The Bronze Saints being injured or hurt by Saga's Galaxian explosion happens after they exhausted and weakened themselves from so many onslaught of battles.
InConclusion
Without the statement from Saint Seiya Omega these would probably be only Tier 3-A Universe Level feats
However, the AE from Assassins should also help provide some light on Low 2-C, maybe...???
My Proposal, Gold Saints in the Classic series be upgraded to Tier 3-A; except for Saga, Aphrodite, Deathmask, and Milo. they should be Multi-Galaxy with only Saga being "Possibly Tier 3-A"
Along with the Bronze Saints that scale via the 7th sense. should get an upgrade from this as well.
Episode G Aiolia should have a Multi-Galaxy key
Episode G Assassins Gold Saints are different Gold Saints. They shouldn't be included into this except for the scaling of Athena Exclamation
We should also discuss if tier 3-A, or tier Low 2-C is more appropriate.
