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Knuckles vs Buzzwole

Well, um...

Buzzwole does have the advantage in AP (debatably) and he does have plenty of ways he can boost his stats, plus a way to keep himself healthy as the match progresses and a resistance to Knuckles normal attacks if they count as fighting types.

But I think Knuckles has plenty of hax to make up for it (negating status with the immunity idol, absorb life force with the nocturn blade, stun or knock Buzzwole off balance, heal himself with his own ability or various items, etc) plus he has Fire attacks to hit Buzzwole with his weakness an if the Wind attacks count as Flying types, then he can seriously put the hurt on Buzzwole, plus he has experience in dealing with opponents that outclass him...kinda.

So...Knuckles I think Duno, maybe someone with better arguments can prove me wrong
 
Only two things that Ultimate said were part of optional equipment though, which was the immunity idol and the nocturnal blade
 
Oh, I'm not discounting the votes of course. But I wanted this match to be between punchers and I don't want items to get in the middle of that.
 
UltimateFlare said:
But I think Knuckles has plenty of hax to make up for it (negating status with the immunity idol, absorb life force with the nocturn blade, stun or knock Buzzwole off balance, heal himself with his own ability or various items, etc) plus he has Fire attacks to hit Buzzwole with his weakness an if the Wind attacks count as Flying types, then he can seriously put the hurt on Buzzwole, plus he has experience in dealing with opponents that outclass him...kinda.

So...Knuckles I think Duno, maybe someone with better arguments can prove me wrong
Click to expand...
Before I get to what Buzzwole could do, im gonna reply to the stuff I bolded out.

Knuckles absorbing Buzzwoles life force and using self healing isnt as much of a win-condition as you say it is when Buzzwole can also do the same with his stingers (Cell style) and Leech Life, which can continiously drain life force out of Knuckles. That would also be a counter against fire and wind based moves. Speaking of that, Buzzwole can also reflect physical based attacks back at Knuckles using counter and it'll be 2x stronger. Now as for what Buzzwole could do here:

Besides what I already mentioned, Buzzwole has multiple ways of buffing up his stats, which will be very beneficial since he has the AP advantage here. He can use Power-Up Punch to constantly grow in AP for every hit, Bulk-Up to increase AP and Durability, and Harden to boost Durability. Using a combo of this will ensure that Knucles has a hard time damaging it, even with super effective moves. This is especially true since Buzzwole also has Endure to definitely ensure it takes any of at least 1 of Knuckles attacks. Along with having a major stat-boosting advantage, Buzzwole can stop Knuckles from using offensive based moves using Taunt, confuse Knuckles with Dynamic Punch, Status induce Knuckles with Thunder and Ice Punch and Increase its chances of landing critical blows with Focus Energy.

Im gonna vote for Buzzwole. Knuckles only saving grace in this match is using super effective fire and debatably wind moves, which Buzzwole has ways around with its own life draining hax and can just reflect them with Counter at even higher levels. Buzzwole already has the AP advantage and has plenty of ways to buff its stats even further to make sure Knuckles cant damage him as easily. And even if he could, Endure will protect Buzzwole from one shots of any kind. Buzzwole can also always just stop Knuckles from damaging him via Taunt and can induce Knuckles with Status's on his own. Along with having higher chances of unleashing critical blows, Buzzwole should have no real problem winning this.
 
Those life draining moves aren't really that good, they barely drain the life force, also it's Ap advantage is at best 1.2 times which isn't that much, especialy with Knuckles super efective attacks, Knuckles is also more skilled, he isn't going to fall to a conter.
 
The real cal howard said:
Taunt does the exact opposite bro. It forces damaging moves only.
Click to expand...
Oh wait, thats Torment isnt it?

Rookie mistake on my part lol. Still without Taunt, im gonna go with Buzzwole. Sitll more options to help him out.
 
Theuser789 said:
Knuckles is also more skilled, he isn't going to fall to a conter.
Click to expand...
If Knuckles is more skilled, its only by a bit. Not as much as you make it out to be.

Buzzwole is a fighting-type, making it naturally skilled in the martial arts and combat variety. To top it all off, it very can very easily outskill a combined group of pokemon, including Ash's Pikachu who has tons of fighting experience from all the regions Ash has visited and taken on with the mouse.

Buzzwoles experience is not exactly just at 0.
 
The real cal howard said:
Oh absolutely nothing. I thought you were just calling the move weak is all.
Click to expand...
Well the move was weak as far as I can remenber

Also Knuckles can just dodge those moves via his superior skill and mobility, and the stat amps don't really help since Knuckles scales to unquantifiable above 614 Zettatons and the Maximun Heat Knuckles attack also boosts his stats
 
If Knuckles is more skilled, its only by a bit. Not as much as you make it out to be.

Buzzwole is a fighting-type, making it naturally skilled in the martial arts and combat variety. To top it all off, it very can very easily outskill a combined group of pokemon, including Ash's Pikachu who has tons of fighting experience from all the regions Ash has visited and taken on with the mouse.

Buzzwoles experience is not exactly just at 0.

Kunckles is a martial arts master and has fought beings with thousands of years of experience, way more than wild pokemon and Ash's Pikachu, especialy since his skill is very inconsistant at times
 
>Can just dodge those moves

Just as Buzzwole can dodge Knuckles attacks. Not much of a reason in itself.

>Via his superior skill and mobility.

Skill I already addressed. And mobility? Buzzwole can fly.

>And the stat amps dont really help much since Knuckes scales to to unquantifiable above 614 Z and the maximum heat Knuckles attack also boosts his stats

And Buzzwole is comparable to mon who are comparable to mon who are superior to Perfect Zygarde, whos much stronger than Xerneas who does a 717 Zettaton feat just by dying. It'll definitely help, especially since Buzzwole has more stat amping methods than Knuckles does.

Also, I forgot to mention that Buzzwole also has Spatial Manipulation too.
 
Theuser789 said:
Kunckles is a martial arts master and has fought beings with thousands of years of experience, way more than wild pokemon and Ash's Pikachu, especialy since his skill is very inconsistant at times
Click to expand...
Cal already addressed the thousands of years bit, but as for Pikachu, its inconsistent how?
 
I did saw Knuckles profile listed Limited Time Manipulation in his profile, what ability is that? Since it doesn't mention an item.
 
ProfessorKukui4Life said:
>Can just dodge those moves

Just as Buzzwole can dodge Knuckles attacks. Not much of a reason in itself.

>Via his superior skill and mobility.

Skill I already addressed. And mobility? Buzzwole can fly.

>And the stat amps dont really help much since Knuckes scales to to unquantifiable above 614 Z and the maximum heat Knuckles attack also boosts his stats

And Buzzwole is comparable to mon who are comparable to mon who are superior to Perfect Zygarde, whos much stronger than Xerneas who does a 717 Zettaton feat just by dying. It'll definitely help, especially since Buzzwole has more stat amping methods than Knuckles does.

Also, I forgot to mention that Buzzwole also has Spatial Manipulation too.
Click to expand...
Knuckles can dodge easier via being smaller, thus hadder to hit plus being more mobile, flight has nothing to do with how mobile you are

I responded to the skill comment, it's what's stated on the profile:"Its personality is shaped by its interactions and the number of emeralds, very skilled combatant and avid learner through its copying ability. Possesses over 4,000 years of experience and weaponry at its disposal." Also you forgot about the martial arts master comment that proves his superior skills

Pretty sure that the Ultra Beast aren't superior to Perfect Zygard, at all

And Pikachu is inconsistant via losing plenty of battles that he should have won thanks to all these experiences, like how he lost to Snive( I think that's it's name)
 
  • There is a glitch where by performing certain actions with certain characters while using the Time Stop Switches, it is possible to stop the flow of time indefinitely.
 
>Knuckles can dodge easier via being smaller, thus hadder to hit plus being more mobile, flight has nothing to do with how mobile you are.

Flying makes it easier to avoid attacks. But anyway, being smaller wont help in the slightest. Pikachu is much smaller than Knuckles, the size of a small dog and Buzzwole was smacking it around casually.

>I responded to the skill comment, it's what's stated on the profile:"Its personality is shaped by its interactions and the number of emeralds, very skilled combatant and avid learner through its copying ability. Possesses over 4,000 years of experience and weaponry at its disposal." Also you forgot about the martial arts master comment that proves his superior skills

Most of this doesnt matter when its not even on Knuckles page under his intelligence. Knuckles page only makes him out to be somewhere above average in experience. Martial Arts i'll concede to, but again, Buzzwole is naturally skilled at that via its typing. Its experience is not at 0 to be completely toyed around with.

>Pretty sure that the Ultra Beast aren't superior to Perfect Zygard, at all

This is completely and utterly wrong, as of now anyway. The UB's are the strongest gen of legendaries right under the god tiers for the moment. Perfect Zygarde left the Kalos Region and came to Alola in order to try and fend them off since they pose a threat to all pokemon. P.Z. may be able to scale to them or even Necrozma in the future but as of now, he's not anything more than comparable to them.

>And Pikachu is inconsistant via losing plenty of battles that he should have won thanks to all these experiences, like how he lost to Snive( I think that's it's name).

For one, Pikachu was weakened by Zekrom when it lost against Snivy. Its power was reset.

Second, losing a battle doesn't mean your experience is lower than anticipated, its only how you lose that does. Someone winning via just overpowering them is not at all the same as someone winning after matching someones fighting tactics in a full scale battle for instance.
 
Pikachu is also way weaker than Buzzlord, so that's a terrible comparassion, they can't fight evenly at all, and Knuckles already fought fying oponents and beatten them, he also hss this move:https://sonic.fandom.com/wiki/Thunder_Arrow

That's Emerl inteligence, someone that Knuckles fought against.

Where it's said that they are stronger than Zygard? If Zygard went there to beat them then that implies that he's stronger than them, also the beasts scale to Zygard, not the contrary.

Pikachu has worse examples then the ones I said and he wasn't overpowered in that fight so it's still a anti-feat for him, and most of Pikachu's startegies comes from Ash, also based on your logic Buzzlord doesn't scale to Ash's Pikachu skill since it beat him by overpowering it
 
Theuser789 said:
Pikachu is also way weaker than Buzzlord, so that's a terrible comparassion, they can't fight evenly at all, and Knuckles already fought fying oponents and beatten them, he also hss this move:https://sonic.fandom.com/wiki/Thunder_Arrow
That's Emerl inteligence, someone that Knuckles fought against.

Where it's said that they are stronger than Zygard? If Zygard went there to beat them then that implies that he's stronger than them, also the beasts scale to Zygard, not the contrary.

Pikachu has worse examples then the ones I said and he wasn't overpowered in that fight so it's still a anti-feat for him, and most of Pikachu's startegies comes from Ash
Click to expand...
Ok, this Pikachu has beaten gods of the pokemon world, like latias, and regice. Just putting that out. Also, Buzwole could survive one attack and then use counter., and has the option to just spam while flying, though that is not as likely. Buzwole for these reasons and FRA.
 
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