Saitama vs Lapis Lazuli

Use Saitama's low end.

It all depends on starting position and scenario imo, if Lapis knows of Saitama then she could easily out-range him.

Can't she make like

Quintillions of clones of him using the whole ocean

Which saitama can't hit and each clone replicates his power

And it FTL in flight speed

I'm actually going to give this to Lapis due to her Hydrokinesis hax

Great & Lovable Peridot said:

Quintillions of clones of him using the whole ocean

Which saitama can't hit and each clone replicates his power

And it FTL in flight speed

Click to expand...

The first is NLF and the second is not considered combat speed

Saitama's AP is vastly greater than her durability so a single hit will kill her (yes, I am using the low end)

On the other hand, Saitama can pretty easily take on her attacks (Boros could barely scratch him, if even that)

Plus, his combat speed is way higher than hers so any gap would be closed very quickly.

Her only viable strategy is flying away but that won't get her anywhere.

I mean, he'd could still get swept under the waves of an entire Ocean crashing on him and drown, or can Saitama breathe underwater? I don't really follow OPM.

Alakabamm said:

Great & Lovable Peridot said:

Quintillions of clones of him using the whole ocean

Which saitama can't hit and each clone replicates his power

And it FTL in flight speed

Click to expand...

The first is NLF and the second is not considered combat speed
Saitama's AP is vastly greater than her durability so a single hit will kill her (yes, I am using the low end)

On the other hand, Saitama can pretty easily take on her attacks (Boros could barely scratch him, if even that)

Plus, his combat speed is way higher than hers so any gap would be closed very quickly.

Her only viable strategy is flying away but that won't get her anywhere.

Click to expand...

But still

Saitama can't land a hit on her due to speed

And her clones can take him head on. he can't physically damage Lapis's clones and they are able to replicate strength, so Saitama's trademark on punch won't work on the clones, his best bet is to aim for Lapis but like I already stated, shes far too fast


She wins via clone hax

But I think Saitama might just destroy her physical form, and since he doesn't know about gems and their power being sourced from the gemstone, she can just keep regenerating. I'm sure he would figure out sooner or later but hitting her is unlikely

I don't think I've seen a clone replicating someone at his level's power, so that is NLF.

Furthermore, they're made of water, correct? He can easily BFR their mass with a punch.

A single hit would destroy her gem as well, which is on her body (I believe).

But whats stopping Lapis from flying realllllllly high and just drown Saitama with the entire mass of the ocean?

He can:

jump out of it

punch the mass of water around him away with pressure (and allow air to flow back in)

just avoid it (he's faster than her combat speed, again)

But her clones just come back together after spliting double the trouble, His punch can't hit, the hit might separate the water tbh but it can easily come back together, he can't destroy water

I'm saying he can punch so hard that the water leaves the planet. Heck, his best calc'ed feat is punching air away. A little bit of water from the clones (comparatively) would very easily get BFR'd.

true,saitama's one serious punch completely cut a Planet busting beam through the middle and not only that after that the force generated from the punch(the punch never connected with boros)was enough to destroy lord boros,a planet level durability being that was capable of Regenerationn using a Gem in his body,earlier,he generated back basically from a puddle of blood in a second or two.Saitama wins.

Lapis really can't fly at MFTL+ speeds without accelerating first, Jasper caught her before she could fly, Saitama can easily do just the same considering he's MUCH faster. As for the water clones, Saitama's Serious Strike can literally blast all the water on Earth way instantly, even with his tier being low end in this fight. Even with countless water clones, they would still be FAR slower than Saitama himself. None of them would hit. In the webcomic, he one shots a water monster which the other heroes can't beat due to physical attacks being supposedly "useless" against it.

Overall, Saitama takes this with little difficulty.

The thing is though

The saitama water clones can do the exact same

And fair enough with the start up, but Lapis still has the better aerial advantage

And we haven't even seen what her limits are aswell, she did all of this while weakened

saitama is subrelativistic+ in combat speed and travel without even trying,and this is the same guy that jumped from moon to earth in seconds,don't think he'll have a problem tagging her anywhere in earth's atmosphere,or just clap his hands real hard to destroy all the clones.

The water clones cannot be as strong and fast as Saitama is, that's only an assumption and they can only move as fast as Lapis can control them, the other Crystal Gems easily kept up with their clones. Saitama can do the same with less effort. Not to mention they are made of water, they can easily be destroyed like this .

No water = Defenseless Lapis

Saitama has his superhuman stats, something Lapis can't get rid of. Unlike Saitama who can get rid of all the water on Earth.

Flight Speed =/= Combat Speed.

Saitama can easily one shot her due to her durability being only Large Country, Saitama is Multi-Continent AP and Durability, she would need to use the whole Ocean to even hurt him, and he can repel that easily.

Saitama's Combat Speed beats Lapis' by a mile, giving her no chance to escape or fly away.

Saitama has been extremely casual, showing zero signs of damage against enemies as strong as Lapis (Boros and Garou). He won't be bothered by her attacks that much.

Saitama wins this.

They kept up with the gems as they were able to replicate their stats, I mean Lapis can literally make Garnets Gauntlets, making them exactly equal in power, but the water clones couldn't be hit j Lapis doesnt have to control the clones, she just has to make them and they do it for her, she can't control things all at the same time, In each of the four battles that took place, she can't multi-task in her mind like that, the only logical explanation is that they are able to work by themselves after being created

So I'm sure they could replicate Saitama's strength, but hes greatly outnumbered by himself

The only way to defeat him is himself

Saitama can't get rid of the water at all, he can punch it sure, but Lapis's clones can just reform, unless his punches have powerful aftershocks similar to that of something sonarous, but the again she can just keep creating them, when her original clones got deformed, Lapis wasn't actually paying attention, and she doesn't need to get rid of his Superhuman power, She can just replicate it

She would get one shot, but if she was truly bloodlusted then she would literally fly away,and use the whole force of the ocean to crush Saitama, whose durability could not take tbh, if we measured a continent by the tectonic plate its resting on, it couldnt take the weight.

The fight wouldn't happen way up close, let's give some breathing space, maybe the victor depends on the starting scenario, but Saitama does have a tendency to firstly see what the opponent can do, when has he ever struck first against something Unknown

Its not her Attacks, its the replication of his power with her own clones, as the soundtrack says they "Mirror match"

Eh, I object

But we have barely seen anything of what they both can truly do

The clones are being directly controlled by Lapis. No evidence says that they can replicate stats or anything like that, using the title of a BGM isn't a good way of seeing their power. "Mirror Match" suggests the Gems are fighting reflections of themselves, none of them replicated any other power they had (didn't copy things like Garent's Future Vision or Steven's Shield). The only they could copy was Amythest's shapeshifting, and that's only due to the fact they're made of water.

Again, they're made of WATER, they're not as strong nor as fast as Saitama himself. The only reason they were able to keep up with the Gems is because they're around Lapis' tier range.

"Saitama can't get rid of the water at all, he can punch it sure, but Lapis's clones can just reform, unless his punches have powerful aftershocks similar to that of something sonarous, but the again she can just keep creating them, when her original clones got deformed, Lapis wasn't actually paying attention, and she doesn't need to get rid of his Superhuman power, She can just replicate it"

Severe NLF. This sentence tells me you don't know much about Saitama. He punched a surface destroying beam (we're only using his low end here) casually into oblivion, the resulting shockwave did this . And in my previous comment, he destroyed a water monster with the same properties as Lapis' clones, no question he can do the same to them. Lapis using all the water on Earth is Multi-Continent Level, Saitama's Punch here is the same, he can literally punch all the water into oblivion. No water means Lapis' powers are useless. Her powers are limited to how much water the area has, Saitama is not limited to something like that. Saitama's Durability on low end is Multi-Continent Level, read his profile , he tanks the Ocean and hits it back hard.

Neither character are bloodlusted, they're in character. Even if they were, Saitama blitzes and one shots her due to superior Combat Speed (Sub-Relativistic >>>> Massively Hypersonic).

It's up to the OP what the fight conditions are. Also, in every battle Lapis was pretty near the Gems, the exception being when she was making the water tower. And again, Saitama easily covers the distance between them like this .

True, their exact limits are Unknown, but due to more feats overall and better stats all around, Saitama still wins :/

Yeah agreed with what Ala and Marvel have said. Saitama has more than enough power to one shot. He has fought water beings before and the assumption that her clones can replicate power of that magnitude is built upon NLF.

Caped Baldy gets my vote.

Same for me here as well, Ryu. Much as i like Lapis, i really don't her winning this more than Saitama.

Given the amount of reasons i've seen thus far on what Saitama has done + the amount of NLF here, Saitama has my vote of taking this.

Saitama takes this for the reasons stated above

MarvelFanatic119 said:

The clones are being directly controlled by Lapis. No evidence says that they can replicate stats or anything like that, using the title of a BGM isn't a good way of seeing their power. "Mirror Match" suggests the Gems are fighting reflections of themselves, none of them replicated any other power they had (didn't copy things like Garent's Future Vision or Steven's Shield). The only they could copy was Amythest's shapeshifting, and that's only due to the fact they're made of water.
Again, they're made of WATER, they're not as strong nor as fast as Saitama himself. The only reason they were able to keep up with the Gems is because they're around Lapis' tier range.

"Saitama can't get rid of the water at all, he can punch it sure, but Lapis's clones can just reform, unless his punches have powerful aftershocks similar to that of something sonarous, but the again she can just keep creating them, when her original clones got deformed, Lapis wasn't actually paying attention, and she doesn't need to get rid of his Superhuman power, She can just replicate it"

Severe NLF. This sentence tells me you don't know much about Saitama. He punched a surface destroying beam (we're only using his low end here) casually into oblivion, the resulting shockwave did this . And in my previous comment, he destroyed a water monster with the same properties as Lapis' clones, no question he can do the same to them. Lapis using all the water on Earth is Multi-Continent Level, Saitama's Punch here is the same, he can literally punch all the water into oblivion. No water means Lapis' powers are useless. Her powers are limited to how much water the area has, Saitama is not limited to something like that. Saitama's Durability on low end is Multi-Continent Level, read his profile , he tanks the Ocean and hits it back hard.

Neither character are bloodlusted, they're in character. Even if they were, Saitama blitzes and one shots her due to superior Combat Speed (Sub-Relativistic >>>> Massively Hypersonic).

It's up to the OP what the fight conditions are. Also, in every battle Lapis was pretty near the Gems, the exception being when she was making the water tower. And again, Saitama easily covers the distance between them like this .

True, their exact limits are Unknown, but due to more feats overall and better stats all around, Saitama still wins :/

Click to expand...

Evidence: The clones were able to create perfect clones that copied the power or Garnet, Pearl and Amethyst, Lapis didn't make them stronger than the gems either which would make more sense than making them identical in power, so you can at least see why I think this rather than the NLF

Who said it didn't copy Garnets future vision, but thats not a physical feature either, and Steven's shield wasn't revealed to them until the last second, where they soon after deformed

The clones took off by themselves

1. Lapis can't think multiple things, there's no Big Hero 6 case in Steven Universe where the people or gems cannot control four different things at the same time through their mind

2. Lapis wasn't even paying attention to the fight, she was looking at stars and what not

3. Lapis didn't reform them once they were deformed, which she could have done easily

There's no evidence that they only work on those in their tier range, so you can't use that

He didn't necessarily "destroy" the water though did he, he just split it. You can't physically destroy water, but then again, Saitama didn't separate the whole ocean, just about 20% at most, and even so Lapis can easily get it back of it gets knocked away

And Lapis can change the density of it aswell to even make it solid for a human to walk on it unlike that monster had shown, so a lot less of it would get knocked

Give Lapis some space, if Saitama truly Speedblitzes this then I call severe mismatch, and I really cannot picture Saitama bloodlusted

Can Saitama sense where Lapis is, she has the whole ocean to hide in and clones that have Saitamas replicated power

The moon did lighten Saitama and them the force down had increased his speed greatly, I'm a bit iffy with that feat


Eh my vote goes to Lapis, but I know I'm gonna be overwhelmed with people picking Saitama

1- Afai read(i am unfamiliar with the comics/show) she replicates other gem's powers,so replicating saitama's power is already crossed out.you can't just assume she'll replicate a non gem user's power

2-Yes saitama wouldn't be blood lusted,but remember saitama's planet level feat is also when he wasn't really trying,we have to yet see a saitama that's exerting himself.and even the speed feats are from a laid back saitama.Saitama beat a planet buster with absolutely no injuries or fatigue or exertion whatsoever,so expect this to be the lower limit of his true power.

Lapis using the whole Ocea : 1.639 Exatons

Saitama punching Boro's Planet Surface destroying beam : 8.834 Exatons

Saitama's best casual feat beats Lapis 4 times over. Suffice to say, he can punch the whole thing into Space.

Lapis has little feats under her, Saitama has much more not to mention more experience against enemies.

The Gems broke apart their clones easily, the only reason they didn't disintegrate was because of Lapis' powers. Steven's Shield made a shockwave that destroyed all of them, I have no clue why you think Saitama can't do the same thing considering his best feat puts him pretty much above Lapis already.

The clones couldn't use Garnet's Future Vision and Steven's Sheild due to the fact they can't, Lapis has no real way of duplicating their abilities as they are unique to Garnet and Steven, not to mention if the clones need to SEE the thing they copy use the power, they can't copy something perfectly. If they don't see Saitama's full strength, then they're only using a small fraction of it, the minute Saitama lets loose, they're destroyed. Just like how Steven destoryed them with his Shield.

For your case here:

1. If Lapis can't think of using the clones, then they shouldn't even be formed. She can easily multitask with her powers, unless you believe those clones are sentinent, which again, is only an assumption with no real evidence. They are made by her powers and are extensions of herself, besides, if we go with your Logic, then Lapis can make a water SSGSSJ Goku clone with all his stats and powers, which my friend, is the EXACT definition of NLF. Your arguement here is very flawed.

2. Splitting water and then hitting across the atmosphere are two different things. With his Serious Strike, the shockwave alone from it will kill Lapis, just like it did with Boros (who again, is someone who is at Lapis' tier, only with better Regenerationn and physical stats). Again, considering it's 4 times more powerful than her controlling the whole Ocean, it will kill her.

3. She can't reform things if it's too far from here, espically if the force behind the attack is too great for her.

4. On second thought, she did strain herself from keeping Malachite down in the ocean, who's superior to her due to being a Fusion of her and Jasper. So yeah, someone around her tier can give her trouble, like Saitama.

5. The only reason this fight is happening is because Saitama is nerfed to his lowest end, if we used his higher end, which is 5-B, this would be a definite stomp.

Saitama isn't bloodlusted, but the point is his durabliity, speed, and AP are vastly superior to Lapis to the point Lapis can't do much against him.

I have no clue how the moon "lighten" or "increased his speed greatly" for Saitama as you say, he hit the Moon by being kicked there by Boros in a matter of seconds, brushed himself off, and jumped back in a few moments. I don't see why this isn't a legit Durability and Speed feat for you and it's apparently "iffy". The calc's been made and accepted, you need to talk to the admins if you want to question the validility of it.

That's something you'll need to get used to here, the character you choose may not be what others would pick, but in the end you have to respect the decisions and rules here. I know I've been there before.

1. The Gem doesn't have anything to do with it tbh, she doesn't replicate just gems, she was able to replicate Steven and he's got part human in him.

2. Same with Lapis, she did all this while her Gem was cracked and without any strain

1. Still didn't replicate things like his Shield or his powers. Not to mention unless you prove they have Garnet's Lightning power and Future Vision, Pearl's Hologram and Weather Manipulation, Steven's Bubble and Shield, your argument holds no ground.

2. She struggled against Malachite so yeah, her limit should be around High 6-A. Saitama is at the least High 6-A and can go far higher. Also doesn't change the fact Saitama's best casual feat beats Lapis' 4 times over. I should know Lapis' power, considering I put that fact you used in 2 in her profile to begin with

Just as I replied to the other guy

Ok, the energy amount doesn't matter tbh, she uses the oceans weight to crush Saitama, he can't take his own power from what we have seen and her clones that replicate his factors greatly outnumber


Lapis is over 6000 years old and unexplored, no experience from Saitama would match what she has hopefully experienced in her lifetime

The clones couldn't be hit, but it seems that they are sort of clones who need to see what the enemy can do first and use it aswell, and Steven's shield split them apart due to the aftershock of a sonarous sound from the shield, from what I see, that's the only thing we can truly call their weakness

Steven's shield was revealed at the very last second, and Lapis of course can't duplicate future vision, that's a special ability, from what I see they only copy their strength and speed, with their durablility not needed, the Garnet one still kept up with Garnet

They're both bloodlusted, so Saitamas full strength will be shown apparently, no holding back

1. She creates the clone and then let's it fight on its own, she can't multi-task several different fights and she can't singularly learn all of the gems moves so that she can control her clones to use them

2. Shockwave? Links plez

3. Her range is at Least planetary, it hasn't been fully explored

4. That's a bit different. Jasper is currently part of Malachite aswell, while in Malachite she can do what Lapis can do as well as her own, it all depends mentally, Fusions are tricky, and Malachite can do everything Lapis can do aswell

5. That's why this is low-end Saitama, but Lapis is bound to get some buffs aswell

Lapis can't win physically, only with her water clone hax

Iffy on his speed, durability is fine, no gravity on the moon means that Saitama has no weight, so theres none of that holding him back, while Lapis adjusts to gravity levels so her speed is always kept the same and then when he enters the Earths atmosphere his weight is back which via force makes him much faster coming down, its hard to explain

Oh I know that perfectly,

But what I also got is this

A human body is made up of at least 60% water, where Saitama is still a mere human, he can't live without the essential body water he needs

So when Lapis takes that out or even freezes it, then he's basically ded

Sure she may not know anything about a human, but we have seen that she can sense water, like when Steven jumped into her tower and she automatically felt him in there, idk that's a bit iffy as well but I'd say that of she knew this, Lapis could basically stomp any organism that needs to live with body water WHICH is slower than her, I guess that doesn't apply to Saitama but with a little scenario work

By your logic, Lapis can make full power clones of universe busters. That's ridiculous.

Also, just because she can freeze him doesn't mean it will kill him or hold him down. Additionally, unless otherwise noted, ice powers do not negate durability.

How does he not tank his own power, where is that shown? Also, the energy conversion of these feats is the reason why either of them are at their respective tier. The weight of the Ocean won't do much as the calc I provided also includes the weight of it and the result was the number there in bold. Disregarding this is again, very flawed on your part.

A good amount of it was spent being trapped in a mirror, not to mention she's behind the world by a few thousand years. Humans in SU can't ever be as strong as Saitama, there's no reason Lapis to assume he's that powerful.

The sound wasn't a real weakness, it was the shockwave that destroyed them, also you don't think that a Punch from Saitama won't cause a sound louder than that?

Assuming that can reach higher levels of power means NLF, man. Read about it. You just admitted Lapis didn't know about Steven's Shield, so how will she know about Saitama's full strength? Again with your Logic, Lapis solos DB Super by making trillions of water clones of them, that will get your thread closed immediately. If I use your logic, it will sound like this: "Saitama solos everything due to having no limit to his strength"

Both bloodlusted means Saitama stomps hard

1. How are you so sure Lapis CAN'T multitask? She has a great control of her powers so she can focus on several things at once. They're made by her powers and are extensions of her abilites like a weapon, unless Rebecca Sugar or another writer here agrees with your statement, it holds no real proof here.

2. "At least Small Building level (Was able to push to "Together Breakfast" monster into a pit, Easily dispatched several Holo-Pearls), likely far higher with Gem powers (The vibrations from his shield destroyed all of the Lapis Lazuli's water clones, who had been easily overpowering the Crystal Gems)" Proof here. From Steven's profile. Not sound, vibrations.

3. If she could get water from other planets she would have done it when she made the tower to go back from Homeworld.

4. Which makes Malachite superior due to being a combination of being Lapis and Jasper. She says she uses the weight of the Ocean to hold her down.

5. Same applies to Saitama

Water clones destroyed via Serious Strike, this has been explained several times and yet you ignore it over and over.

No gravity on the Moon? What are you, uneducated or something? EVERYONE knows the Moon has a gravitational pull. I don't know where you learned there's no Gravity on the Moon, considering the Gems went there and experienced Gravity, which why they adjusted to it. If you think jumping to the Moon to Earth is easy, then why can't Astronauts do it? He needs enough force to push him thorugh the Moon's Gravity and overcome the weightless of the vacuum of space in order to head back to Earth, otherwise he would be stuck floating in space. Once again, your argument is VERY flawed.

Adjusting to the Gravity makes Lapis' Speed the same. It really won't help her here.

Lapis would have manipulated and took the water in every human body to make the tower bigger if thats the case. Again, you're assuming something with no real evidence.

No proof of being able to freeze water either. Not to mention she's still too slow to react to Saitama (Sub-Relativistic >>>> Massively Hypersonic) again, in case you forgot.

She can feel him jumping in the water not to mention he told her he was going to meet her.

"Lapis, I'm coming up to meet you. So please don't drown me."

-Steven Universe

If the scenario doesn't apply to Saitama, why bring it up in the first place?

Saitama still wins this and your arguments just made me even more convinced now.

Great & Lovable Peridot said:

no gravity on the moon means that Saitama has no weight

Click to expand...

Enough internet for today

After all that was stated (and because this needs a verdict), I'm going to say Saitama for myself, for all of the reasons stated above. For the record, I didn't know who would win when I first started this.