• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

Medaka's Durability Downgrade.and a Small Thing About Speed

Status
Not open for further replies.
FateAlbane

FateAlbane

8,998
2,927
*insert Happinness of Marionette playing in the background since I almost forgot to make this.*

Pretty simple deal but Medaka's "possibly Moon Level Dura" should be fully removed.

Also I'm not sure if she should be "At Least FTL", since most statements they have on the series are in regards to plain SoL. She should still be FTL for catching up in speed with Iihiko who previously had treated her SoL KP as moving slowly.

As for backup of what I'm saying...

The argument of flying to the moon does not really fly for travel speed being that fast since she specifically requests a rocket from Kugurugi to take her there and then keeps waiting for it to arrive, and it should be noted that the moon was already long out of its orbit, falling towards the Earth "at ultra high speeds". So Medaka didn't fly all the way to the moon. She intercepted the falling moon in a rocket.

She hangs up saying she'll be going there to destroy the moon (and probs die in the process but I'll get to that).

On her defense, Medaka later mentions that the collision of the moon with earth would probs kill Iihiko and her too, but does it while also considering that, arguably, she alone might survive.

...This goes completely down the drain when it's later revealed that the reason the moon deal didn't kill her wasn't because she tanked, it wasn't even because she used whatever hax to come back. It was because Shiranui Hanten who happens to be comparable to Ajimu went out of his way to save her.

This also quite possibly Debunks "Encounter NLF GG" reasoning in threads forever since logically if she was capable of pushing Moon Level stuff aside she wouldn't need Hanten to save her in the first place or would not consider it a big deal. She also had AF with her all along so I'm pretty sure this settles scale of both haxes and debunks once and for all that talk of Tier 2 Medaka mainly based on a single line with an skill that didn't kill actually kill even the fodder character it was used on.

And so based on that, Moon Dura should go. At least on her FTL probably goes too, it should just be FTL.
MoonYogSothoth Level
 
Ugh.. what am i going to do with you fate?

First of all, Medaka's FTL comes from clac so, no it's not getting downgraded. Calc > Your Headcanon.

Medaka can't fly so ofc she'd need a rocket to the moon.

Medaka doesn't use her hax so you can't just say "she used it", when nothing points toward her doing so, that is just your headcannon.

About Hanten saying that (yes hanten is comparable to Ajimu) he went to save Medaka, as i said Medaka would be stuck on the moon because she cannot fly. Hanten on the other hand is endless he just got her back to earth. That counts as saving.

Anyway, this is just headcanon at it's finest. And the ppl who agreed basically have a boner against Medaka so im not surprised they are like "yes totally argee, we can't lose the oportunity to downgrade Medaka, after all rn she's stomping all of Reinhard's lackeys". You just think like it may be the case so that is the case? If we were to use vauge stuff like that Ajimu would be tier 0 cus yeah... omnipotent statements.
 
Firephoenixearl said:
Anyway, this is just headcanon at it's finest. And the ppl who agreed basically have a boner against Medaka so im not surprised they are like "yes totally argee, we can't lose the oportunity to downgrade Medaka, after all rn she's stomping all of Reinhard's lackeys". You just think like it may be the case so that is the case? If we were to use vauge stuff like that Ajimu would be tier 0 cus yeah... omnipotent statements.
Click to expand...
The last sentence just made me feel like i saw boku no pico all day
 
Overlord775 said:
would All-Fiction allow her to easilly return to earth ?
Click to expand...
Yes but she doesn't use skills. She never used any skills.

Oh and about All Fiction and Encounter not working on the Moon, well yeah. They wouldn't work. Fate forgets something (i mean she's just human after all, it's ok for her to make mistakes)....the MOON DIDN'T COLIDE. Without collision there is no "hit or durability" involved into all of this. Yes the moon was flying at high speeds but unless it hits the earth, it doesn't deal dmg, Medaka was just standing on the moon for all she cares.
 
...Fate has nothing against Medaka Box, that's just you accusing someone else because they don't follow your own view of point.

>Medaka doesn't use her hax so you can't just say "she used it", when nothing points toward her doing so, that is just your headcannon.

Then why you are hell bent on saying Medaka uses hax in character? This seem to goes against what you always told us in vs threads. Stop contradicting your words and start making sense already

And if it's true the moon didn't collide, it still means her durability is not moon level. Adding her saying she cannot survive it means there's a limit to Encounter and that her body cannot withstand the kinetic energy of the moon dropping

And Fate never mentioned Reinhard or any of the vs thread. You just seem to have some beef with it and wanted to mention it. But you did say your biased towards Masadaverse so of course you'll mention it

You say headcanon while being completely oblivious to your own headcanon.

If you wanna argue against Fate, do a favor to everyone and really start to argue instead of saying headcanon or anything along the lines of it. Accusations won't help you with anything
 
Also what calc?

I don't see any calc on Medaka profile so i'm confused as hell

Her profile just slapped an "At least" without any reasoning whatsoever
 
ALRF said:
Also what calc?
I don't see any calc on Medaka profile so i'm confused as hell

Her profile just slapped an "At least" without any reasoning whatsoever
Click to expand...
That's because the calc was done by like 3 ppl. Maybe ppl forgot to put it in the profiles, but they do exist. The reason she has the "at least FTL" was because Medaka "in base form" displayed a speed of a "lowball" (the lowest estimation) 1.426e10 c (which i don't even know how big it is since i'm not knowledgable on the "e" if you can tell me about it that'd be gr8) . So by transforming where each of the transformations were faster than the previous with the last one being massively faster.
 
"instead of saying headcanon"

^ Literally the word Matthew uses to shoot down anything that ups Medaka Box.

Anyway, her durability is moon level, she destroyed it with her fist. Newton's Law my friend, you do remeber it don't you? "for every action there is an equal oposite reaction" If you can punch the Moon out of existence, you get the equal oposite reaction to that in your fist or body whatever you used.

The "moon didn't collide" is still an argument. Why don't u try to kill a fly mid air using only 1 hand? Come on try it, just slap that shit and see if it kills. Then tell me about Medaka and the Moon.

Medaka said she can survive...why? Via encounter. Kumagawa does always say about "dying". So death, even though it is temporary is still death, as it is always called as a death in every case even if he comes back. So dying doesn't = surviving, even if you do somehow get up later. And again, it's just a statement, if we'r gonna accept sth as vague as that, then let's accept the 1-A styles, the 5D Iihiko, the omnipotent ajimu etc etc etc. Come on they are the same satements from the same verse, but only the downgraded ones count? Sounds fair.

I never said fate mentioned everything. Everyone else just upvoted randomly. And that's some nice coincidence that this happened right after Medaka was soloing all of Reinhard's generals. Anyway this isn't exactly an argument so let's drop this.

And about using hax in character. She did use hax vs iihiko, and vs someone else. But against the someone else she used trash stuff (like actual trash skills, that put her at a disadvantage), and against Iihiko, it was freaking Iihiko who killed all of her friends, Ajimu, was taking her friend, and anything else just seemed futile. That was not the case with the moon, the moon was something she could destroy with her raw strength, she never needed anything vs it, she was never in any real danger nor did she need to rush when you are someone moving at over SoL speeds. So yeah.
 
You speak of Newton's Law yet you do know she stated she will die? That means her body is incapable of holding the kinetic energy she generates from her punches or whatever. There are many characters who can project themselves at speed that their bodies cannot withstand and end up destroying themselves.

Dunno what you are trying to tell me here. Comparison doesn't even make sense to boot.

Not getting it. The fact that she would die means her body is incapable of holding down the energy from just punching the moon or anything like that. You call headcanon? Sure. You saying Medaka can survive the moon with Encounter is headcanon too. But seriously, the fact that she is going "i will die probs" to "i might survive" doesn't help at all with your Encounter argument, the fact all were panicking about it makes me even doubtful. If they had the tools to go against the Moon then why the panic?

Inb4, "PIS, that's all".

And that's why i'm starting to dislike even debating with you. You have this kind of ego in which you genuily believe Medaka stomps and want to shove it at everyone face. I don't care if you believe Medaka soloing them, but i certainly cannot keep up with the latters attitude. And k, Celestial Pegasus was in that thread? CrimsonStar was in that thread? Overlord was in that thread? Phoenix821 was in that thread? Fate was in that thread? Sure

For the speed thread. Make a blog, do the calc, than have calc users see them and evaluating them. Otherwise, it's a nono. Or if there's a blog, than do show us

For the hax. I can finally say you're a hypocrite
 
@Matthew Surface area doesn't apply to round objects applying weight as their weight is applied in 1 single point, in our case it's Medaka, if Medaka were to get smashed between the moon and the earth she would feel the full weight of the Moon on her body. And if we'r calcing explosion u'd literally need to be in all directions of a massive object such as the moon to take all the explosion (which means it's pretty hard to get the 5-C tier eh, like it's easier to get higher tiers but not 5-C. We take the shockwave that's produced. Tanking it would mean moon level, by our standards.

@ALRF. She stated she will die, she didn't die. So yeah bye bye to that argument. If she stated she would die with all her hax then she came back alive? (and by that i mean destroyed the moon, had strength left to go fight the concepts of light and darkness, to fight wargold, travel to another universe etc etc etc) Yeah you all know what that means. The "medaka would die' is a bad argument as she didn't die. She came back with bruises (which ARE negated by All Fiction and even Non NLF Encounter will stop such bruises) which means she didn't use any hax. And the reason for why they were Panicking is the same for why everyone was scared at Iihiko's appearance and why Iihiko even beat Ajimu (even though i can literally list hundreds of ways of how Ajimu could have stomped that match without affecting anyone else). Plot. If plot allows Kumagawa to be scared of Zenkichi then it sure as hell can allow everyone to be scared of the moon. Besides they had never faced a similar thing. Anyway Medaka survived, so your point gets broken by facts either way.

Im giving you a real life example of "no collision, no dmg". Without landing or without hitting something it is not enough to kill, it'll just push, push doesn't deal dmg. It will just "increase gravity" at the lowest point (lowest being the direction the object is going). So that is my point, without a collision, there can't be dmg dealt.

This point is just an extention of the first one so imma skip this one.

And the blog already exists, done by multiple ppl. KamiYasha, Reppuzan and Lina Shields did the calc. Just check the blog posts on Medaka Box.
 
No It does. If you hit the moon with an attack and the ensuing explosion kills you, you are only receiving a tiny fraction of the explosion's energy due to how much smaller you are from the moon and the explosion going in multiple directions.

Same thing for a surface wiping attack not aimed at you.
 
She came back alive because Hanten saved her. So your argument is being utterly contradicted by the story itself.

Can't find this blog though, do you have link?

Edit: nevermind did
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
No It does. If you hit the moon with an attack and the ensuing explosion kills you, you are only receiving a tiny fraction of the explosion's energy due to how much smaller you are from the moon and the explosion going in multiple directions.
Same thing for a surface wiping attack not aimed at you.
Click to expand...
If you hit the moon with an attack that explodes it. You are moon level. Your punch can destroy the moon. Newton's Law. Action = opposite reaction. If you destroy the moon with a punch and don't get blown to pieces by that same punch then you have Moon Level durability as u withstood a opposite reaction = blowing up the moon.

And about a surface wiping attack. It depends. If every bit of that attack is 5-C then yes. It's a case by case basis really.
 
ALRF said:
She came back alive because Hanten saved her. So your argument is being utterly contradicted by the story itself.
Can't find this blog though, do you have link?

Edit: nevermind did
Click to expand...
As i said "he went to save her". Medaka herself said "she destroyed the moon". He went to get her back to earth. And the fact that she has bruises means hax wasn't used. Also "everyone will die, and Medaka alone will survive". Everyone includes hanten. Though i guess it doesn't because since he can do this and that and is comparable than everyone we can take as ..............
 
You are not making sense. Medaka dying to the moon exploding or crashing into the Earth actually put her durability at lower than 5-C.
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
You are not making sense. Medaka dying to the moon exploding or crashing into the Earth actually put her durability at lower than 5-C.
Click to expand...
She never died she had mere briuses after destroying the moon. she tanked her own 5-c fists = 5-c durability.
 
My point went over your head. There's no discussion about the legitimacy of this feat. Or whether the calc being used is wrong or not.

I wouldn't mind if the blog gets evaluated and accepted but as long as it isn't reviewed by a calc user, we certainly cannot use it
 
>Medaka wouldn't survive the explosion of the Moon and had to be saved

>Person argues against that despite it being something unarguable and from the story itself

wew
 
Ultima Reality said:
>Medaka wouldn't survive the explosion of the Moon and had to be saved
>Person argues against that despite it being something unarguable and from the story itself

wew
Click to expand...
you believe that she wouldn't survive, it was never mentioned she was dying, she said she would survive

so saying 'i saved her', can mean just went to get her back, untill u have proof for what he means it's a vague statement that needs to be turned down.
 
The Scans show her blatantly stating that she will die upon destroying the Moon, and then considering the possibility that she might survive the collision between the Moon and the Earth

Stop trying to distort what the actual scans say with your headcanon. Your habit of blatantly lying / misinterpreting things deliberately is getting really annoying at this point
 
Ultima Reality said:
The Scans show her blatantly stating that she will die upon destroying the Moon, and then considering the possibility that she might survive the Moon falling into the Earth
Click to expand...
You'll think u'll die if you get hit by a car, if u've never been hit before. That doesn't make it a fact. Those are just estimations. She has never gotten hit by a moon before to have a flat value of whether she will die or survive.

And again she came back with mere bruises = didn't use hax

Hanten's statement can only be headcanon i mean there is no way to know for certain what he means, only how someone inteprets it, so it can't be used.

Medaka has never faced something of that magnitude, being scared is not to be taken as fact. The fact is she came back after fighting concepts and fighting the king of another universe (moon is fodder compared to those), and was completely fine. She came back completely unscathed, if she had been "saved" by Hanten she wouldn't have been in that state, she would have been in a near death state barely alive, if she were "saved" by him.
 
TISSG7Redgrave said:
v
The last sentence just made me feel like i saw boku no pico all day
Click to expand...
Dodosuke
you killed me guy


Firephoenixearl said:
That's because the calc was done by like 3 ppl. Maybe ppl forgot to put it in the profiles, but they do exist. The reason she has the "at least FTL" was because Medaka "in base form" displayed a speed of a "lowball" (the lowest estimation) 1.426e10 c
Click to expand...
Yeah obviously, Medaka is FTL with 1.4e10 c AkA 1.4 Billion time faster than light, nothing wrong
 
I agree

Also the calculation he's talking about was purely calc stacking from Ajimu's Star destroying attack if I remember correctly
 
Firephoenixearl said:
Ugh.. what am i going to do with you fate?
Click to expand...
See Fire this kind of reply is why you're a meme in the wiki about being utterly biased in MB's favor. You say I'm bringing headcanon when I brought the scans and context to what I say. While you give your own absurd interpretation and claim it to be the truth while somehow saying I'M the one applying headcanon.
 
Also since Fire apparently loves to keep his stance in favor of Medaka against all reasons, outright ignores scans and generally - sorry for the word but I can't avoid it at this point - WANKS Medaka Box to Oblivion while also being REALLY agressive against anyone who disagrees with the tiers he makes to it in his head...

While never bringing any evidence to back up what he says...

...Despite it always going against what the story shows - as it's plain for anyone to see from the scans and his behaviour in other previous CRTs as well as older VS Threads...

I'll be straight to the point here.

Look at his very first reply right there. No, just look. He generally snaps at both the OP and everyone who agreed claiming they're all just biased against Medaka when there is every single reason for me to make this CRT downgrade since I'm actively researching and bringing the evidence. Yet he calls all that Headcanon. My headcanon is apparently so strong that it seeps in Medaka Box's pages and makes up entire scans, plot included, becoming Actual Canon, then? Whew.

Nearly everyone agrees.

And Unless Fire actually brings up any evidence that actually debunk the OP, I feel pretty safe to say he's just having a problem with the downgrade and is in denial as he always does in every. Single. Medaka. Box. Thread. Ever.

Facts, Actual Context and Scans >>> Fire's Personal Opinio

Otherwise Ajimu would already be tier 1 by now, since that's his impression of it. And don't even get me on the marvelous scaling he would be giving to the other High / God Tiers based on that.

I will *NOT* engage Fire of all people in a circular debate until he actually proves and back ups what he's saying like I did. Everyone should know why by now: This is simple logic - I went and proved my point from the start. Burden of Proof is 120% on his shoulders right now.

And since he wants to use that word so badly, here's my answer:

"Sorry, Fire, but everyone can see the OP is full of scans, thus your reply ammounts to headcanon and personal interpretation that works based on a ton of unlikely assumptions. Assumptions of the same kind that make you certain Dimensional Tiering exists in Medaka Box or that Ajimu is way up there in tier 1. Until you actually bring up evidence to back up your claims, I can very much ignore your points based on them being objectively false."
 
ALRF said:
So yeah...about the calcs...there's no discussion..?
Click to expand...
You actually mean to tell me that occasion when they say Medaka stopped Ajimu's bullet at Sonic Speed instead of Light Speed when Medaka Box always makes that distinction in Statements was calced here as SoL even when every single student fodder included saw it happen? Oof. As for the Star One, if people actually calced that from Ajimu within the Dream and somehow scaled it to Medaka, I'll be dead inside.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Hades109
  • Locked
Ajimu Najimi Universe level Debunk
Replies
37
Views
3K
Antvasima
Antvasima
Agnaa
Ajimu Upgrade Undo
Replies
28
Views
4K
Antvasima
Antvasima
KobsterHope07
Minor Futaba Limited Durability Negation CRT
Replies
6
Views
573
Excellence616
Excellence616
Yokoahh5743
  • Locked
MCU: 5-C Thanos durability with armor and High 6-B possibly 6-A upgrade durability Agatha
Replies
35
Views
2K
Kaandnyy
Kaandnyy
TyphonEX
  • Locked
Fate/Extra CCC p&a cleanup (Part 1?)
2
Replies
57
Views
4K
LephyrTheRevanchist
LephyrTheRevanchist
Back
Top