Dark Souls AP and Speed Thread

Continuing from this thread: https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/1099154

Here is a rundown of the feats in the previous thread that we will look over one by one. I suggest starting with the speed feats since those should be easier to scale. I'll update the OP as the thread progresses.

Attack Potency

• City Block level
  • Asylum Demon AP of 14.77 Tons
  • Spells like the Chaos Storm are capable of generating 4.743├ù10^10 Joules
  • Curse-Rotted Greatwood collapsing the stone floor to begin the second phase.
  • Low-tier bosses such as the Asylum Demon, Taurus Demon, Capra Demon, Curse-Rotted Greatwood, Iudex Gundyr, etc., are all scaled from the

• Small City level+
  • Pyromancies like Fire Tempest simulate the mighty pyromancy the Daughters of Chaos used in their war with the dragons, generating at most 2.012618715├ù10^17 Joules, and they ended up speaking the Chaos Flame, which all demons of note can wield as power.
  • The Soul of the Old Demon King can even be transposition into Chaos Bed Vestiges, which summon remnants of the Chaos Flame itself. Basically, this is where high-tier spells (Not top-tier) would go, I'd imagine.

• Country level
  • The bosses scaled from this feat are ones that have some sort of parity with the Everlasting Dragons or the Lords, including those who can wield Soul Spear (Which is said to be on-par with Gwyn's Lightning), Crystal Soul Spear (Which is comparable to the Armaments of the Lords) and White Dragon Breath (Which emits the breath of Seath the Scaleless).3
  • The Dark Souls 3 bell magic is able to generate 3.385982844918├ù10^22 Joules
    • 
      Dark Souls 3 Gameplay Walkthrough Part 28 1080p HD PC 60FPS Nameless King BOSS FIGHT-0
      

• Star level
  • The Lords of Cinder and maybe Pontiff Sulyvahn (Since he was partners with Aldrich) are scaled from the First Flame creating and maintaining the existence of the sun, as before it existed there was no light in the world, and if it dies all light, including the sun, will disappear. .

• Large Star level
  • The Soul of Cinder is an amalgamation of every single Lord of Cinder throughout Dark Souls history. While the exact number is unknown, we do know of at least eight (Gwyn, the Chosen Undead, the Bearer of the Curse, Ludleth, Aldrich, the Abyss Watchers, Yhorm and the Twin Princes), with the likelihood of it being a great number more. The Twin Princes are stronger than all three of the past Lords of Cinder bosses and are implied to have killed several Ashen Ones in the past. Finally, the Nameless King is > that even before he absorbs the King of the Storm's soul before you can, and is basically the biggest thing you can take on sans the SoC. He's a fair few magnitudes of power above any of the ordinary Lords of Cinder, basically, and then he powers up MORE so... yeah.

Since the bosses are in a very odd order (Especially in DS3, where the Abyss Watchers are fought fairly early on), we judge the bosses based on their own feats and power scaling to various entities and don't just go "Boss B is stronger than Boss A because he's fought later", or else we'd wind up with the Dancer of the Boreal Valley being > Abyss Watchers, Yhorm, and Aldrich.

Speed

• Game Mechanics and Lore
  • While dodge speed isn't changed in-game, obviously from a developer standpoint, dexterity is shown to level up as the game progresses, indicating an increase in speed.
  • Soul Stream
    • There is no real life comparison for us to gauge how fast a soul travels; however, it it likely comparable in speed to a spell of the same class, Sunlight Spear. It's possible for Soul Stream to be the speed of light since there is no other evidence suggesting that it's not comparable to the Sunlight Spear.

• Speed of Light
  • Sunlight Spear: "Miracle born from the fading soul of Gwyn. Hurl sunlight spear. In the war that marked the dawn of the Age of Fire, Gwyn wielded these rays of sunlight, which remains fierce even as they fade."

• Relativistic+: Chosen Undead, Bearer of the Curse, Soul of Cinder, Ashen One, and possibly Lords of Cinder
  • Dodge Sunlight Spear during invasions

• Massively Hypersonic+: Beginning/Mid game protagonist and bosses
  • Ability to dodge and react to lightning spells
  • Dodging lightning attacks
    • What is real lightning?
      • Most lightning in fiction is not real lightning. Often it is supernatural in nature and is possibly not even electricity. Therefore lightning is only accepted as such under certain circumstances.
      • Cloud-to-ground lightning is considered to be real lightning, as long there is nothing suggesting otherwise.
      • Lightning directly produced by a character is only considered as real lightning if it has demonstrated some properties that real lightning has. Some examples are: making muscles of affected beings contract, having an (electro)magnetic field, being shown to actually move with a speed similar to lightning, flowing through conducting materials, the character being able to manipulate real electricity or electromagnetism in general, generating ozone or causing electrolysis.
      • Lightning speed can change due to a variety of factors, but for practical purposes, concerning attacks that are electricity-based, if they display power comparable to that of natural lightning, and fulfill the other requirements listed within this page, they should be considered to move at a comparable speed. It is required to show that the electricity carries an energy of at least 5 billion joules or a voltage of around 100 million volts in order to qualify.
    • Scientific Basis
      • The speed of lightning can vary mostly in the range of 1.0-14├ù105 m/s. For the purpose of calculating speed feats, we use the average lightning speed of 4.4├ù105 m/s (Mach 1294), which is suggested by this study. Similar studies have found average speeds within the same order of magnitude, albeit lower. [1][2][3] The clouds that usually cause thunderstorms build about 200m to 4000m above the ground.[4] In this wiki, 2000m is the standard assumption.

• Massively Hypersonic
  • The DS3 Bell's Fury of the Storm has a Dispersal Speed of Mach 140.527

• Hypersonic
  • Asylum Demon Swinging Speed is 2582.11m/s or Mach 7.527697

• Subsonic:
  • Compound Bow Arrow Speed ranged from Mach 0.293248 to 0.355452
  • Recurve Bow Arrow Speed is at least Mach 0.186612

Iirc the dragon hunting bows in the game have Been calculated at supersonic actually

i have only a few complains:

the Soul of Cinder shouldn't be "possibly 4-B", we treat countless statements as 1000, and the baseline star- baseline solar system power difference is over 3000x currently and it's gonna be over 9000x with the recent changes to tier 4, so it should be remuved

there's nothing to suggest that the twin princes are above 4-C, and nothing suggest that they are vastly stronger than any other Lord of cinder

Where did you get that the Nameless King is vastly stronger than the princes ? because as far as i know, there no proof for it

On a side note, I was thinking about making a Pontiff Sulyvauhn profile because he is such a key and cool character. What stats would he have?

I have some gripes with MHS+ lightning spells and SOL sunlight spears. Mainly by the token that they are constrained in bolts. The cloud-to-ground lightning (which behaves a decent bit more like actual lightning) in Gael's fight is clearly going faster. However, I do think MHS Dark Souls is perfectly fine. I'm also in the 5-A Dark Souls band wagon

OP has been updated.

@Jesterofgames

Do you know where the calc could be? I tried google and couldn't find anything.

Dexterity is hand movement actually. An increase in body movement is Agility. Which there is no stat for except in DS2. Which I am totally okay with translating to an increase in speed, as marginal as it would be.

Curse-Rotted Greatwood would be low City-Block level imo. Or something straight less. It's both a really small block and also the ground is extremely hollow making it far easier to break. An actual city block has more reinforcement than what the Tree's boss arena had.

Confused about Country-level statement since it says scales from Soul Spear which scales from Gwyn's lightning without any feats tying Gwyn's Lightning to Country-level. Please advise.

> The Twin Princes are stronger than all three of the past Lords of Cinder bosses and are implied to have killed several Ashen Ones in the past. Finally, the Nameless King is >

As in the Gael vs SoC thread it doesn't matter when you fight enemies. So you can't scale enemies based on where you encounter them in the game. Stay consistent guys.

Friendly reminder to control yourselves in regards to the Lords of Cinder because they may have *once* lit the flame but as in EVERY Dark Souls it's done with the help of many other powerful Souls. A good correlation to cite is DS3 itself where one past Lord of Cinder is not good enough to sate the First Flame. Likely because their Soul has burnt out, sure, but it's also likely that in the past when they lit it, they had help then as well.

> Speed of Light

• Sunlight Spear: "Miracle born from the fading soul of Gwyn. Hurl sunlight spear. In the war that marked the dawn of the Age of Fire, Gwyn wielded these rays of sunlight, which remains fierce even as they fade."
  
  There's no feat here I don't know why you quoted it. The description itself even has no feat in it.

And I've already debunked any lightning feats from the previous thread. But I bet some people will want to continue arguing against it.

Rune Katashima said:

And I've already debunked any lightning feats from the previous thread. But I bet some people will want to continue arguing against it.

Click to expand...

Let's just start with that we agree with before we get into the differentiating specifics.

In the video below, we agree that natural lightning is shown during the boss fight.

Starts at 5:00.


Dark Souls 3 Ringed City Slave Knight Gael Boss Fight 4K 60FPS-0

The full lightning bolt appears in one frame of the video.




We use Lightning Speed as 4.4*10^5 m/s

The lightning bolt strikes some distance behind the chair, but still within reason to calculate. If anything, using the current chair height lowballs the lightning speed calculation.

Distance:

Average Male height in the US from 2011-2014: 175.7 cm or 1.755 m

Average proportions have the height at about 7.5 heads.

The thigh takes up about one head.

Person: 1.755 / 7.5 * 6.5 = 1.521 = 110 px

Chair: 220 px = 3.042 m

Lightning: 290 px = 9.28610526316 m

According to VLC, the video above downloaded at 720p by Keepvid runs at 30 fps.

Video Time = 0.0333333333333 seconds

Video Speed = 278.583157895 m/s

Therefore, the protagonist is able to perceive events 4.4*10^5 / 278.583157895 = 1579.42067756 times faster.

@Firestorm The Sunlight Spear was used to kill Everlasting Dragons, the power of the dragons was used to make this Feat

@Overlord775

I'm confused. How is the power of dragons related to the bell? I know the bell calls upon the Nameless King with a storm that it creates.

Firestorm808 said:

@Overlord775
I'm confused. How is the power of dragons related to the bell? I know the bell calls upon the Nameless King with a storm that it creates.

Click to expand...

because the bell was created by those that follow the way of the dragon, and they use the power of the everlasting dragons.so the everlasting dragon should be superior to the bell

@Overlord775

Can you link me to the screenshot or gameplay footage that shows the dialogue for that, so I can cite it?