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the fact that this thread has 2 pages is actually pathetic
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Zeno EE resistance
- Thread starter ZillertheBucko
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- #122
eventually omnipresent isn't relevant here because he wasn't omnipresent during any of his screentime
yes, that's the definition of omnipresence but he is NIGH omnipresent so that's still not relevant
if you're gonna say he was present in all of universe 7 then burden of proof still requires you to show what proves it, since there is visible evidence that he wasn't
they could have easily made the ground zamasu as well, but if you're looking for more definitive evidence then
there are clearly stars still present in the background that are not a part of zamasu
zamasu is nigh omnipresent, not omnipresent.
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- #123
feel free to just not prove your point then, I'm sure false arguments are helping a ton
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no what I'm saying is, the fact that a this thread has 2 pages for 1 single addition for a character baffles me
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Uhh, he's literay stated to be one with the universe? And also stated to extend his reach beyond u7 and into other timelines? That's factually omnipresence. Like I said it's hard to depict omnipresence visually, but it's quite literally stated that he is, you are taking the meaning of nigh omnipresence and skewing it, being nigh omnipresent is still being omnipresent just not being bounded by some places, in this case it's the other universes which is why the profile says "eventually omnipresent", I don't need to prove further as the wiki already accepts this as fact.
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- #126
universal statements are to be taken as obervable universe generally, and I already DIRECTLY ADRESSED the timlines thing, but I'll have to do it yet again
he does indeed extend his reach into the 4th dimension, but this still is possible without being the entirety of that particular 3d universe, it just means he has access to another dimension
shooting a laser into the 4th dimension doesn't mean that the laser is engulfing the entirety of the 3d universe, just that it's extending into another axis, or time if you want to say that
also *literally
I'm sorry, I've tried to be patient with you for a while now, but I seriously don't get what it's going to take for you to realize that the profile quite literally says nigh omnipresent, there is direct and extremely blatant solid evidence that he is not the entirety of the universe
he is nigh omnipresent, not omnipresent
the 2 are literally different things, stop trying to say they aren't
by all means, drop the link to this statement that does not exist in any way
I'm starting to get sick of you actually telling BLATANT LIES bro, this is starting to become more annoying than it needs to be
but if you truly believe this, then just drop the statement because I can 100% guarantee you it does not exist
"The power to almost be everywhere in existence at once. A lesser variation of Omnipresence. This power is similar to omnipresence, except that the users are bound within a certain domain, such as time, space, light, or nothingness."
ALMOST everywhere at once
SIMILAR to omniprescence
there is no possible way this could even get the smallest shred clearer unless I had god himself come and visit your house to tell you that nigh omniprescence isn't omniprescence
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- #127
oh, sorry I'm just a little annoyed rn so forget what I said at first
anyways, to my knowledge any dragon ball thread that had anybody disagree at all ends up like this anyways so
if this ends by the 3rd page it would be relatively short anyways
this is what happens when you discuss the number one most powerscaling associated verse in fiction, so I'm not surprised, just disappointed
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Obviously out of context, and if he's fusing with the universe then yes he's every inch of the universe lol. It doesn't need to be spoonfed to you like that.
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- #129
I sure do love when there is more definitive evidence
"He was cut down. But thanks to the dragon's power, his being remains. It seems he's embraced this new ethereal state. No longer confined by his divine vessel, he may be trying to become part of the very fabric of the cosmos. His own twisted idea of justice and order made manifest."
key word: trying
the statement directly suggests that he hasn't fully become the universe
so yes, I do need to be "spoonfed" proof for bs arguments, sorry!
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never did i think adding a resistance thats so blatantly shown would be this hard...
also i find it weird that people are trying to say zeno selectively erased zamasu when zamasu at the time was omnipresent within the entire area
edit: literally its space and time and zeno was a part of and existed within that space and time
also i find it weird that people are trying to say zeno selectively erased zamasu when zamasu at the time was omnipresent within the entire area
edit: literally its space and time and zeno was a part of and existed within that space and time
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- #131
yeah....trying to argue omniprescence meanwhile zeno who would technically be part of zamasu if he was omnipresent wasn't erased....
it's painful to watch
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- #132
also I feel like 99% of people who left a disagree vote did not stay to listen to counterarguments, which I think is another flaw in the wiki's system
people can just leave a vote at the very start and then dip
people can just leave a vote at the very start and then dip
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Lmaoooooooo.
Yes, he was still fusing with the universe lol. Meaning he hadn't fully become the entire thing or the framework.
If you need to be spoon-fed, then go back to middle school and learn what implications are lmao.
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You do know that Zeno's palace isn't part of the multiverse, right? Or are you going to pull off your headcanon again?
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They have literally read through everything. You can criticize people all you want, but people that disagree with you find your logic bad, not that they haven't read it lmao.
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- #136
did....you literally just admit to my argument being correct? you just admitted that he wasn't the entirety of the universe because he was still in the process of fusing with it
I was saying that by that person's logic, if zamasu was omnipresent then everything, including zeno, should be part of him via just being inside the universe that he was part of
by their own wrong logic, they were still proving my point
I am not using headcanon, I'm using common sense and actual decent reasoning
you literally have no idea if they read it or not bro, all I know right now is that the majority of them have not reacted to a reply, nor replied themselves
usually if people are looking at the thread they'd acknowledge it in some way. but literally everybody has been completely silent
and holy shit dude stop using garbage arguments, stop being too closed minded to comprehend basic logic, this is getting beyond insane when something so ridiculously simply has absolutely no right to be so controversial
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- #137
btw did you already vote or not? unsure if you were added
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i said "agree" earlier but idk if my vote was counted
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- #139
lemme read through and do a recount then
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- #140
ok seems like I've counted every disagree and agree (besides myself) so far
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- #141
by the way if anybody knows some statements saying something like "no ability can defeat zeno" or author statements about zeno relating to it then it would be neat if you could post those right now, since that's probably the most easy way to argue this
Valiant_Abyss
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@ZillerBucko you've been sounding extremely arrogant throughout the entire thread.
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- #143
well when all the counterarguments are so bad it tends to sound that way, but I don't really see how I could make myself look better or something while still debunking their arguments
but regardless of how I may seem rn, all that really matters is that the obvious flaw on the profile be fixed, and I've provided far more evidence than needed to do so
Valiant_Abyss
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And you continue to act arrogant.
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- #145
ok bro whatever this can be discussed later
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Nobody denied it lol. He was fusing with the cosmos. Whether that was the universe, the multiverse, or all timelines in DB, that's not too relevant, but he didn't fully fuse with everything.
Again, Zeno isn't part of the multiverse that Zamasu was fusing with, so it's absolutely ludicrous for that to apply to him.
??????? They have, tho...if they disagree, that just means that they have read the arguments, and don't agree. Not sure why someone would not read the OP and still disagree. Please give me a logical explanation as to how that works lmao.
You're calling them garbage arguments, but you've been called out many times in this thread for contradicting yourself. You're literally making up random arguments as you go along in this thread. At this point, you might as well just get this one closed and make a new one with better, more constructed and organized arguments, so that reading issue doesn't come up like you say it apparently has been with no way of proving it.
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It's not, tho...it's a blatant misunderstanding of how characters get resistance.
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You do know that the only real issue other than the fact that none of your "sources" are consistent with themselves, the wiki doesn't really accept resistance like that from what I know, so I don't know why you're calling them "bad counterarguments".
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- #149
ok, can you be more specific with what you're saying is inconsistent?
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- #150
I know, this is literally what I was proving
the part about zeno being a part of the universe was exclusively a point made to debunk someone using their own logic
well, the point of this is to prove they're not being logical but I was specifically saying that after the moment people voted they mostly didn't acknowledge counterarguments that came later in the thread and just completely dipped
them calling me out means nothing if I didn't contradict myself in the first place
you love to say "you're inconsistent" and "you contradict yourself" but you're intentionally being extremely vague, because I've already covered 99% of the arguments you can even think of
I absolutely dare you to try and explain what about me is wrong, and have a nice 1 on 1 debate in which you attempt to disprove my justifications for zeno having EE
I invite you to do it, but I almost guarantee you can't back up what you're saying with facts
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- #151
at this point it's clear to me that the only way to get this debate over with is to force you to DIRECTLY explain yourselves, otherwise people can just spend their weeks vaguely saying "well it doesn't quite line up soooooooo" and "yeah but your logic doesn't quite make sense because I'm right!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"
I'll be waiting for your response, and I expect an actual clear argument instead of just calling my argument bad vaguely with no specification whatsoever
I'll be waiting for your response, and I expect an actual clear argument instead of just calling my argument bad vaguely with no specification whatsoever
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?????
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But that's basically just lying at that point. "using their logic against them" man, gtfo of here. Use their logic by still being honest.
Again, it's complete headcanon. Plenty of people say "disagree" without further explanation. That doesn't mean they haven't read through the OP. That usually just means that they couldn't care less to further explain their opinion.
You did contradict yourself numerous times, not sure why you're still trying.
Most of your "counterarguments" are based on baseless inaccurate claims, but if this is the route you want to take, just get some mods to take a look at the thread and evaluate it. It would honestly go by a little faster. Anyway, I'll likely just unwatch the thread cause I couldn't care less at this point, and I have to focus on my own CRT
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I don't think Zeno should have EE resistance due to the fact that he only affected the universe Zamasu was merging with. He didn't erase himself, Goku, Vegeta, Trunks, the time machine, etc.
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- #155
I wasn’t using it as my argument to prove my point dude, that should be ******* obvious, I was only using it to tell them that what they were saying wasn’t true, and if it was true it still wouldn’t matter because by their logic I’m still right
Dude I have already explained that I wasn’t referring to the original post, actually read what the **** I said before replying with something BLATANTLY IRRELEVANT like this shit
You are literally doing it again, you say my claims are “baseless” yet you can’t prove it, you can only call it baseless because you know that you can’t explain why and are only trying to make my argument look worse despite it being factual
also mods are always watching crts, if one is gonna offer their opinion they will, but moderators can still be wrong so honestly I don’t really care what they have to say
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- #156
Ok gimme a couple minutes I have a few images and arguments that will explain why the time machine wasn’t erased, and also proves that he did touch himself with the erasure
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Disagree. We don't assume that characters are harmed by their own attacks unless there is evidence in the work to say so. There is no evidence that said zeno could be erased by his own attack.
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Disagree for DT's reasoning.
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I did, I'll read it again cause I merely skimmed through and only really read the arguments cause I couldn't care less about the more minor stuff.
I already did, tho...Also, what's with this pre-concieved notion that mods don't have a life. They are people too, you know? They have more important things to do than look at a single website all day long. So yes, I do recommend messaging one to get them to check it out.
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- #160
ok there are a 2 things that can be proven that justify zeno having EE, that being.....
1. Do zeno's white light balls erase what they touch instead of just being for visual affect?
2. Does Zeno actually touch his attack or not?
assuming the answer is yes to both these questions, then zeno would have EE resistance due to touching something that erases what it touches
Now as for proving point 1, I'd like you to take a look at this image. What is happening here is that after zeno's white balls had expanded from his hands and became larger, it reached zamasu in the sky and began to erase him. The reason this matter is that because it expanded from what was already in his hands, those 2 white lights he hold also erase stuff. There's also examples throughout dragon ball as well as super that show attacks in their "charging" state still being made of the same matter/energy as the attack itself, a good example being when goku literally just does kefla like this while the kamehameha is still charging, establishing that it was able to somewhat take the energy of kefla's blast which was stated to be able to one shot goku if it hit him.
Anyways, so the erasure's light does indeed erase what it touches because it is the same energy or whatever as the erasure itself. The fact that zeno also was seemingly erasing zamasu with just the white ball expanding is further proof supporting it can erase on contact, and it doesn't contradict the other uses of zeno's erasure since we can just treat it as the attack charging, since we see him charging it every time we see him using it.
as for proving point 2, it should be easier and simpler
the goku kamemeha grind comes back as evidence here, because we know that when characters charge attacks, they're touching them, otherwise that scene wouldn't make any sense at all since goku can't fly without it in the tournament of power
also just from observation alone it is pretty clear that he's touching it, and if someone were to say that he wasn't touching it then they would actually need to show some kind of proof for it since I've already shown the proof I need
also just remember that it's stated a few times that nobody can defeat zeno, and given that, it also makes it pretty clear with author intention that zeno shouldn't be erasable by characters like beerus
and EE resistance is something we've already seen from frieza a few times, and he is a far weaker character than the omni king of course
so the argument is undeniably airtight from a narrative and writing standpoint, there is absolutely no reason that zeno should have any kind of susceptibility to EE like hakai, so there's even less reason to disagree with zeno EE resistance really
wrong, when zeno's zamasu erasure was considered a ki blast the wiki defaulted to saying that he tanked his own attack, so clearly they believe otherwise
also see arguments above
see arguments above
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