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Zenless Zone Zero Discussion Thread

Yeah, I imagine currently somewhere in high tier 8 to 7 for Void Hunter level characters.

Trying to compare images of the Qingming Bird is a pain given it’s a being of ink energy with varying forms and probably different in motion
 
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Finished playing through Season 2. It was pretty damn good, not the best ofc but still above average. Regardless, the QOL, the immersion with Suabian Temple/management sim, and overall gameplay are top tier. I honestly want to max out the temple immediately, although I know that's not intended or possible. In short,t I'm having a great time.
 
By the way I want to ask something, should all Evasive Assist characters have some kind of Perception Manipulation/Speed Boost? We already consider characters who can do Defensive Assists as being able to deflect massive attacks normally, after all, so I wonder if we can give the perks of Vital View to characters. There's also some issues of discrepancy between playable characters and their boss versions, such as Hugo being able to manually activate Vital View as a boss but not as a playable character. Thoughts?
 
Naito-desu said:
By the way I want to ask something, should all Evasive Assist characters have some kind of Perception Manipulation/Speed Boost? We already consider characters who can do Defensive Assists as being able to deflect massive attacks normally, after all, so I wonder if we can give the perks of Vital View to characters. There's also some issues of discrepancy between playable characters and their boss versions, such as Hugo being able to manually activate Vital View as a boss but not as a playable character. Thoughts?
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hmmmm, maybe? i do feel like the line between whether or not evasive assist/vital view being a game mechanic or something characters can actually do is kinda blurry

i'm not sure if there's anything in cutscenes or just outside of game combat that suggests it being a phenomenon, the closest things to vital view outside of in game combat would probably be billy monologuing as a bullet's flying towards him or yanagi's time based abilities. if we're utilizing stuff like mindscape cinemas and core passives for character's profiles though, it might be fine to give the evasive characters vital view as part of their abilities
 
I mean tbf Billy monologuing with bullets flying past may also be a humorous depiction of Vital View given he's also a character who can do an evasive assist. I just feel that if we can count defensive assists, we should at least give evasive assists some consideration
 
Sooshirohl said:
hmmmm, maybe? i do feel like the line between whether or not evasive assist/vital view being a game mechanic or something characters can actually do is kinda blurry
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If Decibals and Disorder are straight up acknowledged, then I don’t see why we can’t count Vital View given we’ve had an Agent character do it as a boss.
 
we briefly touched on the topic a while ago but just asking again out of curiosity, how do we all feel about laser/sub-rela ZZZ? the lasers used for the feat mentioned in the chihiro/miyabi blog at the very least have evidence supporting them, and tmk there isn't anything that directly contradicts them
 
Actually come to think of it don't enemies have laser sights? Why not cross reference the laser weapons with those? 🤔 Furthermore, I think if we can count ether lightning as true lightning thenthere's potentially grounds for Relativistic
 
Naito-desu said:
Actually come to think of it don't enemies have laser sights? Why not cross reference the laser weapons with those? 🤔 Furthermore, I think if we can count ether lightning as true lightning thenthere's potentially grounds for Relativistic
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Don't most of our enemies shoot lasers? And laser machines too.
 
GodEarh206 said:
Don't most of our enemies shoot lasers? And laser machines too.
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We don't know if those are true lasers though. VsBattles has strict rules regarding what constitutes a laser and along with it, any Speed of Light rating attached
 
GodEarh206 said:
Don't most of our enemies shoot lasers? And laser machines too.
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yeah i asked because a majority of regular enemies have laser based weapons, with a lot of machine-based enemies being the notable ones. there are also laser turrets found around various maps, which is what the chiyabi blog used to get that sub-rela calc in the first place

Naito-desu said:
Actually come to think of it don't enemies have laser sights? Why not cross reference the laser weapons with those? 🤔 Furthermore, I think if we can count ether lightning as true lightning thenthere's potentially grounds for Relativistic
Click to expand...
you could probably assume that bringer's lightning is ether enhanced, at the very least (since he explicitly uses tailless' power to create the giant storm in the first place), and the 2.0 boss also altering the weather and creating lightning also seems to support that. also the lightning created by ethereal enemies like the thracian also seem to behave pretty much exactly like ordinary lightning from the looks of it, so i can see the argument
 
I'll need to get footage again and look at how fast the laser sights move and then the weapons proper.

Let me also remind everyone that the blog itself casts doubt on the lasers being completely indisputably real lasers that move at the speed of light and treated it as the highest of highest possible ends for a Void Hunter's speed, it would do well to exercise the same restraint and skepticism.
 
I've reviewed the footage of the Enforcer laser vs laser sights and there is no visible difference between them in terms of speed as with 60fps, both travel instantaneously, and heat. However, there is some things that might contest their ability as true lasers as they can kinetically move characters by knocking them back, at least in gameplay. Still, the fastest we can clock Miyabi at would still be Sub Rela rather than Speed of Light, I will get back to you with the lightning calculations as these may be able to back it up.
 
wrapped up with finals for school so i finally have some free time on my hands, so i wanted to back and update all the old profiles i made so that we can finally have more characters on ZZZ's verse page

started off with revamping anby just so we can finally have all of the cunning hare pages posted, i'll work my way through all the other ones i made and upload them as i go
 
Sooshirohl said:
started off with revamping anby just so we can finally have all of the cunning hare pages posted, i'll work my way through all the other ones i made and upload them as i go
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Nice work, I’d think she should have a higher in AP and Attack Speed as Soldier 0 given she’s much more of an offensive fighter than with her CH weapon and fighting style.
Other than that, with her soon added I could make page for Dulluhan and afterwards some mini boss Ethereals that I’d feel can scale to or above Notorious Dulluhan.

Aside from that I’ve been busy with other stuff but I am working on a sandbox for both Miyabi and Yixuan, mainly compiling their feats and abilities so all that would need to be hopefully done is getting an accepted tier and speed for them.
 
Infinity_Dragon said:
Nice work, I’d think she should have a higher in AP and Attack Speed as Soldier 0 given she’s much more of an offensive fighter than with her CH weapon and fighting style.
Other than that, with her soon added I could make page for Dulluhan and afterwards some mini boss Ethereals that I’d feel can scale to or above Notorious Dulluhan.

Aside from that I’ve been busy with other stuff but I am working on a sandbox for both Miyabi and Yixuan, mainly compiling their feats and abilities so all that would need to be hopefully done is getting an accepted tier and speed for them.
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that's fair. i didn't really want to separate regular anby and S0 as separate keys because i didn't think they were different enough to warrant doing that but at least adding higher is fair, i can go back and do that later

not sure if it'd be fine to post it now or not, but if everything seems fine to everyone else i probably could just so we can officially have all the cunning hare pages up
 
updated list of feats that need to get checked/approved since naito made a couple new ones

The Dead End Butcher Swings a Giant Mace (Class M)
Pompey Swings his Bike Around (9-B)
Qingyi Stops a Car (9-B, Subsonic)
Ben's Battering Ram (9-B, Class 5)
Rampart Brute's Reinforced Bat Swing (9-B, Class M)
Guardian Mech Aerial Deployment (9-B+)
Yanagi Hits the Ground Really Fast (9-B to 9-A, possibly up to low 7-C)
Lighter Punches the Ground Really Hard (Up to 9-A)
Dead End Butcher's Giant Mace Swing (9-A, Class M)
Bringer's Massive Hand/Sword (Class 100, 9-A to 8-C)
Miyabi's Ship Cutting (High 8-C)
Miyabi's Water Freezing (8-A)
Yixuan Clears Clouds with her Ultimate (7-C, Hypersonic - Hypersonic+)
Tank Shell Deflecting (Hypersonic)
Characters Deflecting Bullets (Hypersonic+, up to High Hypersonic)

15 calcs literally just sitting waiting to be looked at lmao, this stuff getting approved would probably make hypersonic a baseline for the verse, give a majority of the cast more concrete building level scaling, and give the top tiers as high as town level stuff
 
Played through 2.1 main story

Had a way smoother play through than 2.0 and overall really enjoyed the story more than the one before, I liked Alice, Yuzuha and especially our bro Manato.

Damian solidified himself as my favorite character thus far in season 2, the dude is capable of looking like a ruthless main antagonist in that scene where he threatened Alice to attend the investigation but then he still is an important ally and he even grows to respect Alice, not even taking it personally as she tricked him in their deal.
His final scene in this chapter just adds to my hope he’ll become a Agent, like he’ll get tired of the Exaltists crap so much that he personally enters the fight against them himself alongside that Thiren we see him with in the Season 2 PV.

Isolde is another character that caught me off guard as she wasn’t in the PV, genuinely thought she’d get the Pompey treatment if she wasn’t a surprise villain but we’ll be getting more of her so I wonder if she’ll be a playable agent.

I’m surprised we dealt with the Miasmic Fiend in this update after its creation in finale scene of 2.0, thought it’d be more important but from the story and its lore, it was just an expendable pawn for whatever the Exaltists are planning.
We also learned apparently some Exaltists that are against turning unwilling people and even hated the evil doctor for that alleviating water plan, I’m guessing we’ll eventually get a group of Exaltists that work against the rest of the cults vile methods.

Feat wise, Manato (while heavily injured), Alice and Yuzuha defeated a Sacrifice and earlier held their own against the Miasma Fiend.
The Sacrifice could possibly scale above Lycaon as iirc in the epilogue (a) chapter he expressed that they’d (Himself, Vivian, Hugo and S0 Anby) would be in trouble if the Sacrifice they found awakened but not too sure how to treat the Miasma Fiend as Yixuan didn’t immediately stomp it after getting rid of its healing ability but maybe we could say she wasn’t going all out due to facing it weighed on her emotions while the Miasma Fiend itself only proved a unstoppable threat to weaker characters than her due to its healing ability, the Spook Shack gang holding their own and even forcing it to heal while Yuzuha on her own guarded against its assault for a while.
 
Infinity_Dragon said:
Played through 2.1 main story

Had a way smoother play through than 2.0 and overall really enjoyed the story more than the one before, I liked Alice, Yuzuha and especially our bro Manato.

Damian solidified himself as my favorite character thus far in season 2, the dude is capable of looking like a ruthless main antagonist in that scene where he threatened Alice to attend the investigation but then he still is an important ally and he even grows to respect Alice, not even taking it personally as she tricked him in their deal.
His final scene in this chapter just adds to my hope he’ll become a Agent, like he’ll get tired of the Exaltists crap so much that he personally enters the fight against them himself alongside that Thiren we see him with in the Season 2 PV.

Isolde is another character that caught me off guard as she wasn’t in the PV, genuinely thought she’d get the Pompey treatment if she wasn’t a surprise villain but we’ll be getting more of her so I wonder if she’ll be a playable agent.

I’m surprised we dealt with the Miasmic Fiend in this update after its creation in finale scene of 2.0, thought it’d be more important but from the story and its lore, it was just an expendable pawn for whatever the Exaltists are planning.
We also learned apparently some Exaltists that are against turning unwilling people and even hated the evil doctor for that alleviating water plan, I’m guessing we’ll eventually get a group of Exaltists that work against the rest of the cults vile methods.

Feat wise, Manato (while heavily injured), Alice and Yuzuha defeated a Sacrifice and earlier held their own against the Miasma Fiend.
The Sacrifice could possibly scale above Lycaon as iirc in the epilogue (a) chapter he expressed that they’d (Himself, Vivian, Hugo and S0 Anby) would be in trouble if the Sacrifice they found awakened but not too sure how to treat the Miasma Fiend as Yixuan didn’t immediately stomp it after getting rid of its healing ability but maybe we could say she wasn’t going all out due to facing it weighed on her emotions while the Miasma Fiend itself only proved a unstoppable threat to weaker characters than her due to its healing ability, the Spook Shack gang holding their own and even forcing it to heal while Yuzuha on her own guarded against its assault for a while.
Click to expand...

yeah i reaaaally liked this chapter a lot. people have been really critical of ZZZ's story recently and especially 2.0, and despite me having enjoyed all the stories up until now, this one really feels as if the team as found it's footing again in regards to storytelling which is really nice. really liked alice and yuzuha's dynamic and how their pasts interconnected with alice's dad being the one to save her life. i also love some of the foreshadowing and callbacks in the chapter like alice's story about being the "princess of a dragon palace" foreshadowing her backstory and the scene with alice and yuzuha in the sewer mirroring yuzuha and alice's dad, down to alice even saying the whole "you'll be out in twenty minutes tops" thing that her dad did. and yeah, manato acting as essentially the straight man of the group was also really funny

i also really loved both damian and isolde this chapter. damian has been shaping up to be a really interesting character, and i love the idea of a more morally gray character that seems solely motivated by whatever benefits him most. meanwhile, i was 100% expecting isolde to get either the pompey treatment or be an antagonist turned ethereal, and i'm really glad neither was the case. her design is super pretty and it seems like she'll have more plot importance later on so i really hope she'll be playable at some point in the future. we also got a bit more info on ye shiyuan, who has a sister that's also a disciple of yunkui summit. she's supposedly the one that was teased at the very end of the 2.0 character trailer, and from what i've heard she's expected to be this season's void hunter, so definitely interested in seeing her

i was also expecting the miasmic fiend that resembled yixuan's sister to be way more important plot wise than it actually was. definitely seemed like it was something that could have been an overarching plot point. i felt a tad bit disappointed when it was defeated at the end of the chapter, but the chapter was already super jam packed with content as is and i do like yixuan's dialogue about letting go of her past regrets and moving forward, so i can't complain too much.

feats wise, though it's not a direct feat, there was a dialogue from pan yinhu i thought was interesting where he mentioned that the amount of explosives ferox and his men brought into the hollow would've been enough to destroy "a hundred suiban temples" had it been detonated. the miasma fiend also tanked that point blank explosion yuzuha set off that was pretty decently sized. outside of that, the miasmic fiend seems really strong. it can heal itself with miasma it itself can generate, and it's healing can only get slowed down if it's core gets exposed
 
Sooshirohl said:
we also got a bit more info on ye shiyuan, who has a sister that's also a disciple of yunkui summit. she's supposedly the one that was teased at the very end of the 2.0 character trailer, and from what i've heard she's expected to be this season's void hunter, so definitely interested in seeing her
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I actually didn’t see that info yet personally but from I’ve heard was mentioned and that a behind the scenes talking on the next agents being worked on mentioned a Agent that uses a large sword that has yet to unleash its true potential and is said to be capable of mass destruction, the people I’ve heard that from think Ye Shiyuan’s sister is that Agent and her sword is the sealed Qingming Sword, if true then I’m assuming her part in the story will be unlocking the true potential of the Qingming Sword without it’s harmful effects and becoming a new Void Hunter.

It could also explain why Yixuan hasn’t accepted the title of Void Hunter, maybe she wants Shiyuan’s sister to become a Void Hunter so she could focus on Yunkui Summit.
 
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