Yu-Gi-Oh! Zexal Upgrade

[Zencha9]

simple crt really everyone that was High 4-C scaling off Dyson Sphere should be upgraded to 4-B via this Calc

 

[Zencha9]

bump

 

[Ionliosite]

Well, the calc got accepted, so I agree.

 

[Yar_R_agi_7k]

ı agree

 

[Star_King_Demon_Lord]

I agree

 

[Zencha9]

bump
i think it's okay to add this since it's pretty simple but i need more input just in case

 

[Imaginym]

Apologies if I'm being unpleasant with such input, but....
What's the evidence the Anime Dyson Sphere is big enough to contain a star? Wasn't it summoned in a stadium/arena in a Duel that took place in Earth? & what's the evidence that Zexal monsters, Dyson Sphere in this case, have "realness" to them?

Looking at the calc, it's apparently a copy-paste from Naruto Forums, & the NF's post's only touching on that topic is: "Of course this one was in virtual reality or something but every monster has a "real" counterpart in another dimension, or so I believe."
So that's another matter to be concerned with.

& part of the calc's premise is:
"This will be a rather complicated scaling. I'll start with the assumption that the star inside is the same size as Sol, as that's the type of star that wold generally be required for an actual Dyson shell."

But we can see Kite, a human nearby to Dyson Sphere within the VR, or at least, as a participant in the duel involving said Virtual Reality; If he's at any recognizable size compared to Number 9: Dyson Sphere, no way is it big enough to be containing a star inside of it, let alone if this duel is happening on Earth!
So that's an issue with the premise of the calc that's the basis for this upgrade, seems like.


I'm aware Numbers are exceptional & more powerful than regular cards, but scans to make the exact details of their greater power or realness (if applicable) would be much appreciated.

Also, there's this:
"A sphere with the same volume would have a radius of 18,429,609.22 km. Going to the gravity calculator we get a surface gravity of 52.69 gs. Using the planetary parameters calculator the GBE is 1.505e46j, or 150.5 Foe."

I'm not sure if Dyson Sphere attacks using its gravitational binding energy.

 

[Zencha9]

What's the evidence the Anime Dyson Sphere is big enough to contain a star? Wasn't it summoned in a stadium/arena in a Duel that took place in Earth? & what's the evidence that Zexal monsters, Dyson Sphere in this case, have "realness" to them

it doesn't matter where he's summoned because Numbers are real and are accepted as such also we clearly see dyson sphere engulfing the sun and it was also stated to engulf the sun so there's literally no reason to assume that it's not a real sun

But we can see Kite, a human nearby to Dyson Sphere within the VR, or at least, as a participant in the duel involving said Virtual Reality; If he's at any recognizable size compared to Number 9: Dyson Sphere, no way is it big enough to be containing a star inside of it, let alone if this duel is happening on Earth!
So that's an issue with the premise of the calc that's the basis for this upgrade, seems like.

it doesn't matter numbers are real the sun inside him is real the field doesn't matter
also crest users have barian powers

I'm not sure if Dyson Sphere attacks using its gravitational binding energy.

i'm pretty sure it's due to how Dyson spheres work

 

[Imaginym]

it doesn't matter where he's summoned because Numbers are real and are accepted as such also we clearly see dyson sphere engulfing the sun and it was also stated to engulf the sun so there's literally no reason to assume that it's not a real sun

You say "we clearly see it engulfing the sun", but I can't find a link to footage in that calculation blog to verify that. Would you be willing to direct me to the episode, please?
In part because being capable of engulfing the sun does not mean it did so; If it engulfed a sun in the arena big enough to fit on Earth, that's an extremely small sun.

While I appreciate that Number 9: Dyson Sphere has a statement to help its credibility, I find myself a little frustrated by your response. Quoting us, in part, but word for word for those parts:
Imaginym: "& what's the evidence that Zexal monsters, Dyson Sphere in this case, have "realness" to them?"
Zencha9: "it doesn't matter where he's summoned because Numbers are real and are accepted as such"

I'm sorry if I'm acting out of place, by asking for such, but I'd greatly appreciate it if you please cited a CRT or blog or such where it was made clear what accepted evidence is the basis for the "realness" of Numbers.

it doesn't matter numbers are real the sun inside him is real the field doesn't matter
also crest users have barian powers

I apologize, but I'm not sure what Barian Powers are, thus, I don't understand the relevance. Would you be willing to clarify, please?

i'm pretty sure it's due to how Dyson spheres work

Not my point. (Though, from what I understand, Dyson Spheres use orbiting parts to gather energy from the star they surround, & use that to power things.)

My point is that this:
"A sphere with the same volume would have a radius of 18,429,609.22 km. Going to the gravity calculator we get a surface gravity of 52.69 gs. Using the planetary parameters calculator the GBE is 1.505e46j, or 150.5 Foe."

Is apparently a calculation of Gravitational Binding Energy. Which confuses me why that seems to be being used for Dyson Sphere's AP. I don't think it uses its gravity to perform its attacks.

 

[Zencha9]

You say "we clearly see it engulfing the sun", but I can't find a link to footage in that calculation blog to verify that. Would you be willing to direct me to the episode, please?
In part because being capable of engulfing the sun does not mean it did so; If it engulfed a sun in the arena big enough to fit on Earth, that's an extremely small sun.

While I appreciate that Number 9: Dyson Sphere has a statement to help its credibility, I find myself a little frustrated by your response. Quoting us, in part, but word for word for those parts:
Imaginym: "& what's the evidence that Zexal monsters, Dyson Sphere in this case, have "realness" to them?"
Zencha9: "it doesn't matter where he's summoned because Numbers are real and are accepted as such"

I'm sorry if I'm acting out of place, by asking for such, but I'd greatly appreciate it if you please cited a CRT or blog or such where it was made clear what accepted evidence is the basis for the "realness" of Numbers.

oh you mean the calc ? i assumed you already watched the show okay then

Dyson Sphere englufing the sun

Dyson Sphere covering the sun

this is chaos Dyson Sphere's xyz unit
as you can see dyson sphree doesn't get summoned on earth and i have no idea where that came from just because it's VR
it's always outside earth/covering earth

I'm sorry if I'm acting out of place, by asking for such, but I'd greatly appreciate it if you please cited a CRT or blog or such where it was made clear what accepted evidence is the basis for the "realness" of Numbers.

yes it was discussed here and agreed upon due to don thousand and other characters affecting the real world

I apologize, but I'm not sure what Barian Powers are, thus, I don't understand the relevance. Would you be willing to clarify, please?

crest users use Barian magic to make the duels real

Is apparently a calculation of Gravitational Binding Energy. Which confuses me why that seems to be being used for Dyson Sphere's AP. I don't think it uses its gravity to perform its attacks.

i'm not a math guy but it was rated high 4-C before because of it's size
this calc is about calcing Dyson Sphere's size and the result is 4-B

 

[Imaginym]

oh you mean the calc ? i assumed you already watched the show okay then

Dyson Sphere englufing the sun

Dyson Sphere covering the sun

this is chaos Dyson Sphere's xyz unit
as you can see dyson sphree doesn't get summoned on earth and i have no idea where that came from just because it's VR
it's always outside earth/covering earth

yes it was discussed here and agreed upon due to don thousand and other characters affecting the real world

crest users use Barian magic to make the duels real

I appreciate the clarifying screenshots, especially in the fairly understandable absence of an episode link.

i'm not a math guy but it was rated high 4-C before because of it's size
this calc is about calcing Dyson Sphere's size and the result is 4-B

Yes, but why assume it uses size for attack potency? How does it attack within the show? I'd assume it doesn't ram opposing monsters.

 

[Zencha9]

Yes, but why assume it uses size for attack potency? How does it attack within the show? I'd assume it doesn't ram opposing monsters.

i'm not really sure i thought it is a thing Dyson Spheres do. his attacks is alot lasers coming from it's body or something

 

[Imaginym]

i'm not really sure i thought it is a thing Dyson Spheres do. his attacks is alot lasers coming from it's body or something

Well, I think it seems strange to use AP via Size when Dyson Sphere doesn't apparently use its size to attack..

 

[Zencha9]

Well, I think it seems strange to use AP via Size when Dyson Sphere doesn't apparently use its size to attack..

doesn't really matter because every number and his mother already scales and can destroy Dyson Sphere because it's just a regular number

 

[Imaginym]

doesn't really matter because every number and his mother already scales and can destroy Dyson Sphere because it's just a regular number

So their scaling is based on them destroying something with Number 9': Dyson Sphere's GBE?

 

[Zencha9]

So their scaling is based on them destroying something with Number 9': Dyson Sphere's GBE?

yee

 

[Imaginym]

Then currently, I do not think I have any other concerns with this revision currently.
Although, given you saying:

bump
i think it's okay to add this since it's pretty simple but i need more input just in case

I'd assume you need more input, since, AFAIK, I'm the only one talking about this (Besides you.) since your post.
(Plus, as may have already been inferred, I'm not the most experienced with Zexal.)

I think it may be possible that users such as WeeklyBattles, ProfessorKukui4Life, &/or SomebodyData be contacted, due to them often seeming knowledgeable. Plus, given that some of them are Staff & there hasn't been much Staff input, we probably do want more input, from Staff, especially.

Sorry for any bother &/or unpleasantness.

 

[Zencha9]

k

 

[SomebodyData]

The KE rules have changed since then (Rather big changes too, gonna have to help with Godzilla tomorrow for example as most of the calcs got destroyed), though we probably shouldn't have been using GBE as a replacement to begin with.

 

[Zencha9]

so what's the conclusion? because i already applied the changes

 

[SomebodyData]

Unfortunately, the feat itself can't be used via current wiki standards. We probably have to find a new feat for Zexal in general, since going off what DMB stated, the next feat they have is 9-A.

Though looking at the pages in general, they seem rather outdated. The 3-C feat for example is 4-A; the effects being legit in Zexal is probably going to be removed now that better scans and such of Zexal have revealed that alternative dimensions do affect the duel mechanics in that series.

 

[Zencha9]

i remember Vector creating a black hole and it was calced at high 4-C also why is the feat unusable? it just calcs it's size
if the calc is really that ffy then it should at least be high 4-C due to dyson sphere engulfing the sun

i dunno but the feat itself is quite outdated because it assumes the astral world is just a galaxy and i have other statments of astral world being a universe
also how do alternate dimensions effect duel mechanics?

 

[SomebodyData]

We've had issues with black holes in the past, although if you can calculate it's size, our standards could guesstimate where the black hole feat would land.

Well like I said, the KE standards are a bit stricter now, size alone isn't enough unless Dyson's main attack is ramming.

Well, if you'd like to present them that's fine. The issue is that with the astral and barian worlds is that they're also compared to the Earth and galaxy repeatedly, hence why we went with the mid-end.

Astral World causes dueling to become painful, Shadow Duels also exist with similar rules in an alt. dimension, and within the Barian Sphere Cubes.

 

[Zencha9]

just saying that in zexal they never talk about earth or the galaxy they always use human world
"sekai"

 

[Zencha9]

finally im done eating
1-wow i couldn't find the calc i swore it was CSAP
2-i mean wouldn't destroying Dyson sphere give the same result ?
3-yeah i have some

also yeah even in the end of zexal 2 they refer to the astral barian and human universes as worlds, "sekai" and sekai has 3 meanings either earth universe or society we know the yellow thing that's suppoused to be the human world is neither a planet nor a society so i'm pretty sure theat the most logical conclusion is to say that the "human world" is a universe also the hole parallel world stuff kinda supports it being the case
4-yeah that does not really mean much when there's multiple times when characters get beaten up in duels inside the human world with no barian Spheres nor magic stuff

 

[Imaginym]

Well like I said, the KE standards are a bit stricter now, size alone isn't enough unless Dyson's main attack is ramming.

Does it matter that other monsters are capable of destroying something of Number 9: Dyson Sphere's calculated size/GBE?

 

[SomebodyData]

It matters how Dyson was destroyed. For example destroying the machine wouldn't get you the GBE rating, and depending on how the machine was destroyed comes the rating.

We know its a different dimension / universe, its the size that was up to debate.

Yeah, but the issue was the card effects, not them getting hurt. Hence why I agree with them having ratings.

 

[Zencha9]

that's true
well i think i brought up enough evidence to suggest that the human world is undoubtedly univrsal in size. but eh probably for another day
i mean none of these make card effects real tho except only shadow games so i don't see the problem really