What Abilities Would this Qualify for?

[IDK3465]

Explanation lasts from tmestamp to 30:07

I thought this should grant AE Type 2 for epithets, magic, and anything made by them, but when I asked Agnaa about it, they apparently said that it didn’t count, so I wanted some clarification on if and why that is as well as what abilities this does grant.

 

[IDK3465]

Bump

 

[Astral_Trinity439]

Explanation lasts from tmestamp to 30:07

I thought this should grant AE Type 2 for epithets, magic, and anything made by them, but when I asked Agnaa about it, they apparently said that it didn’t count, so I wanted some clarification on if and why that is as well as what abilities this does grant.

Seems like these Epithets are Concepts of Elements from the physical World that themselves exist in The Ether
When the belief of them increases to a certain level/language spreads, they are able to manifest in physical reality as abilities that allow a person to access their respective element freely
That would more or less be AE1, not Type 2, for Epithets in their conceptual form
As for which type of concept, its either Type 2 or Type 3, though the fact that the Epithet of Fire can bring out any fire out there seems more like type 2

For manifested epithets, they would just have the ability to manipulate any object that falls under the concept that is their true form; It is not direct conceptual manipulation, but more or less subjective reality instead.

However, for AE2, because their original form is not granting their manifested form any immortality or regeneration, they cannot be so via that. They also cannot be so via the other method of having control over the concept as that is not the case here

 

[IDK3465]

Seems like these Epithets are Concepts of Elements from the physical World that themselves exist in The Ether
When the belief of them increases to a certain level/language spreads, they are able to manifest in physical reality as abilities that allow a person to access their respective element freely
That would more or less be AE1, not Type 2, for Epithets in their conceptual form
As for which type of concept, its either Type 2 or Type 3, though the fact that the Epithet of Fire can bring out any fire out there seems more like type 2

Yeah, I generally agree with you on this. Although Agnaa said they should be type 1 concepts, I disagree with that, considering how new words are very clearly shown to be created, changed, and fizzled out over time, depending on how and if people actually use them.

For manifested epithets, they would just have the ability to manipulate any object that falls under the concept that is their true form; It is not direct conceptual manipulation, but more or less subjective reality instead.

I also agree with that, but that makes me ask: if something can take away/give people epithets, would that count as concept manip or not? (i.e. the concept itself isn't changed, just what it governs and is connected to is)

However, for AE2, because their original form is not granting their manifested form any immortality or regeneration, they cannot be so via that. They also cannot be so via the other method of having control over the concept as that is not the case here

The main reason why I thought they should get AE2 is that, as long as the conceptual idea of something exists within an inscribed/magic user, it can always be manifested into reality by them, making their creations immortal in a way. Though I can see why you won't think so, it isn't just reliant on the concept of it existing but also on someone being able to bring that concept into reality.

 

[Astral_Trinity439]

Yeah, I generally agree with you on this. Although Agnaa said they should be type 1 concepts, I disagree with that, considering how new words are very clearly shown to be created, changed, and fizzled out over time, depending on how and if people actually use them.

WeII, that depends on how the verse defines the term word; If is something that is destroyed/becomes nuII when the peopIe speaking it disappears, that is indeed Concept type 2 in that case
But if its so that even if the peopIe speaking them die, words aIready spoken are kept reaIized and the peopIe;s death/destruction does not effect the epithets, then it can be type 1 as weII
The fact that they exist in some other reaIm caIIed Ether aIso supports the idea that the physicaI worId;s destruction wouId not effect them; AIthough if that is not the case, then we have type 2 for them

I also agree with that, but that makes me ask: if something can take away/give people epithets, would that count as concept manip or not? (i.e. the concept itself isn't changed, just what it governs and is connected to is)

By giving epithets, you are referring to the abiIity to controI them, right?
Then no, not inherentIy, it wouId just be Power bestowaI

The main reason why I thought they should get AE2 is that, as long as the conceptual idea of something exists within an inscribed/magic user, it can always be manifested into reality by them, making their creations immortal in a way. Though I can see why you won't think so, it isn't just reliant on the concept of it existing but also on someone being able to bring that concept into reality.

Indeed; AIso, If it were to be type 2, it wouId be more so that the aIready manifested object can regenerate itseIf even if it is destroyed, though, I suppose re-manifesting themseIves is aIso appIicabIe, but that wouId onIy be vaIid if they were doing it by themseIves, not via the magic/epithet user re-manifesting them

Its same as how most magic in fiction that derives its powers from concepts is not AE2 because it cannot regenerate by itseIf just by the fact that it embodies a concept and rather needs the user's mana to re-manifest/regenerate