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always been a big Transformers fan and have read/watched it casually. Forgive my noobness, but is everything one timeline now? pretty sure I read that somewhere, but i cant find the source anymore.
Powerscaling related^^ .... its s pretty funny when you read that Transformers characters are just "planet guys" when you have stuff like this:
Primus and Unicron existed before space/time was a thing and survived the Big Bang, and their battle caused a bunch of other cool things to happen
always been a big Transformers fan and have read/watched it casually. Forgive my noobness, but is everything one timeline now? pretty sure I read that somewhere, but i cant find the source anymore.
That isn't true at all and as far as I know has never been stated. The Yolopark Cliffjumper figure from last year came with an official comic that brought us new Universal Stream designations for the first time in 10 years, Earth Wars is still doing multiversal/omniversal nonsense, Ichikawa when he does bios still includes multiversal stuff in it. TF has been very lore-lite since Funpub ended but they haven't done anything to indicate timelines all merged. The leaked Binder of Revelation outlined a single universe combining elements from many different continuities, but it's both unpublished and just meant as an internal guide, we haven't had any stories published that follow it to the letter.
Anyways no, the parallel universes are more or less the same. The Shroud happened, but then multiversal stuff has kept on happening Post Shroud, so even that isn't a very 'clean' status quo reset at all.
I do find it interesting that essentially from a corporate POV they still place Primus/Unicron before space/time/the big bang, as in canon there's a lot of conflicting information on that (although generally speaking them predating it is more backed up by evidence)
I had a few problems, mainly just how the weight of Cybertronians is calculated, they are not 100% metal.
I would also like to see the sandbox for Skybound, I'm really enjoying it and I want to have a small peak at it, see if I agree with some ratings or not
I had a few problems, mainly just how the weight of Cybertronians is calculated, they are not 100% metal.
I would also like to see the sandbox for Skybound, I'm really enjoying it and I want to have a small peak at it, see if I agree with some ratings or not
Jetfire has practically no other methods of triggering the Earthquake. He clearly says it was him who was responsible for it, and it's further stretch to assume he had done it otherwise.
Jetfire has practically no other methods of triggering the Earthquake. He clearly says it was him who was responsible for it, and it's further stretch to assume he had done it otherwise.
Megatron didn't tank his reentry, in fact, he didn't, Beachcomber also did not tank his reentry, only more proof the Tier 7 feat is not solid and, at most, an outlier
Megatron survived intact in one piece, a majority of the wounds we see on him came from his fight with Optimus in the ark plus Starscream blasting him out of the ark.
Megatron survived intact in one piece, a majority of the wounds we see on him came from his fight with Optimus in the ark plus Starscream blasting him out of the ark.
Megatron's conscious faded before he even hit Earth, on top of that, we have Optimus thinking he would die when re-entering Earth's Atmosphere, Megatron was unconscious for 4 million years and was only reactivated by the GI Joe characters resurrecting him, he can't scale to any re-entry feats if someone he should logically scale to, thought he would die with the same feat
His consciousness faded before he even enter Earth's atmosphere. Him fading was a result of wounds Optimus and Starscream inflicted on him, not the actual fall.
Optimus not thinking he would survive isn't exactly too consistent either when 1. We don't see the actual impact and 2. guys like Hound, Bulkhead and Mirage have survived their falls albeit it did leave them unconscious. Either out of a lack of energy or the fall itself we don't know, but in the case of Hound, we've been shown he got onto Earth fully intact and not much damage.
It's also important to note Hound was far separated by the other Autobots so you can't even argue he repaired himself.
If anything, they should at least downscale from their re-entry value.
His consciousness faded before he even enter Earth's atmosphere. Him fading was a result of wounds Optimus and Starscream inflicted on him, not the actual fall.
Optimus not thinking he would survive isn't exactly too consistent either when 1. We don't see the actual impact and 2. guys like Hound, Bulkhead and Mirage have survived their falls albeit it did leave them unconscious. Either out of a lack of energy or the fall itself we don't know, but in the case of Hound, we've been shown he got onto Earth fully intact and not much damage.
It's also important to note Hound was far separated by the other Autobots so you can't even argue he repaired himself.
If anything, they should at least downscale from their re-entry value.
Being knocked out doesn't mean they scale to it, in fact, it means the contrary. Hound was knocked out, Optimus believed he would die, Megatron was offline for millions of years, and we don't know if either Bulkhead or Mirage tanked their reentry.
We've seen that killing a Cybertronian is very hard, Bumblebee is not a full lost cause in Kirkman's run, Megatron implied that when eating Trailbreaker's spark is what gave him the final nail in the coffin
If anything, the Reentry stuff should not be used, because one character implied he would die, and others were knocked out
One more thing: There's nothing that implies either one of those "re-entry" feats have that speed at all, considering Optimus was going to die, it is safe to assume anybody else aboard the Ark would, so it is already another point against these feats being legitimate or consistant
We've seen that killing a Cybertronian is very hard, Bumblebee is not a full lost cause in Kirkman's run, Megatron implied that when eating Trailbreaker's spark is what gave him the final nail in the coffin
Neither example is related because are examples of them being ripped apart and still being fine.
Hound did not sustain any physical damage, and awoke immediately after Jetfire activated his signal. That and Hound not having any means to heal himself, it's blatant clear he physically did not sustain damage from the fall.
We don't know whether or not Optimus would've been knocked out or no. Megatron getting KO'ed is because of the injuries purely by we know he blacked out right before he even entered the planet's atmosphere.
Hound did not sustain any physical damage, and awoke immediately after Jetfire activated his signal. That and Hound not having any means to heal himself, it's blatant clear he physically did not sustain damage from the fall.
The fact Optimus believed he would've died is another piece of evidence, there is no reason to doubt Optimus in this instance, why would Beachcomber even attempt to save Optimus if he could sustain said fall? This shouldn't be dismissed just because we did not see the final result, every hint implies he would've not make out of it.
We don't know whether or not Optimus would've been knocked out or no. Megatron getting KO'ed is because of the injuries purely by we know he blacked out right before he even entered the planet's atmosphere.
I'll once again, point out the fact we are not really sure if they even entered the planet at re-entry speed or not, there is no showing of them catching fire while falling like Optimus.
To summarize my problems with everything:
There is no proof Beachcomber attained the velocity stated, the Moon doesn't need that big of a speed to reach its surface.
Hound got knocked out, already disqualifies the feat, doesn't matter if he doesn't have visible injuries
Megatron did not tank his re-entry, there is no proof he wouldn't get knocked out like Hound did
On top of that, there is no proof they were going that fast to begin with because;
Optimus, while catching on fire, believed he would die, there is no reason to believe he was lying or wrong just because we did not see the result, Beachcomber wouldn't have tried to save him otherwise
You mentioned both Bulkhead and Mirage, both have injuries, and the argument they ran out of power doesn't work when Beachcomber was functional for millions of years without fuel, so the fall likely did that.
Megatron in his gun form, at the moment, likely the strongest weapon, has shown to create sizable explosions that I'm sure would not get that much higher then the re-entries vallues, and that can take out a limb from a combiner.
Lastly, weaker weaponry has been shown damaging Cybertronians, this one is not that important since this will always happen, but still worth noting.
Like I said, I haven't calculated everything, but outside one or two things that doesn't scale to anybody, I doubt anything will get as close to the first 3 calcs. There are some things that we can likely use to scale Cliffjumper, Beachcomber and the weakest members to it, as they are weaker then the other bots.
There is also 1 or 2 more Class M feats that I can calculate it, further putting it as the most consistant thing about Skybound so far. There is an argument to scale Optimus and Megatron to the Combiners, but I think, so far, we should use Starscream's feats instead and say they upscale from it until I can get a vallue for them
Class M is more consistant, and not only is that vallue close to the Megatron one, it is also, currently, the biggest Class M feat so far. The 8-B feat does not scale to anybody while Devastator punching the ground is only a bit feat since he should logically scale to the High 8-C feat
There is only a few more feats left, I might check out Void Rivals to see if Hot Rod or Springer do anything there, but so far, I'll focus on the actual Transformers book.
I'll then ping relevant people to discuss about it if they not engage these before as I feel like other people's opinion is important
I don't know if Cliff has better feats, he's likely about the same as Beachcomber who was defeated by Starscream's guns quite easily, so neither he or Cliff scale to them, or perhaps only their guns would scale. Although looking back they likely scale to Rumble who tore a piece of Astrotrain, hard to say, I'll sit on this thought for a bit
I should have more time tomorrow to calculate everything I need, including a LS calc for Beachcomber, despite it being hard to make out the full size of the debris. I suppose I'll go ahead and repost every other calc for this so far, the ones I agree with and the ones I disagree with, anyone who wishes to talk about Skybound is free and encouraged to do so, I want everybody to have a say on this
Not every calc is done, but I hope to do some things, maybe get Beachcomber and Cliffjumper a higher tier then 9-B+, there is also the fact Beachcomber is weaker in terms of LS, there is a feat I can calculate for him and the smaller bots.
In my opinion, I believe the most accurate rating would be the 8-C stuff for normal bots, High 8-C for Combiners. Optimus, Shredhead and Megatron scale higher then the 8-Cs, as Megatron manhandles both Starscream and Astrotrain, who have those calcs. There is an argument for them to be High 8-C via scaling to the Combiners, I don't know about that but I'm willing to discuss that.
I believe that is more accurate then the re-entry stuff since the bots got knocked out by those feats, we have no way to prove they were going that fast, and the fact Optimus thought he would die in the same situation.
I'm going to sleep now, feel free to engage in any discussion regarding the scaling of this series, hopefully I'll finish the calcs by tomorrow to ping peeps to talk about the subject which seems to be controversial
Ok, I'll try it a bit more since I won't be doing anymore calcs for the main Transformers book, maybe Void Rivals but I would need to start reading it, same for hound in GI Joe, and I'll tag both @Emirp sumitpo and @Dark-Carioca as they were both ones that seemed to have interest in the Skybound books, but I'll once again, welcome anybody who wants to talk about it, here's what we are dealing in terms of calcs I've made thus far:
Most bots, which include: All the Seekers, Astrotrain, Arcee, Elita-1, Jazz, Cliffjumper, Trailbreaker and Rumble, will scale to either Starscream's feat, or Astrotrain's feat.
Reason being there is an argument for Astrotrain's feat to be above his level, as he was in the ground, but there is also the argument that Megatron already had him in the ropes in the first place. I'm leaning more to Astrotrain's, but I wouldn't mind if it was Starscream's. Cliffjumper and Rumble have each shown feats that put them at this level as well, such as Rumble hurting Astrotrain and Cliffjumper battling Starscream for a short amount of time. This does not include Beachcomber
Stronger bots, such as Ultra Magnus, Arcee Magnus, Shockwave and Soundwave, will be "At least 8-C, likely higher" because they are clearly stronger then the previous bots. There might be a few bots I'm missing but those 4 are the main ones
The Combiners, Megatron, Optimus Prime and Shredhead: Will be High 8-C via scaling from the Combiner calc. Both Optimus and Megatron can hurt them significantly, Megatron's punch straight up decombined Devastator and sent him flying, Optimus scales to him and also hurt Devastator with his kicks and Megatron's fusion cannon while Shredhead is clearly on their level. Those 3 would be the only one in this rating
Here's what I want to propose for LS
Basically everyone but the small bots (That includes Cliff, Beachcomber and Rumble) will scale to the Constructicons' Class M feat, Cliff and the small bots will scale to the Class 100 feat while Optimus, Megatron and Shredhead will both scale to the higher-end Class M feats (Optimus ripping Devastator's finger and Megatron tearing Trailbreaker in half)
Here's what I want to propose for Speed
This one is the least complicated, they will scale to Arcee's Subsonic+ feat movement wise and will scale their reaction and combat speed to Ulchtar, Genvo and Jetfire's feat, while the ones with flying modes will all have their speed scaled to those 3's feats.
That's all, any comment, disagreement or questions can all be done and I'll try to tackle them as much as I can. I still believe we should not use the Re-entry feats due to a lot of problems with it, but if people still want to comment about it I'll debate it no problem
That's all, any comment, disagreement or questions can all be done and I'll try to tackle them as much as I can. I still believe we should not use the Re-entry feats due to a lot of problems with it, but if people still want to comment about it I'll debate it no problem
Void Rivals also has a lot of skill feats that I wonder if it can be scaled back to Cybertronians, considering Springer matched the character doing said skill feats
Finished the 26 issues available from Void Rivals, it is pretty great and I recommend it to people. Because it is the nature of this site, there are no feats for anyone there, maximum you could get is 9-B, but most of them would directly scale to Cybertronians anyway. The best thing realting to this site are the skill feats, the TF books lacked them, but now that Springer battled someone that has a big skill showing (Proximus skill stomped approximatelly 100 highly skilled soldiers, who are all comparable to him in terms of stats)
Springer and Hot Rod are coming back to Cybertron in the latest arc, Kirkman is writting both books, so maybe a "crossover" will happen, the book feels like it is approaching an ending, and I highly recommended, it is a great Comic Book, Darak and Solila are great protagonists, the supporting characters are great, and the Transformers references are very neat.
Edit: It took some money out of my wallet, so I'll likely only grab the GI Joe portion of the Energon Universe in one or two months
Void Rivals also has a lot of skill feats that I wonder if it can be scaled back to Cybertronians, considering Springer matched the character doing said skill feats
Likely Optimus, Megatron and Shredhead >= Springer/Average Cybertronian Warrior >= Zerta Trion, Upgraded Solila and Proximus >(Skill stomp) About 100 trained warriors = Solila (Individually) = Skuxxoid (Won a battle against at least 11 of his clones, who should have some amount of training)
Profiles for Springer, Solila, Proximus and Skuxxoid likely would need to be made, their stats are not hard to guess, considering Proximus fought Springer, they would scale directly to Cybertronians
