The X-Verse (Official Sonic.exe) CRT

[Da3ggman]

I don't take anything personally here if you're wondering. It's a forum designed after arguments.

Gotcha, then all is well; I'll amend my post accordingly.

 

[TheShape03]

I thought I'd already responded to this thread, I guess I forgot.

Definitely disagree with this. It’s far more likely that Raven just…doesn’t know how powerful Sonic IDW characters are

That's irrelevant. 90% of a character's creators aren't familiar with power scaling, and we don't judge a character's power based on the knowledge of their owners but rather by feats or the way they're portrayed in the work. If a character destroys a planet and an author says "this other character is stronger than him" it can be intuited that the second character could also do so since he's represented as stronger.

Under your logic we would have to downgrade 90% of fiction to "Unknown" because it cannot be proven that their creators have the knowledge or believe they can reach the power measured here.

So, you can't just put the owner's powerscaling knowledge above everything else unless you want to downgrade almost all fiction to Unknown Tier.

Not necessarily.

Considering the current state of your sandbox, I'm going to assume you already agree with me. Since you merged everything into one key.

Joe has also changed up things in the past when he stated that 2011 X didn't have a faker form, only for it to be revealed months later that he actually does have one.

That's called a retcon.

I also forgot to mention this, but this is more of a 3-A feat ("destroy everything in his current reality") rather than a Low 2-C one

Fair enough, I could have sworn the tweet said "his entire current reality" xd. Okay, so there's a low ball for the 2011 and Mortis (Full Power) Tiers; 3-A.

We are still arguing about Low 2-C Lord X and you're bringing in statements from Raven, who has no say on his scaling because she does not own the character.

The X-Verse is a single continuity with multiple owners, it is impossible for the statements of a single owner not to affect other characters.

- Whatever Raven says will affect 2011 because EXE exists in the same continuity as 2011.

- What GEAR says about the verse, whether it is about Mortis or not, will affect 2011 because the latter is a counterpart to Mortis.

- ASTRA's statement affects 2011 and 2017 directly.

These are just examples, it is inevitable that data given by a single owner will affect the rest of the characters due to the nature of the verse where they all co-exist in the same dimension or in separate dimensions that are parallel to each other and equal cosmologically speaking.

That's not counting a multitude of other details, such as Joe sharing Raven's post without contradicting her, that she has worked on official works about 2011 before, and to top it off she has already demonstrated that she has the power to decide what is canon and what is not as shown by her statement in X's Lament.

You simply cannot say that Raven has no power when all of these characters exist in the same universe that is being built by all of these people equally.

Not to mention that you are committing a double standard.

• You are taking into account GEAR-O-SHIFT's statement for 2011 as well, when according to you, GEAR would not have the power for their statements to affect 2011.
• You are taking into account ASTRA's statement, even though it affects other .exes that are not Xen.

EDIT: I forgot to mention, but Raven considers EXE superior to Sonic, so EXE would be 2-C anyway.

it breaks the page rule on cross-fanverse scaling because not only is X's cosmology completely different than Game Sonic's, the IDW cast is currently 2-C while Lord X would cap around High 3-A/Low 2-C.

I answered that here.

About VOID Energy:

- X got all his powers because of what he is, so it's safe to assume that other VOID Energy entities would have his same abilities, obviously at a much lower level and range.

 

[OculoOmnibus]

Considering the current state of your sandbox, I'm going to assume you already agree with me. Since you merged everything into one key.

The vote outnumbered mine, so I abided by it and went to apply the changes.

That's irrelevant. 90% of a character's creators aren't familiar with power scaling, and we don't judge a character's power based on the knowledge of their owners but rather by feats or the way they're portrayed in the work. If a character destroys a planet and an author says "this other character is stronger than him" it can be intuited that the second character could also do so since he's represented as stronger.

Under your logic we would have to downgrade 90% of fiction to "Unknown" because it cannot be proven that their creators have the knowledge or believe they can reach the power measured here.

So, you can't just put the owner's powerscaling knowledge above everything else unless you want to downgrade almost all fiction to Unknown Tier.

This logic is indeed correct, but under this specific circumstance it just does not work. It's another author comparing their character to one from another unrelated series with entirely different scaling chains and cosmologies. This logic only works for characters in the same series, not characters cross-verse.

The wikis have also had several instances of DotA applied to works provided by the same author as well. Mob and Tatsumaki, both characters written by ONE and having specific statements regarding one's strength over another, are not scaled the same. The wiki did not accept Solaris being stronger than The End despite the fact that Ian Flynn, who wrote the script and dialogue for Sonic Frontiers, clarified that The End was weaker in a BumbleKast episode and that it's statement did not include the former.

What you said is true when doing in-verse scaling, but since X does not have a 2-C feat, is not an actual Sonic character, is not in the actual Game Sonic verse, and does not have a continuity of events that follow similarly to the timeline of Game Sonic with it being an entirely separate series (Page Rule #10 for FCOC), it wouldn't be accepted either way even if Raven was a full WoG for Lord X.

 

[TheShape03]

This logic is indeed correct, but under this specific circumstance it just does not work. It's another author comparing their character to one from another unrelated series with entirely different scaling chains and cosmologies. This logic only works for characters in the same series, not characters cross-verse.

According to what?

Mob and Tatsumaki, both characters written by ONE and having specific statements regarding one's strength over another, are not scaled the same.

I'm pretty sure it's because of how vague the statement is, he implies that she can beat him but not how.

If there's a way for her way to beat him that doesn't involve hax or something, then the statement should be taken into account.

The wiki did not accept Solaris being stronger than The End despite the fact that Ian Flynn, who wrote the script and dialogue for Sonic Frontiers, clarified that The End was weaker in a BumbleKast episode and that it's statement did not include the former.

That should definitely be taken into account here.

Unfortunately, those two examples you mentioned need to be discussed in a separate thread. They probably aren't taken into account because they contradict what's shown in the works. Although, the most likely reason they probably wouldn't take that into account is because the main wiki has strict rules about WoG (Which are terrible, I mean who has more power over a character and their stories? the one who created/owns them or a random powerscaler from the internet?).

 

[Da3ggman]

This logic is indeed correct, but under this specific circumstance it just does not work. It's another author comparing their character to one from another unrelated series with entirely different scaling chains and cosmologies. This logic only works for characters in the same series, not characters cross-verse.

The wikis have also had several instances of DotA applied to works provided by the same author as well. Mob and Tatsumaki, both characters written by ONE and having specific statements regarding one's strength over another, are not scaled the same. The wiki did not accept Solaris being stronger than The End despite the fact that Ian Flynn, who wrote the script and dialogue for Sonic Frontiers, clarified that The End was weaker in a BumbleKast episode and that it's statement did not include the former.

What you said is true when doing in-verse scaling, but since X does not have a 2-C feat, is not an actual Sonic character, is not in the actual Game Sonic verse, and does not have a continuity of events that follow similarly to the timeline of Game Sonic with it being an entirely separate series (Page Rule #10 for FCOC), it wouldn't be accepted either way even if Raven was a full WoG for Lord X.

Summed up my thoughts exactly, but way more concise and well put together; still count me as disagreeing with the 2-C.

 

[TheShape03]

What you said is true when doing in-verse scaling, but since X does not have a 2-C feat, is not an actual Sonic character, is not in the actual Game Sonic verse, and does not have a continuity of events that follow similarly to the timeline of Game Sonic with it being an entirely separate series (Page Rule #10 for FCOC), it wouldn't be accepted either way even if Raven was a full WoG for Lord X.

I forgot to answer this. As I mentioned before; Irrelevant, this is a hypothetical scenario, not a crossover. So technically it doesn't break the rule.

 

[OculoOmnibus]

Although, the most likely reason they probably wouldn't take that into account is because the main wiki has strict rules about WoG (Which are terrible, I mean who has more power over a character and their stories? the one who created/owns them or a random powerscaler from the internet?).

This is mostly due to the fact that many uses of "author statements" devolved into toxic users harassing authors and using social engineering to give questions that they would give specific responses to (to which most of the time for bigger franchises, are not native English speakers) in order to further their own agendas. It's a very bad practice that has garnered versus debating in general a poor reputation.

Plus there's the fact that VS Battles Wiki has a bad reputation when it comes to video game powerscaling as it turns into "hey this art book that's totally and completely affiliated with the developers of this game has a feat of this character destroying an super ultra dimension" rather than analyzing on-screen feats/statements and their context but we don't talk about this part and it's off-topic to the thread at hand.

I forgot to answer this. As I mentioned before; Irrelevant, this is a hypothetical scenario, not a crossover. So technically it doesn't break the rule.

It's still a cross-verse hypothetical scenario rather than an in-verse what-if since once again, Sonic doesn't exist and is completely fictional in X's verse. It's not something like the Nightmare Universe or Spirits of Hell where it's an actual Sonic fanfiction with the actual cast involved.

Summed up my thoughts exactly, but way more concise and well put together; still count me as disagreeing with the 2-C.

Lol watch as PC Port comes out in a day and Joe gives X his 2-C feats from JC's canon GGs.

 

[Da3ggman]

Lol watch as PC Port comes out in a day and Joe gives X his 2-C feats from JC's canon GGs.

---

Killing myself

 

[TheShape03]

This is mostly due to the fact that many uses of "author statements" devolved into toxic users harassing authors and using social engineering to give questions that they would give specific responses to (to which most of the time for bigger franchises, are not native English speakers) in order to further their own agendas. It's a very bad practice that has garnered versus debating in general a poor reputation.

In that case, to dismiss a statement by an author, it must be shown that it was made under those conditions. Otherwise, it must be accepted.

It's still a cross-verse hypothetical scenario rather than an in-verse what-if since once again, Sonic doesn't exist and is completely fictional in X's verse.

You still haven't explained why what you're saying undermines scaling.

Sonic's nonexistence in the X-Verse is irrelevant because Raven's statement is about a hypothetical scenario of what X would do if he existed in Sonic's world.

Sonic's verse doesn't need to exist in X's continuity for the two's power to be compared by someone. You keep saying "it's not valid because Sonic doesn't exist in that world" even though that aspect doesn't change anything Raven said.

Lol watch as PC Port comes out in a day and Joe gives X his 2-C feats from JC's canon GGs.

The demo came out 4 years ago, I don't think Joe is very interested in making the game.

 

[El_rapero_de_tf2]

It's still a cross-verse hypothetical scenario rather than an in-verse what-if since once again, Sonic doesn't exist and is completely fictional in X's verse. It's not something like the Nightmare Universe or Spirits of Hell where it's an actual Sonic fanfiction with the actual cast involved.

even that being the case, the statements speak directly about X's combative capabilities regardless of sonic's universe existing in x's universe or not, about feats that X could pull off

Lol watch as PC Port comes out in a day and Joe gives X his 2-C feats from JC's canon GGs.

at this point it's more likely for them to just release the two unnamed projects that occur before and after sonic 2011 :'v

 

[OculoOmnibus]

Adding this the new X profile:

• Stealth Mastery (Capable of ambushing)

I was thinking of Limited Resurrection as well since he moves souls in between different bodies, but I don't know the exacts for it and need to do some more research. There was also something about him being capable of performing a ritual that destroys EXE but I also can't find the source for it either.

 

[El_rapero_de_tf2]

body puppetry too(?

 

[OculoOmnibus]

body puppetry too(?

Considering he's also wearing a Sonic vessel like a skin suit, applying it seems fair.

Also Automatic Translation since he can completely understand EXE.

 

[TheShape03]

Since it's very likely that canon won't be removed from here, we can continue with the revision.

• I have responded to the issue of 2-C here.
• As I said here, the "VOID Energy" page must have all of Lord X's supernatural abilities. Since he has his abilities for what he is since he was born.
• Body Puppetry and Automatic Translation make sense to me, but not Stealth Mastery. X isn't being especially stealthy in the slightest, he just appears behind or in front of his victims by teleporting.

 

[OculoOmnibus]

• I have responded to the issue of 2-C here.

And I still disagree with it.

• As I said here, the "VOID Energy" page must have all of Lord X's supernatural abilities. Since he has his abilities for what he is since he was born.

I'm still new on how stuff applies to energy system pages. I've been mostly using the Ki Manipulation page as a template, but for VOID Energy, the EXE characters seems to be the only ones capable of extreme level reality warping (as far as I can tell) in canon, whereas other characters like the Guardians who simply use the energy aren't doing any of the stuff X can do.

Perhaps a "possible uses" section would be the way to go, or just a way of splitting more Advanced abilities from the basics.

• Body Puppetry and Automatic Translation make sense to me, but not Stealth Mastery. X isn't being especially stealthy in the slightest, he just appears behind or in front of his victims by teleporting.

Considering X can completely disguise himself as Sonic and deceive people with it, it could qualify as Stealth Mastery since it's beyond just mere Shapeshifting, even more of a bonus if we use Sonic Legacy content where he literally is Sonic for the first half of the mod.

Though it probably is a stretch.

 

[TheShape03]

And I still disagree with it.

But you haven't given any logical reason to disagree except for things that don't even affect cross-scaling and seem more like a desperate attempt to nerf X, no offense, it's just what I think.

I'm still new on how stuff applies to energy system pages. I've been mostly using the Ki Manipulation page as a template, but for VOID Energy, the EXE characters seems to be the only ones capable of extreme level reality warping (as far as I can tell) in canon, whereas other characters like the Guardians who simply use the energy aren't doing any of the stuff X can do.

Perhaps a "possible uses" section would be the way to go, or just a way of splitting more Advanced abilities from the basics.

Not doing so doesn't mean they can't, especially if we have a logical reason to think they can. Simply adding all of X's supernatural abilities and leaving a note saying "All VOID Energy users except X and Lord Mortis have the mentioned abilities at a lower range and magnitude than the two of them, due to being much less powerful characters and unlike X and Mortis, they weren't described as beings without limits" or something like that should be fine.

Considering X can completely disguise himself as Sonic and deceive people with it, it could qualify as Stealth Mastery since it's beyond just mere Shapeshifting

He's not being stealthy, he's shapeshifting and he manages to fool people because his disguise is convincing.

even more of a bonus if we use Sonic Legacy content where he literally is Sonic for the first half of the mod.

I'm pretty sure Joe said that nothing in FNF is canon, I think I put that statement in the profile I made of the Legacy version.

 

[OculoOmnibus]

But you haven't given any logical reason to disagree except for things that don't even affect cross-scaling and seem more like a desperate attempt to nerf X, no offense, it's just what I think.

Because the site rules outright say that you can't do it.

• If fan content consistently demonstrates and maintains a different level of power from the original work, it should be judged and tiered based on its own feats, not on scaling to canon, even if the original is stronger. If the fanwork is meant to fit within the official timeline, failing to duplicate feats of the same level is fine, but actively contradicting the canon power level is not. As a general rule, fanfiction should not be automatically scaled to canon without an argument in its favor.
  
  • Naturally, this applies doubly to alternate universe and crossover fanfics, which can easily and often inherently contradict not just the statistics but also powers of the original canon materials.

X has no arguments in favor because he doesn't have an in-universe 2-C feat (let alone one that scales to IDW Sonic's 12 universes one) and is not meant to fit within the official timeline of Sonic. Death of the author applies even if we consider Raven a WoG, so this is my final statement on the matter.

If you think I'm wrong, I'm more than willing to have a staff member commentate on the situation so the profiles can follow page guidelines.

Not doing so doesn't mean they can't, especially if we have a logical reason to think they can. Simply adding all of X's supernatural abilities and leaving a note saying "All VOID Energy users except X and Lord Mortis have the mentioned abilities at a lower range and magnitude than the two of them, due to being much less powerful characters and unlike X and Mortis, they weren't described as beings without limits" or something like that should be fine.

I've been looking at different profiles when it comes to more simplistic energy systems, and it seems like the best option to have tabbers and a possible inclusions section for all the abilities. Then with the character profiles, we just list which abilities the character can do (this is what I've seen based on the Ki Manipulation page, which is split between level of usage and potential abilities that can be gained).

The guardians seem to be capable of doing different things while some are incapable of others, such as Kito and Ken'o being completely immobile and Yokubo being so powerful that he can rewrite someone's genetic code. I made a new sandbox that hopefully gets things as accurate as possible.

I'm pretty sure Joe said that nothing in FNF is canon, I think I put that statement in the profile I made of the Legacy version.

Just events/scenarios, the information provided on X by Shady Guy/Cult member would still count as canon.

 

[TheShape03]

Because the site rules outright say that you can't do it.

The X-Verse demonstrates, but does not consistently maintain, a different power level than canon. So technically it's not against the rules or making 2-C contradictory.

Now, let's read a next sentence from the same paragraph.

As a general rule, fanfiction should not be automatically scaled to canon without an argument in its favor.

Oh, it turns out we do have one here.

X has no arguments in favor because he doesn't have an in-universe 2-C feat

The sentence you quoted indicates that the fanfic-verse must consistently maintain that different power level in order to consider cross-scaling contradictory.

is not meant to fit within the official timeline of Sonic

It turns out that doesn't matter, the rules don't prevent such cross-scaling and, I'm sorry to say, the opinion of the person who owns the character matters far more than that of any other random person.

If you don't want to debate it any further, fine.

You have more votes anyway so you are free to downgrade them to 7-C, this is a "democracy" after all. Let's ignore all the analysis I did about infinite power that obviously no one read and refuted, let's ignore the word of the person who has more rights over the character than everyone else here, let's ignore that someone weaker than X is literally capable of destroying everything in his reality, let's ignore all that.

By the way, no one but Xenophanes can scale to MHS+ feat, Astra's statement only talks about physical strength.

The guardians seem to be capable of doing different things while some are incapable of others, such as Kito and Ken'o being completely immobile and Yokubo being so powerful that he can rewrite someone's genetic code.

Kito is technically a statue and Ken'o can move, he just has a permanent expression of disgust. This is more due to how they were created than what they are, extensions of X himself. Not to mention that it makes sense that each guardian has some abilities of their own since each one was the result of fusing a part of X with a different emotion.

However, each one should keep X's abilities (because they are, well, extensions of him) + their own abilities. Of course, the guardians would be weaker than X.

Just events/scenarios, the information provided on X by Shady Guy/Cult member would still count as canon.

No.

 

[OculoOmnibus]

Oh, it turns out we do have one here.

The arguments have to be (from what I can tell with the wording) in-universe scaling.

I think it's best to have a staff member commentate because the rule seems to have differing interpretations. Again, if I'm completely wrong and you're in the right then I guess I'd have no choice to change the argument.

By the way, no one but Xenophanes can scale to MHS+ feat, Astra's statement only talks about physical strength.

No.

Yikes, that's on me. Thanks for pointing these out.

Kito is technically a statue and Ken'o can move, he just has a permanent expression of disgust. This is more due to how they were created than what they are, extensions of X himself. Not to mention that it makes sense that each guardian has some abilities of their own since each one was the result of fusing a part of X with a different emotion.

From what I can tell, it's more of a Dragon Ball Ki situation where your powers are limited with whatever knowledge you have of it's utilization. EXE and the Guardians should technically be capable of eventually learning things X knows, but since they don't showcase or have implied knowledge of those abilities, it would have to fall into the "possible uses" section.

This wouldn't count for Reality Warping, which seems to be the baseplate for all VOID Energy techniques. It would likely be a case by case basis.

 

[El_rapero_de_tf2]

I think it's best to have a staff member commentate because the rule seems to have differing interpretations. Again, if I'm completely wrong and you're in the right then I guess I'd have no choice to change the argument.

i believe that scaling like this, if approved by staff would make sense.

X's power is something that has been teased and never spoken in full detail, we have never seen him use at least a grand portion of his power and if anything it has been spoken about how much X limits himself, plus we've been shown how he limits his strength and speed to make his "games" less uneventful.

if it ends up being taken into consideration, at least as a "possibly" route, then i feel like it would make sense

(A bit more unrelated, but canon super forms are able to negate regeneration up to Low-Godly, which would make sense due to X having this type of regeneration and would make sense with the "Sonic with the chaos emeralds would win against X" limitation raven added)

 

[OculoOmnibus]

i believe that scaling like this, if approved by staff would make sense.

I asked @Phoenks about this and they replied saying to judge it by it's own feats, though I sent them this thread in case they want to evaluate it themselves.

X's power is something that has been teased and never spoken in full detail, we have never seen him use at least a grand portion of his power and if anything it has been spoken about how much X limits himself, plus we've been shown how he limits his strength and speed to make his "games" less uneventful.

if it ends up being taken into consideration, at least as a "possibly" route, then i feel like it would make sense

That's mostly been my problem with applying the scaling. From what I've seen with other verses on the wiki that have author statements like this, DotA usually applies unless the work itself takes place in the same timeline as it's original counterpart, as the scaling chain for how the tiering is justified stays consistent. An EXE example of this is how X Prime from the 2017 reboot has author statements about how he would beat Infinite from Sonic Forces, but it isn't factored into his page because of his verse not replicating (and even contradicting) such feats.

While Lord X's full power is never shown to the audience, his hypothetical cap when going off in-universe statements is only High 3-A (or Low 2-C if you buy the universal argument). Every tier above Low 2-C has complexities revolving scaling because even being one universe stronger in the 2-C range results in you being infinitely stronger and stomping the weaker opponent, which would mean that even if you pitted the only 2-C version of X on the wiki (JC's X) against IDW Modern Sonic, he'd get completely stomped via sheer AP wank.

(A bit more unrelated, but canon super forms are able to negate regeneration up to Low-Godly, which would make sense due to X having this type of regeneration and would make sense with the "Sonic with the chaos emeralds would win against X" limitation raven added)

Umm actually they attacked Solaris' consciousness and defeated him that way but the Sonic scalers on VSBW have reading comprehension problems lololol

But the Chaos Emeralds being a stomp makes total sense, he's this eldritch incarnation of pure evil so the emeralds just need to do the work they did since day one and he's toast.

 

[TheShape03]

I asked @Phoenks about this and they replied saying to judge it by it's own feats, though I sent them this thread in case they want to evaluate it themselves.

At least the way the rule is currently written doesn't imply that it applies in this case. However, since a staff member said it, I guess I can't just go against the rules. Rules are rules (although this specific one is nonsense and is made to go against WoG's decision).

Although 3-A or High 3-A might be the best decision now,, we have EXE destroying his reality and the whole infinite power thing.

That's mostly been my problem with applying the scaling. From what I've seen with other verses on the wiki that have author statements like this, DotA usually applies unless the work itself takes place in the same timeline as it's original counterpart

That's not set in stone, these are rules created by the wiki, and frankly you can't tell me that they have more power to decide about a character than its owners. But since they are site rules there's not much that can be done.

An EXE example of this is how X Prime from the 2017 reboot has author statements about how he would beat Infinite from Sonic Forces, but it isn't factored into his page because of his verse not replicating (and even contradicting) such feats.

I didn't include it only because it's contradicted by the story itself, and if there are parts of the story that contradict WOG, that means WOG is invalid. If that kind of stuff within the story didn't exist, trust me, I would have scaled to X from Infinite.

 

[El_rapero_de_tf2]

I asked @Phoenks about this and they replied saying to judge it by it's own feats, though I sent them this thread in case they want to evaluate it themselves.

 

[El_rapero_de_tf2]

Although 3-A or High 3-A might be the best decision now,, we have EXE destroying his reality and the whole infinite power thing.

that would be a good route

 

[OculoOmnibus]

Although 3-A or High 3-A might be the best decision now,, we have EXE destroying his reality and the whole infinite power thing.

We do need a timeframe for how long it would take EXE to destroy everything (and maybe if he's doing it with the Black Sun or not). For all we know, it could take years, centuries, millenia, or even more.

If we had one to go off of, then a calculation could be made based on that info for his strength and speed and we could get a proper scale for his tiering.

 

[TheShape03]

We do need a timeframe for how long it would take EXE to destroy everything (and maybe if he's doing it with the Black Sun or not). For all we know, it could take years, centuries, millenia, or even more.

I guess that's fair, the reason I brought that feat up in the first place is because I was sure it said "his current reality", not "everything in his current reality". I guess I read it too fast the first time and got the words mixed up.

I still think the whole "limitless abilities" thing is being taken the wrong way. The current reasoning is that only his power has infinite magnitude, when Joe is talking about abilities in general.

 

[El_rapero_de_tf2]

We do need a timeframe for how long it would take EXE to destroy everything (and maybe if he's doing it with the Black Sun or not). For all we know, it could take years, centuries, millenia, or even more.

this is an example that shape had put before, but even if it took EXE like 10 years, it'd place him at a 3-B level
Universal baseline: 2.825e+92 Joules
10 years in seconds: 3.154e+8
2.825e+92/3.154e+8 = 8.9568802e+83 Joules, 3-B
now, the current canon EXE isn't specified to possess some sort of longevity and raven stated that after doing this, he'd go out for Lord X (meaning he'd still have the physical prowess to do so), so actually 10 years as a minimum would be a good standard. But of course, if you wish to make sure you could alwas just scale him to baseline 3-B