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Why is The Prensece tier 1A while TOOA is tier 0? They're supposed to be at the same level, both the gods of DC and Marvel.
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The Presence
- Thread starter Despacheetos
- Start date
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- Tags
- tiering system
- 22,068
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Taking this off the Presence's page:
Note: The Presence has stated that he was shaped by external forces, apparently intended to be the beliefs and imaginations of humanity, rather than a 4th Wall reference to the writers or real-world humans. This concept was introduced in The Sandman: A Dream of a Thousand Cats, which depicts that originally cats were the dominant species on Earth, being giant beasts which hunted humans. However, the collected dream of a world where humans ruled over cats altered reality from it's very beginning, making it so that humans were always larger than cats.
He is incapable of killing The Great Evil Beast, with both being equal halves of the same whole. The Presence is also not fully Omniscient. There are certain things he doesn't know, and which occur outside of his plan, and he cannot know the thoughts of comparable beings.
Furthermore as of the 2015 Vertigo Lucifer Comic, The Presence was severely injured, or temporarily killed by the archangel Gabriel Hornblower, although apparently with a weapon that he himself fashioned, and was later cut to pieces by Lucifer himself.
In addition, Jin En Mok such as Cestis are supposedly much older than he is, which would contradict that he created everything.
As such he is presumably just one aspect of Monitor-Mind The Overvoid, along with The Source, The Hand of Creation, The Voice of the Godhead, The Word, The Great Evil Beast, Wally The God-Boy, etcetera.
Given all of the above, we are scaling him from being far above both Michael Demiurgos and Lucifer Morningstar.
Note: The Presence has stated that he was shaped by external forces, apparently intended to be the beliefs and imaginations of humanity, rather than a 4th Wall reference to the writers or real-world humans. This concept was introduced in The Sandman: A Dream of a Thousand Cats, which depicts that originally cats were the dominant species on Earth, being giant beasts which hunted humans. However, the collected dream of a world where humans ruled over cats altered reality from it's very beginning, making it so that humans were always larger than cats.
He is incapable of killing The Great Evil Beast, with both being equal halves of the same whole. The Presence is also not fully Omniscient. There are certain things he doesn't know, and which occur outside of his plan, and he cannot know the thoughts of comparable beings.
Furthermore as of the 2015 Vertigo Lucifer Comic, The Presence was severely injured, or temporarily killed by the archangel Gabriel Hornblower, although apparently with a weapon that he himself fashioned, and was later cut to pieces by Lucifer himself.
In addition, Jin En Mok such as Cestis are supposedly much older than he is, which would contradict that he created everything.
As such he is presumably just one aspect of Monitor-Mind The Overvoid, along with The Source, The Hand of Creation, The Voice of the Godhead, The Word, The Great Evil Beast, Wally The God-Boy, etcetera.
Given all of the above, we are scaling him from being far above both Michael Demiurgos and Lucifer Morningstar.
