The Courier vs Commander Shepard - Western RPG Showdown

[Stillwinston]

Might as well try this, am playing through Mass Effect Legendary Edition. Halfway through 2 atm

Speed is equalised. Adept Shepherd is being used. Both are 5 metres apart, SBA Otherwise

Ain't that a kick in the head: 4

I should go: 0

Incon: 0

Commander Shepard

We don't know how many the Collectors have stolen. Thousands, hundreds of thousands. It's not important. What matters is this: Not. One. More. That's what we can do here, today. It ends with us. They want to know what we're made of? I say we show them, on our terms. Let's bring our people...

vsbattles.fandom.com

The Courier

The Courier is the character you play in the game Fallout: New Vegas. Fallout: New Vegas is a game based around Las Vegas after a global nuclear war which wiped out most of humanity. Now, there is a war between two factions called the NCR and the Legion. Some people survived by hiding in vaults...

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[Stillwinston]

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[Stillwinston]

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[Shmooply]

Courier for being from a game where your options actually matter in the ending.
jokes aside ill give input later

 

[Stillwinston]

Courier for being from a game where your options actually matter in the ending.
jokes aside ill give input later

T̶b̶f̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶y̶'̶l̶l̶ ̶b̶a̶n̶g̶ ̶o̶k̶a̶y̶?̶ ̶

 

[Shmooply]

T̶b̶f̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶y̶'̶l̶l̶ ̶b̶a̶n̶g̶ ̶o̶k̶a̶y̶?̶ ̶

Please assume the position.

 

[Stillwinston]

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[Stillwinston]

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[Stillwinston]

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[Stillwinston]

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[Stillwinston]

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[Stillwinston]

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[Stillwinston]

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[Stillwinston]

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[Stillwinston]

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[Stillwinston]

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[Stillwinston]

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[Stillwinston]

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[Stillwinston]

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[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Can't the Courier just talk Shepard out of fighting?

 

[Stillwinston]

Shepard's done that before loads of times too though tbh

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Shepard's done that before loads of times too though tbh

But has it been to the same ridiculous extent as the Courier's Social Influencing Feats?

 

[Stillwinston]

Just to bump will try and find and give indepth feats for Shepard but I think they might be comparable off the top of my head

 

[Stillwinston]

Alright time to give some social feats for Commander Shepard

Is able to get Tali exonerated from charges of treason without even having to show any evidence.

Is able to broker peace between the Geth and Quarians. These races feuded for 300 years straight

Is able to talk Saren into blowing his brains out despite being immensely indoctrinated and cyberized by Reapers

Is able to talk The Illusive Man into blowing his brains out. Again while the latter was mindhaxed and cyberized by the Reapers.

The Reapers are able to mindhax people, passively even with their technology and indoctrinate them to the point where their mindset subtly works in their favour to the point where they don't even think the reapers are affecting them when in fact they are. As confirmed here

A Reaper tech artefact could passively indoctrinate people by the dozens as show with the Arrival DLC there. Saren and The Illusive Man were heavily indoctrinated/mindhaxed yet Shepard can still get them to see reason and end themselves. Plus ending a 300 year war plus getting someone off a heavy enough of a charge as Treason to your entire species should count for something I guess.

 

[FinePoint]

The thought of the battle starting with both of them trying to convince eachother to kill themselves is hilarious to me.

 

[FinePoint]

Alright time to give some social feats for Commander Shepard

Is able to get Tali exonerated from charges of treason without even having to show any evidence.

Source: "Dude, just trust me." Actually working is pretty par-for-the-course for the Courier as well, they seem similar in this regard.

Is able to broker peace between the Geth and Quarians. These races feuded for 300 years straight

This seems largely due to factors which already existed, namely the presence of many peace supporters already. There's even several high-ranking officials who side with Shepard immediately.
In contrast, the Courier got Legate Lanius to pull a complete 180 out of nowhere, going against his very fundamental ideals and every single personality trait known about him thus far.

Is able to talk Saren into blowing his brains out despite being immensely indoctrinated and cyberized by Reapers

Is able to talk The Illusive Man into blowing his brains out. Again while the latter was mindhaxed and cyberized by the Reapers.

The first example seems more like a loophole the controlled person exploited rather than entirely being due to SI.
In the second example, he doesn't seem convinced at all, but gets shot? Slightly confused, but it seems to be a similar situation, with the mind-control naturally offering some slack.

Though, most of the Courier's forced-suicide feats are similarly in mitigating circumstances. In particular, the three people I can remember were under these circumstances:
1.) Whole family disowns him.
2.) Watched everyone he loved die, and guilty from killing refugees.
3.) Suffering from Dissociative Personality Disorder.

They both seem capable of convincing someone to kill themselves provided they have some leverage to help, but not without it.

---

Overall: It seems as if they're actually quite similar in their abilities, though I do believe the Courier's is still stronger.
If it comes down to it, I don't think either of them can convince each other to kill themselves, but if it were an argument about who should surrender, I see the Courier as being stronger in that regard based on the evidence.

 

[Stillwinston]

Well assuming they fight after talking I assume Shepard being an Adept prolly opens with Singularity

 

[FinePoint]

Well assuming they fight after talking I assume Shepard being an Adept prolly opens with Singularity

How does that work?
Courier leads with V.A.T.S. (basically Time-Slow [via Self-Perception Manip/Amp] + Aimbot)

 

[Stillwinston]

Shepard raises their hand and fires basically a mini black hole projectile that sucks you in, leaves you ragdolling and rapidly taking damage.

Singularity

Singularity is a biotic ability in Mass Effect, Mass Effect 2, and Mass Effect 3. Singularity is a biotic talent. This gravitational power sucks multiple enemies within a radius to a single area, leaving them floating helplessly and vulnerable to attack. It can also attract objects from the...

masseffect.fandom.com

 

[FinePoint]

Shepard raises their hand and fires basically a mini black hole projectile that sucks you in, leaves you ragdolling and rapidly taking damage.

Singularity

Singularity is a biotic ability in Mass Effect, Mass Effect 2, and Mass Effect 3. Singularity is a biotic talent. This gravitational power sucks multiple enemies within a radius to a single area, leaving them floating helplessly and vulnerable to attack. It can also attract objects from the...

masseffect.fandom.com

How fast is it? Also, shouldn't biotics be restricted since they grant 8-B durability?
V.A.T.S. for reference.

 

[Stillwinston]

The 8-B stuff is just with barriers both kinetic and biotic shields, not with Singularity and offensive biotics which are in the 8-C range. Plus Courier has their tier 8 weapons allowed and even then the shields would do jack shit vs a nuke according to the ME Codex also one last bit about shields in ME is slower attacks don't trigger them, not sure if an ME projectile is faster than a normal gunshot which might help there. "The shielding afforded by kinetic barriers does not protect against extremes of temperature, toxins, or radiation".

I can restrict the barriers though if that helps. Here's an example of Singularity being used

 

[FinePoint]

The 8-B stuff is just with barriers both kinetic and biotic shields, not with Singularity and offensive biotics which are in the 8-C range. Plus Courier has their tier 8 weapons allowed and even then the shields would do jack shit vs a nuke according to the ME Codex also one last bit about shields in ME is slower attacks don't trigger them, not sure if an ME projectile is faster than a normal gunshot which might help there. "The shielding afforded by kinetic barriers does not protect against extremes of temperature, toxins, or radiation".

I can restrict the barriers though if that helps. Here's an example of Singularity being used

Well, you sort of removed any chance at a mini-nuke being viable by making the starting distance only 5 meters.

His best option at this range is an energy weapon.
Light-Speed projectile speed with Matter Manipulation and hot enough to disintegrate people instantly, which I don't think Shepard resists.
If the shield doesn't protect against heat, then I feel like this would be very effective, especially since he can very rapidly quick-draw from V.A.T.S..

 

[FinePoint]

So, given the battle conditions, here's how I think the battle goes:

The Courier and Shepard start by talking and having a heated debate. Shepard can't keep up with the Courier's inhuman charisma, and is convinced to give up the fight. (Wincon 1 for Courier)

Or, if Shepard is somehow able to keep himself from being convinced, the battle starts. Shepard goes for Singularity, and the Courier activates V.A.T.S., where he selects Shepard's head a few times. Then, in his V.A.T.S. amped state, he quick-draws an energy weapon and uses it to disintegrate Shepard instantly. (Wincon 2 for Courier)

Or, if Shepard is able to get the Singularity off before he's disintegrated, the Courier dies after Shepard is disintegrated. (Incon 1)

In conclusion: I currently see about 2 scenarios where the Courier wins, and one where they both kill eachother.
Overall, I have to vote for the Courier.
Though, open for someone to change my mind.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

So, given the battle conditions, here's how I think the battle goes:

The Courier and Shepard start by talking and having a heated debate. Shepard can't keep up with the Courier's inhuman charisma, and is convinced to give up the fight. (Wincon 1)

Or, if Shepard is somehow able to keep himself from being convinced, the battle starts. Shepard goes for Singularity, and the Courier activates V.A.T.S., where he selects Shepard's head a few times. Then, in his V.A.T.S. amped state, he quick-draws an energy weapon and uses it to disintegrate Shepard instantly. (Wincon 2)

Or, if Shepard is able to get the Singularity off before he's disintegrated, the Courier dies after Shepard is disintegrated. (Incon 1)

In conclusion: I currently see about 2 scenarios where the Courier wins, and one where they both kill eachother.
Overall, I have to vote for the Courier.
Though, open for someone to change my mind.

Yeah, that sounds about right to me. Courier FRA.

 

[Stillwinston]

Huh, fair enough that probably works yeah. There's not many lasers being used in ME besides Reapers and the Collector Particle Beam weapon so the laser rifle should work. Besides Singularity Adept Shepard's other opening weapon is possibly Warp, which works similar projectile wise except it just hits you on the molecular level. Guess I need to ask if Courier is going to be alright ragdolling around while in Singularity cause their LS is way below Shep's there.

 

[FinePoint]

Huh, fair enough that probably works yeah. There's not many lasers being used in ME besides Reapers and the Collector Particle Beam weapon so the laser rifle should work. Besides Singularity Adept Shepard's other opening weapon is possibly Warp, which works similar projectile wise except it just hits you on the molecular level. Guess I need to ask if Courier is going to be alright ragdolling around while in Singularity cause their LS is way below Shep's there.

Doubt it. I think they both one-shot eachother, which is why V.A.T.S. is going to be really important in this speed-equalized match.
Best-case scenario is Shepard firing at about the same time, and still getting hit by a laser while killing Courier for an incon.

Again this is assuming he can get past the Social Influencing in the first place.

 

[Stillwinston]

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[Stillwinston]

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