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Talion vs The Sorrow

Isn't the mind manip contact based? It's in character for The Sorrow to just fly and stay out of reach at all times
 
ah yeah, that one. It has a short range, and given The Sorrow's precog he'll just stay out of range. which he can do with his flight; can he do that to intangibles/inorganics to begin with?
 
Now how does Talion work, exactly? Does he have a soul? Is Celebrimbor another being entirely, is he dependant on him... how does it work?
 
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Does Celebrimbor resist BFR? (The Sorrow sends souls/ghosts/spirits to the world of the dead, which is like a parallel universe)
 
1 The Sorrow is intangible
2 Even if this attack could harm him, he has type 7 to neg it and survive
3 He has precog, and I'm pretty sure the shadow strike requires an arrow to hit first, which The Sorrow will see come from a mile away
 
Can he even do that to people comparable to him? (yeah The Sorrow is significantly weaker, but far stronger than 9-A Uruks, and I'm pretty sure you can't even shadow strike all Uruks)
 
And i think we should start by talking about what happens in-character for both, because The Sorrow starts by summoning every person/animal the opponent has ever killed as intangible ghosts against him, he also gets all of their "skills" (which probably means "abilities")
 
The reason you can't Shadow Kill every Uruk is because of Game Mechanics. Unless you want to tell me that there are Uruks that can fight the Nazgūl and Sauron?

Twellas said:
And i think we should start by talking about what happens in-character for both, because The Sorrow starts by summoning every person/animal the opponent has ever killed as intangible ghosts against him, he also gets all of their "skills" (which probably means "abilities")
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If he does that, Talion gets a free Kill Streak to constantly recharge his Elven Wrath, which slows down time while he does a fuckton of damage to everything. Plus, he can still Teleport over to the Sorrow and Drain him, which takes like 3 Seconds Max.
 
XSOULOFCINDERX said:
If he does that, Talion gets a free Kill Streak to constantly recharge his Elven Wrath, which slows down time while he does a fuckton of damage to everything. Plus, he can still Teleport over to the Sorrow and Drain him, which takes like 3 Seconds Max.
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Are you telling me that Talion NEVER killed someone comparable to him that's gonna give him a tough fight? I find that impossible to believe in a game that has bossfights and isn't DMC.

Don't forget that he gets the abilities of the people Talion killed previously.

All of his teleports are projectile-based and The Sorrow 1) has great precog 2) is intangible 3) stays far away from his opponent, in the air 4) can dodge it

IF Talion survives having something like a billion enemies thrown at him at the same time as intangible ghosts (don't forget this part, they are intangible), does Celebrimbor resist BFR? Because the next thing that's gonna happen is that The Sorrow banishes the ghost to the other world. He might also do this while they're busy fighting the horde, mind you
XSOULOFCINDERX said:
The reason you can't Shadow Kill every Uruk is because of Game Mechanics. Unless you want to tell me that there are Uruks that can fight the Nazgūl and Sauron?
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Fair enough, still moot, due to The Sorrow's type 7 and non-corporeality
 
Also, no. Not all of his Teleports are Projectile Based. He can teleport without even pulling his Bow out. He's shown that in Shadow of War when Carnan flies in as a Drake to help kill Tar Goroth and he just pops on top of her.
 
XSOULOFCINDERX said:
He can hit literal Ghosts with his Sword. He does it while dealing with Isildur.
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Cool, still doesn't get through type 2 and 7 imm
XSOULOFCINDERX said:
Also, no. Not all of his Teleports are Projectile Based. He can teleport without even pulling his Bow out. He's shown that in Shadow of War when Carnan flies in as a Drake to help kill Tar Goroth and he just pops on top of her.
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We're using SOM Talion, not SOW. I know they could functionally be the same, but if the keys are separate, they are separate.

You're also kinda ignoring the whole summoning thing, can Talion even deal with that amount of enemies? And i don't just mean the fodder Uruks, I mean the bosses too
 
And before you ask no, you don't have to personally kill the character for The Sorrow to manifest him, this is shown with the Cobras, which appear to Snake even if he just incapacitated them and they died due to the micro-bomb they had; The Sorrow is not strictly limited to people you've personally killed
 
Twellas said:
And before you ask no, you don't have to personally kill the character for The Sorrow to manifest him, this is shown with the Cobras, which appear to Snake even if he just incapacitated them and they died due to the micro-bomb they had; The Sorrow is not strictly limited to people you've personally killed
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How tf did snake kill this guy?
 
He didn't, The Sorrow is on his side and literally brings him back to life at the end of the bossfight; he appears again in MGS4 when he helps Solid Snake out by yeeting Mantis' soul. It's funny how the weird ghost guy who cries blood is quite possibly the single most morally good character in the series
 
His bossfight is notorious for being a stone wall for "lethal" players, since he'll summon every single npc you've killed and the fight could take up to 40 minutes, it's a nice bit of metanarrative criticism, like "hey, you killed those guys even if you had the choice not to, now you suffer the consequences", if only a certain 2020 game had taken inspiration from this and ACTUALLY given the choice for you to not commit the actions it judges you for...
 
You do realize that 8-A Talion is the one you play as throughout all of Shadow of Mordor and Act 1 of Shadow of War, right?
 
The Bosses at Best are close to Talion's Base State, not his Elven Rage which is a Fuckton Stronger. Not a One-Shot worthy Difference, but it's a Noticeable one, so he can still Tear through dozens of these guys.
 
XSOULOFCINDERX said:
The Bosses at Best are close to Talion's Base State, not his Elven Rage which is a Fuckton Stronger. Not a One-Shot worthy Difference, but it's a Noticeable one, so he can still Tear through dozens of these guys.
Click to expand...
Yeah no, I don't think he can just plow through dozens of bosses who are comparable to him in the game, and since you're saying that the 8-A Talios is also the SOW one, then the Balrog is joining the fight as well, are you gonna tell me that he can just steamroll him too?
 
Then mate, why are you using that same scene as justification for the tp? The scene you mention as proof of him not needing a projectile in order to tp is from a different key entirely
 
Because he still has the same powers as that Key, just to a lesser extent. Plus he can teleport without arrows as shown with how he can Fast Travel to Barrows and Region Entrances without a Time Skip.
 
XSOULOFCINDERX said:
Because he still has the same powers as that Key, just to a lesser extent.
Click to expand...
exactly, lesser extent
XSOULOFCINDERX said:
shown with how he can Fast Travel to Barrows and Region Entrances without a Time Skip.
Click to expand...
pretty different from combat applicable annd applied tp
XSOULOFCINDERX said:
And for the Record, Carnan killed the Balrog, not Talion.
Click to expand...
refer to my previous comment, you don't have to be directly responsible for the death for the ghost to appear, the Cobras appear even when Snake simply knocks them out and their own micro-bombs kill them
 
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