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Stellaris Conceptual Manipulation Possible Downgrade

RotofBots

RotofBots

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Anyways, just gonna ask what exactly makes the concepts in Stellaris Type 2 Conceptual Manipulation as nothing on the profile really backs it up:

Could affect time and gravity on an abstract level. Created itself and thus created "the loop"
~ Currently on The Worm In Waiting's Profile​
While a cool feat, it's definitely doesn't qualify for Type 2 Conceptual and would be Type 3 at best.

If it really turns out that the evidence for it is insubstantial, their Conceptual Manipulation should be downgraded to Type 3.
 
I am fine with the downgrade. Also, this thread needs like admin's inputs to be accepted. Yeah, it's abstract nature is on The Worm in Waiting's level.
 
To merely affect time and gravity on an abstract level is not type 2 manipulation without any further explanation, no. Idek if this is conceptual manipulation, considering that time and gravity are rather abstract things as is, even if you don't affect them as concepts.
 
I think that this seems to make sense.
 
This is the second verse where Zach slapped type 2 concepts on, turning out to be wrong.
 
But is it even conceptual manipulation? To affect something "on an abstract level" that is already an abstract thing isn't indicative of conceptual stuff.
 
Discounting that his sounds more like law manip, wouldn't that be a power of that specific book that anyone who writes in it would be able to wield, rather than his own?
 
Well, guess I'll go make that thread real quick then. Anyone have anything else to say in defense of Stellaris conceptual manipulation?
 
@Wokistan

I am not the best to ask about this, but I trust your sense of judgement.
 
I don't see anything on either of those scans indicative of concept manip. Mind pointing out the relevant bits?
 
Zach you need to highlight the relevant parts of that huge pastebin.
 
The worm is embodyied a temporal paradox

WORM_ENTRY_POINT:0 "Generate the Entry Point"
WORM_ENTRY_POINT_DESC:0 "The Theory suggests that the temporal anomalies we have encountered are the cause of the thing we call the Loop, or the Worm. It's a tangled knot of paradoxes that has become conscious; a nexus of awareness and desire outside time. Its cause, or its result - it's hard to say with something like this. But it is attracted to endings and to beginnings. We can use the Omega Alignment to bring it through to our home system. If we do, something will certainly happen. This is many things, but especially, it is science."
"Omega Theory"
"When a temporal paradox becomes tangled, a kind of consciousness arises, with its own needs, its own desires. This is what has occurred with the consciousness that some call the Worm-in-Waiting. If we can align ourselves with that consciousness, we might just achieve a kind of immortality."
It nature is able cause change in spacetime:

The Horizon Signal: A Lesson in the Ashes"

"We've reproduced conditions that approximate those around the black hole. We've found that the fragments we recover cycle between states, in ways that should be impossible - as if time were oscillating. We can derive energy from this - although there are worrying changes to local spacetime."
The Horizon Signal: Where the End Comes From"
""This will be the end of me," [horizonsignal_thirdleader.GetName] says at the briefing before launch. "I know I won't come back. But I think I always knew this would happen. Whatever is in the hole has been waiting for us for a long long time - I think it's been waiting for me, since before I was born."\n\nOnce again, the single-pilot ship approaches the Exit Point. Once again, space boils like a fever. Again, our sensor arrays soak up fascinating data. This time, [horizonsignal_thirdleader.GetName] is silent. The telemetry becomes intermittent; and then it, too, is silent. The ship has reached the Exit Point. The conditions around it are returning to normal. Nothing has happened.\n\nNothing? The monitoring team mutter furiously. The ship is different... in fact, it's a different ship. It's [horizonsignal_firstleader.GetName]'s vessel, lost these years past, drifting now away from the Exit Point. A salvage team finds it pristine and empty - no trace of crew, and no sign of violence. But there's a journal entry in [horizonsignal_firstleader.GetName]'s name, titled §HWHAT WAS WILL BE§!. Our scientists review it nervously. "Impossible," one says. "I hope so," says another.\n\nThe ship is renamed the "Foundling" and returned to service. The Signal, dead or sleeping, says nothing at all, ever again."
In The Horizon Signal: §HTHE WORM§! to The Horizon Signal: Where the End Comes From, we learn it form a paradox with the signal older than civilization from missing ship from their current time.
 
Also, the end and the instrument should probably have the same form of abstract existence, they're of similar nature, it's just that the end is stronger.
 
I think additional abilities would better for another CRT as the main topic is over anyway.
 
Also, I found precognition for a shroud entity

the vision is hazy and indistinct, but there can be no question - it is [Root.Capital.GetName], our capital. The great cities look different yet familiar, even through the obscuring wall of flames and smoke. Thousands... no, millions of mutilated bodies litter the streets, all of them [Root.GetSpeciesName]. The stench of decay is unbearable.\n\n§P"YOUR FUTURE."§!\n\nNothing living remains in the ruins. In the sky above, massive orbital installations, trailing smoke, have begun a slow and inevitable descent towards the planet. Are we witnessing one possible future out of many?\n\n§P"NOT ONE OF MANY. IT SHALL COME TO PASS. AS SURELY AS THE SUN RISES. IT IS YOUR DESTINY."§!\n\nThe vision ends as quickly as it began, leaving behind a miasma of swirling psychic energies."
 
Sure...

But advocating an upgrade in a thread not even meant for it isn't wise. You should make a separate thread instead of derailing this one. Thank you.
 
Nedge1000 said:
The worm is embodied a temporal paradox
WORM_ENTRY_POINT:0 "Generate the Entry Point"
WORM_ENTRY_POINT_DESC:0 "The Theory suggests that the temporal anomalies we have encountered are the cause of the thing we call the Loop, or the Worm. It's a tangled knot of paradoxes that has become conscious; a nexus of awareness and desire outside time. Its cause, or its result - it's hard to say with something like this. But it is attracted to endings and to beginnings. We can use the Omega Alignment to bring it through to our home system. If we do, something will certainly happen. This is many things, but especially, it is science."
"Omega Theory"
"When a temporal paradox becomes tangled, a kind of consciousness arises, with its own needs, its own desires. This is what has occurred with the consciousness that some call the Worm-in-Waiting. If we can align ourselves with that consciousness, we might just achieve a kind of immortality."
It nature is able cause change in spacetime:

The Horizon Signal: A Lesson in the Ashes"

"We've reproduced conditions that approximate those around the black hole. We've found that the fragments we recover cycle between states, in ways that should be impossible - as if time were oscillating. We can derive energy from this - although there are worrying changes to local spacetime."
The Horizon Signal: Where the End Comes From"
""This will be the end of me," [horizonsignal_thirdleader.GetName] says at the briefing before launch. "I know I won't come back. But I think I always knew this would happen. Whatever is in the hole has been waiting for us for a long long time - I think it's been waiting for me, since before I was born."\n\nOnce again, the single-pilot ship approaches the Exit Point. Once again, space boils like a fever. Again, our sensor arrays soak up fascinating data. This time, [horizonsignal_thirdleader.GetName] is silent. The telemetry becomes intermittent; and then it, too, is silent. The ship has reached the Exit Point. The conditions around it are returning to normal. Nothing has happened.\n\nNothing? The monitoring team mutter furiously. The ship is different... in fact, it's a different ship. It's [horizonsignal_firstleader.GetName]'s vessel, lost these years past, drifting now away from the Exit Point. A salvage team finds it pristine and empty - no trace of crew, and no sign of violence. But there's a journal entry in [horizonsignal_firstleader.GetName]'s name, titled §HWHAT WAS WILL BE§!. Our scientists review it nervously. "Impossible," one says. "I hope so," says another.\n\nThe ship is renamed the "Foundling" and returned to service. The Signal, dead or sleeping, says nothing at all, ever again."
In The Horizon Signal: §HTHE WORM§! to The Horizon Signal: Where the End Comes From, we learn it form a paradox with the signal older than civilization from missing ship from their current time.
Click to expand...
The link is posted by Zach above.
 
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