Re:Zero Od = Life

[TheHeavenlySword]

The od, also known as the soul, is the foundation of life, and the wellspring of life, it is ones own life energy, synonymous with the soul.
A specific and finite amount of od is decided at birth which determines a persons' lifespan and the result of its depletion is death. Creating od is equivalent to creating life.
Due to its similar nature to mana, the od can be absorbed by spirits, and can be burned up to cast magic instead of mana but doing that is equivalent to shaving your own life away.

In conclusion, the od is a persons literal life force. It exists in a constant state of being consumed to sustain the individual's life, and once its completely exhausted, reaching zero, the individual would die.

With that said:

---

Death Manipulation

Any character that can directly destroy or Absorb someone else's od, soul, or their life force, should qualify for Soul Manipulation, Mind Manipulation and Death Manipulation.

• Julius
• Priscilla
• Eugard
• Halibel
• Groovy
• Puck
• Reinhard
• Reid
• Satella
• Regulus
• Spirits (Absorption)
• Ulgarm (their curse can rob the targets life force)

Additionally:

Alter - Volcanica​

• Death Manipulation, Soul Manipulation & Mind Manipulation (All of his attacks are lethal, even a mere graze a few millimeters deep could pluck out the life of his opponent. An individuals' life is their very own od, synonymous with the soul. Damage to the soul, also damages the mind, as the mental has been equated to the spiritual)

Holy Swords - Enchanted Swords​

• Death Manipulation, Soul Manipulation & Mind Manipulation (Holy Swords and Enchanted Swords are instant-kill certain-death weapons, the instant they make contact the opponents life would be forfeit. An individuals' life is their very own od, synonymous with the soul. Damage to the soul, also damages the mind, as the mental has been equated to the spiritual)

The LN scan here actually says Demonic Sword, I changed it to Enchanted Sword, because that was likely just a mistranslation. since both of them use the same word (魔剣, Maken), and demonic swords aren't even a thing in Re:Zero.​

---

Resurrection Mid-Godly

Death in the Re:Zero world means your own od-soul-life had ceased to exist and went back to Od Lagna, whether it was naturally burned up from old age, used for magic, destroyed, or absorbed.

Characters who can resurrect their own od back from that state should qualify for a Mid-Godly Resurrection:

• Reinhard
• Subaru
• Aldebaran
• Pandora

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Nonexistent Physiology

This would only apply to the dead souls of the undead, basically the undead can stick around even after having kicked the bucket, they completely lack an existent od-life to be dispersed by Halibel curse. In other words their od have already reached a 0 when they died, the sacrament of the immortal king simply allows it to still function in that nonexistent state.

This would grant this characters a Nonexistent Physiology (Nature Type 1, Aspect Type 1, 3 & 5 "Life").

• Sphinx
• Balleroy
• Eugard
• Rowan
• Theresia
• Kurgan

---

Agree:
Disagree:
Neutral:

 

[Azertyhuuh]

I'm confident this thread will be rejected because it isn't correct. Remember my words.

What I see here is simply Soul Absorption, Soul Manipulation, and Life Manipulation, Age Manipulation

Also, killing someone with a single strike, a scratch, or even something more trivial—like blowing air at them and killing them—does not qualify as Death Manipulation.

I suggest you review the Life Manipulation ability page, because it seems you forgot that such an ability already exists. The arguments you've presented do not establish Death Manipulation.

Life Manipulation is the ability to manipulate the life force that courses inside living beings or the very concept of life itself.

And this is also simply Age Manipulation.

Age Manipulation is the ability to control the age of one's self, other organisms, and/or objects. This can be used in a variety of ways, such as returning a target to a much younger state, rendering them a helpless child, or to rapidly age others, to old age and potentially even their death. In some cases, this effect is so powerful that it can reduce a user's surroundings to dust.

As for Mid-Godly Regeneration, you're mistaken there as well.
Subaru already has Type 4 Immortality, since after his death, his soul is sent back to the past. This itself proves that his soul does not die when his body dies, and the same applies to his mind. Therefore, there is no need to bring up the other characters you listed.

Regarding NEP 1, I don't see any evidence supporting it. Instead, what I see is Type 7 Immortality. (Please take a look at the Immortality page, specifically Type 7, so you'll understand what I mean.)

Undead: Characters who cannot die due to technically being already dead, often overlapping with other forms of immortality. This includes characters who can keep existing as spiritual entities upon dying.

As I said, your thread will be rejected. This will be my last comment here; I was only explaining my reasoning.

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Depend how interpret this: Od came from nothingness(Od Lagna?)

——An abominable technique left behind by the Vicious Old Man, Olbart Dunkelkenn.

By meddling with the Od of others, the Shinobi’s secret infantilization technique could remarkably reverse the growth of one’s body.

All living beings were naught more than containers for that which came into existence from nothingness, the Od. Depending on the shape of the Od, the size and form of the container would vary accordingly.

Therefore, all living creatures would don different appearances, and establish themselves as unique life forms.

If this theory was correct, that the body only served as a container for the Od, then by altering the shape of one’s Od, the form of its container could be altered freely.

By compressing one’s Od, then the body, serving as the container, could also be shrunk—— –Volume 31, Chapter 2

 

[TheHeavenlySword]

I suggest you review the Life Manipulation ability page, because it seems you forgot that such an ability already exists. The arguments you've presented do not establish Death Manipulation.

Life Manipulation is the ability to manipulate the life force that courses inside living beings or the very concept of life itself.

Death Manipulation is the ability to directly induce death in beings, objects or even concepts via supernatural means. This can manifest as the inexplicable death of an individual, the direct cessation of biological functions, dispersal of life force and more.

And this is also simply Age Manipulation.

nothing about this affect the age of others.

Subaru already has Type 4 Immortality, since after his death, his soul is sent back to the past. This itself proves that his soul does not die when his body dies, and the same applies to his mind. Therefore, there is no need to bring up the other characters you listed.

Souls after death also go back to Od Lagna, this has nothing to do with my argument.

 

[UrongSygn1]

Wasnt the Od accepted as CM3?

 

[Azertyhuuh]

nothing about this affect the age of others.


Souls after death also go back to Od Lagna, this has nothing to do with my argument.

Well, I'm fine with Death Manipulation then, as long as these characters are capable of causing instant death by removing the target's entire life force at once. Otherwise, I don't think it qualifies as Death Manipulation.

As for Mid-Godly Resurrection, I think it's fine.

Regarding NEP 1, after reading your arguments, I think I understand what you mean now. However, I don't understand why you didn't include the Mind and Soul aspects. According to your own definition at the beginning, the soul = the Od, since you said that the Od is synonymous with the soul. You also said that the mind is equivalent to the spiritual aspect. That should grant them those aspects as well.

Otherwise, I suspect they simply continue to exist as souls after death, in which case this would just be Immortality Type 7.

Also, has it already been accepted that the Od = the body, soul, and mind, or is this the first time you're proposing this interpretation? Because if it's the latter, then I think this point would need further discussion and verification.

 

[TheHeavenlySword]

Wasnt the Od accepted as CM3?

that's its own CRT, I can't add it here.

Regarding NEP 1, after reading your arguments, I think I understand what you mean now. However, I don't understand why you didn't include the Mind and Soul aspects. According to your own definition at the beginning, the soul = the Od, since you said that the Od is synonymous with the soul. You also said that the mind is equivalent to the spiritual aspect. That should grant them those aspects as well.

Aspect 1, 3 are spiritual and mental nonexistence.

Also, has it already been accepted that the Od = the body, soul, and mind, or is this the first time you're proposing this interpretation? Because if it's the latter, then I think this point would need further discussion and verification.

it was accepted that od = soul & mind, and they all already have low godly resurrections which include the body.

 

[Azertyhuuh]

that's its own CRT, I can't add it here.


Aspect 1, 3 are spiritual and mental nonexistence.

it was accepted that od = soul & mind, and they all already have low godly resurrections which include the body.

I didn't notice that you wrote 1 and 3.

 

[Hercules1125]

Agree

 

[Fezzih_007]

I kinda iffy on Death Manipulation.

It is important to note that just causing death via other abilities or indirect means (such as soul destruction, physical damage, deconstruction etc.) in itself does not qualify for Death Manipulation unless it is specified or portrayed to be a direct inducement of death in its targets with these being aftereffects of that.

Even with the Soul = Life, the characters are killing the target with Soul Manipulation, not by induncing direct Death on them.

Yes, they are affecting their life force, but that would just be Life Manipulation I think?

Life Stealing/Instant Death: Some life manipulators are able to steal life energy or simply remove the life energy from an opponent's body to grievously harm or kill the target.

Or one of the examples in the page says It can do what Re:Zero chars are doing.

It could overlap, but the difference is:

The character affect someone life force = Life Manipulation

The character causes Death on target = Death Manipulation.

For me atleast, It seems more the former than the latter.

I neutral on that, this is just my opinion.

 

[Crimsonobu]

The od, also known as the soul, is the foundation of life, and the wellspring of life, it is ones own life energy, synonymous with the soul.
A specific and finite amount of od is decided at birth which determines a persons' lifespan and the result of its depletion is death. Creating od is equivalent to creating life.
Due to its similar nature to mana, the od can be absorbed by spirits, and can be burned up to cast magic instead of mana but doing that is equivalent to shaving your own life away.

In conclusion, the od is a persons literal life force. It exists in a constant state of being consumed to sustain the individual's life, and once its completely exhausted, reaching zero, the individual would die.

With that said:

Makes sense

---

Death Manipulation

Any character that can directly destroy or Absorb someone else's od, soul, or their life force, should qualify for Soul Manipulation, Mind Manipulation and Death Manipulation.

• Julius
• Priscilla
• Eugard
• Halibel
• Groovy
• Puck
• Reinhard
• Reid
• Satella
• Regulus
• Spirits (Absorption)
• Ulgarm (their curse can rob the targets life force)

The ulgram rob mana. Mana is equivalent to life force, if a person loses all their mana they die. Thus they aren't absorbing the soul. Roswaal, Echidna, Alter, and Sphinx can all use rainbow magic which means they qualify as Julius rainbow magic is what gives him these abikities

Additionally:

Alter - Volcanica​

• Death Manipulation, Soul Manipulation & Mind Manipulation (All of his attacks are lethal, even a mere graze a few millimeters deep could pluck out the life of his opponent. An individuals' life is their very own od, synonymous with the soul. Damage to the soul, also damages the mind, as the mental has been equated to the spiritual)

Holy Swords - Enchanted Swords​

• Death Manipulation, Soul Manipulation & Mind Manipulation (Holy Swords and Enchanted Swords are instant-kill certain-death weapons, the instant they make contact the opponents life would be forfeit. An individuals' life is their very own od, synonymous with the soul. Damage to the soul, also damages the mind, as the mental has been equated to the spiritual)

The LN scan here actually says Demonic Sword, I changed it to Enchanted Sword, because that was likely just a mistranslation. since both of them use the same word (魔剣, Maken), and demonic swords aren't even a thing in Re:Zero.​

---

Resurrection Mid-Godly

Julius coating magic on his weapon doesn't make it an enchanted sword. It literally just says his sword is enchanted, which it is by magic. Even without that scan you'd get all the abilities so it can just be removed,

Death in the Re:Zero world means your own od-soul-life had ceased to exist and went back to Od Lagna, whether it was naturally burned up from old age, used for magic, destroyed, or absorbed.

Characters who can resurrect their own od back from that state should qualify for a Mid-Godly Resurrection:

• Reinhard
• Subaru
• Aldebaran
• Pandora

Ferris dies in arc 3 and come back so he would fall into this list though?

---

Nonexistent Physiology

This would only apply to the dead souls of the undead, basically the undead can stick around even after having kicked the bucket, they completely lack an existent od-life to be dispersed by Halibel curse. In other words their od have already reached a 0 when they died, the sacrament of the immortal king simply allows it to still function in that nonexistent state.

This would grant this characters a Nonexistent Physiology (Nature Type 1, Aspect Type 1, 3 & 5 "Life").

• Sphinx
• Balleroy
• Eugard
• Rowan
• Theresia
• Kurgan

---

Agree:
Disagree:
Neutral:

I'm not that confident in NEP but nature type 1 says this

Material Nonexistence: The character doesn't exist in a conventional sense. In terms of binary, this would be a 0, where existence is 1 and nonexistence is 0. In simple terms, that means that the characters simply lack the aspect, in the same way that a stone lacks a soul.

But Rowan soul was scorched by the yang sword by Eugard

Rowan: “What the hell… Just as expected, I have it.”
As embers emanated from all over his body, a vividly gruesome smile emerged on Rowan’s face.
Reduced to an undead, Rowan had become acutely aware of the state of his own soul, and had placed the tips of his toes upon the steps to reach the Heavenly Sword. In order to reliably take the next steps higher, this was his next trial, indeed.
Rowan’s soul would be scorched to oblivion in the not-so-distant future. But, the flame of a candle would always burn brightest right before it went out.
—For Rowan Segmunt, reaching the Heavenly Sword was his life’s dearest wish.
He had even proved that he would give up his life with no hesitation for that purpose.
In truth, by experiencing death, and gaining awareness of the shape of his soul, Rowan had steadily gotten closer to achieving his wish.
Thus, as long as Rowan reached the Heavenly Sword, it mattered not if it was only for a single second.
For a mere second before his soul was burnt to a crisp, even if it was for naught more than an instant, all that mattered was that he reached it.

Vincent scorched Sphinx

In the hands of Eugard Vollachia, the Yang Sword ignited its true flame. The soul of the Undead Swordmaster who was hit by the slash was the spark from which the flame rose.
Coincidentally, Vincent Vollachia’s Yang Sword set the soul of the Witch, Sphinx, the bearer of the Great Disaster, ablaze. It was the same conclusion.

Sphinx shares clones with her mana via her soul

Plus the more fundamental issue is this spell uses the sacrament and the sacrament

"A kind of magic that, upon death, returns the soul to the body from which it has left… a forbidden art, I suppose.”

And even Sphinx’s alteration in arc 8 uses the soul

Disregarding Garfiel, Roswaal looked at Beatrice with a grim expression on his face.
Roswaal: “Beatrice, this isn’t the Sacrament of the Immortal King, right?”
Beatrice: “…The basis is the same, but the approach is different, in fact. For the Sacrament of the Immortal King, the vessel comes first, and the soul second, I suppose. However, as for these zombies…”
Roswaal: “The soul comes first, and the vessel after. —The body changes form to suit the soul.”

Roswaal: “Beatrice’s observation is correct. The mechanism by which the zombies are revived without the original corpse is an application of Restoration Magic. The prerequisite for this is the invocation of the soul, which is an application of the Sacrament of the Immortal King.”
Beatrice: “Both Restoration Magic and the Sacrament of the Immortal King aren’t the kind of techniques that can be used immediately upon understanding the theory, in fact. To begin with, given the feat of combining such fundamentally different types of magic, it can’t be said that there are even a handful of geniuses who can do it, I suppose. Those who could do it would be…”

Because they have a soul they wouldn't be able to gain any of the aspect NEP

 

[Azertyhuuh]

In this thread, it was accepted that the Od is a Type 3 concept, and therefore it should also have the conceptual aspect within NEP 1.

 

[TheHeavenlySword]

I kinda iffy on Death Manipulation.

Even with the Soul = Life, the characters are killing the target with Soul Manipulation, not by induncing direct Death on them.

Yes, they are affecting their life force, but that would just be Life Manipulation I think?

Or one of the examples in the page says It can do what Re:Zero chars are doing.

the novel equated curses which can rob someone's life force with an instant death spell.

 

[Azertyhuuh]

I kinda iffy on Death Manipulation.

Even with the Soul = Life, the characters are killing the target with Soul Manipulation, not by induncing direct Death on them.

Yes, they are affecting their life force, but that would just be Life Manipulation I think?

Or one of the examples in the page says It can do what Re:Zero chars are doing.

It could overlap, but the difference is:

The character affect someone life force = Life Manipulation

The character causes Death on target = Death Manipulation.

For me atleast, It seems more the former than the latter.

I neutral on that, this is just my opinion.

If the characters are capable of stealing a person's entire life force at once in order to cause an immediate and sudden death, then that would qualify as Death Manipulation. Otherwise, it would only be Life Manipulation and not Death Manipulation.
However, the question here is whether Re:Zero characters, when stealing life, remove it all at once in order to cause direct death, or not. This is the point that needs to be determined in order to know whether they qualify for Death Manipulation or not.

 

[Azertyhuuh]

the novel equated curses which can rob someone's life force with an instant death spell.

Stealing someone's life force alone is not evidence of Death Manipulation; it is Life Manipulation unless that character is capable of removing someone's entire life force at once in order to cause instant death. Only then could it fall under Death Manipulation, and that is something you have not proven so far.

 

[TheHeavenlySword]

The ulgram rob mana. Mana is equivalent to life force, if a person loses all their mana they die. Thus they aren't absorbing the soul.

Having your mana depleted doesn't really kill you.
The life force here should be referring to the Od which can also be absorbed by spirits who can absorb mana.

Roswaal, Echidna, Alter, and Sphinx can all use rainbow magic which means they qualify as Julius rainbow magic is what gives him these abikities

the rainbow aurora is an original magic that Julius created, only Roswaal who copied it can use it.

Ferris dies in arc 3 and come back so he would fall into this list though?

its listed as High-Mid regeneration in his profile.

I'm not that confident in NEP but nature type 1 says this

But Rowan soul was scorched by the yang sword by Eugard

Vincent scorched Sphinx

Nonexistent Interaction.

Sphinx shares clones with her mana via her soul

Sphinx mana pool is irrelevant to her od.

 

[Fezzih_007]

the novel equated curses which can rob someone's life force with an instant death spell.

Wolgarm curse, the one that Subaru is talking about here, didn't cause him to Instant Death like that.

Spoiler: Images

So is just Subaru using videogame lingo that don't apply.

 

[Crimsonobu]

Having your mana depleted doesn't really kill you.
The life force here should be referring to the Od which can also be absorbed by spirits who can absorb mana.

I sent the scan. It explicitly says mana. This is also not true. In Puck's form he absorbs all mana in the area which reduces things to nothing causing everything to disappear. Mana is the building block of their reality and fundamental particles.

the rainbow aurora is an original magic that Julius created, only Roswaal who copied it can use it.

Julius created the rainbow magic by being inspired by Roswaal magic originally. Roswaal was taught rainbow magic by Echidna.

its listed as High-Mid regeneration in his profile.

He has immortality on his profile

Nonexistent Interaction.

It explicitly says it burns their soul. This also didn't answer anything I said about the sacrament spell bringing back the soul.

Sphinx mana pool is irrelevant to her od.

Priscilla is telling Sphinx that her mana is stored in her soul meaning she still has it. Sphinx doesn't deny that and the narration says Priscilla deduction is correct.

 

[MrTayman616]

There is 4 open thread with this thread.

This should be closed as the limit is 3.

 

[Crimsonobu]

There is 4 open thread with this thread.

This should be closed as the limit is 3.

What are the other 3?

 

[MrTayman616]

What are the other 3?

Regulus one, Od Two, Ability rev three.

 

[Crimsonobu]

Regulus one, Od Two, Ability rev three.

Od cm3 finished with necessary votes. Its just the thread wasn't closed which should be done in all purpose request ig.

 

[MrTayman616]

Od cm3 finished with necessary votes. Its just the thread wasn't closed which should be done in all purpose request ig.

No, it didn't end yet.

 

[Crimsonobu]

No, it didn't end yet.

Celestial and Spaceman voted for type 3. That's 2 mods, no? It's not as if this verse needs 3.

 

[Zabazab]

The od, also known as the soul, is the foundation of life, and the wellspring of life, it is ones own life energy, synonymous with the soul.
A specific and finite amount of od is decided at birth which determines a persons' lifespan and the result of its depletion is death. Creating od is equivalent to creating life.
Due to its similar nature to mana, the od can be absorbed by spirits, and can be burned up to cast magic instead of mana but doing that is equivalent to shaving your own life away.

I don't think I agree with the idea that the soul immediately vanishes upon death. Rui states the souls of the dead are baptised by Od Lagna for re-use. Echidna collected the souls of the Witches who were killed and housed them inside her dream. Reinhard's Divine Protection of the Phoenix will not resurrect him if his soul is destroyed.

The zombies of the Great Disaster explicitly do have souls, as their deceased souls were called into earthern vessels by forbidden arts, in fact they appeared not as walking corpses because their vessels were fashioned after the shape of their souls. The place the zombies' souls are being called down from is Od Lagna, and their existence can be seen having an effect on their respective Books of the Dead turning blank.

“Meili, you said there were Books of the Dead that you can and can’t read, right? Are all the ones you can’t read blank like this one?” asked Reinhard.

The book in his hand was filled with blank pages.

Meili shook her head as she looked at the book he was holding. “Nooo, nothing of that sorttt. The books that can’t be read also had their own unique letters written in theeem.”

“Miss Meili is right,” said Ezzo. “All the books I pulled from the shelves had something written in them. Although many of them were too difficult to understand, the only books with blank pages are the ones on the floor.”

“You say ‘only’, but…” Felt said, scratching her head and looking at the pile of books on the floor. It looked as if someone had knocked down a whole bookshelf. There must have been a few hundred books scattered about.

“If someone went on a rampage here, it must have been someone who’s skilled enough to sneak past the Divine Dragon,” suggested Flam.

“A big weirdo like the Young Master,” added Grassis.

“But that’s more likely than an entire bookshelf falling over on its own,” concluded Ezzo. “Miss Felt, if there is an intruder, we must consider searching for them, or withdrawing.”

Taking her vassals’ advice into consideration, Felt turned her attention to the spine of the book Reinhard was holding, then to the pile on the floor. No matter who the intruder is, the hint lies in the books. However, there wasn’t much she could glean from them.

“From the names, all I can say is that they’re probably related to Vollachia. Not to mention that this is all happening at the same time Emilia is infiltrating there. I’m getting a bad feeling about this,” she muttered to herself, starting to suspect that the Empire had some sort of connection to the anomalous Books of the Dead. —Meili's Witchbeast Observation Record V

That said, when Aldebaran ignores the restrictions of doctoring a curse mark the backlash damages his soul/fissures his Od, and it's mentioned Subaru experiences the same phenomena (contextually via Return by Death), implying dying in Domain does not shatter the soul.

Death Manipulation

All of the characters you listed can either damage/destroy souls— which is not death manipulation (I mean, Julius's Al Clarista doesn't immediately kill either Petelgeuse or Balleroy, and the Yang Sword requires at least several tens of seconds to scorch an ignited soul to nothing)— or have death manipulation— which does not necessarily destroy a soul.

Mana is life-force and draining too much would kill a person, and even though mana is stored in the soul there's no mention of draining Od itself.

Death Manipulation, Soul Manipulation & Mind Manipulation (All of his attacks are lethal, even a mere graze a few millimeters deep could pluck out the life of his opponent.

This is referring to the fact that Alter is so strong merely being grazed will result in a fatal injury, not that his claws have some death hax attached.

Theresia
Kurgan

I said my piece on the undead's souls, but Theresia and Kurgan were not Zombies (spawn of the Great Disaster) but Corpse Soldiers, a type of undead that are stated to lack souls. Is this also contradicted by Theresia having her Divine Protection of the Death God despite Divine Protections targeting the soul of the user and target? Absolutely, but it is what it is.