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Questions about Laharl, Trenia, and Pram.

Jesterofgames

Jesterofgames

2,075
283
i don't think this goes under content revision (yet.)

but let's start off with Laharl, why does he low-high regen? Is it because some moves Vaporize the people they attack? If yes why doesn't this apply to every major demon since multiple moves have this effect?

second Trenia why is she just low 2-C if her mana waves where destroying the cosmos? Wouldn't that be a 2-C feat?

And third... Why is Pram 2-C for just taking over the cosmos? First form Frieza takes over solar systems but he isn't solar system level. If there's more to it shouldn't the explanation be expanded upon?
 
Okay for the first one after looking through skils low-high seems to be from the Nekomata's hundred cat fist , skill. that is in disgaea 4, and d2. Though the tome skill NIS Certificatio would give everyone Mid-high as it looks to turn them into vapor.

As for 2 I do not know why. Thought do to witch and the hundred knight stating that there are Infinite timelines in the cosmos called "worlds " in that game. so that feat would likely be at least 2-C, possably 2-A rating.

As for Pram my guess it is do to the ending imploying that no one was able to challange her power. Though it would likely depend on how powerful characters like the Creator, or Niike are.
 
I mean I do quesion why Disgaea character's are given regen off of surviving special moves but other verses aren't.

Yeah trenia should be 2-C... according to her page that is. I looked up a makai kingdom script and saw no mention of her mana waves destryoing the cosmos.

And pretty sure even if pram was strong enough to one shot a low 2-C casually she'd still be Low 2-C.
 
if I had to guess it might be do to the odd why the verse itself is. As most of if not all the game mechanics seem to be a canon in verse, so that might be the reason why they have the regen.
 
though if is it alright to add my own question here.

Why is Valvatorez put as Comparable to Laharl? When he has feats that put him above Laharl. Like beating Zetta on his own without drinking humen blood to leave his weakend state, and beating Killia who seems to beats a full power laharl, and Etna with easy.
 
Because he's in the same ball park. Also Killia didn't seem to beat full power laharl and etna easily to me. Really the only person who seemed to do that is Gig who consistantly toys with everyone who isn't true Zenon.

Also he beat Zetta with help he even says he didn't do it alone.
 
Except He says he needed help to get to this point which could mean just getting through thegames events leading up to the point. Not that he needed help with the fight.

Which is backed up by everyone there including Zetta acting like Valvatorez was the only one doing the fighting after then affter the battle was over. Zetta even goes as far as to call Valvatorez his rival.
 
Yes but it could also mean fighting Zettain general as well.

Also "no this victory isn't mine it belongs to all of us. I wouldn't be here if I had to do this by myself and with out my powers." Seems pretty consive that he's saying everyone did it.

As for they acted like Valvatorez did it alone, Desco and fuka wanted to claim the title for themselves. Plus it could have just been Valvatorez dealing the final blow.
 
I my have just misinterpreted the scene then, and I always though Fuka trying to claim it was her just using the "it's my dream" logic that she tends to use in the plot some times. So my bad.
 
so something that I forgot about Pram. Didn't she overpower the cosmos while in her true form in the main plot of makai kingdom? Shouldn't that make her true form at least 2-C?
 
https://youtu.be/w682gQ8T-IU?t=7199

When they are trying to bring Salome back to life, Pram writes in the Sacred Tome to resurrect Salome, however, the wish gets overwritten by the Cosmos. After powering up, the wish comes true which implies that Pram overcame the will of the Cosmos with sheer power alone.
 
Yeah that's a good 2-C feat. But why isn't it listed on her page and instead it's just "she took over the cosmos".
 
I mean it is listed on her true form key but for some reason that form is labeled low-2C. Also now that I think of it. Since the cosmos has Infinite timelines in it wouldn't that make the cosmos that Pram overpowered 2-A?
 
Also something I just found when regoing through disgaea 5. It looks like the lead characters that would be able to scale disgaea 5 might be way over baseline Low-2C

Do to disgaea 5 leads who were shown to to fight aoverlord class character that was having a 2000% stat boost and this overlord class demon was still seen as weaker the bloodis, and majorita. As well the fodder of the lost army got this same boost and were seen as overlord level.

As well the party at the strongest could beat carnage dark , who is a high ranking carnage world demon.
 
do you guys think we should make another thread for the AP stuff? Since if Pram's true form changes tiers would also change a few other character's at well or at least give them a key.
 
If Pram gets upgraded then so should Zetta and Trenia. Considering that Zetta doesn't even look surprised by this level of power and that he is canonically the strongest Overlord. Trenia should also be stronger than both of them considering she has the most Mana.
 
From what I can tell if zetta scales to this. the disgaea 4 cast, the disgaea 5 cast, and the Disgaea D2 cast should likely also scale.

Since the disgaea 4 cast beat zetta, killia took on pram and zetta though killia lost the fight he was able to somewhat tire zetta, and one of pram's attacks in disgaea 5 has her taking her true form before attacking. Also Valvatoraz in his weakend state beat killia in a 1v1 fight in the disgaea 5 DLC.

As well the disgaea d2 cast beat alaxander who is considered one of zetta's rivals.
 
thank you. The main thing is a feat from Pram where her true form was able to overwelm the cosmos' will (the Cosmos is the setting name for the multiverse. Which there is statment of it having infinite timelines which are called "worlds" )

we are trying to figure out if this should counted as an at least 2-C likely 2-A feat.
 
would this scale to anybody else from the disgaea cast low key hoping it somehow bumps laharl up even though it likely won't. Edit: wait isn't a lot of the cast scaled to ba'al who's scaled to trenia?
 
aright. then we will likely have to Upgrade most people then. Since most characters right now scale to Laharl. Who if this is to be counted as a 2-A feat. should now also be 2-A in his full power key.

For beating a character named alixander who beat a guy that knocked out True form Pram.
 
Jesterofgames said:
would this scale to anybody else from the disgaea cast low key hoping it somehow bumps laharl up even though it likely won't.Edit: wait isn't a lot of the cast scaled to ba'al who's scaled to trenia?
Click to expand...
looking at the the low 2-C thread. Ba'al is Low-2C do to being stated to have 4D power and being above fodder that can make a big bang with a punch. though Ba'al did fight zetta 2 times in Makai Kingdom. As well laharl could scale off Alaxander instead of Ba'al.
 
Yeah but it says this on laharls page "Defeated Baal, whose power is said to be of the 4th dimension and Trenia herself couldn't eliminate"
 
That is true. though it could be Ba'al possably having resistence to the tome's Reality Warping. Since Trenia had no clue how to put Ba'al down for good.
 
Well, this would be a massive upgrade, so we need more staff input.

Cosmos is also usually a title for a single universe.
 
Okay. That seems more reliable then.

Please explain which characters that scale to this and why.
 
To be fair in disgaea 5 netherworld is shown to mean planet (in that very specific case all other times netherworld means universe) netherworlds means universes in disgaea 5.
 
Well almost everyone would scale to this.

Zetta who is in cannon the strongest overlord would be more powerful then Pram.

Trenia is considered to be more powerful then both Zetta, and Pram.

Valvatorez&Desco would scale to zetta as the disgaea 4 cast beat zetta. Valvatorez with out drinking for 400 years (which puts him weakened stete) was still strong enough to be considered one of Zetta's rival. and Valvatorez beat Killia in a 1v1 fight.

Killia could scale off either Zetta or Pram. Since while he lost to them, he slightly tired Zetta, and one of Pram's skills in disgaea 5 has her taking her true form before the attack. As well he beat Laharl and Etna while the 2 where fighting as a team.

Void Dark, and Zeroken should be able scale to Killia as the other members of the disgaea 5 cast are comprable to him by post game events. and void has always been shown to be a bit stronger then Killia.

Laharl, etna, flonne. can scale to alaxander who is another of Zetta's rivals do to them being able to beat him. (Alaxender was able to fight Seedle who is strong enough to knock out Full power Pram.)

Adell in Disgaea 2 beats Larahl. showing that adell is stronger then him.

Marjoly can scale from laharl and adell do to them needing help in order to beat her.

Ash can scale to laharl as he can take attack from him, and can damage him.

the Hro Prinny how has beaten Pram, andprinny Ba'al.

Asagi who has is able to fight just about every disgaea cast while they are at full power.

and possable Darkdeath Evilman as his true form in more powerful then the player character of Z.H.P who is strong enough to beat Asagi 16 times.
 
Okay, and can you summarise why specifically they should be 2-A in the first place?
 
The Reason is do either being able to fight or beat characters are comprable to Pram in her True form.

In the events of the game Makai Kingdom, Pram uses the sacrad tome (a tome that grants wishes, and tell people the future) to try to wish back an overlord class demon named Salome, from the dead.

But when she tries the cosmos rejects the wish, and erases it from the tome . She then goes into her true form and forces the wish to start happening anyway. Even though the cosmos is rejecting the wish. implying that she is over powering the cosmos.

As well the main reason the cosmos would be 2-A is do to a statment from the game Witch and the Hundred Knight, which states that there are infinite worlds . In this game they use the word world to mean timelines/univreses. This game is cannon to the verse as the lead character of the game has shown up in disgaea d2 and fights the cast of that game.
 
We do not know how much power the cosmos exerted on the tome. If she has not shown destruction or creation feats on an infinite universes scale, it seems unreliable to scale from for such a massive upgrade.
 
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