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Question about Dabura DBZ

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LordGriffin1000

LordGriffin1000

Awakened after 1000 years
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I notice we place Dabura at High 4-C for being equal to Perfect Cell, this was stated by Goku. Problem is Goku never said which Cell, just Cell.

Teen Gohan SS2 Could defeat SP Cell at full power, Older Gohan in SS2 could battle Dabura but could not defeat him, just match him. This is because Gohan was not as strong as he was as when he fought Cell, this is why he couldn't defeat Dabura. Now as I did just admit Gohan was not as strong as he was before but I highly doubt he was so weak to the point where his SS2 couldn't beat a Perfect Cell level enemy.

Now I'm not saying it was SP Cell Goku was referring to but it is possible he was talking about SP Cell.

I'm also not saying Dabura should be straight up 4-B but I think he should also have "possible 4-B" next to his High 4-C rating.

His AP would just need to say "Was stated by Goku to be just as strong as Cell but it is unknown which Cell goku was referring to", obviously he wasn't talking about Imperfect or Semi-Perfect Cell.

So what are your thoughts on this?
 
I agree that Dabura should get a "possibly 4-B" rating after his High 4-C rating. Not to mention that SPC was baseline Solar System Level so anyone much weaker than him or on par with his regular Perfect Form should be High 4-C such as Older SSJ2 Gohan.
 
This was already discussed before. Let's see Goku was referring to Perfect Cell since it's the form Goku saw and struggled the most, he was in heaven when SPC Cell (Who broke SS2 Gohan arm with a casual beam) returned. Vegeta also points out that he and Goku trained after the end of the arc, while Gohan stopped training in order to study and as a result he became weaker than before. This Gohan matched Dabura as only as a SS while SS2 Gohan kamehameha struggled with SPC, who was only nervous about everyone shooting their strongest ki blast at him in order to slow him down and Vegeta Final Flash ended up distracting him, which allowed Gohan to finish him.
 
Gohan was protecting Vegeta for one, and no, if he broke his arm with a casual beam he would have destroyed Gohan in the final beam struggle.

Gohan was in SS2 from what I saw. I'll need to ho find a picture.
 
Goku sensed SPC's power, he knows how strong he is. We cant simply assume because "Goku only fought that Cell, so he was refering to Perfect Cell" even though it was Gohan in the match not Goku.

Again, Goku could have been refering to SPC, thats why i suggested possibly 4-B.
 
Like i said before Cell was not enraged (Remember that he used a power stressed form, which was only concentrated in strength), he was only nervous because the others were annoying him during the beam struggle and was not expecting Vegeta to distract him while Gohan used his strongest attack.
 
You just said Cell comes back and brakes Gohan's arm with a casual beam.

If that was casual, as soon his and Gohan's beams colluded with each other Cell's would have instantly overpowered Gohan... But he didn't. They where in a struggle.

Technically Vegeta and them shouldn't have done anything and even though they did, Cell should have instantly have pushed him back once their attacks where over if a casual beam from SPC broke Gohan's arm.
 
Because the plot needed Gohan to win, everyone else was distracting him, Cell was not at the very full power and even Goku was helping him, sorry but no 4-B Dabura and SS Gohan.
 
I never once said Gohan in SS should get 4-B, I said Dabura because Gohan fought him in SS2 unless I'm mistaken. I have a bad memory so I need to go look at the fight again to make sure he was in SS2.
 
I would actually like to apologize if this topic was repeatedly (I only remember one time this was discussed here) I looked around on the internet and notice this was a big topic back then. Some people say Gohan didn't use SS2 because their wasn't any lighting but others say he did use it because his hair was drawn in the style of SS2.

For the no lighting thing I believe there where different times when no lighting was drawn even though they where in SS2 (at least in the anime, I can't remember the Manga).

I personally still think there is a possibility that Gohan was in SS2 even though there wasn't lighting because his hair was drawn in that style.

If this is a controversial subject someone could close this thread but if it's not that bad then ok.

My phone constantly acts up so I can post images from their fight but from the images I see from the Manga he does look like he's in SS2.
 
LordGriffin1000 said:
If this is a controversial subject someone could close this thread but if it's not that bad then ok.
Click to expand...
I think not, we should hear the opinion of other users.
 
@Apprentice21

What do you mean what?

I said, I'm not saying it was a fact that Goku ment Super Perfect Cell when he said Cell but it is a possibility he was talking about Super Perfect Cell not just Perfect Cell.
 
I think that Dark649 makes sense.
 
Alright so I've found some scans and I'm going to post a link to each scan. I half to do this one at a time so please bear with me, I'm going to post two images of Gohan in normal Super Sayian then I'm going to post two images of his SS2 form so we can see the differences and then I'm going to post the scans from the fight with Dabura.

First SS: http://i7.**********.com/dragon-ball/422/dragon-ball-71238.jpg

http://i40.tinypic.com/6571ok.jpg

Next SS2: https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/...7Pw-B_gy8__psUWNyQpR-O5JQWdF6Nbk9U-Faz9R9xuXA

http://i.imgur.com/wNGjP8k.jpg

Lastly Dabura Battle:

http://cdn.mangaeden.com/mangasimg/5d/5de43abe3ee415839a4996995bfa9296edf695afdd9f0866cdfa518d.jpg

http://s12.postimg.org/qmcdw72q5/381007.jpg

http://cdn.mangaeden.com/mangasimg/23/230c30ed13d55e032920e51cd1fa703b8f80d28cb1bd5021d4810a20.jpg

As you can see, Gohan's hair in the Dabura fight (at least in these images I found) are drawn in the style of SS2 but he has no lighting.

This is what I was talking about with the argument on the internet. Some say because there was no lighting he wasn't SS2 but others say his hair was drawn in the style of SS2 so it had to be him. This is why I said Goku could have been referencing SPC also because Gohan was likely in SS2 and I doubt his SS2 got so weak he couldn't kill a Perfect Cell level. I believe it would have been more likely (in my opinion at least) that Gohan was SS2 and was eqaul to Dabura, so believe he should get a possible 4-B next to his High 4-C rating.
 
Look at my comments..

I know, I look at your comments and clicked the link that talked about Dabura and his power. I just wanted to show that Gohan was drawn as a SS2 just without lighting.

It could be mess up and they drew his hair wrong multiple times or they just didnt bother two draw the lightning. Ether way I believe Dabura should have a possible 4-B as it is unknown which form Gohan was in (unless those scans I posted of the Dabura fight are fake).

This all comes down to if Gohan was in SS2 or not when he fought Dabura.
 
In reference to the Cell thing earlier I showed multiple characters referring to Gohan vs Cell, which would imply SPC, since the involved characters were super saiyan 2s.
 
Yes both times they said "Cell"

Majin Vegeta (SS2 Level) fought Fat Buu and Piccolo said: He ascended beyond normal SS like Gohan against Cell (obviously he was saying Majin Vegeta is SS2 Level and referring to Gohan SS2 vs Cell)

Majin Vegeta vs SS2 Goku: Vegeta said "at least your stronger then when your son fought Cell(He didn't say which Cell but he said it when Goku was SS2 so that clearly means he was referring to SS2 Gohan).

Lastly is Goku's comment about Dabura being Cell level (he didn't say which Cell as Goku know's Perfect Cell's power and Super Perfect Cell's power, when the other said Cell they where referring to Super Perfect Cell as their where SS2 level characters being addressed) (Goku SS2 vs Majin Vegeta and Majin Vegeta vs Fat Buu).

So it is likely Goku was referring to Super Perfect Cell but this can only be true if Gohan was SS2 in his fight with Dabura. From the scans I posted Gohan looks like SS2 just without lighting.
 
Well the image I posted from the Daizenshuu confirms it, as well as the fact that kid Gohan beat Cell with 50% power, which means he was normally 2x stronger than that (greater considering it was a rage-boosted SSJ2 at that).

But possibly 4-B seems feasible too.
 
We still half to take into account that Cell was distracted (even though he should have immediately pushed Gohan back as soon as he brushed the other attacks of).

However Cell may have been distracted Gohan was still more injured then he was so a full powered SS2 Teen Gohan is stronger then a full powered Super Perfect Cell.

So if Gohan did get weaker like Vegeta said but was in SS2 when he fought Dabura this would mean Dabura is 4-B as Gohan's SS2 should have only dropped to around equal to Super Perfect Cell Level, unless his SS2 got so weak he could only contend with a Perfect Cell Level enemy.

This is why I suggest possibly 4-B as their is evidence that Dabura was fighting SS2 Gohan.

Still gotta be patient and wait for others to check out the thread, I'm in no rush.
 
It does not seem like the rest of the staff is interested in commenting.
 
Antvasima said:
It does not seem like the rest of the staff is interested in commenting.
Click to expand...
Well I'm in no rush, there are very importent revisions and othings going on. This will only effect one character so I can understand if not many are inturested.
 
Are there no other characters that would have to be adjusted?
 
No, the question that I am asking is why we don't scale Dabura to Super Perfect Cell.

To summarize what I'm saying...

Super Sayian 2 Teen Gohan is stronger than Super Perfect Cell, this we know.

Goku mentioned Dabura was as strong as Cell but he didn't specifically said which Cell (Perfect or Super Perfect). It is assumed Goku was referring to Perfect Cell. Vegeta stated Gohan (adult) was not as strong as he was before.

Now Dabura is High 4-C because he was stated to be just as strong as Perfect Cell and Dabura apparently only fought Super Sayian Gohan not Super Sayian 2 Gohan.

I'm trying to show Goku was referring to Super Perfect Cell not Perfect Cell. My proof is the image links I posted a few posts back up, where I show two images of SS Gohan and SS2 Gohan so you can see the differences.

The first two images are of SS Gohan

SS Gohan has two strand's of hair coming from the top of his head and his hair is not super spikey.

The next two images are of SS2 Gohan

SS2 Gohan's hair is more spikey and has only one large bang.

The last 3 images are from the Dabura battle

If you look at Gohan his hair is drawn in the style of SS2 not SS just without lighting around him. The show's he was in SS2 in the fight. Gohan may have gotten weaker (taken from Vegeta's statement) but his SS2 should not be so weak he can't defeat a Super Perfect Cell level threat.

This all comes down to if Gohan was in SS or SS2 in his fight with Dabura (if so Dabura should be scaled to Super Perfect Cell, if not... Well he stays the same tier).
 
Here are the scans again

First SS: http://i7.**********.com/dragon-ball/422/dragon-ball-71238.jpg

http://i40.tinypic.com/6571ok.jpg

Next SS2: https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/...7Pw-B_gy8__psUWNyQpR-O5JQWdF6Nbk9U-Faz9R9xuXA

http://i.imgur.com/wNGjP8k.jpg

Lastly Dabura Battle:

http://cdn.mangaeden.com/mangasimg/5d/5de43abe3ee415839a4996995bfa9296edf695afdd9f0866cdfa518d.jpg

http://s12.postimg.org/qmcdw72q5/381007.jpg

http://cdn.mangaeden.com/mangasimg/23/230c30ed13d55e032920e51cd1fa703b8f80d28cb1bd5021d4810a20.jpg

The first two images are Gohan in Super Sayian, the seconed two are him in Super Sayian 2 and the last three images are from the Dabura fight.

Gohan in the Dabura fight is clearly in Super Sayian 2 just without lightning. Some say because there is no lightning hes not Super Sayian 2 but unless they messed up Gohan's hair each time or hell maybe they did.

I just would like people to look at the images and give their opinons on wether or not Gohan was Super Sayian 2 or not.

SS2 Teen Gohan>>>>>Super Perfect Cell

SS2 Teen Gohan>>>SS2 Adult Gohan

SS2 Adult Gohan=Dabura

Dabura should be on Super Perfect Cell's level.

This if Gohan was in SS2.
 
Well, I do not have an opinion regarding the issue, but am open for input from Dark649 and the rest of the staff.
 
Okay. That might be a workable compromise solution.
 
Antvasima or Dark649 you can close this, I'm planning to do a blog about. It'll be my first one and it might take some time and it might be a bit messy but I think it would be better then having this thread just sitting here.
 
Well, I doubt thst it will get more replies, but okay.
 
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